Reply-To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Discipline #77 Discipline, Number 77 Sunday, 24 January 1993 Today's Topics: Musos Discipline Reader Survey -- please respond! Bass tab The Cheerful Insanity... Band on "Exposure" The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles and Fripp when did Fripp start with the new tuning??? Tony Levin discography Discipline #76 (Re: "Trio" and "flute" Improv) Re: The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles and Fripp (re-released) Great Deceiver [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: aaron at minster dot york dot ac dot uk Subject: Musos Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 12:06:08 GMT A comment in the latest issue of Discipline set me thinking. How many of us Discipliarians (for what else do you call the readers) are musicians? Is King Crimson's appeal as firmly rooted in muscianship as anecdotal evidence would suggest (all the Crimson devotees I know play instruments). Hmmm +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Aaron Turner | "And a letter in your writing | | aaron at minster dot york dot ac dot uk | doesn't mean you're not dead" Pixies RIP | +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Toby Subject: Discipline Reader Survey -- please respond! Good evening hippies. OK, let's try and answer Aaron's question and find out how many of you readers are musicians. Send me an email note if you play an instrument, saying what it is, and I'll collate. Please do reply -- just one word, like 'bassoon' is fine. Other comments about whether and why Crimson has special appeal for musicians are welcome. I'll summarise. By the way, if you want to include any general comments about Discipline -- like good ideas for improving it, or (perish the thought) complaints -- that would be fine. (I'll treat such ideas as letters to the editor, not for publciation in Discipline). -- Toby [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: aaron at minster dot york dot ac dot uk Subject: Bass tab Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 11:00:39 GMT Discipline has been a good read of late (interesting speculation about the mystery 'fifth man'). I thought it was about time I contributed something. I've been gradually increasing my repetoire of Crimson numbers and have transcribed Fallen Angel and Red for bass and am just about to actually type them in. No responsibility is accepted for errors of course especially as on occasion Wetton's grungy sound is not conducive to accurate transcription. I have managed to emulate Wetton's sound to a certain extent by biamping through a bass amp and 10W guitar amp simultaneously although I am led to believe that Wetton used a fuzz-wah or something like that (and a Fender Precision played with a pick?). Anyone know? I suggest that those who want copies (after the weekend) send me a request over email at aaron at minster dot york dot ac dot uk Aaron Turner [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Vercingetorix Subject: The Cheerful Insanity... Date: Fri, 22 Jan 93 0:21:07 EST I was lucky enough a few years ago (when it was near-impossible to find) to pick up a UK vinyl bootleg "reissue" of the Giles/Giles/Fripp album, for a very modest price (an old original copy i once saw carried a prohibitive price tag). I loved the album, quirky and uneven as it was. it contains not only musical content but also the trio's sometimes abortive attempts at comedy. It's definitely interesting from an historical perspective, but as music-for -pleasure I found it equally interesting, though the album is -- I would stress -- not to every taste. The first six tracks or so are interwoven with a tedious and rather sick narrative called "the story of Rodney Toady", but some tracks are very clever, though simple. "Digging my Lawn" is such a track, it contains one of my fave lines from the 60s: ..."she was half-german/ half out of bed/ which half was which doesn't have to be said..." Also enjoyable was "Call Tomorrow", the bizarre "The Crukster", and the eccentric "Elephant Song" the trax on my bootleg ran as follows: northmeadow newlyweds one in a million call tomorrow digging my lawn little children the crukster thursday morning how do they know elephant song the sun is shining suite no. 1 erudite eyes groon* *this track was not from the original lp, but lifted from a later crimso b side All in all it is a very dated and patchy album, featuring a wide range of musical styles (from the hardedged acid "crukster" to the emetic, almost self- parodying crooner "the sun is shining") but a real must for crimso collections. andre. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Subject: Band on "Exposure" Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 9:55:23 EST From: The Wombat at skidmore dot EDU Organization: Neurotica Ltd. I recently got a less than legal copy of Fripps "Exposure" album, (I have since been searching high and low to no avail for a legal copy since what I have is of dubious quality) But... I was wondering about who all was in the band on this album, I know that Darryl Hall [sic?] sings on _You Burn Me Up I'm a Cigarette_ but what about the rest, I think that many of the voice overs are Eno and Frip, a few of Fripps Mom according to a friend, and some of an old man who I have no idea about. Soo, anyone know about this, and possibly where I could get a copy, most likely I'll end up ordering it from a local little shop that caters to what some have called obscure music. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-This message was brought to you by Matthew Frazer-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- I tell you they have not died, their hands clasp, yours and mine -Windom Earle Finger mfrazer at scott dot skidmore dot edu for more --------------------------------=Be Seeing You=-------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 15:19:30 GMT From: "Mark Cytera " Subject: The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles and Fripp You asked about this CD in the last round of "Discipline". I've had a copy for more than a year (I bought it as a Japanese import in Holland). Well, it's nothing like Crimson, though I do actually quite like it. It seems to be something of a novelty album, with two silly stories creating an even sillier concept idea. At times, I wonder if they're taking the piss out of The Moody Blues from that era. A voice narrates the two stories, and I think it's Fripp's. The writing is done mostly by the Giles brothers, who do all the main singing, and there is good instrumentation on the album. It sounds really quite late-sixties-ish, with some genuinely good melodies squeezing through sometimes. If you're prepared to have a good laugh a few times and listen for the very occasional musical and lyrical gems it's worth buying. But don't take it too seriously. Cheers, Mark _______________________________________________________________________________ Mark Cytera Telephone: +44 31 228 4583 Technical Author Facsimile: +44 31 229 9429 ORACLE EUROPE Email (internal): mcytera.UK 2 Festival Square Email (external): mcytera at uk dot oracle dot com Lothian Road EDINBURGH EH3 9SU SCOTLAND ________________________________________________________________________________ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 09:21:20 CST From: david at gca-prism dot com (David Oskardmay) Subject: when did Fripp start with the new tuning??? Wayne Wylupski writes: Fripp didn't start using the tuning until after the last Crimson. There's one tune on the Fripp and Summers' BEWITCHED album (the one word title beginning with M that makes me think of "mucilage") and everything after that, including David Sylvian's GONE TO EARTH and all Craftie stuff. I reply: I heard otherwise. Fripp indicated that he had first started using the new tuning (though not exclusively) around the time he did Bowie's Scary Monsters. That's about 1980 right? He related an anecdote about just getting off the plane and going into the studio to record It's No Game Pt. I with basically no preparation. So here he is in the studio working in this tuning that he doesn't really know, playing a solo for a song he hasn't heard more than once or twice, with Dave B. looking on encouragingly. YOW. Anyway, the rest of the tuning story as I know it is that he came up with the tuning, didn't really know what to do with it (so probably set it aside, making it entirely possible/probable that none of the KC stuff was in the new tuning), and then decided that it was sort of intended to be for Guitar Craft when that came about. OK, that's all for me... later, david [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 21 Jan 93 11:35:38 CST From: linetsky at nde dot unl dot edu (Gene Linetsky) Subject: Mellotron? Am I the only one who doesn't know what is mellotron? Please, tell me... Gene Linetsky linetsky at nde dot unl dot edu [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] I anticipate lots of answers to this one! So, I'll try and knit them together to save having 1001 separate messages in the next Discipline! Send in your Mellotron anecdotes NOW! -- Toby [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: wcsanil at ccs dot carleton dot ca (Anil Prasad) Subject: Greg Lake in reformed King Crimson rumours Date: Fri, 22 Jan 93 0:07:24 EST I spoke to Greg Lake tonight and we discussed his alleged involvement in a reformed King Crimson. Basically, he realizes that there is a new King Crimson line-up that he *ISN'T* involved in (I said, "is it Fripp/Levin/Marotta/ Belew/Sylvian" and he said "Yeah, that sounds right"), however, he's strongly confident that he will be involved with a King Crimson line-up at some later date!!!!!!!!! He said it's something he'd really like to do and that he had spoken to Fripp about it recently!!!!!!!! No, I'm not making this up! (wish I was though) Other tidbits: Greg Lake recorded some tracks with MICHAEL GILES and Geoff Downes for a project called "Ride The Tiger" which has been permanently shelved. Two tracks from these aborted sessions appear on the new ELP and Asia album (minus Giles of course...). ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Anil Prasad | "Anyhow cow and many cows floating upside ----------------------------| down mao on tao brown cow how now." wcsanil at ccs dot carleton dot ca | -- e.e. goings ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 00:38:59 -0500 (EST) From: Chad H Hutchinson <06819 at brahms dot udel dot edu> Subject: Tony Levin discography About the Tony Levin discography, try Jeremy here on the Discipline. 07822 at chopin dot udel dot edu Ghost [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 22 Jan 93 10:29:58 +0100 From: Bj|rn Lisper Subject: Discipline #76 (Re: "Trio" and "flute" Improv) Dave White writes: > I never thought the "flute" improv was Fripp's guitar. I'm fairly >certain that the flute sounds are generated by a mellotron. In addition to >the familiar string sound (e.g. "Epitapth"), the mellotron also had choirs >e.g. "Entangled" by Genesis), and flute sounds (I think these sounds are >utilitzed by Tony Banks on the "Seconds Out" version of "Supper's Ready" to >cover Gabriel's flute and oboe parts). I can second that opinion. I once played around with a Mellotron in a music store, and the flute sound was exactly that. Bjorn Lisper [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 17:54:49 -0500 Organization: The Leningrad Carrot Conspiracy From: rbharding%yuggoth at uunet dot ca (Ron Harding) Subject: Re: The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles and Fripp (re-released) > I saw this on sale in Virgin here. There were two versions, one a Decca > re-release, at normal CD price (hm... are UK CD prices ever NORMAL??) and > the other was a Japanese import (at import CD price!) with different track > listings. It just figures. Right after I bought it at an inflated Japanese import price. > > I haven't heard this album. (It has a *gruesome* end-of-sixties cover photo > of Fripp & the Gileses grinning horribly!) One of the few photos of Fripp actually smiling to be released before the new boxed sets showed up. Really quite a funny picture. They look so idiotic. > > What style of music is it, and is it of anything other than historical > value? Is it worth getting for Fripp's playing? > The music is, well, not like anything else I've heard. Short, jazzy little ditties. Not mainstream, but still much more accessible than later Crimson would be. There are no audience-crushing juggernauts like "Schizoid Man." I like most of the songs. I especially like "The Elephant Song." Totally twisted lyrics, and a strangely catchy tune. Fripp has a piece called "Suite No. 1" which is a showcase for some serious chops. But most of his playing is fairly subdued. There are weird spoken bits before each song. On side 1, they describe the life and times of Rodney Toady, who was fat and ugly and who nobody liked. If you can handle the weirdness, the spoken bits are sort of funny. - Ron [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 23 Jan 93 18:25 PST From: ken at wet dot uucp (kenneth stuart) Subject: Great Deceiver Hello, I have finally listened to the whole of the Great Deceiver set. My impression is that, since the set does not have any complete, unedited concerts (unlike some live CDs by other groups), I would have preferred to see two or three CDs of the best material; ie either whole concerts or more choices made. For me, the first CD was so-so, I can't imagine playing it in preference to the other three which were much more interesting. And, most of the shorter "Wetton" pieces were unremarkable - certainly only one of each "Fractures" [:-) excuse the mail fracture!]). In any event, I wanted to ask if anyone else has noticed a one-minute gap near the end of Disc Three (certain songs have periods of only audience sounds, but this one has no sounds whatsoever)?? Thanks, Ken PS Anyone who liked all the Improvisations on this set MIGHT also like the CD called Infrared Roses by the Grateful Dead, which is entirely composed of similar live improvisations.... [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] To join this mailing list or have your thoughts in the next issue, please send electronic mail to Toby Howard at the following address: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The Discipline archives are available on ftp.uwp.edu, in /pub/music/lists/discipline. The views expressed in Discipline are those of the individual authors only.