Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #946 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 946 Saturday, 23 February 2002 Today's Topics: THE BEARS Re: Guitarist = Insult? (Mark Tucker) Kai Eckhardt; Colin Hodgkinson Bass Players Belew covers Fripp Fripp's diary Thrak cap Guitar teams (cont) Resend: Favorite bassists? Mine was born in 1685 newsletter #944 bassists that rule the world The bass player thing... Um....one more note Re: bassists ColinH again... Re: bootsay Tight But Loose Guitar teams Oh go on then, favourite bass players ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 13:17:03 -0500 From: "D'Amour, Andrew" Subject: THE BEARS Im not sure if this is off-topic or not, but here goes. Have loved em since the first album, just got so see em the other night. Great band; great bassist. My query is this, and please feel free to email me as well as reply here; does anyone know of any tab or sheet music in existence for the Bear's oeuvre? Please let me know. Also, as to Kevin Holms comments about the 80's KC albums, interesting thought, I have to say I agree. Andrew D'Amour Investors Bank and Trust Global Treasury Operations Supervisor Portfolio/Money Desk Operations 617-937-4990 Phone 617-351-0335 Fax adamour at ibtco dot com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 11:29:51 -0800 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: Guitarist = Insult? (Mark Tucker) "So for me, no, Robert Fripp is not a guitarist he just plays the guitar." Well, according to the Oxford English Dictionary, a guitarist is "one who plays the guitar." So, if you're speaking English, your statement makes no sense. Jason ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:22:16 -0800 From: "Scott Steele" Subject: Kai Eckhardt; Colin Hodgkinson >Kai Eckhardt (find John McLaughlin's "Live at the Royal Festival Hall" disc and check this guy out!!!) Check him out as one of the leaders of Garaj Mahal. >But the best bass player I ever saw was a guy from a jazz trio called Back Door. I think his name was Colin Hodgkinson. Good call Gordon - dude is awesome - S. np: win2k class (time to take the test!) scottst at ohsu dot edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 16:16:34 -0500 From: "Beth El" Subject: Bass Players I'm happy to see that several people have already brought up Bill Laswell and Jah Wobble. They are my top two bass players. Then there is Jack Bruce, this originator of the 6-string bass, with the help of Ginger Baker on drums forced Clapton to become "Slow-hand" because he could not keep up (I have heard this comment attributed to both Ginger and Jack, but maybe neither really ever expressed it, or maybe both did). Mingus is definitely one of my top picks too and am glad to see he made other people's lists. Lastly, I am surprised Steve Harris hasn't been mentioned yet, seeing that other ETers are also not ashamed to mention Iron Maiden (Dave Murray and Adrian Smith guitar duo heroes). I really don't actively listen to Maiden anymore, but Harris's slap bass helped inspire me to play. I always loved seeing him live. As normal when I send these posts in, I'm not bothering to mention Crimson's own bass players since we are all familiar already and don't feel like comparing them; they all stand out individually at points to me. I'm sure I've forgotten some obvious people, but these are the guys that jump into my head right now. Peace and Love, Scott ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 17:26:35 -0500 From: "Speak, Robert (CAP, GEFA, Contractor)" Subject: Belew covers Fripp This falls under the category of useless trivia. When has Adrian covered a song that Robert performed the original guitar part? Talking Heads " Remain in the Light" tour; Belew performed "I Zimbra" David Bowie "Sound and Vision " tour; "Heroes" and "Fashion" Bears (current tour) "Red" Are there others? bob ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 17:27:33 -0500 From: Jack Jaundice Subject: Fripp's diary Why did Fripp stop posting his diary on-line? I SO miss them... Jack Jaundice ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:15:55 -0500 From: Geordie Robertson Subject: Thrak cap Hi folks!! I purchased one of the "Thrak" baseball caps during the 1995(?) tour and it is finally beginning to fall apart due to much usage. Does anyone know where I can find another, or at least something comparable? Thanx. - Geordie ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 01:32:30 +0000 From: "T. J. Wrench" Subject: Guitar teams (cont) One of my personal favourties: Partridge and Gregory. There's even a Crimso link there. TW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 21:08:55 -0500 From: "Stick Man" Subject: Resend: Favorite bassists? Mine was born in 1685 Hi Toby - my message got scrambled along the way so I am resending. Everybody please note I am not giving away ski trips - I snowboard. Here is my original message: Regarding bassists - I are one, and I can think of lots of heroes. However, I thought we should pay tribute to my favorite bass writer and that is JS Bach. His lines are elegant, indestructible, and educational. The pieces he has written for cello sound great and make for good agility exercise on the bass, even if they are transposed. Plus, the Stick is tuned sort of like an upside-down cello and if I keep eating my Wheaties I might be able to rip out some lines on that too. Hey, it just occurred to me that playing cello lines on an instrument with inverse tuning is kind of like Jimi playing the strat upside-down because he was left handed. Uh oh... a 6 degrees of separation thing between Bach and Hendrix is happening in my head. I am sure the Star Spangled Banner fits into this somehow... Ah... Bach. Stickman -- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 19:21:31 -0800 From: "dchetkin" Subject: newsletter #944 bassists that rule the world Who might have been the first most perfect player, who never played too much and played perfectly precise aptly called out bass lines? McCartney who else. And the first to rock it out of its league? Entwhistle!! I saw Squire on the 2000 Masterworks tour and then recently saw John Paul Jones on the Level 5 tour and I was appalled to hear ho hum criticism regarding Jone's brilliant virtuosity. What were these people expecting? He was amazing, being able to transcend his magical fingers to play pretty much anything with strings!!! Like David Lindley and Steve Howe!! In my opinion Jones put Squire in his place, who is too comfortable playing the same bass lines throughout every song and especially his fish solo year after year after tour. Levin to me is the master of our time. I recently have purchased CD's of his early 70's recordings with Buddy Rich. Utterly amazing. As for the team work of dual guitarists, Fripp and Belew have turned the world upside down and around again. Intricately and technologically stunning and rhythmically weaving spells around anyone who crosses their path. With all due respect to shred fest guitar meisters, Vai and Satriani can't compose a song if their life depended on it. I prefer Steve Morse. This man can write a mean multi faceted song and can solo any one under the table. Beat is my favorite album of the 3 80's recordings simply because it is a true reflection of life as we all know it; poppy, cheerful, romantic, rhythmic, aggresive, complex, nuerotic and sometimes instrumental. Cheers ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 14:27:20 +1100 From: "Keenan, Owen" Subject: The bass player thing... Gordon Taylor wrote >But the best bass player I ever saw was a guy from a jazz trio called Back >Door. I think his name was Colin Hodgkinson. There was no guitarist in the >band so, somehow, he played the bass parts and the lead guitar parts, chords >included, all at the same time on his bass. You could hear the album and >just think it was overdubbed but see him live and you realise it was real. I normally don't get involved in these personal opinion debates but any mention of ColinH deserves some comment. ColinH was a member of the trio BackDoor (ColinH: bass(& vox on later albums), TonyHicks: drums, RonAsbury(?): sax/flute) when he was "spotted by the late Alexis Korner who immediately recognised his potential. Alexis and Colin regularly played together up until Alexis's death in 1985(?) The duos concerts from France are well worth hearing. BackDoor's debut self titled LP was originally released on an independent Label (Blakey... I Think that's right) but was reissued by Warners the next year. Long deleted, it was issued on a German label CD last year. I am not going to try and describe this band suffice to say that as a bass player, this is the best album I have *ever* heard. A second LP "BackStreetNights" was soon released but by this stage (IMO) they had lost track of the original LPs **groove** and begun to jam more blues instead. They released a couple more LPs before their eventual break up. ColinH is of note to KC fans because you can hear him play alongside Boz, Ian Wallace & Mel Collins on several Alexis Korner LPs. I have one at home called "MisterBlues (Aussie title)". Not progressive music at all but a curious Crim related artefact. ColinH also played with TheSpencerDavisGroup and last year he released a solo LP "TheBottomEnd" on some obscure independent label. Most search engines fail to locate this title, but it is out there somewhere. Warners also commissioned and recorded a solo LP at the same time as BackDoor, but this has never been released... Anyone out there have any tapes from these sessions? Anyway, ColinH's bass playing ability is more than words can adequately describe. Please check it out, he puts most bassplayers to shame in terms of technique and flamboyancy, yet he was never "wanky". A true forgotten Gem. Cheers, O! PS. Get the BackDoor LP/CD okay! PPS. someone has done a website about him, but it's bloody hard to find. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 22:45:58 EST From: JohnWylam at aol dot com Subject: Um....one more note Re: bassists Hi, Folks -- I promised myself I wouldn't do this, but have to weigh in on the thread concerning fave bass players. This isn't a list, only a quick tale about John Wetton. I was lucky enough to see the 73/4 band twice whilst living in FL, once in '73 at Bayfront Center in St. Petersburg (of all people, Peter Frampton opened for them; his closing tune was "White Sugar," if you can believe that), and once in '74 at Curtis Hixon Convention Center in Tampa (note to DGM -- please check the spelling in relevant documents -- this from a pain-in-the-ass-former-proofreader-turned-writing-teacher). At one performance, as "Talking Drum" crescendoed toward "LTiA II," I saw Wetton do the most amazing thing I'd ever seen a bass player do -- full-out chords. Bear in mind, gentle people, that this was a long time ago and a great many bassists have moved far beyond that. At that time, and in that particular piece, it was sufficiently dramatic that to this day I haven't forgotten. Of course, the Tampa show also included a surrepticious inclusion (by Wetton) of a stanza from "In the Court...." during "Easy Money" as well as a marvelously-botched closing figure in "Starless," neither of which are less precious to me for those moments. Both performances were powerful and illuminating; I still remember them down where I live. John Wylam ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:59:37 +1100 From: "Keenan, Owen" Subject: ColinH again... Further to my last blurb... That ColinHodgkinson solo CD might be called TheBottomLine, not TheBottomEnd, can't quite remember... sorry. O! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 00:22:24 -0500 From: "Jordan Clifford" Subject: Re: bootsay >How could I EVER have neglected to mention the great BOOTSY COLLINS? >His work with James Brown & various P-funk projects virtually defined the >FUNK bass style. His slappin', snappin', poppin' right hand technique & >angular syncopations have influenced thousands of other bassists. thank god someone said it. maybe not the best bassist ever, but as far as within genres, and development , and influence, Bootsy is tha man. being a DIE HARD fan of Parliament, and everything George Clinton related, and James Brown related for that matter, i think Bootsy is incredible. now that someone finally got us onto a FUNK related subject matter, is anyone here a big Parliament/funkadelic/georgeclinton fan? I mean, prog- talk about concept albums, almost each one of Parliaments albums was a concept album. there entire being was a huge conceptual world ranging from complex metaphors and political statements to comic book characters. i am deeply into parliament, when i listen to the albums i just go nuts. ive never known any other group like them (i mean outside the p-funk family) and i never will. I know this isnt a P-Funk newsletter, but if there are any like minded people out there, drop me a line if you wanna keep this off the list. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:30:07 +0000 From: "lawrence moseley" Subject: Tight But Loose Hi ET readers, Is there anyone in a position to oblige the publisher of the excellent LZ fanzine? See below for details. NEXT TBL MAG This from Dave Lewis "I'm currently researching various features for the next TBL mag and to that end I have the following requests: Can anyone supply pics of John Paul Jones from the US King Crimson tour for possible use in the mag? -- I'm also keen to get pics from the Jan 27 Mine Aid Manchester gig and would also welcome a recording of the set. Also looking for clear pics from the Albert Hall show for use in the mag. (Please email davelewis dot tbl at virgin dot net) many thanks in advance" Thanks Lawrence ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:41:19 -0000 From: "Edward of Sim" Subject: Guitar teams Robyn Hitchcock and Kimberley Rew! Check out the Soft Boys 'Can of Bees' -- "What if '80s Crimso were a punk band!?" peace, Edward +x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+ Edward of Sim a Californian in Lancashire my band: http://www.mp3.com/VirginTwin Spiritual psychedelic power-folk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:19:31 -0000 From: "Edward of Sim" Subject: Oh go on then, favourite bass players As a passionate bassist myself, I'm afraid I can't help but chime in. It's not the typical ET list of prog and jazz dudes, though... Colin Moulding Brian Ritchie John Paul Jones Paul McCartney Levin and Gunn are both, in their different ways, HUGE for me, but I'm still so new to their playing (only been listening to KC seriously since TCOL came out), so they haven't quite found where they're going to sit in my heart, but they're certainly two of the finest musicians I've ever encountered. In fact, thinking about it, I'll add Levin to the list now -- his unbelievable work on 3oaPP (the song) alone does it for me. peace Edward +x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+ Edward of Sim a Californian in Lancashire the band: http://www.mp3.com/VirginTwin Spiritual psychedelic power-folk ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #946 ********************************