Errors-To: et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk Reply-To: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Elephant Talk Digest #328 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 328 Tuesday, 14 January 1997 Today's Topics: Double Trio in review Re: Muir/Bailey//S.A. Elephant Talk Digest #327 Boots and Imports From Robert Fripp Re: Lyrics on Easy Money Clouds Above Mercury follow-up? Re: Is Prog Dead Bill's humor Tacuma/USA/'bootleg' video Re: Elephant Talk Digest #327 I really miss the saxes and flutes Easy Money - lyrics Fripp on Bowie: _Low_? Earthbound, boots, and Hendrix Trey's hair / Luscious Jackson Thrak in the Middle Ages; Tritones Re: Status of Soundscapes... The mind is a hopper... DVD's--Worth the Wait? giles muir and cunningham "Prog" livelihood Crimson sheet music ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk UNSUB/ADDRESS CHANGES: Send a message with a body of HELP to et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk, or use the DIY list machine at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/list/ ETWEB: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ (partial mirror at http://members.aol.com/etmirror/) THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmeister) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest 3.0 package. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Sat, 11 Jan 1997 16:35:41 -0500 (EST) From: agower at netcom dot ca Subject: Double Trio in review OK. When I discovered KC, I had listened to other "progressive rock" groups. Yes, Genesis, Pink Floyd, ELP. I always hated The Moody Blues though. After listening to the CD in the store, I acquired Sleepless (compilation covering FrByFr). 21st CeSchMan is still one of my favorite tracks. Soon after I heard about the new double trio. I couldn't believe the timing. VROOOM was quite a revelation. I enjoyed every track immensely. The compactness of Cage (and its subsequent non-inclusion on THRAK) appealed to me. THe following releases strike me as incomplete follow ups to that release. I found the material on THRAK to be in a similar spirit to VROOOM but with fancier overdubs. I felt that with such an amazing group of musicians and an interesting instrumental lineup, they could have made much more of a "mind-blowing" record. Then again I am unable to choose a favorite KC album because all of them are great (kind of like choosing a favorite colour. I like colour period). My view of this album as a failure to meet expectations may be tainted due to reading the Bruford-Mastelotto interview in Modern Drummer (great interview!). B'BOOM proves as always that good live KC will always be better than studio KC (If Fripp knows this why does KC even bother with studio albums?). Unfortunately, I feel the release of this album may be due to commercial reasons more than artistic ones. Fripp stated that these shows were bootlegged and released, the release may be an attempt to combat that bootleg. Sure I'm happy that these shows were released. I liked "Two Sticks/Elephant Talk", "The Talking Drum" and both "B'Boom/Thrak"s. I just feel that a live album would have be better recorded later on in the tour as the band gelled into a tighter unit. You must note that the concerts were actually recorded before the recording of B'BOOM. THRAK ATTAK is frankly very difficult. I can't imagine anyone saying that they whole heartedly love the entire album (but in this forum somebody probably will!). A theoretical experiment that I can't comment on obejectively not being able to display the listening intensity and concentration required to fully comprehend the players' performance intensity and concetration. Honestly, I fear that Fripp may be becoming too comfortable with the current players. I love BB but he's been in the band for ages, AB & TL are also great. I think that KC should not be about the players, but an attitude towards the performance of music. Using the same performers provides an environment that may not be entirely suitable to the KC ethos. Too much organized and not enough anarchy. If KC is just an attitude, how come Fripp is always in the band, maybe he's too comfortable with himself. The world is Fripp's oyster and we just listen to it! November is too long to wait for new KC. Andy Gower agower at netcom dot ca Vancouver Beautiful British Columbia Canada PS. Hey y'all Fripp doesn't perform on Eno's Taking Tiger Mountain (By Strategy). Why does PossProd sell it. Because those four albums kick ass!!! Buy them!!! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 09:42:16 -0500 (EST) From: terry kroetsch f Subject: Re: Muir/Bailey//S.A. Finally found the Jamie Muir/Derek Bailey CD *Dart Drug* in Los Angeles. Highly atmospheric and recommended (Incus CD19). Speaking of ex-Crimso members, how many CDs has Gordon Haskell released. Can anyone tell me titles and label? tkroetsc at mach1 dot wlu dot ca Mostly Off-topic: I believe there are a number of South Americans on the list. I have a chance to go anywhere in S.A. for no money (one week). Any suggestions? I have kinda entertained the idea of Buenos Aires (3rd week of Feb) - any thoughts on weather, CD shops and concerts, please contact me privately: tkroetsc at mach1 dot wlu dot ca THANKS. Terry K ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 11:34:21 -0500 From: Philip Curme <100535 dot 433 at compuserve dot com> Subject: Elephant Talk Digest #327 The various American interpretations of the Easy Money lyrics are very amusing....but I am afraid the truth is very staid in an English sort of way.... The much debated line reads as follows.... "They caught me naked once" .... not an item of confectionery in sight ! Phil Curme ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 09:48:08 -0600 From: whittakd at lib dot enmuros dot cc dot nm dot us (dmw) Subject: Boots and Imports >The Japan video, so far as I know (which does not mean anything), was shown >on MTV and is not available "legitimately". I taped my copy from the >original broadcast and am disappointed in that it was not even a whole show >(Is there more available?). It was released legitimately, I rented a copy from a really cool video store a few years ago. The same store had the Belew and Bruford instructional tapes. >The salesperson at "one of those IMPORTS stores" was not happy when I >mentioned the word "boot", (He replied, "Would you like a bong with that?"; >actually, most "head shops" don't have a problem with you using the word >"bong", as long as you don't mention what you'll probably smoke in it.) I am not sure about the rest of the world, but in Texas if you say "bong" instead of "water pipe", you will be asked to leave. One of my friends was making a student film and went to a "head shop" and asked for a bong, he was asked to leave. More recently, an old roommate got a job at a store that sells "water pipes" and she was told the same thing. David David Whittaker whittakd at lib dot enmuros dot cc dot nm dot us http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/6009 668 - The Neighbor of the Beast ------------------------------ [ Note to readers, in the light of the controversy about whether the post from Adrian Belew a few issues ago was genuine: this next post is indeed from Robert -- Toby ] Date: 13 Jan 97 05:16:45 EST Subject: From Robert Fripp Monday, 13th. January 1997. Dear Team, 1. Harvey Keitel and Kevin Spacey should play Fripp in "King Crimson: The Movie", in alternating scenes. Who cares if anyone's confused? 2. Stop arguing about Fripp's attitude towards you, etc., and acknowledge he's the greatest guitarist in the world. 3. Would ET readers be kind enough to consider, and respond, to these questions: i) What is the nature of the relationship between the audience / enthusiast / fan and the musician? ii) What are the rights of the audience / enthusiast / fan? iii) What are the responsibilities and obligations of the audience / enthusiast / fan? iv) What do you personally, as an audient / enthusiast / fan expect of your artists? v) What do you personally, as a KC-RF audient / enthusiast / fan expect of Robert Fripp? Since 1969 I have received reviews, articles, interviews, commentaries, and letters from fans and enthusiasts numbering in the thousands. Since it began, I have scanned and read Discipline / Elephant Talk. For several years I have undertaken this as part of my personal discipline. As part of a discipline, the question is always: how can I use this to help me serve my aim? No other musicians of my acquaintance or knowing read as widely as myself the commentaries and chit-chat concerning them. My hunch is because, in various ways and for various reasons, the musicians often get hurt, sometimes injured, and even damaged. To put it another way, most public commentary has negative "side" (in the country use of the word) to it. To put it differently, the net benefit is negligible. And to get to net benefit, you have to read it all. I don't see how anyone would want to read it all for fun. My personal approach is to either read everything or nothing. In between can be harmful. If you read nothing, it doesn't reach you. If you do read it all (pretty well) probably the net balance (in a love / hate, nice guy / creep way) simply balances. Whenever someone gets really nasty or personal, it doesn't touch me. Firstly, because it has nothing to do with me: the commentator is commenting on themselves. Secondly, it's like walking through a farmyard: if you step into a cow pat, it's not particularly informative, or instructive (other than telling you to wake up and look where you're walking) but, because you wear Wellington boots, it doesn't touch you either. Although it may make a nasty smell. And then you wash your boots. Occasionally I receive a letter, or see one in ET, that gladdens my heart: someone has actually seen how it works! Clean feedback is a joy, a reward, a friend. It is impersonal. Where the elephantosities touch upon the relationship between musicians and enthusiasts, fans and followers, my responses have moved between bemusement, amazement, laughter, anger and sheer disbelief that mature and reasonable people might come to their expressed opinions and judgements, often with some heat, on the basis of a clearly developed sense of what they expect of the artists they patronise; umbrage when these expectations are not met; with clearly implied assumptions on the part of what the artist's position is / should / might / can only be, and certainly is despite anything, in any case, anyway, because I've bought my ticket with hard-earned pay and that gives me rights. So, what rights? What obligations? What expectations? What assumptions? 4. Very little in my life is arbitrary. In all the comments on "Fripp's 'tude" I don't recall anyone commenting that my onstage and offstage behaviour might simply be practical, and in some way serving my aim. Also, that this is itself part of an ongoing exploration and learning curve for me of how I do what I do. This is an alternative approach to "Fripp's a jerk, so who cares?" or "Fripp's a genius, so how can we know?" lines of enquiry. If any commentator did burble and banter about that one, the first question is probably "What is Fripp's aim?" before moving to how this eccentric / standoffish / egotistical / rude / kind / brilliant Englishman's behaviour might serve that aim. 5. Actually, I am very grateful for the level of public support which has enabled me to remain a musician, or at least a guitarist, for 38 years. My own feelings towards this public are intimate, yet utterly impersonal. And sometimes personal. Sincerely, Robert Fripp. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 12:00:43 -0500 From: Datboy Subject: Re: Lyrics on Easy Money I can't believe this has gone on for so long .... I always heard it as: Well I argued with the judge But the bastard wouldn't budge 'Cause they caught me licking fudge And they never told me once you were a minor. Of course, the words can change slightly, but I've never heard "eating fudge" and it sounds funny to my ears if "once" becomes "that" -- I've never heard JW sing it that way. It loses its punch and doesn't communicate the shock of discovering the girl was underage if it's "that." One would think the interpretation would be narrow, considering that the song seems to be totally debunking the rock 'n' roll myth -- you know no work, much booze, much sex, and a wild, fun life, more money than God, the money comes easy (it's the name of the song), etc. After all it is something that Fripp seems to enjoy doing. ------------------------------ From: "Brown, Ken" Subject: Clouds Above Mercury follow-up? Date: Sun, 12 Jan 97 11:57:00 EST Well nothing Torn as done as come close to touching the immortal 'Clouds Above Mercury'. He has done others that are close. Besides 'Polytown', with Karn and Bozzio. There are his two most current solo cd 'What Means Solid Traveler' and 'Tripping Over God'. More obscure Torn cds that are is the same mode as CAM are Mark Isham 'The Beast' soundtrack with Torn, and The Lonely Universe self title cd with Karn, Mike Lambert and Mike White. All recommend to anyone who wants to hear torn's monster playing. Keep the Faith (in the music) Ken ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 13:18:43 -0500 (EST) From: Emuguy5830 at aol dot com Subject: Bill's humor first, thanks to everyone who replied to my CAM post. Everything was very helpful (and I'm hoping I'll one day have the money to buy some of the cds). Anyway. I read this in the Yes Stories: Yes in their Own Words book by Tim Morse and thought some of my fellow et'ers might get a kick out of it. This is quoted from Bill Bruford in 1994. "I love seeing the whites of an audience's eyes instead being stuck in the back and seeing John Wetton's ass. Life for me is a series of asses that I played behind. Adrian Belew has got a very nice ass, slim. John Wetton's is a little bigger. Jon Anderson's is very small. Nice legs, lousy ass. It's a series of asses." Maybe that's why he took to walking around, drum in hand, during "Sheltering Sky." Matt C ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 14:54:59 -0500 (EST) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: Tacuma/USA/'bootleg' video Three unrelated issues that demand my input, from the latest ET: 1) The Jamaaladeen Tacuma album that Bruford plays on is called "Renaissance Man'. I think it's still in print on CD; at least, I was able to buy one a year or so ago, to repleace my LP. Bruford plays on only *one* track ("Sparkle") where he's joined by Vernon Reid on guitar. The rest of the album is certainlyh interesting enough too, fusion with distinct free jazz tendencies (undertandable, since Tacuma played with Ornettee Coleman). There's also a chamber piece for bass guitar and string quartet. 2) The version of 'Schizoid Man' that appeared on USA (the LP) was, I thought, derived from the PRovidence, RI show, not WIlmington DE. It's the same one found closing the Providence show on the Great Deceiver boxed set. 3) SOmeone said that the 'Live In Japan' video that was shown on MTV in the 80's can only be a bootleg if you find it in stores. This is incorrect. THis video was released officially on laser disc (and possibly on VHS, I don't remember) in fuill-length form (the MTV stuff was an excerpt). I used to see it in stores but it's likely long out of print now, except as an import. I distinctly recall it being used by a stereo magazine that was reviewing home theater sound in the 80's. This and the Frejus show were the only official video KC available for many years. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 15:32:08 -0500 (EST) From: Roberto Galvez Subject: Re: Elephant Talk Digest #327 > >From: Matt Walsh >Subject: Peter Hammill >Date: Fri, 10 Jan 97 15:11:00 PST > >Does anyone have Peter Hammill's "X My Heart" album? I am debating on >buying it and thought I'd see if I can get some opinions. I'm not too >thrilled with the song on the "Sometimes God Hides" sampler. but I like his >work with VDDG, and have his "Room Temperature" live CD, which is OK. If >anyone can give me a description of the album and their opinions of it, it >would be greatly appreciated. Of course, respond to me directly, no use in >wasting bandwidth. > >Thanks, > >Matt Walsh >mattw at smginc dot com I have it,and my opinion is that it's a beautiful,mature work.Hammill has changed a lot,and in recent years his style has become quiet,calmed,instead of the violence.But that peace was a little boring too. In X my Heart he's returned to some aggresive songs (but you'll miss his unique madness of early records).However it has really excellent songs. If you're into the 'Room Temperature..' mood ,you'll appreciate it. I think Hammill has reached the status of other mature and excellent songwriters like John Cale,Van Morrison,Leonard Cohen,Richard Thompson or Lou Reed.He has almost left progressive rock styles,but he's producing honest and intimate music.(Also,I would like to hear another collaboration with Fripp .Does someone here know the song 'The Birds' from Hammill's 'Fool's mate'? it's a delicate song with a subtle Fripp ). Roberto. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 15:32:06 -0500 (EST) From: Roberto Galvez Subject: I really miss the saxes and flutes Hi !I think few people here talk about 'Lizard' or 'Islands'.Over the years I had different favorite KC LP's (Red,ITCOTCK,Lark ...) but ,right know I think 'Lizard' is the most obscure,advanced, mad,and interesting Fripp work to date ,as a composer.(excuse me ,IMHO). The mix is excellent : a Jimi Hendrix-alike voice (Gordon Haskell), Jon Anderson appearence,the insane Keith Tippet,a strange Bolero,the savage Cirkus,and one of the most satanic solos of our dear friend RF,the finale of The Battle of Glass Tears. But what I really miss from the old KC is the use of winds (saxes,flutes,etc). I'm happy to hear again the mellotron in the new KC ,but it would be interesting to enjoy a guitar-sax duel also, as 'The Sailor's Tale' and '21st century ..'. Peter Hammill's solo career still plays with his old partner and sax player,David Jackson ,who keeps the spirit of the old VDGG in many songs. In that case,'Red' is an excellent compilation of all KC styles (pre-Belew). (I love Mc Donald and Collins playing in 'Starless'). cheers, Roberto. Lima,Peru. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 22:32:13 +0100 From: GW Subject: Easy Money - lyrics For that EASY-MONEY - threat: these are the lyrics (according to the 'Chasing The Dragon'-booklet) : --- EASY MONEY Your admirers in the street Got to hoot and stamp their feet In the heat from your physique As you twinkle by in moccassin sneakers Well I argued with the judge But the bastard wouldn't budge Cos they caught me licking fudge And they never told me once You were a minor ... Easy money With your figure and your face Strutting out at every race Throw a glass around the place Show the colour of your crimson suspenders We could take the money home Sit around the family throne My old dog could chew his bone For two weeks we could appease the almighty Just making easy money ... --- Ciao GW ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 19:28:49 -0500 From: James Poulakos Subject: Fripp on Bowie: _Low_? I can't remember if Fripp plays on any track of _Low_, an Eno/Bowie album, but it has cool Eno tricks and guitar tidbits from other players that might appeal to fans of _Scary Monsters_ or Eno/Fripp collaborations, IMO. If you do wish to check it out and are scouring the cut-out bins, look for album cover with a photo of Bowie, in profile, sporting the slit-pupil eyes he wore in the film _The Man Who Fell To Earth_. He stands against an eerie orange sky. Because I recognized this photo as linked to the movie, I ignored this album for years, but when I finally heard it, I dug the jangly, angular guitar and Eno's tape manipulations. IMO, the coolest Bowie album next to _Scary Monsters_. ------------------------------ From: "Weissenburger - Jeremy S." Date: Sun, 12 Jan 1997 23:11:16 -0500 Subject: Earthbound, boots, and Hendrix That sums it up nicely: >From: Andrew Dietr Miller >I recently bought The 21st Century single, and am very impressed with the >live version taken from USA I live from Wilmington Delaware. I thought >that was really interesting too, considering I live in Wilmington and have >all my life. Does anyone know where that was recorded at? And were is the > rest of USA I from, and finally can anyone get me a copy of that? I'm sure there's a lot of responses to this, but the album you're looking for is "Earthbound," NOT USA. USA is the S&BB line-up, "Earthbound" is the Islands tour. In an older ET were the dates and times for the album. Here they are again: 1.21th Century Schizoid Man (11.45) 2.Peoria (7.30) 3.The Sailors Tale (4.45) 4.Earthbound (7.08) 5.Groon (15.30) 1 and 5 recorded in Willmington, Delaware, 11.Feb.1972 2 recorded in Peoria, 10.March 1972 3.recorded in Jacksonville, Florida, 26.Feb.1972 4 recorded in Orlando, Florida, 27. Feb. 1972 The players: Robert Fripp: electric guitar Mel Collins: alto, tenor and barritone sax, mellotron Boz: bass, vocals Ian Wallace: drums Re: FISHBOY and the meeting of Hendrix & Fripp: It is known that Hendrix did meet with the late 60s Crimso group. There is a boot (more on the b word later) with Hendrix, Lake & McDonald, I think. But the sound is so bad from the person I knew who had it I never pursued it. As for Hendrix/Fripp, I see no reason for him to lie about it. I remember him on an MTV Documentary about Hendrix (opened with Fripp, ended with Belew). He may have gotten the dates mixed up, but what would he gain by lying? To Christopher Jepson : "Larks' Tongues In Aspic" was coined by Jamie Muir, not Fripp. The sound of the words together sounded good, that's all. From: Daniel Wright >Let's stop this BS and call bootlegs bootlegs! > >There are legitimately released imports, and then there are bootlegs. This is true. It's just that any time the word bootleg comes up, there are some people who get upset due to its legality. This is why people try to skirt the issue by calling them "imports." >The Japan video, so far as I know (which does not mean anything), was shown >on MTV and is not available "legitimately". I taped my copy from the >original broadcast and am disappointed in that it was not even a whole show >(Is there more available?). Which Japan show? 95 or 84? >There is a need to distinguish the two. Fripp has been shallow enough to >be anti-boot, but little does he realize that most people who buy boots or >trade them already have everything they've released. I think he does. I think most bands realize that many boot collectors are fans. Perhaps overeager fans, but fans nonetheless. >If Fripp (or anyone else) is really worried about boots, let them do >what Frank Zappa did, and release everything that was ever bootlegged on >CD, from the best copy available, which is bound to be better than >anything any greedy bootlegger who will charge you $25 a disc can ever >expect to reproduce. Fripp decided to do one better by coming out with TGD set. Most CD boots don't really have a lot of their improv material on it. >Fripp, BTW, is not immune to greed, and taking advantage of those of us >who will buy anything we don't already have. The "abbreviated", >"compact", "concise", "Young person's guide" and most especially Frame >by Frame are all examples of this. Well, each artist's group tries to come out with a greatest hits package. I, for one, have not bought the concise or abbreviated versions. Most of the time greatest hits packages are for casual listeners who might want a starting point but not buy every album. BTW, the only two that are now regularly printed are "Concise" and "FbF," right? >Great Deceiver was an excellent effort and is the best release I own of any >Crimson, save possibly for "Un Reve Sans Consequence Especie", which is of >the same era - even though the date is incorrectly labeled and the cover >art is unimpressive. Depends on which version you get, I guess. Isn't this show the most bootlegged? --Jeremy ------------------------------ From: "Mathews, Thomas J." Subject: Trey's hair / Luscious Jackson Date: Mon, 13 Jan 97 07:52:00 EST Trey was recently seen with a new haircut. It was described to me as short, very short. I would imagine this is, for some people, a big deal cutting off a decades worth (?) of hair. I wouldn't know. You heard it here 1st. In the most recent _Option_ in an article about "Luscious Jackson" band member Vivian Trimble says: "...got into a multitude of weird things like Can and King Crimson." The next sentence reads: "Hearing this confession, the other members of Luscious Jackson elbow each other and snicker." I know nothing about L.J. (except the cool name) but found the band members reaction interesting. What's so funny? Liking KC is weird and humorous to others? I think Vivian should drag her fellow band members kicking and screaming to a show - they won't be giggling after that. (short sigs are better) tj ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 14:02:05 +0100 From: Ferenc Riesz Subject: Thrak in the Middle Ages; Tritones Hi, if you want to hear Thrak-like music from the Middle Ages, check out "Music from the court of King Janus at Nicosia" by Huelgas Ensemble (SONY Vivarte label). It's mindblowing music from XIV and XV century with extremely complex rhythms, mainly for voices but with some instrumental lines. A somehow related question: is the strong affection of Mr. Fripp to tritones connected with the prohibition of tritones in mediaeval church music (tritones were considered as the Devil in music). (It would be an interesting thread to track the role of tritones in Fripp's music and its evolution. Even worth a Thesis !!) RF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 14:19:00 -0500 From: jmc at sdr dot utias dot utoronto dot ca (James MacKenzie Crawford) Subject: Re: Status of Soundscapes... Dave Lane asked: > As for Fripp content, does anyone know anything about the releases of > "That Which Passes" and "Soundbytes", both of which were supposed to be > out in December according to PossProd? I just happened to ask the same question to Mark Perry and this was his reply: > The box will be coming(scheduling is up to England and they're not sure) anf > That Which Passes is scheduled for early February. > Mark See ya, James C. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 15:16:03 -0500 (EST) From: Jeremiade at aol dot com Subject: The mind is a hopper... A few mentions of various, pointless values: Was on vacation in the Augusta, ME area a year or two ago, watching TV during a lull in the fishing, and caught a PSA (public-service announcement) dealing with delinquient children (as in "always know what your child is up to or Junior's bound to wind up dead, in jail, or both"). Background music was "Dig Me." Insane. Yes, there's a lull here, too. I wish Wetton would just set us all straight (and knock all of us on our arses). I'll now never be able to eat fudge again. Finally, would the gent who was attempting to cook a Turducken please weigh in with the results? I'm curious as hell to find out! Thanks. Jere ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 18:08:14 -0500 From: rhino at indy dot net (rhino) Subject: DVD's--Worth the Wait? >A number of people have inquired about laserdisc versions for King Crimson'= s >Live in Japan video and Yes' Keys to Ascension video. Presently these are >only available as expensive Japanese imports which we can get. The King >Crimson laserdisc is $74.99 and the Yes laserdisc (last years perfomance at >SLO) is $134.99. The latter is about 150 minutes. As far as U.S. release, >Discipline has only released the VHS version of the Crimson video and has n= o >plans at this time to release a laserdisc in the U.S. Having first purchased the entire KC collection on LP, and then on Definitive Edition LP, and then on Definitive Edition CD, am I crazy to think that all the KC related video will be placed on Digital Video Disc? Recently there were technological standards agreed upon for the production of DVD's. (remember the beta vs. VHS wars?) With this in mind I have to believe this new medium will be utilized. I for one don't want to repurchase KC material every time it's reissued. I've been that route and it's expensive! The downside is I'll do without longer than I'd like because I think that tape in any format is going the way of the dinosaur. So if anyone has any keen insight to the DVD issue with particular reference to KC's output, I'm sure we'd all like to know. If DVD releases are an inevitability, then I'll wait. Then there will only be one format change left to worry about--flash chips! Cheers, rhino ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Jan 1997 11:06:56 +1000 From: j dot keens at rmit dot EDU dot AU (Jeremy Keens) Subject: giles muir and cunningham As an old poster who got waylaid for a while and is now back, I don't know if this has been mentioned, so here goes David Cunningham's piano label has released some interesting back catalogue, the relevant one of which is piano502: giles/muir/cunningham: ghost dance Have only had a chance to listen through once, but it seems like a very varied, percussion based soundtrack. There are some nice relatively solo tracks (jamie on thumb piano) plus more complex ones. not very crimsoid, but worth looking up. jeremy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 18:49:45 -0600 (CST) From: Andrew Harmon Subject: "Prog" livelihood In respose to E.B.'s post about how there is no resurgence in progressive music, I would like to point him in the direction of indie labels. Sure the recordings aren't for audiophiles and there are very important reasons why these bands are not signed to majors yet. But the music is made not to get on MTV or to make tons of money, but for the music's sake (sound familiar). Prog (I hate that word) will never make a comeback like punk, disco (shudder), or ska unless some group of execs high up in the capitalist food chain decide that it would be profitable. The very "definition" of progressive art goes against this mentality, in my opinion. Progressive music is made up of small victories and large sacrifices (wow, I really DO sound pretentious). The fact that Fripp could stand at the conference board at Virgin Records or whatever and tear the proposed contract up in front of them baffles me. Anyhoo, indie music is the way to go for Crimson-influenced (NOT Crimson-like) music, if you can stand the decibel level and the lack of pure, unabashed virtuosity. Soundgarden got really lucky, and most of the Kansas City bands are ever so slowly working their way up, but for the most part, the only place to find music that I think Crimheads (or at least their kids) could relate to are still found in smokey basement bars with bad PA's and a crowd with too much piercing and tattoos. -Haaaman ** please deposit two bits for the next post ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jan 1997 21:39:01 -0800 From: joebeats at ix dot netcom dot com (Lou Levinson ) Subject: Crimson sheet music Does anyone out here know of a good source for King Crimson sheet music??? It seems a bit hard to come by. Many thanx, JoeBeats at ix dot netcom dot com ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #328 ********************************