Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #885 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 885 Sunday, 4 November 2001 Today's Topics: GIG BIZ: Surplus Nashville Tix GIG BIZ: 2 Tickets for Beacon Theater NY 12/13 radio commercial St. Louis 11/25/01--Fripp and Jonesy in the SAME place! Re: New York bands (was: Prog decline in the 80's; Club 17) architects and music Re: Prog slog About this EP put on sale on forthcoming US gigs. PROG DECLINE IN THE EIGHTIES - Pink Floyd as architects beat club fall of the house of prog Beat Club DVD Vrooom Voooices 80's Prog is Prog Level 5 EP Help Can anyone assist? a well respected, self made band YO ADRIAN! Re: The 80's and MTV Re: 2nd Hand Genesis ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 17:15:55 -0600 From: roger Subject: GIG BIZ: Surplus Nashville Tix Thanks to Ticketmaster's horribly slow online ticketing experience, I have an extra pair of General Admission tickets to the Friday, November 9, 2001 show at 328 performance Hall, Nashville. Am seeking only the face value. rstevens at qx dot net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 07:13:00 EST From: Nitmotized at aol dot com Subject: GIG BIZ: 2 Tickets for Beacon Theater NY 12/13 I am looking to sell 2 tickets for the NYC show on Dec. 13 at the Beacon Theater. The seat locations are Orchestra Row K (15th row) seat numbers 13 and 15. I am looking to sell them for face value plus the Ticketmaster charges. Please e mail me at Nitmotized @aol.com. Thanks! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 05:02:56 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Stack Subject: radio commercial On my list of odd occurances... This morning I was driving into work, listening to the morning show on one of the local stations (99.1 out of Hamden, CT, if anyone is interested...), and during a commercial break, what do I hear but familiar strains of Larks' IV and one of those monster truck rally advertisement voices.... "KING CRIMSON -- LEVEL FIVE TOUR, ADRIAN BELEW, TREY GUNN, PAT MASTELOTTO, AND ... ROBERT FRIPP, KING CRIMSON -- LEVEL FIVE TOUR, 21ST CENTURY KING CRIMSON AT THE PALACE THEATRE ..." It went on for a little while, but it was certainly unexpected. A friend of mine (who lives up near Hartford...) told me the Courant was carrying an ad for the show. Anyone else see this kind of promotion? mike ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 17:20:03 -0600 From: Paul MacFarlane Subject: St. Louis 11/25/01--Fripp and Jonesy in the SAME place! Hello, biiiiiiiiggest Led Zeppelin/JPJ fan in the universe here. Also, huuuuge Crimso freak. So, naturally, since this date is going to occur, I just MUST be there. Right to the point: any tips on meeting the men before or after the show? On Jonesy's last USA tour, I'd heard he was quite friendly to meet/greet in most places. Didn't come here, of course. But as I'm 41, who knows how many opps there'll be like this-- as long as I stay in this backwatery St. Louis. Crimsos' music, Fripps ethics, smarts and wit combined with such raw, experimental musical beauty--- remains one of the greatest transformational thrills of this life. --help anyone? Respectfully, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 02:18:23 +0100 From: "Michael Liermann" Subject: Re: New York bands (was: Prog decline in the 80's; Club 17) Robert Bennett wrote: > As all of you should know, "punk" started in earnest in New York around 1972 - 1974 or so > (with bands like the MC5, Iggy Stooge, New York Dolls, the Heartbreakers, > the Deadboys, Wayne "Jane" County, to name but a few). It's a nitpick, but...you should know that The Stooges and the MC5 were based in Detroit, which was nowhere near NYC last time I checked. And Wayne County was still Wayne back in those days; he only became Jayne in the late 80s IIRC. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 13:07:10 +0800 From: Errol Tout Subject: architects and music Mike McLaughlin posted an interesting message. His quote 'They'd be stagnating or they'd have given up music and become architects' could only be described as a bit harsh - to Architects at least. Does Mr. McLaughlin suggest that Architects are failed rock stars? I have recently completed a Masters degree on Music and Architecture [an examination of the constructs] where I ended up using the constructing ideas of a piece of Music to design a piece of Architecture. You may recieve a few flames [is that the right term?] from other failed rock stars er... architects [oh what a give away]. Errol H. Tout Architect Lecturer Chair Design Communication Stream Enrolments Officer Curtin University Department of Architecture ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 00:36:19 -0500 From: DR Subject: Re: Prog slog Wonderful post, Bill. Thx for sharing. DR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 10:11:49 +0100 From: leif dot myhrer at seb dot se Subject: About this EP put on sale on forthcoming US gigs. About this EP put on sale on forthcoming US gigs. If anyone would assist me and buy me a copy I would be very thankful. I will off course send cash in advance covering all possible costs. Please email me private at leif dot myhrer at seb dot se Thanks in advance! Leif ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 13:23:05 -0500 From: David Vella Subject: PROG DECLINE IN THE EIGHTIES - Pink Floyd as architects Greetings, Eletalkers! I already responded to the original post on prog decline in the 80's, but in #884, Mike McLaughlin added his own insights, which included the following comment on Pink Floyd: > They were on drugs they produced music to trip to and they happened to > do it well but where would they be if they continued singing about > gnomes, scarecrows, and ownership of a bike, to quote some their > earliest album's subjects? They'd be stagnating or they'd have given > up music and become architects. Hhmmm... this has inspired some interesting thoughts.. architects of what? Well, if the Pink Floyd of 'Piper At the gates of Dawn' were architects, the buildings they would have designed would surely be just like those depicted in a Dr. Seuss book. Strange, bizarre, but childlike and innocent. If the Pink Floyd of 'Atom Heart Mother', 'Meddle' or 'Ummagumma' had been architects, their buildings would be even more strange and bizarre, otherworldly even, and defying gravity and other laws of reality, but not at all childlike, except perhaps a gargoyle or two to refer to past influences. More like the impossible buildings of M.C. Escher than Dr. Seuss. If the Pink Floyd of 'Dark Side of the Moon' or 'Wish You Were Here' were architects their buildings would be grand, sweeping statements, built to last on solid foundations, with the finest marble and other materials, with excellent taste in design, but no gargoyles or impossible staircases anymore. More like the highest skyscrapers in New York City than anything in Escher or Seuss. If the Pink Floyd of "The Wall" had been architects, well, I guess they WERE architects by then. And they built a wall. Out of bricks. Anyone care to speculate on post-wall buildings? I lost interest by then. I appreciate the Seuss, Escher & Skyscraper periods of Pink Floyd, but my favorite is the Escher period. Hope this makes it in before the ET gods kill the 'decline of prog' thread. Tickets secured for the KC show in Boston! Yay! Here's hoping all the wallpaper within 3 miles is duly shredded.... -David Vella ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 14:41:11 EST From: Inturmoil at aol dot com Subject: beat club As I once stated, I have the beat club dvd, and I bought it on line from a german source. I can't remember whom!!! sorry. The dvd is encoded for (i believe) region 4. If you buy this you will need a dvd player on your computer to watch it----------AND download a region killer. I believe the video illustrates that Jamie Muir was no more than a side show. . . . contributing only so much noise. The Bruford - Mastelotto combo is much more refined(and talented). Goood luck out there. Jason ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 16:02:58 -0500 From: Steve Rewa Subject: fall of the house of prog So any ideas on why Focus declined in the 80's? Do you think this is a sellout situation? I'm sorry, this doesn't really require a response. -Steve ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 16:12:48 -0500 From: Randall dot Hammill at hartfordlife dot com Subject: Beat Club DVD The Beat Club DVD is readily available, in the UK. Go to www.hmv.co.uk. Then go to the DVD section and do a search on Beat Club. You will find all of the Beat Club DVDs, including the Best of '73. But Be Aware: However, they are all Region 2 DVDs, which means they will not play on US DVD players. They will work on region-free DVD players, and DVD-ROMs with special software. What I don't know is if you will also run into a problem with the video format. The European standard is PAL, which will not play on a US TV. I'm sure there are some better-informed people who can give you more details on the technical side of this issue. This is a disclaimer from one region free player: Notes for NTSC/PAL The above region free player can play both PAL and NTSC discs providing you have a NTSC and PAL TV. For example, if you live in the USA you will only be able to play PAL region 2 discs from Europe if your TV can play PAL. Please check with your TV's manufacturer to check suitability. Toby - perhaps this should be included in the FAQ's? I hope this helps... Randy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 16:24:05 -0500 From: "Louis A.Spinelli" Subject: Vrooom Voooices Greetings to all, Can anyone tell me who is talking, and what is being said, in the background toward the end of the original studio version of "Vrooom" ? I am listening to each of the "boys" CD's (in preparation for their November 30th show at the Lakewood Civic Auditorium here in Cleveland) and remember wondering who and what it was about. Any help or thought are welcome. Thanks, Late Shift Louie Lou Spinelli Mechanical Engineering Technician NASA Glenn Research Center 21000 Brookpark Rd. M.S.14-1 Cleveland, Ohio 44135 Phone:(216)433-2082 Louis dot A dot Spinelli at grc dot nasa dot gov "Music is the Best ..." F.Z. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 16:15:09 -0600 From: Andres Gomez Subject: 80's Prog is Prog Prog is about progressing through time, and all this bands did was explore a new item available for music makers: technology. In my opinion the 80's, my childhood, were all about regressing to the roots of music to incorporate new items like beat boxes, electric drum kits, and synths. These bands wanted to re-explore their musicality from a different perspective. The way I see it, 80's KC is a return to simple concepts, but in order to strengthen knowledge regarding newly introduced elements. Just like did the ProjeKcts, BLUE, and BPM&M. Andres Gomez Costa Rica ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 16:18:36 -0600 From: Andres Gomez Subject: Level 5 EP Help I too live in a place King Crimson would never play, (or go) so I wanted to know if anyone could de me the favor of picking one of these EP's for me. Thanks, and reply privately (pollo at punkass dot com) Andres Gomez Costa Rica ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 22:39:00 -0000 From: "Dougie" Subject: Can anyone assist? Hi everyone, I'm wondering if anybody out there in ET land, will be able to help me track down some KC footage? I'm assuming it was circa _Discipline_ On a Friday night, here in the UK, Annie Nightingale (sp?) used to present a show called "In Concert" (IIRC). Anyway, KC were on one night, playing most of the _Discipline_ album in their session. I'm afraid, that due to age, and carelessness on my part, my copy has met with an untimely end. Would anybody have a copy of the above footage? If they do, would they be willing to make a copy for me? In advance, I'd send the tape, return postage + something for your trouble. This was a great session, and it's a pity it doesn't seem to be commercially available through DGM, which is why I'm putting myself at the mercy of the group. Anyone able and willing, please contact me at: d-reid at bllueyonder dot co dot uk Thx Dougie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 21:24:58 -0800 (PST) From: Bill Messinger Subject: a well respected, self made band What happened to all those bands I loved? I can't believe they let me down by changing, but what goes up must come down(you can only drop so much acid.) If we look at the life span of rock bands, we see some common trends: - the band that rocks hard then sells out to the producer of the moment - the band that aims for pop success then surprises us with substance - the band that is always great until the members all get totally sick of each other We are living in a much different world now. Things are more interconnected but not anymore interdependent (how many channels of shit on the tv to choose from?) The message of a decline in progressive music isn't to prod the old bands or dig up new ones, but rather, to create what we feel is missing on our own! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2001 01:27:33 -0800 (PST) From: Bill Messinger Subject: YO ADRIAN! Looking through the RF encounter posts, I was reminded of a sophomoric prank... When I was a teenager I used to go into this dept. store with my juvenile delinquent friends, and we'd go to the toy isle in search of a product called Silly String. We'd then run about the store spraying unsuspecting shoppers with the pink, stringy, goo. Wouldn't it be a great idea if, rather than trying to talk to Fripp, we spray him with Silly String? (he would look just like he did back in the 60's) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2001 09:41:46 EST From: Gtrman3811 at aol dot com Subject: Re: The 80's and MTV I guess I beg to differ on this one, I'd like to know what great music MTV spawned in the early 80's; maybe Journey, how about John Cougar or REO Speedwagon. If memory serves me well, there might have been a few good songs at best. If anything, it was the newness of it all that made it intriguing, beyond that, it made the Top 40 stations of the day seem progressive. On another front, it amazes me that Pink Floyd - The Wall, and Final Cut is taking a beating, two great recordings, in my opinion. As far as Yes is concerned, I jumped off the bandwagon after Big Generator. I got caught up when they got back together, being that, I missed them first time around, but I did see them live on Union and A,B,W, and H; both excellent concerts. I would go see them again if Bruford and Wakeman were with them again, otherwise they're a shell of what they used to be. Regards, Mike ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2001 16:10:13 From: "David Reilly" Subject: Re: 2nd Hand Genesis Keeping short and sweet in response to one of many points made by Doug Abrell in #883 - it seem obvious that you should find more copies of Invisble Touch, Genesis or We Can't Dance in the 2nd Hand market, as many more copies of these are in circulation due to their immense mainstream popularity. ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #885 ********************************