Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #967 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 967 Wednesday, 17 April 2002 Today's Topics: Level Five: Japanese Vs. standard editions An Eye for an I Tony Levin interview with David Dye on World Cafe Logical Conclusions KCCC "unsustainable" Toyah; Bruford; GG song; Club 20 9/8 and genesis Re: KC Video Scam KC VIDEO SCAM!!! 4/4 as an odd time sig? Apocalypse in 9/8 Rome asf --> mp3 What key is 21st Century Schizoid Man in? T Levin Band and Agent 22 Allan Holdsworth's concerts I need DGM's phone # in LA Requiem,Anyone? Re: Nuovo Metal DGM. IS King Crimson... or not? KC collectors club CDs GIG REVIEW: CGT/Flower Kings ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:40:44 +0100 From: Nick Loebner Subject: Level Five: Japanese Vs. standard editions Hi all, I just received the Japanese copy of this CD expecting to find 6 tracks only to find the same tracklist. There appears to be minor differences between the two - but of course had I known I wouldn't have shelled out #25 for the disc.... Anyone got any info on this can they please reply to me privately as well as to ET (I don't get time to read ET regularly). Thanks, - Nick. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 14:05:06 -0400 From: "Josh Chasin" Subject: An Eye for an I In ET #966, Jordan Clifford ponders: > i wonder how long it took you to change all the c's to capital Ks, and i > also wonder if you could not do it next time you post Eye just want 2 say, if U think this is annoying, B glad U aren't on the Prince mailing list! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 14:07:45 EDT From: PeterSchaut at aol dot com Subject: Tony Levin interview with David Dye on World Cafe Greetings! Sorry, I know this is very short notice but, I just heard that David Dye will be interviewing Tony Levin on the World Cafe radio show. The show will air on 88.5 FM WXPN in Philadelphia, at 2:00 PM (14:00) on Thursday, April 11 Philadelphia time. For more info and how you can hear it on-line go to http://xpn.org/sites/wc/up.mv Once again, sorry for the late notice. VROOM, VROOM! Peter Schaut ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 14:09:15 -0400 From: "Beth El" Subject: Logical Conclusions For those of us still hung-up on the turntable question - DJ Logic is performing Thursday, April 11 at 8:30 PM at the Knitting Factory (located on Leonard St. between Church and Broadway in Manhattan). I am not familiar with those he is performing with, but neither have I known anyone at his other shows I've caught. A fine opportunity for those in the Manhattan area. Hope to see you there. Sincerely, Scott Congregation Beth El 222 Irvington Ave. South Orange, NJ 07079 (973)763-0111 www.bethelnj.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 13:13:06 -0700 From: Bob Ramstad Subject: KCCC "unsustainable" Just a quick heads-up for those who haven't seen this yet. http://www.disciplineglobalmobile.com/order/ Click on KCCC, and read in disbelief... It's dated April 8th. Pardon me if my head has been in the sand, but I haven't seen anything about this on Elephant Talk... I had wanted to renew my membership, seeing as how 6 * 3 = 18 and with Club 16 missing in the sequence and Club 19 just arrived, I figured I should take care of it... I really enjoyed the subscription format, and it's too bad that it will not continue. Bummer! -- Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 16:08:39 -0700 From: "Scott Steele" Subject: Toyah; Bruford; GG song; Club 20 >TOYAH-SHEEP FARMING IN BARNET /... (2CD) The first 2 Toyah albums released in a double CD set - Sheep Farming In Barnet & The Blue Meaning, both from 1980. Can anyone review these? Who is in her band in 1980? Thank you. >Bill Bruford's Earthworks/Footloose in NYC ....DVD Can anyone address the similarities/differences in the song lists between the CD and DVD (in other words, should I own both or will one do)? >Heck, it's possible to take something in 4 and make it an odd time signature. There's a Gentle Giant song that's in four that's very hard to count until you manage to figure out where 1 is. Downbeat is on *weeks*!! >Noticed Club Selection 20 is 1972. Is that the "Boz" band, or the Cross/Muir Band? Zoom Club, Frankfurt is the Cross/Muir Band with Bill, Bob, and Wilton. I own a crappy version of this and am very excited to get a regrooved version from DGM. - S. np: Zappa/Ponty, "Canard du jour" scottst at ohsu dot edu ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:07:38 -0400 From: "Michael Destefano" Subject: 9/8 and genesis This might only be my interpretation, but Tony Banks seems to solo over odd time signatures by playing in 4/4 and inserting threads to bring the phrases back into the defined meter(listen to the many times he repeats phrases in order to jump back into the time sig.). It's pretty obvious that Genesis micro-composes almost everything; so when Tony Banks "solos"-it isn't improvised. This affords him the luxury of fitting the solo into the odd meter and not having to think and create in real time. Also remember that the verses are in 9/4, which I believe is what Banks thinking process is based on ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:18:11 +0100 From: Tim [mailto:tfoster6272 at comcast dot net] Subject: Re: KC Video Scam > From: Dave Allen [mailto:allen508 at hotmail dot com] > Sent: 10 April 2002 01:39 > To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com > ubject: KC VIDEO SCAM!!! > > I was glancing over my junk mail the other day before dumping it, as one > does, and I noticed a "KING CRIMSON videos..." subject line. So I click on > it and discover a list of KC and related videos, including one from '74. > Attached was an order form. > > Interested, but not being a complete idiot I decided to check out their web > site before going any further. I discovered it was an all-porn video site > (I won't name it here). Somehow hotmail knew to throw this email in with > my > junk mail. > > Anyway, I'm assuming they got my email address from Elephant Talk and > thought I'd warn y'all. Has this happened to anyone else? Maybe Josette's > found a new way to waste our time. > > - Dave Just a note that yes, I got that email too. What's the scoop Toby, did someone scam all of our emails? I didn't check the web site out initially, but Dave is right. The content is, er, questionable... Tim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:18:32 +0100 From: wviland at thin-film dot com [mailto:wviland at thin-film dot com] Subject: KC VIDEO SCAM!!! I got the email also. I expected it came directly from Robert so I deleted it before opening. The guy is always bugging me for ideas. Ok here's one. Try a photo session in Time Square right next to MTV studio. Play the turntable. Perhaps you could get a Philip Morris sponsership. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 12:41:14 +0200 From: Laurent Masse Subject: 4/4 as an odd time sig? >Heck, it's possible to take something in 4 and make it an odd time >signature. There's a Gentle Giant song that's in four that's very >hard to count until you manage to figure out where 1 is. And we have the verses and ending of Firepower on Sylvian/Fripp's the first day. Absolutely not difficult to count if you listen to the drums only, but Marotta's 1 is actually 1 1/2 beats after everybody else's, which leads to some serious discomfort when the "choruses" come in. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 12:52:27 +0200 From: Laurent Masse Subject: Apocalypse in 9/8 >The problem with trying to count "Apocalypse in 9/8" is that Genesis is >playing in polyrhythm and the entire "movement" is not in 9/8. Although >Tony Banks is for the most part playing in 9/8, Mike Rutherford is playing >in a syncopated 3/4 against Banks. In the break between the verses, Banks' >phrasing shifts to 12/8 while Rutherford still plays the synocopated 3/4 >riff. (I have never been great at rhythmic analysis from recordings, but >this is what I can get out of it). Or maybe it's just that the basic 1-2-3-4 / 1-2-3 / 1-2 pattern makes it completely odd sounding? Like if you count a basic 4/4 as 1-2-3-4-5 / 1-2-3 ? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2002 00:04:00 -0400 From: "Jennifer Haines" Subject: Rome asf --> mp3 I was wondering if anyone has had any success in converting the kcrome.asf file from the 2nd Heavy ConstruKction disc to WAV/MP3. I tried using VirtualDub 1.3c with the appropriate codec but it crashes with an access violation when trying to open the file. (Newer versions of VirtualDub will not work as Microsoft has declared asf a propriatary file format and made it illegal to backward engineer it. This functionality is not present in later versions of VirtualDub.) This method of conversion has worked on other large asf files. Any suggestions are welcome. Thanks, Andy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2002 02:39:24 -0400 From: "Nik Smith" Subject: What key is 21st Century Schizoid Man in? Probably a simple question, my band is covering it, and I don't want to do the bass solo note for note (it seems cheap if I do that) and I was wondering what key it is in. It seems like it changes. -Nik ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2002 12:17:51 -0700 From: "Pam& Dave" Subject: T Levin Band and Agent 22 Caught Tony Levin Band at the Coach House last night--and absolutely awesome concert that showcased both the music and the skills of the individual musicians. "Pieces of the Sun" is a great album, but everything about it is vastly more powerful live, so if you are hesitating about whether to drag yourself a long distance to catch this band: Do it. All in all, I have to say that if the result of having Levin out of Crimson is the music that he's been producing over the last couple of years, then its well worth it. This is amazing, underrated stuff. In addition, I have to mention one of the opening groups, 'Agent 22.' I gather that this is usually a stick player, a drummer, and a guy who plays two guitars simultaneously, but last night it was just a stick and drums. Wonderful, brilliant, imaginative music nonetheless. It doesn't look like these guys tour much (the seem to be based in San Diego), but they have two CDs. The CDs and other info about them are at an indie music website called http://www.thossounds.com. Highly recommended to all KC enthusiasts and to anyone who is interested in amazing use of the Chapman Stick--this guy is taking the instrument to new places. Cheers, David Isaak ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Apr 2002 15:59:47 +1000 From: "prof.Dawid" Subject: Allan Holdsworth's concerts Hello folks, Does anybody know anything about Allan Holdsworth's tour? I can't find any information on that subject. His official site has not been updated for a long time and I have heard that he'll play in Australia on 8 and 9 May and then in Poland on 25 May. I am not sure about that. Can you provide me with some more details? Cheers, Davy Ps. Somehow connected with Crimso, isn't it? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Apr 2002 23:31:43 -0700 From: "PT" Subject: I need DGM's phone # in LA Hello, in the past when I've had problems with my Collector's Club subscription, I've found the best way to solve it, is by calling DGM in LA. I've misplaced the phone number and they haven't responded to any emails in the past several weeks that I've sent them. (I'm still waiting to Club 19) does anyone have the phone # of DGM in LA that they can email to me ? thanks, Pat in San Fran ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 12:10:22 +0100 From: Ricky (RIC) M Wilson [mailto:outrider1955 at juno dot com] Subject: Requiem,Anyone? Hello,and Good Evening to All Elephant Talker's... I must say that I am slightly saddened to see the end of The DGM Website as it has been...But having been in Rock Radio for two score and six,I truly know that all things GOOD must change,and this is no exception. Discipline Global Mobile has brought me many hours of reading,and listening pleasure,as well as countless others I'm sure. SO,I won't mourn too long...For deep inside,I Know,The Venal Heartless One has other plans in mind! Don't Worry...It's only beginning. And by the way, There are NO "Worst" or "Bad" King Crimson songs...Just "Different" ones. My God,What A Thought! All Things Loved,Yours... Ric Wilson/Radio Veteran And Dead Hippie,Esq. "I Played Progressive,When You Got Fired For It,Damn It"...R.W. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 13:31:12 +0200 From: Dan Jonsson Subject: Re: Nuovo Metal Hi, they are on their way to the studio right now. So it will take a while'til Nuovo Metal is released. Half a year or so. Danny ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 13:09:05 +0000 From: "lawrence moseley" Subject: DGM. IS King Crimson... or not? Hi all, While I certainly don't know what is happeing with DGM, someone far more significant and important also does not know. John Paul Jones was asked what was up and his reply was that he didn't know. Fripp just closed the web site and that was that. JPJ had been playing at a free gigi in a book shop (see tblweb.com)with Julie Felix and the question arose as did the answer such as it was. Is KC a going concern or what? What about the club? I was just sorting out my next six to get (that was the way I did my membership) especially the Live 2001 and now....? BTW the Julie Felix / JPJ gig was a superb little acoustic venture. JPJ unplugged no less. JPJ featured on both lead and rhythm mandolin! And humour. When asked to sign a LZ calendar and faced with Plant in ,er, full trouser mode, reply was 'I'm not signing THAT!...' The gig was in aid of Land Mine removal, any unworthy inference that DGM and it's associates and the purpose of the gig is mine alone. ciao for now Lawrence ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2002 09:33:18 +1200 From: "Paul Brobbel" Subject: KC collectors club CDs What are these CDs worth ? I've checked a few of them out in a store here in NZ and they're all over $200, one is even over $300. I find that offensivily excessive for these discs. The Great Deciever set is the same price as the more expensive CC discs. This is $NZ, so think of buying 300+ cans of coca cola, or over 60 Big Mac combos, equivalent to a used KC collectors club CD. I thought about joining the club but couldn't justify the money. I thought I'd be able to pick up a disc here or there over the years at a reasonable price. NOT for the price it would cost to buy every other KC album. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 19:36:50 -0400 From: Frankie Camiola Subject: GIG REVIEW: CGT/Flower Kings 4/14/02 - Bottom Line, NYC The show: Troache already posted the set list for both shows. There is really not much more I can add but to say this show was simply outrageous. The California Guitar Trio are top-notch guitarists with really great arranging skills. They played a version of Heart Of The Sunrise, Bohemian Rhapsody (their version really showed what a truly beautiful song that is), and a SICK arrangement of Beethoven's 9th Symphony (4th movement) complete with the fugal contrapuntal section. Really good stuff. But as good as they were... The Flower Kings: First set: The sound last night was fantastic, not too loud, and vocals were very present and clear. The first set was fantastic, although I still think that "Church Of Your Heart" is not my favorite choice for an opening tune."Retropolis" was so great to hear live and it segued into "There Is More" after another intense bass solo by Dr. Jonas. I almost pissed myself when they went into the infamous "Latin" section of SWA that caused such a stir on this list about two weeks ago. All I could do is look at Tim and laugh. We were all hysterical. How's that for "breaking the flow" of the tune, Timmy my man!!! But as good as this set was... Second set: When I tell you this was one of the greatest sets of any band I have ever seen, I shit you not. I rank this performance on the level of some amazing shows I have seen such as Shakti, Holdsworth, Tribal Tech, Keneally, Brecker, you name it."GoD" was so damn perfect and incredible, no description will do it justice. The grooves, the improvs, the solos, the scored passages, the emotion - it just had everything. I guess two words to describe this tune last night are profound and perfect. The rest of the set was as equally amazing, if you can believe it. If this was not the greatest set this band has EVER played, I would really be surprised. Believe me, I don't rank many shows with a perfect 10, but this second set was a 10/10. ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #967 ********************************