Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #744 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 744 Sunday, 15 October 2000 Today's Topics: GIG BIZ: crim audients connection page GIG BIZ: Seeking Ride to SF show Trilogy, thoughts abortion & napalm? Radiohead samples KC? Urbanfetch those CDs! Bill Bruford rare LP and other Crimson related LPs for sale on eBay Lark Ascending in Aspic Re: Fripp Solo Mio Daryll Hall's Sacred Songs Fripp/Bowie/Eno Rehersals in argentina 1994 in CD fromat Lemsip and Toyah Crimson Remixes / Kineally Todd Rundgren Robert Fripp is a penguin Robert Fripp is a penguin - disclaimer Fripp and Eno - unissued Bill Bruford's Drumming Bill B in Kendal ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 16:57:01 -0400 From: Dave & Racquel Subject: GIG BIZ: crim audients connection page Hey gang... Seeing how tour dates have been set up for the US, I thought I'd drop another reminder... http://www.midnightmecca.com/vbpro/crimso/index.html is still up and running, awaiting Crim-posts from/for Crimsos going to shows (US and world-wide) that want to find others needing or having spare tix/hotel space to swap/sell/share. Drop in! Thanx Dave ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 23:53:59 EDT From: Biffyshrew at aol dot com Subject: GIG BIZ: Seeking Ride to SF show I lost my ride to the Fillmore show Thursday 10-19. I'm coming from San Mateo. Can anyone out there help? Thanks, Michael P. Dawson http://members.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 19:04:42 EDT From: GenoTT at aol dot com Subject: Trilogy, thoughts >Exposure was in fact part of a mooted trilogy not with Peter Gabriel 1, >but Peter Gabriel 2 .It was Daryl Hall's `Sacred Songs' that was number 3 As I gathered from Exposure's liner notes, it was planned to go in the order of PG2 - Sacred Songs - Exposure. Gabriel's album and Exposure both deserve the description "surreal masterpiece" in my mind. Can anyone give an evaluation on Sacred Songs? The comments I've read only say it's quite different from the work of Hall & Oates (which can only be a good thing...). Also, regarding the remasters: >Is the upgrade noticeable and work the cost/effort? I managed to persuade some uninitiated (and unsuspecting) friends to buy my previous CD copies of Larks' Tongues and Red for $10 each. I see it as paying $4 or so for an 'upgrade,' as well as widening the circle of enthusiasts. 5 days and counting.... -g ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 02:45:06 GMT From: "Tom Compagnoni" Subject: abortion & napalm? Dear ET, readers & Mr. Belew (if you're reading), I'm a big fan - gotta luv crimso 'n all that. But straight to my point (opinion)... I'm not particularly enamoured by the association of the act of terminating an unwanted pregnancy with the holocaust, Hiroshima, napalm, the AIDS epidemic, the killings of the Kennedys & Lennon, the beating of Rodney King and the very sad situations that have occurred in Kosovo, Bosnia, South Africa and Columbine High School. Surely the subject of terrorist attacks on abortion clinics could have constituted a more worthy & fitting phrase in TCOL coda? Nobody *likes* abortion, but to include this lyric in a sombre, mournfully sung song - highlighting much of our planets lowest moments in the 20th century - suggests that the singer doesn't only dislike it, but seems to think it is some kind of crime against humanity. This is bible belt talk. Maybe I'm wrong, but this is the way it sounds to me. Good stuff otherwise, Cheers, Tom... Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 08:59:25 -0400 From: "Justin Weinberg" Subject: Radiohead samples KC? I was listening to Radiohead's new CD (Kid A) when I heard something strangely familiar. For a second or two I couldn't identify it, but then I realized I had just heard a snippet of The Talking Drum! I backtracked the CD to listen again. Well, this time it sounded like The Talking Drum, but if it were a sample of it, it was a fairly muddied sample, mainly the bass line. OK. Third listen: probably not a sample, just a coincidence. The passage begins at 3:13 of track 7, as the song is beginning to fade out. As for the album itself, it's fairly good, but it doesn't live up to the ridiculous hype ("so experimental," "pushes the envelope," etc.), which must have been concocted by people completely unfamiliar with anything outside the Billboard 100. It would be very easy to mistake Kid A for a Porcupine Tree CD (a la The Sky Moves Sideways) with a guest vocalist, if that tells you anything about its sound and how "revolutionary" it is. (Note: that's not to slight PT.) This isn't the first time I've heard KC in Radiohead. The main riff of "Airbag" from OK Computer (a great album) is so Red-like I'm surprised Fripp didn't write it. Justin Weinberg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 09:35:37 -0400 From: Warren Melnick Subject: Urbanfetch those CDs! Urbanfetch is going out of business. If you live in an UrbanFetch area (ie NYC) you can get TCOL or DotT for $10 each with free delivery. Only catch is the $60 minimum order. Their delivery people are quitting in droves so they had to bump up the minimum. Warren Melnick Director, Research & Development Astata Corporation (212) 584-5523 Fax: (212) 584-5580 "I worry about my child and the Internet all the time, even though she's too young to have logged on yet. Here's what I worry about. I worry that 10 or 15 years from now, she will come to me and say 'Daddy, where were you when they took freedom of the press away from the Internet?' " -Mike Godwin Plan: > cd /pub > more beer ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 08:29:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Leo Furman Subject: Bill Bruford rare LP and other Crimson related LPs for sale on eBay Hi, fellow E.T.'ers...I have an LP for sale on eBay that the Bruford completists in the crowd might be interested in. The group's name is Absolute Elsewhere, and the title of the LP is "In Search of the Gods". The music is based on Eric von Daniken's "Chariots Of The Gods" book, and features Bill Bruford on drums and percussion throughout. This is difficult LP to find, even in the Bomp label version, but this is the UK Warner Bros. pressing, complete with an illustrated booklet. Other Crimson related LPs for sale on eBay: King Crimson - "Beat" NM Japanese LP w/Obi strip; The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles & Fripp - NM Japanese LP w/Obi strip; U.K (Bruford Wetton Jobson Holdsworth)- 1st LP Japan NM w/Obi And for Bill Nelson fans: Bill Nelson - "Quit Dreaming and Get On The Beam" + bonus LP "Sounding The Ritual Echo" rare UK LP Please search on eBay under "Top > Books, Movies, Music > Printed, Recorded > Records", and use any key word from the title/artist name. Thank you very much. Leo Furman florpog at yahoo dot com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 12:26:19 -0400 From: Glenn F Leonard Subject: Lark Ascending in Aspic Hooray for Ted!!! This is the first time another person on the planet has pointed out to me that there _is_ a similarity / influence of Lark Ascending on David Cross' violin on Larks Toungues in Aspic 1. Hooray! I heard this piece a few years back & have asked every Crim I knew if..... Finally, validation. :^) Glenn ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 16:06:18 -0400 From: Gary Davis Subject: Re: Fripp Solo Mio At 04:22 PM 10/12/00 GMT, Steve Smith wrote: > >As has been mentioned elsewhere before, the 1999 Buddha CD reissue of >'Sacred Songs' is remastered by Fripp, and includes a brief liner note by >him (as well as a longer liner note by Jeremy Holiday revealing aborted >plans by Fripp and Hall to go on the road with Gabriel's rhythm section of >Tony Levin and Jerry Marotta, thus consummating the trilogy) and, appended >as bonus tracks, the 'Exposure' cuts "You Burn Me Up I'm a Cigarette" and >"North Star." > Steve's information above is all correct. However, I feel I have to comment that I don't agree with the choices for the bonus tracks. Those tracks are available on Exposure. And I suspect that anyone on this list who has Sacred Songs is unlikely to be without Exposure (although I suppose one could argue that few of Hall's fans through Hall and Oates would have Exposure so for them it's a nice introduction to it; but I'll readily admit I'm making this argument from a self centered viewpoint!). So for me including those tracks aren't really bonuses. So that begs the question as to what would have been the appropriate bonuses. If you check the writing credits for Exposure, you'll see Hall gets co-composition credits for two songs on which he does not appear - Chicago and Mary. Those are sung by Peter Hammill and Terry Roche respectively. It is my understanding that these were originally sung by Daryl Hall, but that his vocals had to be eliminated for contractual reasons. So if the original versions of those songs with the Hall vocals could have been used for the bonus tracks, I think that would have made for excellent collector's items!!! Gary ************************************************************** Gary Davis The Artist Shop The Other Road http://www.artist-shop.com artshop at artist-shop dot com phone: 877-856-1158, 330-929-2056 fax:330-945-4923 INDEPENDENT PROGRESSIVE MUSIC!!! ************************************************************** Artist Shop Radio Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 22:57:52 +0200 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Daryll Hall's Sacred Songs Steve Smith wrote: > As has been mentioned elsewhere before, the 1999 Buddha CD reissue of > 'Sacred Songs' is remastered by Fripp, and includes a brief liner note by > him What is the album like? Is it similiar to the other two albums? Is it worth buying? Marcin Gokieli marcin dot gokieli at mospan dot pl marcingokieli at go2 dot pl ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 15:42:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: Fripp/Bowie/Eno > Date: 10 Oct 00 17:52:46 EDT > From: James Dusewicz > Subject: The 'Trilogy' > > The Bowie/Eno/Fripp 'trilogy' is: > > Low(1977) > Heroes(1977) > Lodger(1979) > > Fripp also appears on Scary Monsters(1980). Fripp is only on Heroes and Scary Monsters, not the other two. -S. "Screw Charity!" -- T. Herman Zweibel ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 14:29:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Jorge Luis Jimenez Subject: Rehersals in argentina 1994 in CD fromat hi guys, I got a CD with a Krimson rehersal in Argentina in 1994, Live with no audience, very rare stuff and interesting things in there. jljimenezs at rocketmail dot com Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 22:38:13 +0100 From: "Andrew Dearden" Subject: Lemsip and Toyah In response to Jim Bailey's recent inquiry (ET #743), Lemsip has been around for ages and is certainly what KC's title refers to. It never occurred to me that it wasn't known outside these shores. This concept of "sightings" which really aren't anything to do with the band does take me back to my days on the old Rush list, the National Midnight Star, which was beset with people posting about how they had seen some sports game where the score was 21-12, or that their last grocery bill had been for $21.12. Gosh. As for Toyah, it is pretty well impossible to watch TV for a week in Britain without seeing her at some stage, be it on some daytime celebrity game show, or presenting a report on a Sunday morning "something very vaguely to do with religion" type of programme. She does seem an intelligent and thoughtful person, though, and yes, she is nice to look at. Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 23:36:50 +0200 From: "Markus Gnad" Subject: Crimson Remixes / Kineally ELEPHANTS! A few things... 1) Anyone got ideas if some ultra-sick DJ has tried to REMIX some of the King Crimson stuff? 2) Is that Mike Kineally who is credited on some ZAPPA records the same one who is present at the DGM site? 3) Hey, freaks - I've made my first telephone contact with another ETer! I think this doesn't happen that much - Toby, have you got some champaigne? [ I wish. ETers, please feel free to ship me a few crates -- Toby ] Cheers all Markus ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 20:59:32 -0400 From: "Jay Black" Subject: Todd Rundgren Don't like Adrian Belew (and I do, believe, me)? How about Todd Rundgren? Killer! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 23:53:56 +0200 From: Daniel Santo Orcero Subject: Robert Fripp is a penguin I have a suggestion for us: 1-finish the no-flashing, no-smoking thread 2-finish the fripp-bad vibrations with the public thread 3-finish the new-old material thread The reason is obvious and its essence is expressed as a zen poem in the subject. (No offense intended, Tony). BTW, i want to apologize for having said Fripp tours only for the money. It just made nonsense. Love for you all DanieL ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 01:14:50 +0200 From: Daniel Santo Orcero Subject: Robert Fripp is a penguin - disclaimer I forgot to include the quote. > It was too late, the magic of the moment had been destroyed by one simple ignorant > act. Small Children were emotionally scarred for life, grown adults wept at > the humanity, and I counted the cost of the fuel, the tickets, the crappy food, > the watered down drinks, the souvenir booklet, the t-shirt, the cap and the > damn fridge magnet. > > Robert Fripp is that Penguin. And a KC venue should is like the Penguin > Sanctuary at Phillip Island. Rule No 1: NO FLASH PHOTOGRAPHY. > > Tony Iremonger > Melbourne, Australia (Again: Tony, I hope you understand my sense of humour. Your story was really beautiful, it's just that it stroke me when out of context). ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 10:09:57 +0100 From: Simon Calkin Subject: Fripp and Eno - unissued The exuberant post concerning the Paris Olympia concert reminds me....there is also an unissued 1973 BBC session (two tracks,one of which is a version of "Swastika Girls"). These can be found on a bootleg album of wretched quality;it would be nice if they were released properly (if it can be done with old Bowie stuff,why not F&E?).This presupposes that the BBC haven't wiped/lost the tapes,of course. And NO,before anyone asks,I don't have any knowledge of or contact with the nice people at BBC Worldwide who get involved in releasing old BBC archive material. Yours in envy of those getting to see the King in the USA......... Simon Calkin Support Services,News Resources * Work: 0208 576 0910 * Fax: 0208 749 7853 * Room 4252 TV Centre, Wood Lane, London, W12 7RJ * mailto:simon dot calkin at bbc dot co dot uk * http://www.bbcresources.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Oct 2000 13:01:00 GMT From: "mike mclaughlin" Subject: Bill Bruford's Drumming This is gonna cause a host of abuse and people trying to explain to me why etc... but I'm gonna say it anyway. I and some friends were watching the video of the Three Of A Perfect Pair tour (I forgot what it's called but it's the official DGM one anyway that's not important) we noticed something shocking and quite frankly so unlikely we checked up on it. Bill Bruford was playing out of time, it was most obvious on Indiscipline when Ade was playing drums (he was in time perfectly) but Bill Bruford was definitely playing out of time. We all decided to check this up and listened to Three Of A Perfect Pair and he was out of time on that too. I'd never noticed before but it is there when you listen he plays either slightly early or slightly late. On the live Indiscipline he started out of time and then drifted into time with Ade. Now don't get me wrong I'm not some human metronome out to quash offbeat drumming, nor do I have it in for Bill Bruford I just felt it was an important point and warranted mentioning, reguardless of the no doubt venomous responses I will recieve (either in future ET's or some of the more vicious of you may decide to e-mail me personally) any how I don't want to sound totally negative so I'll point out that I do still enjoy all the Crim albums I have they provide me with a much needed mental stimulation after a day at work being subjected to the joys of mind-numbing techno. On a related note (isn't everything related...synchronicity and all that) the band for whom I perform all manner of bass related stunts (including playing the damn thing and gurning over it live) are contemplating a one off cover of 21st Century Schizoid Man (without the instrumental mid section just the vocal parts) for our Xmas gig that has little relevance to most ET readers since we will probably forget to record the show or play like a sack of socks (that and of course none of you people will be my friend after my crushing "anti-bruford" statements (for the record I'm not "Anti-Bruford" I just chose to point this out)). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:27:17 +0100 From: "Rich" Subject: Bill B in Kendal Last night I wandered down to the Brewery Arts Centre in Kendal to see Bill Bruford's Earthworks. The last time I saw Bruford playing live was a few months ago at the same venue when he appeared with Pete Lockett's Network of Sparks - a percussion extravaganza which made for a very unusual and exciting musical experience. I was hoping for similar this time around, and I was not disappointed. The line-up was as on the last Earthworks albumn, namely Steve Hamilton (piano), Patrick Clahar (tenor and soprano sax) and Kendal-born Mark Hodgson (double bass). This was a fully acoustic performance, with no electronics on show, and Bruford displayed a very minimal kit. The evening began with 'No Truce Without Furies' from the 'A Part, and Yet Apart' albumn, but the set soon moved on to new music, which Bruford cryptically announced as available in a couple of weeks - I think he meant recording will begin in a couple of weeks, as all the players were still working from lead sheets on these pieces. The first set concluded with 'Pigalle' from 'All Heaven Broke Loose' and the second set was made up with new material and tracks from 'APAYA'. The playing was excellent from all concerned all night. Clahar has a very Coltrane-ish tone and moved seamlessly from tenor to soprano. Hamilton displayed a variety of techniques, mixing intricate and extended right-hand figures with solid comping and some fine solos. The biggest cheers were not suprisingly reserved for Hodgson's solo spots, which showcased his mastery of the double bass. Bruford was superb all night, understated yet rock-solid and weaving a variety of patterns in front and behind the beat. A friend commented that he felt this band is not as distinctive as the Bellamy-Bates incarnation of Earthworks, as the band is more straight jazz and doesn't feature the quirky and distinctive melodies of that duo. I agree to some extent, but the new material displayed the angular melodies and odd metres which are a characteristic all Bruford's bands, but without the electronics. To me it demonstrated how Bill B is continually moving on and evolving the projects he is involved in, refusing to conform to what some fans might expect from this 'art-rock legend' (the Brewery's advertising blurb). Bruford seemed to enjoy the night himself, cracking jokes ("the next tune is a jazz version of 'Close to the Edge' - don't worry, I'm joking) and announcing that he would be willing to sign CDs after the show "for those wearing a Yes t-shirt who like that kind of thing". A superb evening's entertainment and I for one hope he returns to Cumbria soon. ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #744 ********************************