Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #632 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 632 Wednesday, 2 February 2000 Today's Topics: NEWS: Trey Gunn Update - February 1, 2000 What's going on? Meanings to P.Sinfield's Lyrics Tickmaster and printing your own tickets posters + concert price Some proposals For what it's worth... Voyager Episode & Your Favorite Quadratic Equation Bill Rieflin "Birth Of A Giant" Dr. Evil has stolen my Mojo crimson on t.v. and summit studios cd's for sale hidden bonus tracks discourse Negative Psychological Impact of KC ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.5b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 19:00:59 -0500 From: Trey Gunn Update Subject: NEWS: Trey Gunn Update - February 1, 2000 The latest Trey Gunn news direct to your mailbox http://www.treygunn.com News: - New CD Available "The Joy of Molybdenum" - Trey Gunn Band Tour Dates - Site redesign update Trey Gunn Releases "The Joy of Molybdenum" Trey's latest solo CD, "The Joy of Molybdenum" is now available online at Trey's revamped online store, and on February 1, 2000 via better retailers everywhere. The CD info: The Trey Gunn Band The Joy of Molybdenum DGM 0001 Call or visit your local independent retailer today and ask for it. Or, if you'd like to get it online, go to Trey's Online Store: http://www.treygunn.com/onlinestore.html Trey Gunn Band Tours the U.S. West Coast; confirm dates with the individual venue. Feb. 1 Arcata, CA Humboldt State University Feb. 1 McKinleyville, CA Six Rivers Feb. 2 Sacramento, CA Big Shots Feb. 3 Los Angeles, CA Jack's Sugar Shack Feb. 5 Santa Barbara, CA The Mercury Feb. 6 San Luis Obispo, CA SLO Brewery Feb. 7 San Francisco, CA Last Day Saloon, w/Michael Manring Feb. 8 Santa Cruz, CA Palookaville Feb. 10 Eugene, OR WOW Hall Feb. 11 Seattle, WA I Spy Feb. 12 Portland, OR The Tonic Redesign Update: treygunn.com The site is under redesign; you'll notice new additions over the next few weeks. For now, all the important information is available via a simple interface. The New Online Store: http://www.treygunn.com/onlinestore.html The Diaries: http://www.treygunn.com/road.html The Joy of Molybdenum http://www.treygunn.com/molybdenum.html Trey Gunn News http://www.treygunn.com/2000news.html Contact Info: Questions: mailto:info at treygunn dot com Site problems, questions: mailto:webmaster at treygunn dot com Update List problems: mailto:list at treygunn dot com ____________________________________________________ You're receiving this email update because you submitted your email address for more information at treygunn.com. If you wish to be removed from this list, simply send an email from the address under which you are subscribed, with the subject line "REMOVE", and we will remove your email address immediately. Your friends can receive this update by submitting their email address at http://www.treygunn.com/update.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000 21:27:00 -0800 From: oberhiem at uswest dot net Subject: What's going on? Yes, I know that this is a stupid question, but what happened to Crim last summer? I have searched and searched and searched for a complete statement,(I have gathered that Bill and Tony are out) but I just want to know what has happened. Did they leave? Uninterested? New RF band vision that does not include them? Please tell me what's going on. :( [ Private email replies only, please -- Toby ] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 00:39:12 -0000 From: "Keith Bennett" Subject: Meanings to P.Sinfield's Lyrics After 30 years, I suddenly need to know the meaning of the story behind Lizard. I've read all the reviews, and emailed most of the interested people, but most of them have changed their email addresses since publication. Some are a couple of years old. Has anyone ever put forward a definitive case? Ben ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 08:22:00 PST From: "Nomad Stem" Subject: Tickmaster and printing your own tickets Interesting news in the paper a couple of days ago: Tickmaster announced it will be allowing customers to print their own tickets. Now what I'd like to know is how they will continue to justify their excessive "shipping & handling" fees when they no longer will be shipping or handling my ticket at all. I'm sure they'll find a way. Nomad ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 21:13:33 CET From: "Macahan The Unifaun" Subject: posters + concert price Hello! To use the Frippian maildivision: I Since a 60s or 70s, or maybe 80s, 90s or 00s Crimso poster (concert/band picture/anything) would make me truly happy, I have tried to find such a one for sale on the Internet the latest three days. However, the search has so far been too in vain (have to take my wallet and estethical tastes in account) to give me satisfaction. So I wonder if there's any good webified marketplace where there surfaces an old, or new, Crimso poster every now and then, and if so, you could mail me info about it? Have any ETer found and bought any KC poster online? What poster? II To my extreme delight I have been exposed to the news about the KC European tour this summer, and that it will start off with two dates in Copenhagen. Since I live in south Sweden, close to Denmark and Copenhagen I, of course, must attend at least one of these dates. I know it will cost though. Todays Fripp diary says that the price will be approximately, and equivaletnly $30, $39 or $52. Is there any well informed ETer who might tell me what the Copenhagen gigs will cost. The venue knows nothing so far, it seems. /Macahan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 16:04:46 PST From: "Jorge Landa" Subject: Some proposals Hi everybody: I've think about some proposals, many people in ET (included myself) have search for things hard to find, maybe this points help us: 1. Many people here plays some instrument, I think than many of them knows how to play some KC material, this is a kind of invitation to share what you've learned, I play the guitar and the bass and I'm workin on some songs but most of them are incomplete so I'll send'em when they are finished, I only have sent the Tab for "Ladies of the Road". I think than we can help each other to play and hear better the Crimson music. 2. I think than many of us are interesed on to find some Krimson tapes, bootlegs and some other rarities, but most of these things are hard to find in some places, so I belive than we can share what we have find. Maybe you've heard about a site called "e-circles", there you can upload and download freely. This could be an interesting option to get innaccesible Krimson Material. I have editied some concert songs to make them sound better (don't expect miracles), if you go there you'll find the first two tracks of a concert in Arlington in 1973, many people may've heard them, but I think than there must be someones than haven't, so there they are. Anyway the whole of the Krimson official albums are better sources of his music, but If you can't get them, this is an option. I've thinked than this can serve to some people to get: a) some versions of songs than are almost impossible to buy (everybody knows the differences on the editions of songs like Matte Kudesai, LTiA1, also early recordings or some stranges side projekcts.), b) the live unofficial albums than are edited locally. I know than some people may disagree with the non authorized recordings (I still remember some numbers of the BEC (RIP?), where people talk about it), so I think than they don't must go and we can evite some useless discussions. I repeat than it is just an option. If you're interesed on this, mail-me personally to send you the invitation (you can only come into the circles where you have been invited and there is no way to search in the existing circles), also you can mail for any doubt or comment. 3. To the people in Mexico : a) The new album of Russell Mills will be played on Radio UNAM, before than any other place in the American Continent. This recording includes the participation of people like Peter Gabriel, Brian Eno, David Sylvian, Hector Zazou, etc. I think it will be great, but there is no date for this. It will be played on the "Ex-perimento", wich is transmited all the saturdays, at the 19:00 hrs., on the 96.1 FM. I'm not sure, but maybe transmited on the international short band of 31 m., if it's true I'll send another mail to let all of you know it, as well as i'll do it when i know the sure date of the show. Regulary the show is very good, so even if it's not the announced album, it's interesting to hear it. b) If you want to know more people interesed on the progressive, mail me, always is a pleasure to know people than likes of the good music. This is all by now, I hope you think about it, this purposes can work good, but only if you come in. Thank's for read it, and forgive my english. Landa ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 14:03:16 -0500 From: Jim Bailey Subject: For what it's worth... Hello folks, Nothing particularly earth-shattering, but I just noticed that there were two (count 'em, two) mentions of King Crimson in the Dec. '99 issue of Mix magazine. The first is in an article about Chris Blackwell, who started Island Records. Just a mention of KC as being one of the bands on that label. The second is actually a mention of Ian McDonald's role as horn player on T-Rex's "Bang a Gong (Get it On)." Just in case anyone is mildly interested. Jim Bailey ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 18:52:50 -0500 From: David Kirkdorffer Subject: Voyager Episode & Your Favorite Quadratic Equation Did anyone catch the recent Voyager episode in which the Dr. becomes a star in the eyes of aliens who have never before heard any songs? The dialog between Seven of Nine and Capt. Janeway about fans and fame would warm the heart of an ernest earth-travelling gigster. Of course, unlike the space aliens of the future, all true Crimson fans already know what a faux pas it is to ask if the objects of their fandom have a favorite quadratic equation, n'est pas? David Kirkdorffer ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 21:03:23 -0800 From: Rod Le Cloux Subject: Bill Rieflin "Birth Of A Giant" Hi, Just picked up Bill Rieflin's CD titled "Birth Of A Giant" and the last track blew me away. It's simply called "Outro(non intro). It is played by Robert Fripp-rhythm & dueling guitars, Trey Gunn-bass & dueling warr guitars, Bill Rieflin-bass, un-mellotron, drums, and Carmen Rizzo-blips. The album is very solid and falls in nicely between KC and NIN land. Also, I just listened to another release titled "The Repercussions of Angelic Behavior" by Rieflin-Fripp-Gunn. Upon first listen it appears to be less commercial then above mentioned CD but still well worth the small investment towards this incredible musicianship. This one has a link listed on back www.firstworldmusic.com Bye, Rod ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 14:30:00 EST From: Hocow at aol dot com Subject: Dr. Evil has stolen my Mojo Help. I would really like to read the Dec. 99 Mojo article on the KC 30th anniversary. When Fripp mentioned it in his diary awhile back I thought it was an upcoming issue rather than one already out. I was disappointed to find that the issue currently on the newstands is the issue after the one with the KC story. Toby, if its available, could this be added to the ET collection of articles? Does anyone have a copy they are through with they would sell or would someone be willing to scan the article and mail it to me? Thanks. Check out the new timeline feature. Interesting links to past members. New survey: I wanted to say so much more. My favorite CC release based on quality or enjoyment is live on Broadway but it is also the least indispensible. The Vroom Sessions, Jacksonville, and Beat Club are all more rare and unique opportunities to hear phases not in general release. So what is your single favorite is hard to answer because I would give up Broadway before the others because there are other quality sources of double trio live. Are you less interested in non KC releases? Yes, but there are non KC releases that would interest me a great deal. I wouldn't want to see the club go to far off track but some live Sunday All Over, or Bears, RFSQ, or BLUE would all be welcome by me. Brad Wilmot hocow at aol dot com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 12:23:29 EST From: "Brian !@#$%" Subject: crimson on t.v. and summit studios Hey all- Two quick questions for everybody- 1. Does anybody know which band is going to be on the next release? Is it the end of the "Islands" band, or the beginning of the "Larks" band? If you know more about it thatn just that, please feel free to share-(songs, why it would be of particular interest) 2. Does anybody have a copy of the bruford-wetton-cross-fripp band playing on t.v in 73'? I have been hungering to actually see them play some of this amazing stuff(as i am a musician myself, i love actually watching bands do things that amaze me) Thanks all, Brian Hopely jodokast at hotmail dot com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 13:07:01 PST From: "Matt D" Subject: cd's for sale I have the following CD's for sale. John Wetton King's Road Ten Seconds Ten Seconds Liquid Tension Experiment Liquid Tension Experiment Adrian Belew Inner Revolution Prometheus Prometheus Not really interested in trades... I need the money badly. Matt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 00:37:22 -1300 From: Andrew Acunzo Subject: hidden bonus tracks mph2 wrote: > More importantly, can I raise an objection to the all-too-common > practice nowadays of the art rock album 'hidden bonus track'? > Whereas in the past this practice had value in terms of surprise > and subversiveness, it has now become a routine cliche to get to > the end of an album and then have to sit through a minute of > silence in order to hear the weird noises bunged on at the end. > It makes sense aesthetically on P2 to have a break between the > tracks and the recording of the photography incident, but on P3 > and P4 it's just annoying. You beat me to the punch! I wanted to post something about this. I don't know if it's an "art rock" thing, but it seems like more and more Crimson releases have this (I agree it makes sense on P2 though). It would almost be more surprising and subversive at this point if following the last track they had two minutes of silence and then the disc just ended. Andy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 00:22:39 -0600 From: "W. Stuart Kirkham" Subject: discourse I just wanted to make a few comments that I have been mulling for some time, and given some of the comments just recently made, I feel its time to join the discussion. After listening to the ProjecKt Box set, I, too, feel that KC may be becoming "too discordant." Not that discord is a negative quality (I never would of listened in the first place if I thought that was true), but rather that it is uninspired discord. Can it be that King Crimson has simply become a product? That is, do the members of KC play discordantly because they think they have to, because they think that they are giving their fans what they want, in order to sell CDs? There are however, many moments on the CDs where the music simply grabbed my attention, and the band knows that these are the highlights, given their appearance on the single-CD editions. Much in between seems to fall flat, though, in my opinion. I understand that the improvisational nature of the music requires the musicians to feel around and the music comes together and unravels, often, but the whole premise that the improvisation rests on a discordant foundation, and I wonder if it has to be this way. My personal favorite of the Boxed set is on P1, and yes I am a Bruford fan, but I think the best track is 2 ii 3 (you know, the one where BB shows admirable restraint). For me it evokes a sense of peacefulness admidst tension. It is a well crafted piece. (As I listen to this as I type, I realize again that 3 i 2 follows nicely, and 3 ii 2 starts to rock but kind of falters...) While many of the "discordant" pieces from older releases speak to me as well, the current tracks seem to embrace discord for discord's sake, without much feeling... I do not feel that the music is so bad that it should be used as a herbicide... I listened to the CDs frequently after I bought them, and the negative reaction is really an initial impression. As I listened more, I began to realize that I began to listen differently, and I appreciated them more. I had a similar response to Fela Anikulapo Kuti when I first heard his music (too repetitious), until it occurred to me that it was similar in some ways to "minimalist" music (Reich, Glass) that I became interested in because of Fripp's soundscapes. Once I listened to Fela differently, it became a whole new music. Listening differently to 3 ii 2 just now hasn't improved it though. It had a promising start, but they didn't pull it off. Oh yeah, IMO (screw the H). Oh well. Since this is supposed to be a learning and growing experience for the band, I am looking forward to the next album. In summary I'd just like to say that I have always liked KC because I could find some kind of emotional resonance in it that just wasn't available in your standard popular music. Many of the new pieces in the boxed set resonate with me (and resonate very well), but many do not. It seems to me that the potential exists to make some incredibly great music, and I hope that they realize this potential. And that they come to Austin. In fact, they should consult with me personally before doing so...no frisbee catching dog, but they won't have to put up with mum... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 08:27:00 -0500 From: "BELONIS, KONSTANTINOS" Subject: Negative Psychological Impact of KC After reading the aforementioned post, I was left with a feeling of free floating anxiety, much as Mr. Fenkner apparently felt when listening to the recent KC work. His feelings are understandable inasmuch as all art forms must evoke some sort of response to be effective, even if the response is generally perceived as negative. Other examples that generate similar responses can be found in the Minimalist composers, such as Philip Glass, repertoire. Many people enjoy these transcendent feelings which resonate from these pieces. So, because of this I would disagree with Mr. Fenkner's hypothesis that there is a general negative impact encountered with this music. However, I would agree that there is a more specific to the individual impact and that those who do find this negative should either try to approach the pieces in question from a different perspective or just retreat to more familiar turf. That said, I would like to ask if there might be a course of exercises in picking that exists. Although there are to be guitar craft courses here in New Jersey, I really have no use in learning the GC standard tuning. Regular tuning has not yet given up all of its secrets but I am curious with regards to R. Fripp's picking style. I use a 3mm pick and have attained a great deal of velocity. My cross-picking is also efficient, but one can always learn more...... p.s. everyone stop whining!!! ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #632 ********************************