Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #993 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 993 Saturday, 22 June 2002 Today's Topics: Re: The food of love Yeah, Toby!/Cutler slagging Fripp/Anthony Phillips Bowie Heathen Errol's wife; Zorn/Laswell; 30th anniv editions Re: Identity of the Vicar! A sad wife/KC story SABB, Young Person's Guide & USA Crimson King Cherries USA ON VINYL - LABORATORY RESULTS Re: Anniverary editions, USA 2, KC Studio Unreleased, Definitive KC "Red" as an overture Prince Rupert Awakes with a Fracture "Thunderbird" Dead threads and "cold" newsletters Holst - Mars Why did the 80s lineup disband so quickly? Les Claypool & KC Tony Levin with Peter Murphy Re: Two new dead threads ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:27:39 +0200 From: Dario Tortora Subject: Re: The food of love >Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 01:16:33 +0100 >From: Mr Tea >Subject: The food of love > >My courting days are long gone, but I'd be interested to hear which >Crim/Fripp tracks have been effectively used by the young bucks on this list >when seeking to impress the ladies. > >Regards > >Mr Tea Starlees. I still remember: Dario -- Mac OS for productivity. UNIX for stability. Palm OS for mobility. Windows for solitaire. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:13:50 -0500 From: Albert Oller Subject: Yeah, Toby!/Cutler slagging Fripp/Anthony Phillips Hey all, Yeah to Toby for killing the wives/girlfriends topic! Especially after Josette was slagged here for her posts about Trey. In ET 989 Alan asked: >>I found it interesting how much Cutler seems to know of Fripp, considering how much he seems to dislike him. Why would anyone go out of their way to follow someone they obviously dislike? I figured Cutler was just an amateur at posting to ET. His comments seemed mild compared to what Fripp, Belew, et. al. have received in this forum. Good to hear that Anthony Phillips is still getting some attention from ET'ers, if no-one else. He has released some very good albums, post Genesis. It would be nice if his music received the acclaim and success that Gordon Haskell recently did Like everything, except music, don't take this too seriously. Regards, Albert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 15:20:40 -0400 From: "Bob Bennett" Subject: Bowie Heathen I missed the Bowie special on A&E Saturday - but I bought the new album. I think it is a very good album. The songs are subtle and I find them interesting. The Time magazine review is nothing short of rubbish and totally unfair. Bowie (except for Scary Monsters) never got a good review and yet today all those old farts who dogged his work consider him a classic. Like King Crimson, I've been listening and enjoying Bowie's work for years. This new album is a fine piece of work. Also, Tony Levin plays on the album as well. I can't think of many artists Bowie's age who are still making good or great albums - but Bowie is definitely one of them. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 13:03:05 -0700 From: "Scott Steele" Subject: Errol's wife; Zorn/Laswell; 30th anniv editions >Mind you, when the neighbours are annoying her, she knows where to find 'Red' That is funny Errol. >Zorns fairly unimpressive, as is most of his labels output...along the same level as the prodigiously mediocre Bill Laswell and his label and works. Apples and pears eh? >Still wondering, how come the 80s Crim releases are thirtieth anniversary editions? The band is thirty years old. You are correct in noting that the music is not. >in any event, a fan is still a fan, and as long as there is a love for the music, gender is irrelevant. Thank you Amelia. We would love to hear your music up here in Portland OR, please let us know when you are coming north. - S. np: Mahavishnu IV, "The Wait" from Toad's Place, New Haven CT 1986 scottst at ohsu dot edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 14:29:26 -0700 From: "LAVERNE MUNARI" Subject: Re: Identity of the Vicar! Shame on you TURTLE, for thinking "The Vicar" was Anthony Phillips....! Of ALL PEOPLE, I was sure YOU knew that "The Vicar"(right under your nose for all these years) was....TOMMY MCDERMOTT!! KINGPIN 1 original Turtle's Circus member "and the pantalooned duck...white goose neck quacked; Webcor-Webcor." CB ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 17:30:47 -0400 From: Jim Bailey Subject: A sad wife/KC story Hello all, I've been trying to decide whether to send a post about this or not, but the recent thread has helped make up my mind. Obviously I've left it just a bit too late, but if you could indulge me this once Toby, I would appreciate it. It does not really concern her dis-/like of the music, for at best she thought that the gentler, more melodic pieces were "nice," while the rest brought out a definitely negative reaction. My use of the past tense is intentional, as she passed away, suddenly, back in January, from heart failure. While it was not totally unexpected (she'd had a bypass operation five years before, and wasn't in the best overall health), there was no indication that anything was about to happen. The relevance here is that at the time I was copying pieces from TGD onto a mini-disc. I was using headphones to monitor, but not at high volume, and not all the time. It was enough, however, to mask whatever happened, since it wasn't until I went to find her several minutes later that I discovered what had happened. I will spare you all the details, but a paramedic who attended to her said that even if I had been beside her when it happened (and I have no idea how long prior that might have been) any medical attention, no matter how immediate, would still probably have been to late. That helped to assuage some of the guilt I was feeling at being otherwise occupied. For her memorial service I made a disc containing many of her favourite songs, and also included two pieces from "A Blessing of Tears," as well as "Lady of the Dancing Waters," one of the few KC pieces for which she actually expressed some fondness. While The Great Deceiver held some significance for me before, since I was at one of the performances included (Toronto, '74), it has even more now, albeit of a sadder nature. Thank you for your time. Jim Bailey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 20:27:32 -0300 From: "Diderot de Britto Jr" Subject: SABB, Young Person's Guide & USA Hi, >> From Steve McMillan >> (...) and on track 6 "The Mincer," the audio abruptly >> cuts out after about 4 minutes and 8 seconds. It >> sounds as though the tape machine just stops... It is exactly what it seemed to you. The tape reel finished just before the song. I've read this on some post not long ago, or on some liner notes. About "The Young Person's Guide To King Crimson", it was a very important source for me because all KC albums released at that time in Brazil, got out of print very soon, with NO reprints (just first print!). I got it imported (from France - FR Polydor 2625 035) in 79 and then I could know a little more what they did during 71-74. Fortunately I had "USA" that filled some gaps from Wetton/Bruford/Cross era. No need to say how I would like to have a copy of a remastered "USA". Diderot ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 01:45:53 -0700 From: "Steve McMillan" Subject: Crimson King Cherries I feel certain I'm probably not the first person to discover this, but thought I would mention it. I just saw an item (an antique, apparently) up for bid on Ebay. The item number is 1741881832. It is a label for "Crimson King Cherries." Now, I have always been under the impression that the band's name comes from a description of Satan (PLEASE do not take this to mean that the band is Satanic) and I'm reasonably sure I read that somewhere. Could it be from the cherries, though? Steve (I'll attach a .jpg of the label, but I don't know how to put it visibly into an email.) [ I cut the jpeg, sorry. Please email the poster direct if you're interested. -- Toby ] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 13:36:40 -0400 From: "Rich Rossi" Subject: USA ON VINYL - LABORATORY RESULTS Since everyone else is ultra-examining the original USA release with the various tracks that appear on Great Deceiver and Club releases, I thought I would put my vinyl copy through my own creation, the "Krimson Trackopsillator" (patent pending). Here's what the printout reads: "Who the **** cares? Why are you bothering me with this tripe? Don't you know I have better things to do with my mega processing power then to figure out who played what chord in what city on what date?" Sheesh, so sensitive! I think I need to tweak some settings....... But seriously, folks, I'd like to let you know that for sheer intensity, nothing beats this album - nothing. I remember quite well when I purchased it in 1976 how amazing LTIA II was (and still is). Talk about ripping and shredding.....Lament and Exiles are so powerful and moving they bring tears to my eyes. Asbury Park is another ripper/shredder. The thing about Easy Money that impresses me is that Mr. Wetton actually remembers all of the words! And bringing it home is 21stCSM - frantic, frenetic, fabulous! That's my two cents. If anyone has a release they'd like analyzed through the "Krimson Trackopsillator" (patent pending), please feel free to ring me up. Cheers! Rich Richard R. Rossi CMC CD-R Duplication 650 Rock Cut Road Walden, NY 12586 www.cdrdup.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:33:13 -0600 From: "Christian Hess Araya" Subject: Re: Anniverary editions, USA 2, KC Studio Unreleased, Definitive KC On Thu, 13 Jun 2002 18:15:22, lawrence moseley wrote: > Still wondering, how come the 80s Crim releases are > thirtieth anniversary editions? By my count it is now > 21, 19 and 18 years respectively for these blessings > to have been given to the sweaty masses... As far as I understand it, the editions are meant to celebrate the band's thirtieth anniversary, not the releases themselves. Christian Hess San Jose, Costa Rica ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:52:59 -0600 From: "Christian Hess Araya" Subject: "Red" as an overture Glancing over my KC collection, I guess I must now have around four or five different versions of "Red" (the song, not the album): the original studio version, plus three or four live ones. Of these, my favorite is the one on "Cirkus", for its sheer ferocity and T-Lev's brontosaurian bass. However, lately I've become increasingly convinced that the beauty of "Red" lies in the original studio version, which is slower and not as loud as the live ones. In fact, I now think that perhaps it was never meant to be a stand-alone song, but rather just an overture, in the classic sense, to the rest of the album: an instrumental opening, designed to set the tone for what comes next, leading beautifully into the cello notes with which "Fallen Angel" begins. Not that I don't appreciate the live performances, of course. It's just that it seems best to savor the song as an integral part of the album instead of by itself. Wonder if anyone else has experienced the same feeling. Christian Hess San Jose, Costa Rica ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:40:39 +0300 From: Hans Annellsson Subject: Prince Rupert Awakes with a Fracture Dear KCfans, Maybe this CD could be of interest to you. Artist:Hans Annellsson Title:One More Time For The World Some More Label:Annellssongs (ANNCD8) Distribution:Record Heaven,www.recordheaven.net, look under "Prog Scandinavia". Songlist: 1.Prince Rupert Awakes (Fripp-Sinfield) 2.What's the Ugliest Part of Your Body? (Zappa) 3.Anabolic Parabolic (Annellsson) 4.Close to the Edge (Anderson-Howe) 5.Woman is the Nigger of the World (Lennon-Ono) 6.Let's Rock!(the Boat) (Annellsson) 7.Afterglow (Banks) 8.Magical Mystery Tour (Lennon-McCartney) 9.Fracture (Fripp) 10.Onward (Squire) 11.Basement Dweller (Annellsson) 12.South Side of the Sky (Anderson-Squire) 13.It Conquered the World (Annellsson) 14.Yours is No Disgrace (Anderson-Squire-Howe-Bruford-Kaye) 15.Sit.com (Annellsson) 16.Here Come the Warm Jetz (Eno) -- www.annellssongs.com www.swebmusic.com www.planetzappa.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:54:15 -0700 From: Brian Mafi Subject: "Thunderbird" Hello, Okay...SOMEONE divulge a little as to what this/these ditties sound like. I've no access to the Internet/radio deal. Is it only Pat & Trey? what can you compare it to? Somewhat like the current KC fare? Perspiring minds want to know! Peace, Brian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:30:16 +0200 From: "Avi Shaked" Subject: Dead threads and "cold" newsletters >Date: Fri, 14 Jun 2002 13:40:41 +0400 >From: "Toby Howard, ET Moderator" >Subject: NEWS: Two new dead threads >Hello ETers. >As of now I'm declaring the following two threads "dead": >- Bill Bruford and Genesis >- "Why do/don't wives/girlfriends like/dislike King Crimson?" >So no more posts on these topics please. Now, that's a shame. This is not the first time I wanted to say this: Why? Sometimes it seems like people here, who are all King Crimson fans, enjoy certain subjects, and then these topics are pronounced "dead". It's a shame, especially when it comes to more personal topics such as "wives/girlfriends/boyfriends & king crimson", which actually add a more personal touch to this "Internet Newsletter" (what a "cold" title...) Yours truly, Avi ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 15:24:56 +0100 From: "Mike Dennis" Subject: Holst - Mars 'Live at the Marquee 1969' has a recording of Mars, and Sid Smith recounts that for ITWOP this became 'The Devils Triangle' for fear of legal action by the Holst family. Was there ever any or threats of it when the Marquee CD came out? Or had the necessary 50 years passed? I know the Tomita version of 'The Planets' and Manfred Mann's Earthband's 'Joybringer' both were subject to legal restraint in the UK, so how did KC get away with it? Perhaps the Holst's like KC? --- On a different note, I ordered a couple of CDs from DGM on 17th June, they were despatched the same day in Los Angles and arrived here in the UK today (20th June). Good show! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 18:48:54 -0400 From: "Nik Smith" Subject: Why did the 80s lineup disband so quickly? Was that the plan from the beginning? or did Fripp have one of his "change of hearts" like with the wetton lineup? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 21:54:09 -0400 From: "Griebel Greg" Subject: Les Claypool & KC I recently obtained a legally tradeable bootleg of a Les Claypool & FFB show from July '01 @ the Orlando House of Blues. The 2nd song is a great cover of "Thela Hun Ginjeet". Well about 5 minutes in, they slow things down and Les speaks to the crowd, saying something to the effect : " This song is Thela Hun Ginjeet from an extrordinary album by King Crimson. I noticed looking at the calander that they're going to be in town in the next week or so and I would highly recommend that you check them out, it will change your life. Whereas attending this event likely won't change a damn thing." They then proceeded to shred THG for another 7 or 8 mins. Good stuff. He's right - the 1st time I saw KC back in '84 it certainly had a tremendous positive effect on my musical "life". BTW - if anyone's interested in working out a trade or B&P for this show, drop me an email. later- greg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:16:13 -0700 From: christopher anderson Subject: Tony Levin with Peter Murphy Ian: I'm not shure but the regular Stick man in Murphy's act is Fergus Marsh who also shaves his head and has a mustache. But I could be wrong..... Finger to the fretboard - cja ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 19:30:38 -0400 From: "Barry Moore" Subject: Re: Two new dead threads >>But the "Women & KC" thread?!? It is a valid and obviously >>popular topic, so I would be most interested in hearing our >>esteemed moderator's reasoning behind making it a dead thread. >[ It had gone on too long and was getting boring. Sorry, I have > to be subjective sometimes :-) -- Toby ] I don't mean to be a jerk, Toby, because you do a nearly thankless job (thank you, BTW), but since when is it a moderator's job to decide what is "boring" or not? I've seen quite a few topics in ET that *I* consider to be boring. I'm not petty enough to stop reading ET because of this, but am I the only one that is mildly disturbed by it? I guess it's the principle of the thing... considering the subject matter is not off-topic, it rather smacks of censorship, doesn't it? [ Barry, you make some good points, and I'm happy to reply. I cut the thread because I got a whole bunch of people emailing me requesting that I do so, plus I felt (as Mr Moderator) that the thread was wearing a little thin. I tread a fine line, I guess. As Mr Moderator I have to make decisions, and these are naturally personal decisions (because I am a person!). On reflection, I think I may have been a bit over-hasty with the "wives/girlfiends" thread, so I apologise to ETers, and the thread may now continue... for a while :-). -- Toby ] Oh well... either way, I'm moving on. :-) Obligatory Crim content: For those who are waffling on whether or not to purchase Club 20... the quality is abyssmal. For diehard bootleg fans only, IMHO. ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #993 ********************************