Reply-To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Discipline #67 Discipline, Number 67 Saturday, 28 November 1992 Today's Topics: Boz Clarification Re: Discipline #66 Bill Bruford vs. Fripp Comments on Discipline #66 Re: Discipline Fripp on new Eno track? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 10:45:08 PST From: 20-Nov-1992 1338 Subject: Boz Clarification >From: tm1cy1 >Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 17:42:59 GMT >Sybject: Lark's talk >Many thanks for the answers to my previous queries, to continue with the >Boz Burrell theme, did he play bass on Lizard, and if so had his playing >improved by any ammount? Paul, You seem to be confused here. "Lizard" predated "Islands". The bassist on "Lizard" was Gordon Haskell, who also did the vocals. Boz only appears on one other Crimson album, the live "Earthbound" which Fripp has disavowed and I have never heard. After that tour, the entire band abandoned Fripp and went off to play with bluesman Alexis Korner. They called themselves Snape and there is an album on Warner Bros. (out of print) documenting that band. Boz went off to Bad Co. next. Since he left them, he's been out of sight, hopefully living well off his royalties. Brian Rost rost at tecrus dot enet dot dec dot com 508-568-6115 DEC, Hudson, MA ******************************************************************************* "There's too many hands in your persimmon pie, when one hand is my desire" -Roosevelt Sykes ******************************************************************************* [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 20 Nov 92 16:01:56 CST From: tmadson at pnet51 dot orb dot mn dot org (Todd Madson) Subject: Re: Discipline #66 Thanks to whomever for re-printing the "Coffee and Chocolates for Two Guitars." My issue mysteriously dissapeared some years back and I've wanted to read it again. Hey, how about getting Mr. Prasad to interview Mr. Fripp? UUCP: {amdahl!bungia, crash}!orbit!pnet51!tmadson ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!tmadson at nosc dot mil INET: tmadson at pnet51 dot orb dot mn dot org [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: sigh at rhi dot hi dot is Subject: Bill Bruford vs. Fripp Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 13:11:33 GMT There seems to be a lot of discussion on Bruford-Fripp relationship and to that I would like to add my own DIRECT information. I was in sommer 1985 in London and saw this advertizement for Bruford-Moraz concert. I went there but a little late and the concert was over when I finally arrived. The performance was held in a small pub (ca. 100-200 people) somewhere in the suburbs of London. Well I wasnt happy missing this concert which was "Great" from what I heard form other people. I decided to go to the backroom and greet my favorite drummer. There they were Moraz and Bruford and some manager. They were friendly and I had long talk with Bruford who was quick and obviously an intelligent man. Moraz was however a dissapointment and looked just to tired to talk (not as intelligent). I told them to come and play in Iceland and they agreed, but they wanted to play in big halls and earn some money, but they are simply to avantgarde to get more then 200 people here. The manager gave me however his card. I asked Bruford about Crimson and Fripp. He was obviously negative minded about him and told me that he was teaching at some "lunatic school" in America. A remark read in Discipline#66. I think that Fripp is to pretentious character for the straightforward no nonsense Bill. Bill is the natural gifted player who just want to play more and talk less. Well afterwards we drank a can of beer and chatted some nonsense (well I had drunken some liters before) and a photograph was taken of us and Moraz. Any offers? Two years later I saw Bill with Earthworks and that was something! Orn Orrason Multi-Detector-Systems 107 Reykjavik Iceland Tel. 1-694783 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 21 Nov 92 17:38:27 -0500 From: bt979 at cleveland dot Freenet dot Edu (Jeff Preston) Subject: Comments on Discipline #66 >From: davidh at kau1 dot kodak dot com (David Hodson) >Subject: misquote >> From: ee152fcy at sdcc15 dot UCSD dot EDU (Paolo Valladolid) >> >> "...We learn reading, writing, and fainting in coils..." >> >> - Bill Bruford as the Mock Turtle >That's " ... drawling, stretching, and fainting in coils." From Alice (in >Wonderland? through the Looking Glass?), of course. Sorry about the >pedantry, but some of us take this stuff seriously :-) Well, you know how some of us mainly-instrumental listeners can be with lyrics. ;) I always thought it was "drawling," but I wasn't sure. Just like a recent post to 'alt.music.progressive' -- someone posted the first line in the U.K. tune, "Time To Kill," which I would have never deciphered on my own (and in fact I've forgotten the exact wording even now). And I've probably only heard that tune about 800 times. :) >From: MICHAEL dot LEE at mail dot admin dot wisc dot edu >Subject: Great Deceiver [...] >The simple review: Is it worth it? I bought mine for $52.00, and have >already decided it's my best investement in Crimson. Throw out those >bootlegs - you just Don't Need Them. [...] I've already decided this will be my first-ever box set. I guess I'll have to make it a post-Christmas Christmas present -- to myself. ;) [...] >Beg, borrow, and steal for this one.....it's excessive, both in >documentation (67 pages, most of which has absolutely nothing to do with >Wetton-era Crimson) and in content (4+ hours)), but it really is >incredible. I may ship some more comments out later, if I have time. And if anyone's interested, the Michael Bloom who's mentioned in the "excessive documentation" by Fripp (he calls him "clueless and slightly slack," heh heh) is a regular contributor to the Allmusic list on Bitnet (ALLMUSIC at AUVM dot BITNET). Hey, he probably reads this digest, as well. He's had more than his 15 minutes of fame now, but I think we should extend our congrats to him for being a gracious target of a Fripp insult! :) Jeff -- | Jeff Preston - owner and moderator of | "We don't get many requests | | the Allan Holdsworth discussion list | for recent history." -- Mr. | | *** To subscribe, send e-mail to: *** | Atoz, from the '69 Star Trek | | | episode _All Our Yesterdays_ | [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 25 Nov 92 11:20:41 EST From: "Michael H. Bloom" Subject: Re: Discipline #66 >From: tm1cy1 >Sybject: Lark's talk > >Many thanks for the answers to my previous queries, to continue with the >Boz Burrell theme, did he play bass on Lizard, and if so had his playing >improved by any ammount? Boz was not on _Lizard_. Boz was invited to join the band as vocalist, and Rick Kemp was going to be the bassist. Kemp told a story that basically made it sound like Fripp was already working on complicated tunes in the "Larks' Tongues" or "Fracture" vein, and Kemp couldn't keep up; it was like "Okay, now play that theme backwards, inserting an extra beat every sixth bar." So Kemp quit, and Boz said he'd be interested in trying to play bass, so Fripp showed him some rudiments, and wrote a bunch of simpler tunes, which became _Islands_. I think I heard that the length of time Boz had played bass when they went in to record _Islands_ was three weeks. He of course went on to fame and fortune as a bassist with Bad Company, and said some quite hilarious nasty things about his original benefactor, which Fripp dutifully recorded in the "scrapbook" to the _Frame By Frame_ box set. >From: MICHAEL dot LEE at mail dot admin dot wisc dot edu >Subject: Great Deceiver > >Wow! I picked up the live boxed set yesterday. I've managed to get >through 3 of the 4 '70 minute discs. A solid track by track review is >beyond my scope -- I don't have the time right now, and I am trying to get >some work done today. :-) Some more statistics: each CD is over an hour, up to something like 77 min, so there's well over four and a half hours of music in this box. There are half a dozen concerts represented, including in its entirety the Providence, RI, show the night before Central Park, which was of course this band's last performance. The Providence show was where the improv called "Providence" took place, and this is a more "live" mix than the version on _Red_. There is also a different (and longer) mix of "We'll Let You Know." Altogether nearly two hours of this is improvised-- although some of that is extended intros to songs like "Exiles" that start rather amorphously, which Fripp assigned separate titles and CD index entries to. About half the music comes from the band's last week, when they were much closer to their heavy metal mode. The earliest material is only eight months earlier-- 23 October 1973, a show in Glasgow (I think)-- which was already a year into their too short existence. The lack of material featuring Jamie Muir is my biggest gripe with the thing. >The simple review: Is it worth it? I bought mine for $52.00, and have >already decided it's my best investement in Crimson. Throw out those >bootlegs - you just Don't Need Them. It was, ironically, a bootleg from >this period that turned me on to Crimson, and this is just incredible >stuff. The sound is excellent and clear, with vivid stereo. I was playing >the first disc on my roommates surround sound system, and I couldn't even >work I was getting into Larks' Tongues in Aspic so deeply. > >There really isn't a lot of duplication of songs, and even when they are >duplicated, they are different enough that you don't care. Well, four takes of "Easy Money" is two too many, I think. (My second biggest complaint.) >Interesting tracks - a Wetton version of Cat Food! > >Beg, borrow, and steal for this one.....it's excessive, both in >documentation (67 pages, most of which has absolutely nothing to do with >Wetton-era Crimson) and in content (4+ hours)), but it really is >incredible. I may ship some more comments out later, if I have time. The "scrapbook" in this box picks up where the last box leaves off, and includes all the reviews of the last box. It looks like Fripp proposes to keep issuing Crimson box sets as a kind of annual magazine, until either he runs out of archival tapes, or the revived Crimson takes up all his time. The proposed next project is a two CD set of the _Court..._ and/or _Islands_ band, hopefully with better sound quality than the three songs on the live disc from _Frame By Frame_. I've heard n'th generation dubs of audience hand-held cassettes that sounded better than that! My favorite part of the booklet here is David Cross's reminiscences, which shed a lot of light on the inner workings of this band. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] [[[ The following is taken from alt.guitar -- Toby ]]] From: malcolm at wrs dot com (Malcolm Humes) Subject: Fripp on new Eno track? Date: 27 Nov 92 22:41:27 GMT Organization: Wind River Systems, Inc. [[ comments about Eno's new album 'The Shutov Assembly' deleted ]] [BTW, I discovered that the US CD5 for ALI CLICK has two mixes not on the European release, plus it has an extra track that was originally planned for My Squelchy Life: I Fall Up. But it sounds like a slightly different mix. Fripp isn't credited on guitar on this track but I'd swear it's him. It sounds like it's guitar synth circa The Sheltering Sky solo. Could be Percy Jones on bass on there too. - Malcolm [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] To join this mailing list or have your thoughts in the next issue, please send electronic mail to Toby Howard at the following address: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The Discipline archives are available on ftp.uwp.edu, in /pub/music/lists/discipline. The views expressed in Discipline are those of the individual authors only.