Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #812 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 812 Wednesday, 21 March 2001 Today's Topics: Prog Music; KC for string quartet Re: How have the recent cds been sounding over time? Crimson reviews online Top 10 Prog bands: Rush KC's spiritual vision So, wot's "Progressive"? Prog "Top Ten" Adrian swingalong prog (was Re: Top 10 Prog Bands... Disappointing) Re: different opinions Mellotron Prog rock "top ten" Prog rock "top ten" Prog rock top 10 & Steve Hackett Tokyo tapes! Problems with King Crimson TV website KC on TV Broof loves the swing! "progressive"? The Greatest ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 15:30:01 -0500 From: David Vella Subject: Prog Music; KC for string quartet Greetings Eletalkers, In ET 810, Russell Whitworth made some interesting comments about the Channel 4 Prog Rock Episode, by listing those folks who made it on the "top 10" list by being in more than one band. Need I state the obvious? -- that everyone on his list had King Crimson as one of their gigs? John Moshier added his own comments regarding who was left off, and on who really should be considered "prog". I really want to avoid getting into the second question -- There have been some very extended and wearisome discussions of this issue on the Gentle Giant mailing list, particularly on whether or not Rush was a prog band. I've seen a couple of posts on this same issue in ET, and I REALLY don't want to encourage discussion of this. On the other hand, John's list of omissions includes some bands I think are not prog by any stretch of the definition, such as Traffic. Don't get me wrong, I love Traffic - they are definitely in my list of top 10 bands of all time - I just don't think of them as prog. On the other hand, if anyone wants to argue that point, I won't defend my position very strenuously - such categorizations are fraught with fuzziness and are lame attempts for us feeble-brained humans to pigeonhole our experiences. My real point here is that John's list has omitted a band which also escaped mention by the Channel 4 show, and which not only should be counted as prog by any definition, but also should undoubtedly be in the top 10 (unlike Focus, the Strawbs, Manfred Mann's Earth Band and Starcastle.) I've already mentioned them - Gentle Giant! Shame on everybody for missing them! My own list would look something like: Top prog bands by any definition: 1) King Crimson (but 'prog' is too constraining a term!) 2) Gentle Giant 3) Yes 4) ELP 5) Genesis 6) Jethro Tull Top bands that some people call prog, but I don't: 1) Cream 2) Traffic 3) Moody Blues 4) Pink Floyd Honorable Mention prog or prog-related acts: 1) Camel 2) Todd Rundgren's Utopia 3) Some of Frank Zappa's work 4) Procol Harum I'm making these lists up off the top of my head, so I've certainly missed somebody. To move on to a completely different topic, here is an excerpt from another post on the Gentle Giant discussion list: > Spent part of my piano teaching day jamming with a 2nd grader on a grand > piano to the outchorus of One More Red Nightmare. I gave him a pentatonic > scale to improvise on. Those chords sound awesome on a Young Chang grand! > Hah, at least once a day I observe to myself "for this, I get _paid_?!? > Coooool...." > > The world needs more teachers like you Glenn. Wouldn't it be great to > purchase the complete works of King Crimson scored for string quartet, > and hand them over to the young people for sonic reproduction? Now there's an idea I second. Venal Marketing Weasel, are you listening? But why restrict it to string quartet? Players of other instruments would miss out. OK, whoever would buy King Crimson sheet music from DGM, raise your digital hand..... - -David Vella ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 15:33:43 -0500 From: "Stephen P. Carl" Subject: Re: How have the recent cds been sounding over time? I can't explain how this happens very well, but I was afraid that after listening to HC for a couple of months, the bulk of tCOL (except for the title track, Frying Pan, Heaven&Earth) would sound pale to me. But, I put it on just a couple of weeks ago and it spoke to me in a completely different voice than before. Prior to December I just *liked* the album; I thought like other posters that things like Fractured and Lark's didn't have enough energy or whatever. This last listen, everything clicked. Something similar happened with the Projects. 2&3 have been my favorites; initially I didn't get as much out of P4 as Fripp apparently did back when it was being mixed. However, I took the entire set as part of my listening on a 7-hour (one way) drive to North Carolina recently. I listened to P2 and P3 on the way down, and P4 on the way back. I tell you what, I may have not been listening intently enough before, but this time I heard music I don't recall ever hearing on this CD before. The music as a whole made complete sense in a way not known in the last year or so that I"ve had these. A very pleasant surprise. Sadly, I had a bad surprise too. When I reached for P1, I found the case was empty. I have no idea where "Live at the Jazz Cafe" could be...it's completely possible that it was in the CD-ROM drive of a computer that gave up the Ghost last year. What to do? Just by the way, there have been many pieces of music that I didn't get into initially, but now enjoy a great deal. This has happened with artists/composers as varied as Yes, Dmitri Shostakovitch, and some jazz musicians. They all have in common that you perhaps have to train your mind to what they are doing new or different. It's that expectations thing, I guess. - -Stephen Stephen P. Carl, Instructor Computer Science and Engineering 328 Russ Engineering Center Wright State University scarl at cs dot wright dot edu 3640 Colonel Glenn Hwy. (937) 775-5057 Dayton, Ohio 45435-0001 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:23:16 -0000 From: "D. Chinn" Subject: Crimson reviews online Hi there, Rather than clog up bandwidth with my opinion on the King Crimson output of recent years, I'll just say that reviews are online in my "Misfit City" e-zine. All old news to most ET-ers, I'm sure - but if you want to visit, go ahead. If you want to read one about the ProjeKCts you can link directly to: http://www.collective.co.uk/misfitcity/ish02/ish02a03.htm#kingcrimson-tp If you want to read one about "ConstruKCtion Of Light" and "Heavy ConstruKCtion", go to: http://www.collective.co.uk/misfitcity/ish02/ish02a06.htm#kingcrimson-tcolhc The whole sweep of reissues should be reviewed and up online en-masse before too long as well. While you're there and if you have a moment, check out the coverage of The Monsoon Bassoon, No-Man and Michael Bearpark/Peter Chilvers (and also Tim Bowness/Samuel Smiles for their cover version of "Two Hands"). best wishes, Dann Chinn np (variously): No-Man - "Returning Jesus"; Hexdragon - "Hexdragon"; Jocelyn Pook - "Deluge". ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 19:24:31 -0500 From: Warren Melnick Subject: Top 10 Prog bands: Rush Lucas Bleicher write: The only problem with him (Neil Peart) is that he doesn't like to swing, as does Broof... You have got to be kidding me! Do you think the only place he plays is in Rush? Check out the Buddy Rich tribute CDs that he put together and played on. Then tell me whether or not he swings... Warren ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:43:15 -0500 From: "Gregory Gardener" Subject: KC's spiritual vision Is there anyone else ought there who listens to KC for their spiritual vision, too? I got ITCOTCK when I was 12 about 30 years ago from an older neighbor who sold it to me for a few bucks--he was a blues fan who had no interest in prog rock--and ever since I've pretty much gotten every studio album (and the TGD 4-CD set). Even if it didn't hook me at first, I persevered to explore as much as I could. Nevertheless, in spite of their ever-changing musical appproach, Fripp-Belew's spiritual vision will always keep me coming back: Blake's fiery tiger still lurks in the forest of the night, tearing up and consuming what actually isn't so that what is might emerge; and, as most recently put by them, we supervise the construction of light as we act on our suroundings with love, acts made possible by our ongoing partnership with God in which we receive whatever refining fire (symbolized by Blake's tiger) we might find ourselves in. I and some other unchurched friends (we have no time for ancient church traditions nor interest in evangelical narcissistic readings of Scripture) consider Fripp and Belew real kindred spirits in this regard and appreciate their company. I know this was religious but, hey, it's all over their work and nobody's talking about it! Greg Robert Fripp (of King Crimson) quote of the day: http://www.disciplineglobalmobile.com/cgi-bin/frippery.cgi ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:37:50 -0800 From: "Brian Pearson" Subject: So, wot's "Progressive"? Not living in the UK I missed out on this "top 10" show that's generating so much discussion, but hardly find it surprising that such a show should focus on the most commercially successful artists in a commercially-defined genre. I'm most pleasantly surprised that a band as uncompromisingly non-commercial as KC should make the cut at all. If "basic" rock is defined as music performed on amplified instruments (particularly electric guitars) and characterized by short, simple songs with rudimentary chords, easily accessible melodies, uptempo 4/4 backbeat rhythms, and lyrics describing the joys or frustrations of adolescent romance, then ANY music which uses these same instruments but "progresses" beyond generic conventions in one or more of these other areas might be considered "progressive." Were the Beatles progressive? From 1966 on, hell yeah! Though they never completely abandoned the "pop song" format they consistently pushed its limits, exploring new instrumental textures, expanding their harmonic and melodic vocabulary, and writing witty, sardonic lyrics which transcended the trite cliches of the pop formula. "Rubber Soul" pointed the way, "Revolver" included some radically weird sounds, and "Sgt. Pepper" was the monumental breakthrough album which set the stage for the whole "symphonic rock" movement which followed. Its artistic and commercial success convinced many talented young musicians that they COULD draw upon diverse musical traditions, expand their instrumental pallette, write intelligent songs, compose extended pieces encompassing multiple tempo, key, and dynamic changes, AND find a receptive audience. Bands like Pink Floyd, Moody Blues, Jethro Tull, Genesis, Yes, and KC (among MANY others) were the direct consequence. So why quibble about what's "progressive" (a label coined by critics to describe what musicians were accomplishing intuitively without benefit of labels) and what isn't? Duke Ellington once commented that "There's only two kinds of music--good and bad." Why not just allow ourselves to enjoy music that is sincerely and intelligently made, that is emotionally and intellectually satisfying to hear, without reference to artificial genres? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 23:47:19 -0500 (EST) From: Darryl Subject: Prog "Top Ten" Hello everybody, I never seen the program since I don't live in the UK but I'd thought I would comment on what some people have been saying about the list. First of all, what are people talking about when they say Pink Floyd isn't prog? Have you actually listened to their albums? Or did you hear "Money" and "Another Brick In The Wall" on the radio and think that's all they were? Not only was Floyd a progressive band, they were the FIRST progressive-rock band! They paved the way for everyone else. Everything they wrote from 1967-77 was prog; it was only after Roger Waters' egomania took over that they started making junk like the way-over-rated The Wall. They were the first band to concentrate more on long, instrumental pieces than 2-3 minute pop songs. If you don't think Floyd is progressive than you obviously have not heard any of their albums from the 60s/early 70s. Even the Mellotron parts on the '69-'71 KC albums sound similar to some of the organ parts on Floyd's early albums. They may not deserve the #1 position, but to say they don't belong on it at all is heresy! It's understandable why KC, ELP, Yes & Genesis are on the list; EVERYONE would expect those groups to be on there. I personally don't think The Moody Blues should be on the list; only their '67-'69 material can be described as 'progressive'. Jethro Tull was progressive mainly during their '71-'73 heyday. You could classify most of Rush's music 'progressive', specifically the '76-'81 stuff. I've never heard Camel, but from what I know about them they were as progressive as Genesis or Yes at the time. Hawkwind was the real eye-opener. They may not be prog, per se, but if you think the '73-74 KC and 70s Rush were, then their not THAT far off. I was dissapointed, as most, that KC only made it to 8 or 9(To me they should have at least been in the top 5). Another thing is: WHAT IS PROGRESSIVE ROCK? I remember reading in either the Lizard or Islands booklets(of the remasters) that had a chart of the "Top Progressive Albums Of The Week" or something similar. Alongside Crimson, Yes and ELP were the likes of Zeppelin, John Lennon and Rod Stewert! Sometimes prog-rock is also referred to as "art-rock". To my knowledge "progressive-rock" was what the Brits called anything that didn't sound like the Osmonds or Jackson 5; "Art-rock" was the term the American press used to describe British groups like Pink Floyd, Yes and ELP. It's the same thing that happened in the early 90s with the term "alternative-rock". Likewise no one actually defined what made a band 'alternative'. So bands that were too heavy to be punk/too punk to be metal like Nirvana, etc. were lumped in the same category as truly innovative bands like Primus and Nine Inch Nails. Just my .02 cents or more, Darryl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 01:41:18 -0500 From: "Suzanne ..." Subject: Adrian I'm not sure if this made it into a post here yet or not so thought I'd spread the good word just in case :) Adrian is up for a Lifetime Acheivement Cammy Award.. http://enquirer.com/editions/2001/02/25/tem_lifetime_cammys_go.html Congradulations Adrian!! You deserve it! ((: ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 11:42:02 +0000 From: Peter Clinch

Subject: swingalong prog (was Re: Top 10 Prog Bands... Disappointing) In ET #810 Lucas Bleicher suggested of Rush's Neil Peart: > The only problem with him is that he doesn't like to swing, as does Broof... NP swings a lot more than he used to, mainly since taking lessons from Freddie Gruber (see Ian Wallace's DGM diaries for plenty of stuff on FG and what a great swinging drummer and teacher he is). By his own admission, and by aural evidence on the last couple of records, his style is now much more fluid, so hats off to him for experimenting and broadening his style. Some Rush fans seem to actually feel he's been ruined, but cartainly not me. Pete. - -- Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net p dot j dot clinch at dundee dot ac dot uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 11:54:21 +0000 From: Peter Clinch

Subject: Re: different opinions in ET 810 "Timothy W Cox" cluelessly wittered: > The only group that loses are those who want Ade in the band, who are in the > minority (based on personal observations outside of e-groups) Based on personal observations, the "majority" (actually the most vocally obnoxious, not the same thing but this is perceptions, not reality) think KC should abandon composing new material and just replay stuff from the 70s, preferably with the same personnel. In this matter, I'm very glad to be in the "minority". I note that Adrian doesn't seem to be represented as a "loser" in the nonsense I'm replying to, so presumably he's been kidnapped and is held in the band against his will? Pete. - -- Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net p dot j dot clinch at dundee dot ac dot uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 20:50:18 +0100 From: Goran Janicijevic Subject: Mellotron Daniel Branco P. wrote in : >I like to receive information about the mellotron: I don't know what it is. Here: http://www.mellotron.com http://www.vemia.co.uk/mellotron/ - -- Goran ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 20:50:18 +0100 From: Goran Janicijevic Subject: Prog rock "top ten" Moshier, John T wrote in : > Anyway, my two cents' worth probably isn't worth any more than Channel >4's, but at least I don't consider Phil Collins progressive. Believe me, he's more progressive than Asia. To anyone who doesn't think that Pink Floyd are progressive, well, this genre is much harder to define than soul or heavy metal. Maybe PF are not typical prog band (e.g. no classical influences), but they surely are prog. - -- Goran ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 03:48:14 +0700 From: "T. Ismail Reza" Subject: Prog rock "top ten" Russell Whitworth : > 2 appearances: > > Greg Lake (KC, ELP) > Jon Anderson (Yes, KC) > Mel Collins (KC, Camel) I do not know for sure, but I feel that Mel Collins was somehow connected with Pink Floyd also.... I wasn't very familiar with these top-ten thingie, but surely the biggest flaw is to categorize Prog in commercial manners. *ahem* this would be my version of Prog top ten; inwhich flaws would possibly occurs, but hopefuly not as sinful as the first...: 1. King Crimson (....are we in the same mailing list?=)) 2. Soft Machine (canterbury-thingie) 3. Procol Harum 4. Moody Blues 5. Yes 6. Pink Floyd 7. Magma (zeuhl; a "loner" in Prog...) 8. ELP 9. Rush (somehow "responsible" for the prog-metal movement...) 10. Genesis (yep, they're in my list...=)) At least these are the names that should be appeared...... But from another point of view, someone still remember to make top ten program for prog...then we should be thankful for it....=) > Can anyone offer a suggestion about a good > starting point for an Asia "newby?" Try their first one; "Asia". And then you could progress untill Astra. Then stop. Or start crying really hard. =) > I would prefer to see them with a band like Dream Theater or Spock's Beard who > actually are progressive in nature. Well, I could imagine if DT or SB sharing the same stage, or with Rush, or Kansas; but I do not think that King Crimson would be an appropriate match... I don't know; bad "feng shui", maybe....=) Salam Sakral! Reza! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 12:57:27 +1100 From: "Tony Greig" Subject: Prog rock top 10 & Steve Hackett Tokyo tapes! Hello Again Crimophiles, It has been a while and now time for a serious rave or three! I have not witnessed the UK channel 4 documentary on the top 10 progressive rock bands (as I reside in Oz) and have only been reading ET fans comments. As a fan of most of the bands mentioned (Camel excepted, as I have never heard their music), I feel inclined to comment. The late 60's and early 70's spawned many a 'progressive' act if you feel inclined to use that terminology. These artists were all trying to expand on ideas and sounds etc, to create something from nothing. The idea of placing a selected number of artists in a top 10 is limiting in itself and can only create criticism from different music lovers! The Moody Blues, Hawkwind and Pink Floyd all came out with very different sounds/styles etc, and as far as I am concerned would 'fit' into the 'progressive' tag. Pink Floyd were instrumental in creating improvised music over melody as well as the classic Jethro Tull. Do Tull not play in odd time signature occasionally with extended playing and complex changes? Thick as a Brick, what a classic as well as a dozen or so other Tull albums! Sounds 'progressive' to me! ELP, Yes and King Crimson definitely broke ground with their adventurous playing and melodies and the latter two continue to do so to this day. Hooray! Rush are a class act and I agree with fans who pinpoint their late 70's and early 80's material as being classed as 'progressive'. Is that 10? Hang on I had better check! oopps, I have left out Genesis who were also superb in the early to mid 70's! Who cares what order these bands are placed in! As long as you enjoy it, then that should be all that matters! If you do not enjoy some of these bands, then all the more reason to not worry about it! On a more Crim related topic, I have just heard a portion of the Steve Hackett Tokyo tapes and I am very impressed with the versions of ITCOTCK and I Talk to the Wind. Brilliant stuff and what a lineup! The Genesis songs are also superb and what a night this must have been! Forgive me for 'living in the past' temporarely (again). In regards to John Moshier's Et 810 query on Asia. Their debut self titled album is the only one worth owning in my opinion. But it is not at all 'progressive', more a commercial/progressive crossover, as the early 80's seemed to be for some of these acts! Sure the members all came from classic 70's progressive bands, but that is where it stops! A 'one off' album, as was the Yes 90125 album! Steve Howe is respectfully back where he belongs! Cheers, Tony Greig. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 23:10:53 EST From: SuprMallet at aol dot com Subject: Problems with King Crimson TV website Please forgive me if this has been discussed before, but has www.kingcrimsontv.com been taken down? I just bought Heavy ConstrucKtion today (marked down to $13.99 at Best Buy, go figure), and I wanted to watch the concert. When I tried to get the password, the site wouldn't connect, IE told me the site didn't even exist. Does anyone know what happened, and can anyone tell me a password so I can see the live video? Thank you so much. - -Daniel Hirshleifer ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 13:06:44 -0000 From: "Steve Dinsdale" Subject: KC on TV Further to recent discussion arising from the Prog Top Ten, I can confirm that KC doing `Cat Food' is long since gone from the BBC archives, as is GGF on `Colour Me Pop' In the period in question the tape that these programmes was recorded on was seen as being more valuable for re-use than the ephemeral `pop' perfomances contained therein. Certain VT reels survived from this era usually only because engineers took tape home with them or refused to comply with the BBC's wiping policy. A big shame, as the idea of Keith Tippett on TOTP is a funny one... The clip seen on `Prog Top Ten' of `Starless' will have been from the ORTF (French TV) tape that RF has considered putting out, although they did appear on the Old Grey Whistle Test in 1982 (Frame by Frame/Indiscipline), they did not get anywhere near the show in their earlier incarnations. Interestingly Genesis and Van Der Graaf were never invited on to the show either....in fact the OGWT was a bit shit really. (Believe me I've looked through the whole archive). Readers may be interested to note that there is some VT of KC in Central Park 1973 perf LTIA 2 (Extract) and Easy Money/ Improv (Wild Guitar !)...and of course there is the Beat Club 1972 which was again featured on Prog Top Ten. Steve Dinsdale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 17:33:26 +0100 From: "john veerman" Subject: Broof loves the swing! Hey addiKcts, For once I feel a very strong urge to react, as Lucas Bleicher wrote: "The only problem with him [Neil Peart] is that he doesn't like to swing, as does Broof..." Do you mean Bill doesn't like to swing? Excuse me? Obviously you've been told by someone that what Bruford does, isn't very thorough, reel, genuine, deep or whatever: swing... But listen to the records, and it will start to get clear that it must be some other persons in Brufords vicinity that seems to dislike shuffling: From Yes' first recordings to Earthworks's youngest there is sir William "wailing at his biggest" and loving to swing. It wouldn't be exactly because of the swing, but one should be aware of the fact that he left King Crimson to explore different musical roads. While King Crimson gets more and more involved in electronics, Bruford behaves like a New British Art Blakey - playing modern jazz with relatively young and talented musicians. Mr. Bleicher, please listen to the A part, a yet apart - album and you'll hear Broof enjoying the swing. Regards, John Veerman ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 15:50:35 -0500 From: "Peter Shindler" Subject: "progressive"? > Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 14:34:04 -0500 > From: "top jimmy" > Subject: remasters > > I apologize if this was already posted, but does anybody know the release > date for the Discipline, Beat and Three of a Perfect Pair remasters in the > US? I am eagerly anticipating these. > > Maybe it is just me, but if Crimson was going to tour with a newer band as > the rumors are floating around about this tour with Tool later this year, I > would prefer to see them with a band like Dream Theater or Spock's Beard who > actually are progressive in nature. That is just my opinion, I am probably > right... No you're not. :) I think it's shallow to limit your definition of "progressive" music only to bands who write long sectional pieces with lots of complex rhythms and virtuoso-level playing. Tool is a very progressive band, when you factor in the challenging themes they cover in their songs, their bizarro live performances, and the extreme environments they create in their studio recordings. I'm not a huge Tool fan (my tolerance for self-pitying lyrics and sludgey guitars is limited), but they are more ambitious and forward-thinking than Dream Theater, Spock's Beard, and lots of other bands that are considered "progressive" just because they do the same things that Rush and ELP did twenty years ago. Peter ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 22:06:27 0000 From: "Aluric" Subject: The Greatest Hi, I bought Court of the Cromson King new in '69. Wore the grooves off. Fast fwd to '73. I met an guy--who became my editor, & mentor after a fashion, who was a Crimhead--an original. Only, he had everything from Wake of Poseidon to Lark's Tongues. After I moved in w/ he & his wife in'74, came Starless, & then Red. I reveled in this Great music. I still do. Aluric Free email addresses helping endangered species every time you write http://www.purpleturtle.com ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #812 ********************************