Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #842 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 842 Wednesday, 23 May 2001 Today's Topics: GIG BIZ: Krimson ConneKctions page Movie Discipline Remaster General Crimson/Tool, V-Drums, etc. Primus-les claypool. Re: KC and Toolish negativity ColleKctor's Club questions tool/crim crap Matte Kudasai versions Bruford's Cash The REAL wacky stuff... alt.music.tool on KC Re: King Crimson in painting ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 08:23:44 -0400 From: Dave Subject: GIG BIZ: Krimson ConneKctions page Hey gang... Just sending another reminder... http://www.midnightmecca.com/crim/fsguest.html is awaiting posts from/for Crimsos going to shows that want to find others needing or having spare tix/hotel space/etc to swap/sell/share, or even just to meet up! Drop in and check it out... Thanx Dave PS: See ya in Nashville! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 15:03:33 +0100 From: Sphere Subject: Movie How about Tony Levin as Tony Levin? I seem to remember seeing him playing a bass player with Paul Simon in some '80s film, and he did a fine job! Anyone have any details on the film? Neil -- Sphere3 Official web site: http://www.sphere3.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 11:19:31 -0400 From: "Danny Stamper" Subject: Discipline Remaster Whoever was complaining about the sound quality of the new Discipline remaster should consider himself lucky he even has one to listen to. Yesterday, after waiting nearly a month to receive my copy of the newly remastered Discipline, I got it home, only to discover that it had no disc in it. I am still cussing over that one. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 12:11:03 -0400 From: "Lincoln McCormick" Subject: General "I think its ironic that Fripp has said on several occasions how much he likes Tool, yet bands like Anekdoten (who really do sound like Crimson) don't get commentary." Robert Fripp has traditionally put a lot of work into writing his own unique music. Does it not make sense that he would have greater respect for other artists who did the same than for those who tried to emulate the sounds of others? ----- Lincoln lincoln at flatlinesystems dot net ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 16:56:30 -0000 From: "Cameron Devlin" Subject: Crimson/Tool, V-Drums, etc. CRIMSON/TOOL: Why is everyone so bothered? It's only 7 dates, not an entire tour. If it goes well, then perhaps Crimson would become the support for a longer tour, but considering the audience of a Tool gig, it's unlikely to happen. What do you all think will happen? Fripp will perform 1 gig with Tool and then out of disgust for the crowd, folds King Crimson and never plays guitar again? Relax! We all make mistakes, and only a few of you have even considered the possibility that this may be the best thing to have happened to Crim, commercially, since the Rolling Stones Hyde Park gig in 69. V-DRUMS: I own a set of TD-8 V-Drums, for my own studio work. These used to have better sound than the TD-10s (in my opinion) before the TDW-1 Expansion Pack came out for the 10s. Some of the sounds are completely indistinguishable from acoustic drums, if you play them right (the occasional triggering of the rimshot instead of the main snare sound makes it sound more broken up and natural) however a lot of them are really not very good. That's why I stick to electronic sounding sounds with the occasional real sounding acoustic kit. On speaking to Pat, he would seem to prefer the acoustic snare and bass drum to the electronic version of the same (so don't blame him, basically). In fact, his exact answer the the question "What made you change back to acoustic snare and bass drum?" he said: "I guess Fripp finally realised what all us drummers have been saying" I have a feeling that the un-natural sounding drums were intentional. If he wanted to sound like an acoustic kit Fripp would have made him use "the good sounds", or indeed, an acoustic drum kit! As a side note, I've managed to construKct (sorry) a pretty nice replica of the Bruford THRAK kit on the V-Drums.. if anyone has a TD-8, just make some alterations to the "Crack!" kit... notice the similarities, especially on the snare. Sounds great for Dinosaur! THE "Kc" THING: I agree with whoever said it - this is just getting stupid now. "The De-ConstruKction of Light", "EleKctriKc", "A Virtuous CirKcle"... what's next, "LarCks Tongues in AspiKc Part (whatever)"? (oh god... I've given Fripp a new title....) My problem with it is not that "This Is King Crimson, It Should Be Serious Blah Blah Blah Blah BLAH BLAH" but that the joke is over. We all smirCked at the PROJEkCTS, and even when we got to The ConstruKction of Light, it was still an nice injeKction of humour into an otherwise straight-faced group of fans but it's just getting irritating now. Not that I'll stop buying albums if it continues.. or that anything will happen if the band ignores these comments... just forget I said anything. "FRIPP? GOD?" POST: The original post wasn't meant in a "Hey, does Fripp like moshing and crowd surfing, because if he does I'll do it! I WANT TO BE LIKE ROBERT FRIPP!!!!". It was meant in a "Har har har... Crimson & Tool? What does Fripp think of moshing and crowd surfing? Har har har ". So calm down. REM: Entirely unrelated, but I think the new album is pretty great. Buy it. You know you must. It's called Reveal. FREE ADVERTISING SECTION: Go to http://www.alteredstate.co.uk We're attempting to get an album recorded during the summer for dumping onto record companies.. our first choice being Discipline Global Mobile due to their policies - that'll only happen if we can find a way to get it to them (they're quite good at hiding). We have sound samples of two of our tracks - Frak-tl Zoom (based around a riff that I came up with*) and No Data (*you can blame me for the name - I soon found out about the Brian Eno track "Fractal Zoom" and changed it to a less ripped off fashion. I almost slipped in the KC thing, but decided against it). Both are bootleg recordings but the general adoration from the crowd still comes across. Please go and listen to it. You may like it, you may not. But we're still influenced by King Crimson. Well that's me done for a while. If any other topics come up of any interest, I'll return. Until then... goodbye. ~Cameron ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 15:21:56 -0700 From: Raul Reyes Subject: Primus-les claypool. Hey fellow crimsos,today i found the new Les Claypools-frogs brigade solo cd containing a very cool live version of King Crimsons: Thela Hun Ginjeet!In fact its the first track on that disk.I found it at tower records............check it out :0)..........cheers R.Reyes. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:34:21 -0500 From: "21St CentURY SCh|zO|D MaN" Subject: Re: KC and Toolish negativity [Unknown MIME type or encoding (text/html), contents not processed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 09:49:09 +0200 From: "Enzo Diodato Lamberti" Subject: ColleKctor's Club questions Hi everyone, Since i was looking forward subscribing KCCc for the first time, i hope you will help me finding out the best 6 cds out by now. (imean: audio quality, rare songs, asthonishing performance, alternative arrangement,etc.) I will appreciate your help, Thanks ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 11:21:05 EDT From: LIKADAPRDR at aol dot com Subject: tool/crim crap i'm getting tired of reading all of these comments on trying to predict how the tool/crim tour will work. first of all, i think that people need to give tool a chance and stop trying to make exact comparisons between the two. to me they are both incredible bands that push musical boundaries to their extremes. one of the similarities between the two is that they both have huge fan bases, yet somehow have always avoided the mainstream. they are not popular bands, just very well liked by the few that enjoy them, and these fans will do anything to experience a live outing. if fripp has a problem with the tool fans, so be it. i do not think that crim just jumped into this without thinking about these things. since i am only 22 and was not around during the conception of KC, i do not know how people reacted to them, but i'm guessing that it wasn't all that much different than how you are reacting to tool. so please go out and buy the new tool album, lateralus, listen to it with an open mind and forget anything you have already read about them. and if you still don't like them, don't but a ticket, because some grateful tool fan will. Chuck Geiger ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 23:54:28 -0400 From: Don Cooper Subject: Matte Kudasai versions Josh wrote in ET #840: > I have an online buddy who swears that the "alternate version" of Matte > Kudasai on the recently-remastered Discipline is actually the original > version that first appeared on the lp > > Is he right? Yes. > If yes, is this old news? Depends on where you came in. I've had them all, and I did miss the RF guitar track on the remastered edition. > and, that the Matte Kudasai that is > claimed to be the original was in fact originally released on the Compact > King Crimson collection. I'd have to pull that off the shelf to be sure, but most likely. Don http://www.cooperaudio.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 15:33:50 -0400 From: Randall dot Hammill at hartfordlife dot com Subject: Bruford's Cash << Although I suspect there's more to the story than a simple case of Bruford not wanting to play electronic drums as the reason he's not in KC now.... Perhaps the major one being money. He makes plenty of cash off Earthworks gigs--more so than KC gigs. >> I seem to remember Bill mentioning in several interviews that he plays with YES for the money so he can support his less-profitable (financially) endeavors, like Earthworks. Of course, I still like the Yes stuff too... Randy ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 18:11:52 -0500 From: Matt McCaffree Subject: The REAL wacky stuff... Sounds like several people around here are familiar with TooL and their music, but have many of you seen any of their videos? I think I actually lost sleep after seeing "Prison Sex" for the first time. Wow. . . Bizarre. (note the capital "B") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 17:31:27 -0600 From: "Guido Vacano" Subject: alt.music.tool on KC Hello-- I took an amusing and informative trip to http://groups.google.com (formerly dejanews), went to alt.music.tool, and searched for "King Crimson". I perused the output (the first twenty out of 264 posts) and discovered the following: 1) Some folks wrote that they had never heard of King Crimson, and wanted suggestions as to which CDs they should buy. 2) Many wrote to recommend King Crimson songs and releases. 3) Many wrote that they are big King Crimson fans, and that they are really excited that Tool and Crimson are going to tour together. 4) Many folks wrote that they could really hear the King Crimson influence in Tool's music. 5) Several folks posted to say that they thought it was odd that King Crimson was opening for Tool, and that it ought to be the other way around. One poster said he thought Tool must feel honored to have King Crimson open for them. Oh, and there was one "negative" post. This person took some material from recent issues of Elephant Talk (you know, stuff like "What I get from Tool is hate, ugliness, aggression, bitterness and negativity", "I'm not so sure I want to be in a venue where the vast majority of the crowd is 16-21", "I trust that Tool is opening for KC, and not the other way around", etc.) and effectively demonstrated that "Crimheads ARE like Deadheads with advanced egos...." and are "a bunch of narrow minded oldsters". I think he's got a point. Guido N. Vacano, Ph.D. King Crimson Fan Tool Fan Research Associate/Webmaster Eleanor Roosevelt Institute http://eri.uchsc.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 20:12:25 -0400 From: "Alan Cohen" Subject: Re: King Crimson in painting >She is going to have a one-man show in the Polonaise Art Gallery in SHE is going to have a one MAN show? This sounds really groundbreaking. :>) Alan ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #842 ********************************