Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #760 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 760 Friday, 10 November 2000 Today's Topics: Gamelan Re: Cleveland show projekctions KC in Oz? Re: Dan Ceo's review of the Majestic Theater, Detroit show Jazz Chords More connections bruford-gong Quick question about cameras Re: Bruford Disc Reviewed Re: Gong & ELP Daevid Allen Connections & Bill Bruford Heavy Construkction release date Bruford in Brand X HDCD remasters Heavy ConstruKction Charles Hayward and Gong Bruford and Brand X Australian Tour Re: Bill/Pat debate Dying impovisations GIG REVIEW: Cliche' fo Clevland ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 21:19:57 -0500 From: "Eric / Susan Young" Subject: Gamelan Hi Folks! Eric Young here. I saw the mention of Gamelan music in the last post and my eyes perked up. Forgive me if this this is of little interest to most, but this Indonesian Court music has more than once been mentioned in reference to (particularly the early 80's) KC style, so I just thought I'd offer this little tidbit. My wife has been a member of a Gamelan ensemble for fifteen years (and she is, by the way, a huge KC/Fripp fan!). Her group is playing a performance at the University of Delaware on the 29th of November. They perform there twice a year there - free, by the way - as well as other places around Pennsylvania, D.C and even in NYC. Some may remember me from my posting about my 'story' having met Mr. Fripp on several occasions, including my wedding. (41 ETers emailed me and received this story, by the way! Thanks. I'll send to anyone else interested) Anyhow, at one of the Music For Non-Musicians Seminars, in WV, our good friend Bill Naylor, who is also in this Gamelan group, had approached Mr. Fripp about a Gamelan piece (for around twenty-two members that is) which he had composed. This piece is called "Hammerhead'' and is based soley around the passages of both Lark's Tongues and Waiting Man. Bill had written out this piece completely on paper (which does not include notes, but numbers, for the notes themselves) and had given it to Robert. He soon got a response in the mail from Mr. Fripp giving his blessing and okay for this piece! Neat. I have seen and videotaped that group many many times over the last fifteen years, and ''Hammerhead'' is an absolute favorite of the audience - each and every time! Crimson fans?....eh, hard to say....but the piece is rocking and hilarious! Whether they will be performing this piece on the November gig I cannot say for sure. But it's a neat story all the same. And here, finally, is my point; my wife Susan has a rather extensive collection of traditional and modern Gamelan music from Indonesia, as well as by other groups including her own. I would be pleased to tape some of this fabulous music for anyone with the patience and open-mindedness to give this stuff a listen. There is one particular favorite of mine that has breaks and stop/start percussive dynamics that - so help me God - even King Crimson would shudder from! Not for everybody, let me say that. But if interested, please email me privately and I'd love to share this fantastic, cultural and ancient music with ya. Thanks Toby for the great work, patience and all this space! Now back to the bikKcering. Peace to all, my musical friends - Eric Young ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 16:40:49 +0100 From: Eric Joseph White Subject: Re: Cleveland show projekctions To all and any- I saw the Cleveland show last weekend. Great playing of course. However, I was also pleased with the intrigueing projekctions on the two screens above the band. Any ideas about these images and whether they are designed by the folks behind the album cover? Very trippy and enjoyable. Thanks King Crimson, for a Fantastic performance. Worth the wait and the drive from Pittsburgh! Eric White ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 12:37:56 From: Errol Tout Subject: KC in Oz? Dear ET Alan Todhunter suggested that there was much speculation that KC may come to Australia. This is news to me - I have heard no such rumours. Perhaps Mr. Todhunter is attempting to start the rumour - bon chance mate! Is it worth mentioning that the Oz dollar is trading at about 51 US cents at the moment? [the subtle suggestion is that KC may actually make money coming here - even though it's a hell of a long way]. As to Alan's comments about the Australian music in the olympic ceremony - picture if you will 17 million people cringing simultaneously... Errol H. Tout Architect Lecturer Chair Design Communication Stream Enrolments Officer Generally Cool Dude! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 01:06:21 EST From: Ianreyn at aol dot com Subject: Re: Dan Ceo's review of the Majestic Theater, Detroit show Well said Dan. I wish the bellyachers on this forum would realize how fortunate we are to have a band like King Crimson playing the sort of music they play. Keep on whooping it up. Ian ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 23:39:45 -0800 From: "Ehrcraft" Subject: Jazz Chords Grant Colburn wrote, >There's no real jazz structure to the music or jazz chords from the guitar, >violin or keys. Grant, what are jazz chords and jazz structure?? Dave. "One man's garden is another man's basement & vice versa" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 03:10:07 -0500 (EST) From: Darryl Subject: More connections Hey!, After posting about KC connections I remembered 2 for Soft Machine(if only I had posted an hour later!). One is Marc Charig, member of S.M. and, of course, he played on both "Islands" and "Red"(and maybe "Lizard" too, I forget). Another one is Andy Summers, who was in S.M. at one point, and made two albums with Fripp in the '80s. Anyway, I hope that stops others from saying the same thing as I did above. However, I would still like to know about connections with Beefheart, Caravan, Traffic and Hawkwind(or any other connections with Soft Machine). Cheers, Beers & Ears, Darryl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 09:47:05 +0100 From: "Simen Bing Stafseng" Subject: bruford-gong Peter.k.Geddes wrote: - As was previously mentioned, Bruford did a French(?) tour with Gong in 1974 or 1975. Whenever it was, it was only a month or something. Bruford played a gig with Gong at Chateau Neuf, Norway, in '74-'75! A friend of mine even got it on tape somewhere! I haven't heard it, 'cause he's a bit wacko; he has almost no space left to live on due to the archives of 30 years of tape recording, but his music knowledge is nearly autistic... this much I know. simen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 05:28:06 -0800 From: Paulo Henrique Leocadio Subject: Quick question about cameras Greetings, I've read some posts regarding the use of camera and recording devices during crim-gigs. Can anybody help on this: is the act of taking pictures WITHOUT flashes allowed or they do not allow entering with cameras at all? Thnx all Paulo H. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 10:31:26 -0500 From: Jim Bailey Subject: Re: Bruford Disc Reviewed >From: "Music Street Journal Gary Hill" >Just to let everyone know, Bruford's One of A King is reviewed in the newest >update at Music Street Journal. Would this be considered a "Frippian" slip? Jim Bailey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 11:10:49 -0500 (EST) From: Art Cohen Subject: Re: Gong & ELP >Gong's brilliant LP "You" had entered the charts at number 14, "Red" had >entered at 18 and ELP's "Welcome Back..." at 30. > >I was surprised because I don't remember Gong being that popular. I'm >English and was a Gong fan (as well as Crimson and ELP) living in England >at that time. I was more surprised at the chart (In the Larks' Tongues reissue?) that showed the first two albums lots held by Mike Oldfield (Tubular Bells & Hergest Ridge). You crazy brits! >Also, I was surprised about ELP's "poor" showing. I do remember that >"Brain Salad Surgery" had entered at number 2 (from memory), so the >success of that >LP didn't carry over to the live recording of the "Brain Salad Surgery" >world tour. Well, it *was* a triple album. I'd think that "Brain Salad", especially with the radio hit "Karn Evil part 2" would have had a much wider mass appeal. --Art ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 12:07:27 -0500 From: "melvin zirkes" Subject: Daevid Allen Connections & Bill Bruford Please forgive if this has already been brought up, I haven't been keeping up with the newsletter too well. Maybe two months ago, I saw Daevid Allen's recent project, University of Errors. They closed the show with a parody of 21st Century Schizoid Man. In addition, there was a section in the show earlier that featured elephant shrieks from the guitars. I'm pretty sure the inspiration for the shrieks was just as inspired by Crimson as was the more obvious Schizoid parody. Next, I'm probably wrong, but I think I once saw a Gong recording (bootleg?) featuring John Wetton. Mr. Allen is performing at the Knitting Factory in December and will try to make it a point to ask him about it (I usually have pretty free reign of the club, so this is not unreasonably). I find it all very interesting how different people notice different things about the music. I have been shocked to see all the talk of Bruford's drumming out of time. I learned what syncopation meant listening to him. I recall seeing Bruford/Moraz many years back, and the main thing I remember was Moraz keeping the beat while Bill went nuts. I also have a little story about Bruford with Crimson, which may or not be true, but certainly sounds possible. A friend from college says he saw them on the Discipline tour and had some family member involved in the production who managed to get him backstage. He didn't say anything about trying to get autographs or anything stupid like that, but he says he overheard Fripp criticizing Bruford for not keeping the beat. The criticism did not seem to be anything about ability, but was about his choice not play against the beat. My friend and I both thought it was maybe a little uncalled for since by now Fripp and the rest of the band don't need a drum kit going 1-2-3-4 to keep themselves in tempo. It seemed to be a question of taste, and ultimately, I'll admit Fripp has a better idea of what's called for than I do and possibly has better taste, so maybe Bill deserved the critisism. On the other hand, the story could be invented too, I really can't vouch for the storyteller. Lastly, I just want to say as someone who just picked-up the Island remaster and heard the album for the first time in 15 years, what the hell was I thinking when I put that album away? The only album I've been listening to as much is the Red remaster (which I HAD to pick-up since my original copy of Red has been played to death. Yes, CD's do wear out). Scott ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 10:24:37 US/Pacific From: mkempton at telocity dot com Subject: Heavy Construkction release date I'm sure a million peolpe will have already mentioned this, but the street date for Heavy Construkction is definitely Nov. 7. I work part-time at Borders and there were three copies in the back last night (Tue.). I confirmed in the computer that they were to be released yesterday. I have one on hold until the big employee discount this weekend. I would have bought it then, but I won't have time to listen before the weekend anyhow, so I'm left to suffer and wonder. Also, it was fun to see that two other Marks put in their reviews of the Cleveland show, so I'll keep mine brief. There were no flashes, but plenty of smoking, both legal and otherwise. Also, the blurted comments were a little dopey ("rip it Adrian!" while he was off stage during Thrush). But otherwise, the show rocked, and the band appeared to be having a grand time. Either that or they're on mood-enhancers. But if the show was so bad, they didn't reflect it while they were playing. The biggest surprise to me was the lack of interaction vocally with the audience. Last year, Adrian talked and talked and talked during his show. This time, I don't remember much talking at all. Or maybe it was while I was entranced. Anyhow, I second all the comments that the show is a must-see. It was my first opportunity, and it was worth the five year wait. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:04:05 -0500 (EST) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: Bruford in Brand X > Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 14:47:50 -0000 > From: Clive Backham > Subject: Let's clear up the Gong stuff. > > Peter.K.Geddes said: > >Bill Bruford was in an early version of Brand X (or so I've heard), > >whose drum chair was later filled by Gong's Pierre Moerlen. > > I'm 99% sure Bruford was never in Brand X. Bruford did play with Brand X (and Phil Collins) early on, just prior to joining Genesis for the Trick of the Tail tour. It's mentioned in the Genesis Archives #2 booklet. Don't know if anything got recorded. -S. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:23:56 -0500 (EST) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: HDCD remasters > Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 10:04:11 EST > From: Eeeyaaaah at aol dot com > Subject: HDCD re-Releases > > Well, some have posted about the new 24 bit remasters of LTiA, SaBB, and Red, > to the effect that there's no real difference. There's obvious differences, the main one being the higher volume level at which the new ones were mastered. As higher volume tends to translate as 'better sounding' , psychoacoustically, that's imporatnt. > But with an HDCD-capable stereo with good resolution, I find the changes so > large that at times its disorienting! It almost sounds like a remix! > HDCD is an odd technology--it basically sneaks extra resolution via a form of > spread-spectrum trickiness riding underneath the actual music bits. It uses > perceptual coding, ? Where did you read this? From what I understand, it's really just a variant of bit-mapping (20 bit encoding --> 16 bit playback). > so that it seems to draw out more detail according to what > is playing and how. I find my brain being guided into places it would not > normally pay attention to. Hmm, that sounds like more than just HDCD. > Make no mistake, if you have a good HDCD-able stereo system, and you've spent > a long time with these recordings, get 'em. They sound almost radically > different, and you will listen as if for the 1st time. IMO, the HDCD encoding/decoding itself doesn't make all that much difference; it's all in the mastering, and the selection of source tapes. I doubt people could reliably tell a a 'normal' CD player and and HDCD-capable player apart if they were both playing the same HDCD in a level-matched blind test. In other words, the quality of the 'software' matters more than the hardware. Pacific Microsonics (who has the patent on HDCD) tries to sell it both ways: it claims that HDCDs sound better than normal CDs on any CD player, and that all CDs will sound better on an HDCD player. P M doesn't explain the former, but I suspect it's because HDCD CDs tend to be mastered with more care and from better sources, if only to maximize the difference between the 'old CD' and the reissue. The latter is explained by the fact that HDCD players use the same high-quality chip for digital filtering (which is applied to every CD) as well as HDCD encoding (which works only on HDCD CD). -S. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 12:08:02 -0800 (PST) From: Sum WhiteGuy Subject: Heavy ConstruKction > Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 20:54:31 GMT > From: "Danny Anderson" > Subject: Heavy ConstruKction - Short Review > > Howdy folks. I don't know how Everyday Music store here in > Portland, Oregon > got ahold of Heavy ConstruKction before its supposed release date of > November 13 (today is the 7th) but it did and it's playing in > the headphones as I type. I was in a Record and Tape Traders (Maryland local music store) last night to pick up tickets for the 2nd 9:30 Club show and saw the release there. I immediately picked it up. $24.00 for 3 discs (21.00 because I have a discount card, $1 off per disc). Listening to "Heroes" right now. Yes...I was very surprised to find it! So if you're in MD and near a R&TT, go look. The sound isn't crisp like a full live release, as this was taken from the FOH DATs. But I like it like this to begin with. Trey stands out more than on the studio versions, which I also like. I have not yet listened to the Improv disc, that's next. I'm curious as to what the video on disc 2 looks like. Of course, I'm seeing them tonight at the 9:30 Club and tomorrow night as well. Tomorrow, I'm bringing someone who has had minimal exposure to KC and someone else who never heard of them. Ought to be fun. (I'll be in my green "Got DeCSS?" t-shirt....say hi!). Jon. pokgaitsai at yahoo dot com mau-tze at erols dot com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 16:11:38 -0500 From: Bob Pascarella Subject: Charles Hayward and Gong Clive Backham wrote: >"Rachid was the drummer. Charles Hayward wasn't on any Gong album. I've never >heard of him being one of the stand-in drummers, but there were so many of >them I couldn't say definitely." I'm surprised Clive. A true PotHeadPixie would know that Charles Hayward was a drummer on "Camembert Electrique" and "Continental Circus" with Pip Pyle. Hayward was a busy boy playing in several groups: Quiet sun Dolphin Logic Gong (ofcourse) This Heat along with Fred frith and Percy Howard. Robert Pascarella. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 14:09:43 -0500 From: Mark Rehder Subject: Bruford and Brand X Clive Backham wrote: > I'm 99% sure Bruford was never in Brand X. That band's original drummer was > Phil Collins. Later on, Brand X had two main rhythm sections: John > Giblin/Collins, and Percy Jones/Mike Clarke. When Brand X reformed a few > years ago the drummer was Frank Katz. Pierre Moerlen toured with Brand X for > a bit, but never made an album with them. The only official recording I know > of with Moerlen in Brand X is a couple of bonus live tracks on "Manifest > Destiny". May I quote Bill himself from Hugh Fielder's tome "The Book of Genesis": "I was rehearsing with Brand X - I was playing percussion and Phil was on drums. During a break, Phil mentioned they had a "small problem" with Genesis, namely that Gabriel had left. ...I said 'You sing and I'll play drums'". Mark -- +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Bill Bruford's wry take on drumming: "My career has been spent facing the rear ends of other men." +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 21:48:39 +1100 From: Tony Iremonger Subject: Australian Tour Australia is long overdue for a KC tour. I guarantee that a performance at the Continental (Melbourne's most intimate venue) would be packed out. Tony Iremonger Melbourne, Australia ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 16:55:58 EST From: BroMeg1 at aol dot com Subject: Re: Bill/Pat debate > Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 17:07:01 -0800 (PST) > From: eight binks > Subject: Enough about Bruford! > > Bruford is a good player but highly over-rated in my > book. Isn't anyone else bored with this long, > drawn-out idol worship? Has anyone every heard of Pat > Mastelotto? He's the KC drummer now. Move on people. > I don't think anyone should be bored with thinking Bruford is one of the best(which he is), but they also should except Pat for who he is and what he brings to the band. I don't see how folks continue to compare all the incarnations of the group. If you or we are progressive music fans then therefore we must progress. Perhaps you(we) feel this incarnation is not progressing, but from what I saw on Halloween this is a damn good/killer band ! Pat is fantastic and I look foward to the future of Crimson whatever it may turn out to be. Quit complaining about Fripp, Belew, Pat and whoever else and thank the Gods that they choose to go out on the road and bring you some of the most intense, challenging music that our world and possibly other worlds have ever seen the likes of. Thats enough Brother Meg ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2000 16:00:20 -0600 From: "Justin A. Kolodziej" Subject: Dying impovisations >>It seems there >>have been a few posts of late regarding Mr. Fripp stopping performances >>during the middle of an improv because some ass is screaming "Starless"or >>"Cat Food". First let me say that I agree 100% that Mr. Fripp has every right >>to request no photos/recording. I am not at all arguing that point. What >>boggles my mind is why should the rest of the audience be punished because of >>one or two drunk assholes who have no respect? Well, at the Milwaukee show that's not an accurate depiction of what actually happened. The guy yelling "Cat Food" did it between songs, so there wasn't an opportunity for Fripp to stop an improvisation cold, only for the guy to look like a real idiot. I hope "Red" with a big rock star ending was close enough :-) I think the below more accurately describes what actually happened to the improv: >I attended the third show in San Francisco >where the band has generally given the audience favorable reviews. Even at >these shows people yelled at the quiet moments. I personally think every >improv and Thrush were cut short due to exuberant applause when the band >dropped down to a quiet moment that had the potential to evolve into >something else. In the Lark's era improvs the band often dropped to next to >nothing and built gradually to a cresendo. This also happened in many >performances of Thrak. It worked in Thrak because everyone knew it wasn't >over until the written bookend was played. I think when the new band >attempts this, the audience thinks the song is over and starts yelling and >clapping. The improv ends because the audience says it's over. This is just >part of the give and take at a live performance. It is neither positive or >negative. It just is. Fripp may have stopped because individually or >collectively the audience ended the song. However, I disagree that it's not negative. The improv could have gone on quitely for another good 2-3 minutes if given the chance, and the fact that there were some confused lokks between the band members seems to me that they really did want it to go on longer, but the audience wouldn't let it. Therefore the band had no choice but to stop and go on to the next piece. Perhaps my use of the word "abort" was too strong, but at the time that was my feeling of exactly what had happened. It quite simply ended before it should have, and I let it affect my perception of the show. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 12:41:55 -0500 From: "Joseph" Subject: GIG REVIEW: Cliche' fo Clevland Cleveland November 4th/oo From the stage and the Balcony, (sorry for the cliche) CLEVELAND ROCKED! The floor seemed cramped, hot, and tired. The stage and balcony rocked! It was pretty cool sitting on a stool and watching the four world class musicians giving me the whole gamma of emotions. Sitting on a stool and drinking a Corona or three. What a perfect way to enjoy a Crimson concert. We almost snuck in at the sound check. I should not of asked for permission (then I could apologized later). Listening to the sound check Vorrroooommmmm when the door was open during the sound check, one knew the night was going to rock. We waited in line over an hour and we where still about the 100th person let in. They were frisking most people at the door. I kind of liked this idea. I would rather the audience be violated, than the performer. I just showed them my binoculars and told them not to touch me. They didn't. Knowing the balcony was the best bet; we raced up and took audience right (you know why). Well, I see what looked like Bobby's processor on audience left. But it was too late to change. Then I see on stage a stool, audience right. Then I see the lights go on what seemed to be a new more complex, processor than the one I saw used during P2 and the Horde Tours. YES! Crimson must have the most expensive instruments in the industry? The drum set looked complex and expensive, but had a few acoustic drums that surprised me. The crowd was a mix, with a few chicks I had to " shhh", being a schoolteacher. Other ladies were escorted by dates. Also saw a few Bobby impersonators. Ran into some Brookliners' (dad and 2 sons, I'm jealous) that I gave an extra copy of the ORB too. I wanted to give this away to someone who would appreciate it. Also gave away a couple of other spare rarities that I had doubles of over the years, to complete Crimson strangers. Also meet some Crimson deadheads. This is the only way I can describe this percentage of the audience. Tull may have said it best, living in the past. The songs? You know the set by now. My metacognition as a non-musician? Passion, joy, beauty, day, night, love, joy, GOD is not dead! Did say many prayers of thanks during the encore wait. (Yes, I know I'm weird, but grateful) There may or may not be better musicians in the world today, but not four of this quality on the same stage! During most songs I was stunned! Crimson knocked me out! All I could do is hand my binocular over to share during the peak times. After the songs we hooted and hollered with all our might. I lost my voice. Trey and Patsy's playing on/as the "new trio" (Deception of Thrash?) had me in tears. Robert seemed the admiral, and Adrian was the captain on this ship. What team players! What a team! What a TEAM! Crimson of this era has to be the most physical band to date. I had many goosebumps moments. The sing along with Adrian was so cool. I wish I could carry a tune. Can I fathom Crimson being a better team tonight? If this audience had more current Crimson knowledge and enthusiasm. Or maybe the floor conditions lead to some of the semi-enthusiasm. Or maybe many in the audience were just simply to stun for enthusiasm. As a Monday morning quarterback I am wondering if it would be possible, with more crowd enthusiasm, could Crimson boil over? Did I have any Crimson expectation? Of course. My Crimson expectation is to have my expectations surpassed. Did they? Of course, they always do? It is like anticipation to your favorite place or seeing a best friend. Expectation, anticipation, and preparation are part of the enjoyment, be it a new recording, video, interview or concert. An example is the last Crimson Horde Tour. This was to short of an appearance for a band like Crimson in my mind. But what a blissful hour it was! Things come up in life like this that I can't control. What to do? I try to control my own space and time. This may be my favorite thing about Crimson, like the Beatles, Lepplin, and a best friend; you can depend on them to exceed your expectations if I give them the chance. Give them some space and time and they grow. Grow as a team. And grow on me. The semi-negatives of this day were the poorly marked road system in Cleveland. We got lost a few times downtown and back. Also the ODEON THEATER is not a theater, it is a club. Third, I hope I see this band soon, I can't wait years. (Maybe Pittsburgh?) Do have a vivid memory of the Cleveland show to bide my time. Last,we parked early for 4$. Later it was raised to $8 for the "event". This didn't seem fair to the late fans. ODDS & THE END; Well it has been three days now and my voice isn't back, and the song: THE CONSTRUCTION OF LIGHT burns in my mind. The ODEON parking lot was next to a small river, a massive ship tugged by (Hence the admiral captain reference). Cleveland is a very pretty, pretty city. Especially at night. My favorite musical experience ever! Nothing else is a close second! Well maybe the Beatles on Sullivan, but that was TV, and I was only nine. I may get scolded, but I have to agree with the London Times quote printed on the CONSTRUCTION OF LIGHT post card (I would quote this, but I would miss quote). Leaving for the parking lot Mike was extremely appreciative of me taking him to his first Crimson concert (4th Crimson,& 6th time I saw Bobby). My only reply was, "CLEVELAND ROCKED... TONIGHT!" ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #760 ********************************