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Subject: Elephant Talk #724


               E L E P H A N T    T A L K

        The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp
              and King Crimson enthusiasts

                        Number 724

                  Sunday, 6 August 2000

Today's Topics:

   21st Century Schizoid Pumpkin
   Guide to guides :-)
   American, European and Latin appreciation
   ALICE ("THE 3rd STAR")
   Re; Set list.
   Great Deceiver and Ade
   Adrian - my turn
   FraKctured tablature
   My seemingly obligatory opinions on TCOL (and others)
   Adrian Belew
   Hello intense folks
   Adrian Belew sounding like John Lennon
   Trey Gunn Band, Tony Geballe, and interesting Turkish music
   Hidden Humour & Unexpected Origins
   Beatles again
   Re: TCOL in review
   Fans, ET, etc...
   Re: Bjork,Brittany Spears,& What?
   the obvious choice
   A Canadian ET'er in the Crimson King's Court
   ELP TRIBUTE ALBUM
   QUEEN RUBY & THE SCHIZOIDS
   ET is still about the Fans and I like it

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Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 07:08:34 -0500
From: Craig <v-dorje at ticnet dot com>
Subject: 21st Century Schizoid Pumpkin

Great site this guy has...............
~Craig

http://home.earthlink.net/~paulcarr/music_files/21CSPumpkin.html

http://home.earthlink.net/~paulcarr/music_files/fripp.html

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 00:23:15 +0700
From: Alexander Bessonov <alxb at mail2000 dot ru>
Subject: Guide to guides :-)

There are so many guides to different Fripp's projects, that it's
necessary to make yet another one -- a guide to all that guides. :-)))

Alexander.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 10:33:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: jan geerts <forimul at yahoo dot com>
Subject: American, European and Latin appreciation

I think a lot  of the debates around Fripp's attitude
towards his public and vice versa, are illustrated by
this quote :

<That what music is for entertaining>

Synchronicity : I read in Fripp's diary today the
different views on music in America, Europe and Latin
regions. Of course, they are generalizations : for me
music is art as well as a daily necessity (I am
European, but not a latino) However, I am guessing
this poster is an american:)
 And some rereactions : first, I don't think a
negative reaction to a post is hate mail, as mr Brown
catagorized it.  No hard feelings at all.

 <Are you trying to say that pop music is crap, yet
highly complex music is good just because it is?>

No such statement was in my post, not even between the
lines.  I like Motorhead, Derrick May, Melanie, The
Shirts...  Not really virtuosos there, but I like 'em
fine. I don't enjoy Limp Bizkit, Korn, Celine
Dion(especially her),... but that's taste for ya.
That's miles away from the professional audio
products(which is not the same as music) that dominate
the charts.

<Maybe Fripp wouldn't dislike fan interaction so much
if people would stop treating him like he was better
then they. Yes, he has influenced a lot of people. So
I have, so have you, everybody  influences everybody
else.>

He certainly is a better guitarist and composer than I
am.  Guitar Craft and DGM are great achievements as
well.  I admire him for that, this does not imply any
idolatry or inferiority complexes on my part.  And I
dare say that people like Fripp, Miles,... have
influenced a little more people than we have, again
with no regret on my part.

<I know lots of musicians who would sell their souls
to be as half as famous as Fripp.>

I believe that 'the soul' is the main ingredient for
music.  Most artists do have to sell their soul to get
their music heard, and if that soul is sucked dry,
they go for drugs,... and eventualy they get dumped.
There are musicians who will not allow that, and
choose for performing on a very small scale.  I'm glad
people like Fripp got such a thick skin and
perseverance, so the whole world (and myself
particulary)can listen to them.
I would be very interested to hear firsthand from
people from different demographic area's what's their
view on the role of music, except the (generalized)
american view, thank you, I've got that one. I think
it maybe best this would happen through private mail,
maybe it's too general for ET.
toodles,

Sound Mind

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 15:28:57 EDT
From: "MALCOLM XERXES" <malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com>
Subject: ALICE ("THE 3rd STAR")

THUAUG3/2000/15:22

     PARLIAMENT OF PACHYDERMS, Greetings one and all!  I have been seeking
in vain to find recordings and/or information by and about the mysterious
ALICE, who gives voice on TREY GUNN'S "THE 3rd STAR".  Her voice sounds like
a synthesis of what I like best about TOYAH & DIAMANDA GALAS.

     If anyone has pertinent information, please forward it to me at the
address below:

     "There's nothing you can do that can't be done."
                                                -JOHN LENNON

     Excelsior!

     MALCOLM XERXES  (BATTERIE/PERCUSSIVES)  ACTRA/BAEA/CAEA
     malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com

     www.angelfire.com/music/a1000m  Email: a1000m at hotmail dot com
     www.shakesintherough.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 06:56:28 +1000
From: " Tony Greig" <sztgnym at turboweb dot net dot au>
Subject: Re; Set list.

Hello Crimophiles,
In ET 722, "Jeremy Klein" <jmk238 at hotmail dot com wrote,

<First of all, it is the performer's choice as to what material they play
<and the audience is well aware that KC is not going to be playing any old
<material.  SO DON'T KEEP POSTING ABOUT IT!  It's pointless and stupid.

It may be a pointless rave, but it is not a stupid one! There is nothing
wrong with people expressing their point of view, just because you think
something, does not mean it is correct! Where does this absurd rave come
from that everyone knows what Crimson will be playing at a concert? What,
everyone is connected to the internet and has access to Fripp's diary, the
Guestbook at DGM or Elephant Talk etc, to see what Crimson may play?
I think not!
How many people get news of Crimson coming to town sometime in the future
and go along because of their liking for the music that the band is known
for and the new material they will perform? I agree the debate has gone on a
bit, but I am sure Toby will be the one who says enough is enough!

 <I understand that many people are nostaglia lovers and want to hear their
<old favorites played live and bring back fond or not so fond memories.
<Well go see a tribute band or something and allow others who want to focus
<and add to the energy of the event come instead.

It is not nostalgia to enjoy a performance of music from the past, if it is,
then everyone had better get rid of everything they buy, because as soon as
you experience it, history is created! Secondly, why would anyone want to
bring back not so fond memories?
A tribute band, really, I shudder at the thought.
Because certain people who love Crimson in whatever form express an opinion,
does not necessarily mean they will, or could be limiting others from
contributing to and enjoying a concert.

<As many other posters have already said, if nobody comes to the shows then
<KC will be forced to reconsider their position.  However, this does not
<seem to be the case nor does it seems remotely likely of occuring.
<Therefore, unless you're interested in energizing KC and allowing the
<creation of magical moments, stay the hell away and play your CD'S at home.

Are you telling us what to do again Jeremy? HMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!

I agree about the flash photography and autograph rave,
but...................

We would have dearly loved the opportunity to experience a Crimson gig in
Australia, but as we know, it isn't going to happen and life goes on! But I
will fervently defend the suggestion that fans like myself, could be
impeding the energy and magic of a concert we attend, because we comment on
a thought that we happened to think about. (It is not an expectation)
I would not attend a concert of one of my favourite artists (or any artist),
if I was pre-judging the concert or being negative to the point of affecting
the performer(s) or the audience!

I think I could have been the one who started the 'old material' rave a
while back, and if thats the case, NO I am not going to apologise for it. It
isn't that bad an opinion is it? I could think of a lot of other comments
that have dragged on a bit, that are much more irrelevant (and personal)!
After all, this is Elephant Talk!
Life is too short to worry about these things!
Cheers again, Tony Greig.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 21:36:08 GMT
From: "Mark Kisselbach" <mwkbach at hotmail dot com>
Subject: Great Deceiver and Ade

"Good Evening Hippies":

I think that starting KC over is intriguing, but wrong.  The 3 piece
already exists--P3--and to start over would mean to start from scratch.  I
still think Ade's words/singing/guitar are at the cutting edge--but enough
with Mastoletto!  The drum sound on TCOL is not great (I would've yelled,
"BRUFORD!" just like other fans on Great Deceiver box--but I was only @ 6
yrs. old).

Speaking of GD--I have the original 1992 box set in mint cond.  Is it worth
anything?  I wouldn't mind selling it for the right price, even though I
think it is the best thing ever produced by KC.  I just think I outplayed
it! (I also think the Proj. Box is a close 2nd).

One more Crimbit: I'm a 6th/7th/8th grade English Teacher in NJ, and every
once in awhile, at the end of the day, I'll throw on "LTIA" or "Red", or
the Proj. Box, just to see my kids either a.) cringe, or b.) say, "That's
cool .  . . what's that?")  I'm going to try out Proj. X and the
"Repurcussions of Angelic Behavior" on them this fall.

--Mark (from the "center of the cosmos" in NJ)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 19:09:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dan Wasser <crimsonkng at mail dot com>
Subject: Adrian - my turn

"nerval" <nerval at email dot msn dot com> wrote:

<"I really like Belew, and "Beat" is one of my favorite Crimson works.  When
pressed, it seems that the guitar of Fripp gets on my nerves. "<

I agree wholeheartedly.  The '80s Crimson is my favorite.  And it seems to
me that Fripp hasn't written a decent Crimson melody in years.

I like the fact that Adrian is a Beatles freak.  So am I!  And I enjoy his
music BECAUSE it has a Beatles influence.  Guess that's why I like XTC,
too.

And, though not Crimson, Adrian's Op Zop Too Wah is amazing.  And while I'm
at it: Rob Fetters is an amazing guitarist!

So there.

Dan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 23:58:32 +0200
From: "Jakub Misak" <jmisak at centrum dot cz>
Subject: FraKctured tablature

Hi,

I sent a complete guitar transcription of FraKctured to ET Web. Yes,
complete with that insane section - I know Marcus Enochsson was also working
on FraKctured tab, but since I haven't seen it yet at ET Web, I decided to
send my own version, which is BTW in the tuning that RF uses.
I can also send it to you via e-mail, if you wish (or if it's not there
yet).

Jakub
jmisak at centrum dot cz

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 10:19:04 +1000
From: "STUDER, Andrew" <ajs at ansto dot gov dot au>
Subject: My seemingly obligatory opinions on TCOL (and others)

Well every one else has had their say. Why should I be circumspect?

1) I find myself immediately attracted to the longer tracks
(TCOL, LTiA 4, Frakctured) and finding the "songs" a little
harder to get into.

2) I find myself liking the album for a lot of the reasons
others don't- the V-drums, Pat's playing, Belew's processed
vocals, the selective influence of older KC. It is, however,
a demanding album to listen to in its entirety, and like many
KC albums falls into the category of "like it but don't listen
to it all the time". Perversely though, the ProjeKcts set gets
constant airplay, (as well as the P4 KCCC disc) so I'm
sure that reflects (refleKcts?) my personal response rather
than the material itself.

3) Although I've mentioned Pat's playing already, I find
myself enjoying everyone's contribution to the album. As
others point out, it seems that as well as drawing on past
Crimson "methods" where apposite, there's the occasional
direct quotation of little riffs and selections from the past.
For example, Trey's particular style of touch playing
comes across very strongly on this album, but I swear
there's 10 seconds during TCOL where he rips off Levin
perfectly.

Other releases: I was disappointed (slightly) with the sound
quality on Moles Club but only because the quality of
Central Park (my first KCCC) was so good. I soon got over
it, and enjoy the disc a lot.

Finally, given the predilection for ET readers to post wish
lists for what KC band members should do with their time,
mine is this: I'm quite enjoying the music of the current
KC 4 piece, though I hear plenty of musical space for Levin
and/or Bruford to "reintegrate" themselves if that situation
were to occur. What would be way cool would be for
B.L.U.E. to become a more permanent arrangement.
Still, with one studio and two live discs, I can't complain too
much.

Andrew

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 19:34:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alfred Bello <alfbello at yahoo dot com>
Subject: Adrian Belew

How can anybody even consider or imagine King Crimson without Adrian? Do not anoy anymore!

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 23:09:12 EDT
From: Obelisk123 at aol dot com
Subject: Hello intense folks

Hey there people... I am the new guy.. I am really amazed at the intensity
of u folks ( Kinda a voyeur at the moment ) Anyway, soon I will try to
contribute something of value.. But..... As a newcomer..

I am a 33 yr ole fellow from the Hudson Valley in NY State.. I have seen
Crimson a bunch since I first cracked my egg in the early 80's. I have seen
Fripp presentations of soundscapes n other stuff ta boot.. Also Some Belew
solo stuff.. Tony Levin... Bruford n other offshoots.. Asia.. Elp... Solo
Wetton...

I own the records n know them..

U must excuse my spelling...

this is intense music performed by intense human beings. We are a strange
lot n so are they..  It seems to come with the package.. U see it in many
music scenes where there is a dedicated following...  Strange spagetti..

If Robert does not want to be in that kind of situations ( Photo flashes n
Mics in the crowd ) thats that...  what can u do??  If yr not really into
Adrian's vocals or lyrical concepts don't listen ( Try to tune em out n
latch on to what u dig in the music)..

I think Adrian N Robert click..... The music is friggn fantastic.... If
Robert is doing his thing n I pass em on the street n I say, " Hey Man...
Yr a crazy ass guitar genius" n he keeps walkn away ( always keepn me in
his line of vision )That's what I gotta deal with.. Thats who he is.. I can
respect that...

I am known to ocasionaly dance at crimson shows n even regeratate some of
my Grateful Dead space shimmys at a soundscape gig. ( Had a few folks
really upset with me at the Bottem Line a few yrs ago cause I was having
fun.. It seemed to bother some who were stoic ) N no I was not blocking
anybody's view.. I was holding court in the far corner by the bar..  What
my pt is.. If I have one

enjoy the music. enjoy the current players.. enjoy the past recordings..
Enjoy this newsgroup

The red head in yr mists

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 22:38:00 -0500
From: Don Hosek <dhosek at quixote dot com>
Subject: Adrian Belew sounding like John Lennon

Jay Black wrote:

>Should I land a recording contract
>someday, and become wildly popular among Krim-heads, will you all 'dis my
>originals because you will say that I sound too much like Adrian?

Of course we will. This is elephant talk ;-)

-dh

---

'In his chapter on "Colour," Sir Charles Stanford calls the Bass a
"dangerous rogue elephant."  This is rather cruel.  It is so long since he
was corralled and shut up in the Government Keddahs that he has by now
become docile.  Such a huge brute can indeed still be mighty unpleasant, if
he is ill-treated.  It is therefore *safer* to treat him well.  Then he
will show his true elephantine nature in not withholding his skill from the
most burdensome tasks.  Humour him a little.
 Don't let him stand about, perhaps catching cold, and probably getting in
everyone's way.  Give him a certain amount of freedom, air, and exercise.
Above all don't stable him in the cellar.' -Cecil Forsythe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 00:43:20 EDT
From: Arctan2000 at aol dot com
Subject: Trey Gunn Band, Tony Geballe, and interesting Turkish music

These are some web sites that some listeners of the Trey Gunn Band,
especially of their recent album The Joy of Molybdenum, and of Tony Geballe
could find interesting.

The following is the site, in English, of a record company called Kalan
Music specializing in Turkish music. Although I have not ordered from them
online and therefore have no opinion of their online service, I have many
of their CDs which I enjoy greatly in the overall Turkish music universe.
The site has useful information about the musicians and works, so it is
also helpful from an info source perspective. The site occasionally gives
problems, like "page not found", but it seems to be improving with time -
if you run into problems, revisiting at a later date seems to help.

http://www.kalan.com/maineng.asp

Within this site, and online generally, I would recommend checking out the
works by Erkan Ogur. Click on "artists" on the left and then click on the
link that has his name. Erkan plays several instruments, and is primarily a
guitar player. As far as I know, he was the person to originally create and
start playing the guitar without frets within Turkey. Since that time
(1976), he has developed his own quite unique, technically masterful, and
simply beautiful way of playing the fretless guitar. His CDs are usually
also available at the following mail order service based in New Jersey that
sells Turkish music CDs.

http://www.turkishmusic.com

If you were into saz which Tony Geballe plays on Molybdenum, the CD called
Gulun Kokusu Vardi by Erkan Ogur and Ismail Demircioglu might be especially
interesting. They play different types of saz, as well as an instrument
called kopuz which has older historical roots. If mainly you want to check
out Erkan's fretless guitar playing, his CD called Bir Omurluk Misafir is
excellent. In addition to his own CDs listed on the two sites above, Erkan
has contributed to albums by numerous other Turkish musicians such as
Bulent Ortacgil (his stuff is usually acoustic guitar based folk pop with a
melancholic/observational/ social lyrical twist) and Okay Temiz (percussion
guru, with countless innovative and interesting albums, especially worth
mentioning his role in the 70s' multi-national Euro ethno-jazz band called
Oriental Wind) and these CDs can usually be found in the second site.

Yaman Aksu

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 03:07:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: Shane Brady <shanerolio at email dot com>
Subject: Hidden Humour & Unexpected Origins

Hello There

I seem to recall someone posting recently about hidden references to
Krim-past on TCoL. Well, I picked up on one last month that had me in
stitches. Without spoiling it for anyone who hasn't noticed check out
Adrian's solo on Prozakc Blues about 4:20 into the track.  And some people
want this guy out of the band?

I was listening to my P1 jazz cafe disc the other day and rediscovered what
an amazing piece track 5 is for me. Later I heard the 7th track on the disc
and found myself listening to an earlier link in the -Projekction-Frying
Pan- chain. Sounds like a similar concept anyway.

Best Wishes to all!
Shane Brady

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 13:57:53 +0100
From: Simon Calkin <simon dot calkin at bbc dot co dot uk>
Subject: Beatles again

Notice that the Beatles appear on the cover of "Lizard".One of the cartoon
boxes clearly has the fab four (and Yoko,if memory serves) in it. Elsewhere
you'll also see Hendrix (albeit playing righthanded).

Simon Calkin
Support Services,News Resources
*  Work:                0208 576 0910
*  Fax:                 0208 749 7853
* Room 4252 TV Centre, Wood Lane, London, W12 7RJ
> * mailto:simon dot calkin at bbc dot co dot uk
> * http://www.bbcresources.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 08:25:55 -0300
From: "Ricardo Aranda" <rockisland at arnet dot com dot ar>
Subject: Re: TCOL in review

Hi All Eters:

About Proclaimation Posting.: Totally Agree.
File me in the list of those who does'nt like
TCOL very much, so I Guess the score is
actually NO: Half plus one.
So suffocating...heaven and Earth is indeed
a very good one, it reminds me the Fripp and
Sylvian works, that's why.

It get's hard to imagine that the first Kc 1973
lineup rehersals were dissapointing...

See you later
Rick

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 17:25:28 +0200
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <marcingokieli at go2 dot pl>
Subject: Fans, ET, etc...

Mark Newstrom wrote:
>PS Is it true that all King Crimson bass players have made vocal
>contributions to the Crimson repertoire?  (Forgive me, Toby, if this is in
>the FAQ.)

As far as I know, the only exception would be Pete Giles on ITWOP ( a great
bass player, and he had a great bass sound, too. I like his playing much
more more then what Lake did on ITCOCK). Neither TL nor TG did much vocal
in Crimso, but they did some backgrounds.

Marcin Gokieli
marcin dot gokieli at mospan dot pl
Generally speaking, if a philosopher offers to 'dissolve' the problem you
are working on, tell him to go climb a tree - Jerry Fodor

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 12:42:57 -0400 (CLT)
From: "Miguel Farah F." <miguel at antonia dot webhost dot cl>
Subject: Re: Bjork,Brittany Spears,& What?

>
>Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 13:08:28 -0500 (CDT)
>From: TheMincer at webtv dot net (Ric Wilson)
>Subject: Bjork,Brittany Spears,& What?
>
>Hello,and I've gotta say this...Yeah, Bjork has the vocal range to make a
>great vocalist IF the King were to ever consider a femme vocalist.  Yeah,I
>think she could handle the task! She has the vocal range of a Female
>"Captain Beefheart"! As for Brittney Spears, how in hell's name she even
>get brought up in "Elephant Talk"? I thought I was reading "Teeny Beat" or

Actually, BS could play a lady of the road in a KC live show...

(I'll shut up now)

--
MIGUEL FARAH              //   miguel at webhost dot cl
#include <disclaimer.h>   //   http://www.webhost.cl/~miguel
<*>
"Trust me - I know what I'm doing."
- Sledge Hammer

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2000 13:45:10 -0400
From: Steve Gould <SGould at VNSNY dot org>
Subject: the obvious choice

For a new or additional or even guest vocalist how about  Meshell
Ndegeocello
(don't ask me how it's pronounced).  She's black, she's bald!, she's
beautiful, and she also plays bass!

check a few sample songs here

http://www.maverickrc.com/meshell/music.html

on another topic, I must recommend the 30th anniversary cd's in the mini-lp
format, the booklets are great, with press clippings (some positive some
negative)  from the appropriate era.  And exceptional sound, I have a HDCD
compatible player and all 4 sound terrific (I have noticed that ITCOTCK is
not HDCD).  If an artist is going to remaster old material this is the way
to go.  Sticking Groon on ITWOP would have been a nice touch though.
Looking forward to the next 3 re-issues.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 14:00:58 -0400
From: Jim Bailey <jimb at ehmail dot com>
Subject: A Canadian ET'er in the Crimson King's Court

Greetings to all...,

...But especially to those in the UK. If all goes well, my wife and I will
be over there at the end of the month, and it would be nice to meet a few
of you. No promises, as I have no idea what we'll be doing or where we'll
be going, but our initial base of operations will be my sister's place in
Plaistow, east London.

At this point, I can't see the possibility of a pilgrimage to Manchester,
so I may have to forego a personal audience with our Great Dicta...er
Moderator, Toby. :-(

Any personal correspondence (recommended) should be addressed to my
free-mail account: jimb at ehmail dot com

I will travel hopefully.

Jim Bailey

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 19:20:50 EDT
From: "MALCOLM XERXES" <malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com>
Subject: ELP TRIBUTE ALBUM

FRIAUG4/2000/19:17

     PACHYDERMIC PARLIAMENT:  In ELEPHANT TALK #723, SANDY STARR mentions an
EMERSON, LAKE & POWELL/PALMER tribute on which MISTER JOHN WETTON performs:
could anyone please tell me the title of this record and whether or not it
is still in print?

     "Any help you could give would be most er, um...well, helpful,
really...."

     "There's nothing you can do that can't be done."
                                                -JOHN LENNON

     Excelsior!

     MALCOLM XERXES  (BATTERIE/PERCUSSIVES)  ACTRA/BAEA/CAEA
     malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com

     www.angelfire.com/music/a1000m  Email: a1000m at hotmail dot com
     www.shakesintherough.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 21:13:28 EDT
From: "MALCOLM XERXES" <malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com>
Subject: QUEEN RUBY & THE SCHIZOIDS

FRIAUG4/2000/21:01

     PACHYDERMIC PARLIAMENT:  MARK NEWSTROM suggested that an alternate
KRIMSON be formed in an effort to accommodate the so-called "nostalgists" in
the audience.  I suspect that his tongue was somewhat in his cheek, but just
in case...

     "There's nothing you can do that can't be done."
                                                -JOHN LENNON

     Excelsior!

     MALCOLM XERXES  (BATTERIE/PERCUSSIVES)  ACTRA/BAEA/CAEA
     malcolmxerxes at hotmail dot com

     www.angelfire.com/music/a1000m  Email: a1000m at hotmail dot com
     www.shakesintherough.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2000 11:11:19 +0200
From: "Markus Gnad" <richard dot gnad at liwest dot at>
Subject: ET is still about the Fans and I like it

HI THERE!!!

After a few digests of staying away, because I had to set up
my new PC and private internet connection, I got a lot of new
crazy thoughts and "lots of joyious noise" to annoy you with.

1) First an announcement. I changed my eMail address, and
because I have regular contact with many ETers I'll let you know
by now: Markus Alexander Gnad can be contacted via
thegreatdeceiver at liwest dot at. Please no more mails to mgnad at rundschau dot co dot at
Thanks!

2) My cent about John Wetton: I've been listening to Johnny before
I got into KC. From his works with Asia on (which were the first I heard) I
always connected him with dark and sad music. Did anyone read Robert's
diary entries about the JW-era? He says something like John Wetton
is continually trying to become a great singer and he is actually a great
singer,
and that for Johnny this seems to be more important than being that Bass
Beast.

3) Speaking of the female vocalist for KC: I can only think of two ...female
dressed...
vocalists: Possible choice would be Klaus Nomi, but he isn't among us
anymore.
The only possible choice would be, yeah, you have it, Marilyn Manson.
Imagine
Robert and Ade torturing their guitars while MM cries "Mechanical Animals",
or MM screaming "I'm a dinosaur".

4) Adrian Belew Issue.
First to say, Ade is what I connected with KC from day one on. I saw his
picture on the Thrakattak CD and I knew... hey, this one is great. I
then only knew his work with Mike Oldfield, and subsequently got hold of
Mr. Music Head. Hey, this is such a fascinating musician.
His Beatles influence: Shouldn't be new to anyone here that AB loves
Beatles. And to those who still don't believe, check out 117 Valley Drive
on Coming Attractions. He says that he's been playing Beatles tune in
his teen days. But then, probably any rock musician has put his hands
on some Beatles songs.

5) The Bad ETers. I have to get this one out. I don't believe that there
are so many hate-posters on ET. I believe this is an illusion. Most
replies to posts are replies to negative posts, and so it creates
the illusion that many out there hate AB, hate RF, and want to destroy
KConcert events. I really believe that Elephant Talk is a friendly and
posivite resource. By the way, did anyone see the recommendation
for ET on KingCrimson.TV?

6) Nancy Mack wrote

"Because I know that at the end of a nasty day of slave labor, fighting
traffic and getting hit with whatever daily crap Life throws at me, I can
think of nothing better than popping my earphones on and losing myself in
the music."  This is great - but I listen to KC during work also! (if
nobody is in the room)

7) Ian Beltrow wrote

"In a past posting I read a good point was given - To be in a band with
someone you also have to like, respect, and get along with them."  I
remember Nick Mason of Pink Floyd saying something like "Well, everybody
believes being in a band is all happy and we're so good friends. Hey,
everybody wishes that his band was like the Beatles (were this was the case
obviously). But things are not like that."

8) The one ideal opening act for KC would be the famous Carlos Peron
(founding member of Yello). Visit www.carlos-peron.de

9) Alex McCune said "The only other vocalist that I could compare Belew to
was David Byrne, and at this time I was unaware that they had worked
together." and he said "The thing that always annoyed me was the constant
branding of Crimson as a Prog-Rock outfit, lumping them in with the likes
of Yes, Genesis and so on (what an insult)" This leads me to one point that
is often overseen in here. I put it carefully, because it's a very fragile
theme.  Robert Fripp and also Adrian Belew have continually worked with
many musicians who had their roots in the avantgarde underground. David
Bowie, David Sylvian, Brian Eno, Talking Heads, no matter how famous they
have become later.  It's no secret that Robert favs this direction to the
prog-direction. Robert Fripp has always tried to make an underground band
out of King Crimson, with only the freaks to come to the shows and listen
to the musiKc. And it's his effort that I got hold of so many discs that
come from that source.

I had a discussion with an ETer about two months ago, don't remember his
name, where I told him that I tend to call all that stuff - spanning from
Bowie to Talking Heads to Eno to Sylvian to Gabriel to all the others - Gay
Music. Hey I hear you wondering.  Explanation: Real music that is produced
by homosexual artists is definitely superior.  No doubt about it. There's a
deeper sensitiveness in the words and in the music, and if you listen
really intensively to gay-rock-and-pop-verterans-music you will acknowledge
that. Easy examples: Life On Mars, Your Song. That emotions don't come
across to that extent in "non-gay-music".  Subsequently - maybe out of
stupidity - I call all kinds of music that have a very deep emotional sense
"Gay Music". And in this source, you find a lot of bands and artists that
have worked with RF and AB. That makes KC even more special and definitely
puts them out of that prog bottle.

Before you mail me now with your questions: This is my interpretation. It
doesn't matter to me if an artists is homosexual or not, why should it
matter at all, I simply file music that sounds like gay-rock under
that. This is no discrimination, well, maybe just a discrimination of music
that I don't file under gay-rock. I know this is a fragile theme so I would
be very pleased if nobody would misinterpret it and start to make trouble
about it.

That's all for today!
Markus Alexander Gnad

PS Toby: those funny top-bit characters.... that's what makes German
so interesting! (smile)

PPS Long articles in the newspaper which I work for, are not read by
the readers. Is the same true for ET? (smile, too)

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End of Elephant Talk Digest #724
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