Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #614 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 614 Saturday, 18 September 1999 Today's Topics: Bijou Review-ette: ProjeKcts Box Crimson Videos P Box tracklist and a quick review question for the Know All DGM pricing Calling Howard B.; Centipede Genesis tab site Theremin; Ghost Dance Adrian Belew Trey Gunn's 'Raw Power' Fripp diary entries wanted "Melotrone" Mogul Thrash Yeah, wha'apened? Barry Godber in Milano BELEW IS NOT LEAVING KC DGM and lyric questions... PJ Crook stuff? You've got to hear that once in your life ! No Self Control and the birth of Discipline Samples KC idea? Some interesting Bruford news... Re: Cale and Young P.J. Crook stuff part 2 And then Belew came back and ... Pavlovs dog RE: Mellotron Smellotron Re: Bruford Interview and Mellotrons Overseas Collectors Club Subscribers Sailor's Tale - help wanted. Mexico Problems Redux e-music Mexico City Download Mexico City for Mac OS: Virtual PC? Live in Mexico City - do you have trouble downloading it? Major Bad Karma for Those Who Burn... Mexico City? I'm too lazy! More on the Mexico City download ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.5b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 09:55:47 +0100 From: Peter Clinch

Subject: Bijou Review-ette: ProjeKcts Box A pleasant surprise on my doormat rather sooner than expected, and on my Birthday too. Horrified faces of flatmates finding out I had another 4 hours of Krim to torture them with aside, I manfully worked through them all... Superficial summary of reactions go like this: P1: very, very good P2: very, very good P3: very, very good P4: even better than the others Some slightly more detailed observations: After the sampler track from P1 I was expecting rather more in the way of "dustbin down a lift shaft" action with Live At The Jazz Cafe, but a big chunk in the middle is rather beautiful, subtle soundscape based material. And this leads to A Conclusion, which is whenever soundscapes are worked into any of the ProjeKct releases the music goes from great to even better than that. So hopefully the Double Duo (unless it's broken up for a second time before recording...) will further increase the soundscape element in their work. The P4 release stands out above the excellent P3 because of the bottom end. It really benefits from Tony on board IMHO, so it's a shame that the DD/T-Lev plans aren't flexible enough to get him on board this time around. Not really a criticism of the plans, as it would be churlish to think that all that's required to alter the DD planning is a 'phone call to Tony with a time and place, but just a comment that I'm looking forwards to Tony back in action, be it a ProjeKct or Crim or whatever. Hopefully with Adrian about there'll be slightly more finger space available between everyone for the basslines. If the DD release is as good as any of these discs it will be well worth the entry price. Every one a winner, and I'm looking forwards to the P4 club release. It would also be Very Cool if even with the DD back together Adrian's thought of a Bill/Tony/Ade ProjeKct 'n' goes ahead. Pete. -- Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net p dot j dot clinch at dundee dot ac dot uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 07:09:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Punksatan Bobby Subject: Crimson Videos I just bought the "The Noice" "Three of..." And "Live in Japan" Videos. And I was Completely blown away... I. Fripp is actually seen smiling, several times. (Wow, he is capable of joy ;) ) II. He also makes the wildes guitarsolos ever seen on tape, how he squirms, and moves about and on a Chair too... I always thougt that it was Belew messing around... III. Seeing is beliving, I never gave the "Warr Guitar" much attention, but now after seeing it, I still don't. Was It just me or was Trey low in mix? I heard him a couple of times, but not allways. But still it looks really hard to play, But he's kind'a booring on stage. IIII. Levin, what a guy... Not only does he deliver the solidest grooves and the bad-ass-est solos. He also really IS on stage. Some times he just lookes up and closes his eyes, looks lika a teddybear (don't you just want to hug him?) he really has Carizma. (Not only with KC but also when he played with Robbie Dupree). And how hard is it really to play Stick, it lookes like nothing to him, but when you think of what he's doing... IIIII. Bruford, how soft his wrists are (I'm a drummer, Mostly) it's alomost as if he's picking cotton, ;). It was great to see him play, he looked like he actually enjoyed it sometimes. IIIIIII. Mastelotto, here's a guy that I've followed since Mr Mister. Great to see him play with KC. But how come he got to do all the booring stuff, and Bruford got to du all the wicked solo stuff? I know how good Mstelotto is.Still he got to keep a steady groove whilst Bruford Pounded his ass off. OK it takes a great drummer to deliver a steady groove, but it would have been nice to see something more... And finally Adrian Belew... ther'sn't much to say... "I like it" (indicipline) Thats it n thats that... Rafael Maria di Liumbard Chairman of NotWorthShitProductions and Holy spirit of St.Lois ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 17:32:20 +0200 From: masse at geocean dot u-bordeaux dot fr (Laurent MASSE) Subject: P Box tracklist and a quick review There's been some confusion about the release date of the King Crimson P Box. For those who don't know yet, it is already available online on the DGM site. I received it Saturday, and here is a quick tracklist and review. P1 - Live at the Jazz Cafe Mostly familiar ground, including a Trey Gunn solo track, and a drum/soundscapes duet (the original concept behind this) - this is probably where the 73/74 lineup would be had they remained together. 9 tracks, the titles clearly indicate the date, set and piece. The exact list has been posted some time ago on ET. Apparently, two tracks are alternative mixes of the Japanese/PonyCanyon release of last spring. 1ii 2 on Cirkus and 4 i 1 on Sometimes God Smiles are both edits. P2 - Live Groove When a friend of mine heard Space Groove, he labelled it "funny easy-listening improv for a cartoon soundtrack". Nothing very new here, apart from "Deception of the Thrush" (atmospheric) and "Heavy ConstruKction" (well...heavy). The rest is just... Space Groove live. Enjoyable nonetheless. Low point: no recording dates. Tracklist: 1 Sus-Tayn-Z 2 Heavy ConstruKction (longer than on Cirkus and Sometimes God Smiles) 3 Deception Of The Thrush (longer than on Cirkus) 4 X-Chayn-JiZ (the basic riff/rhythm reminds me of THRAK) 5 Light ConstruKction 6 Vector Shift To Planet Detroit 7 Contrary ConstruKction 8 Live Groove 9 Vector Shift To Planet Belewbeloid (who plays that funny bit at the end?) 10 21st Century Schizoid man (2 mn, then 9 mn of crowd noise after a flash light) P3 - Masque That one is the big surprise. Totally unknown territory. Pat M really shows the extent of his playing / percussion conception. The album was entirely mixed and constructed by him, and he contributed the sleevenotes. There are no titles, just numbers from 1 to 13 (plus one small invisible track at the very end). The first eight tracks are strange/weird/mellow moods, then everything gets heavier by 9 (which totally blew me away on first listening). Pat did a lot of editing, and some tracks are assembled from several nights. All the details are in the booklet. P4 - West Coast Live Not enough time to listen through that one. More familiar territory than P3, but still ahead from P1 and P2. Lots of interesting stuff, including an adaptation of P2's "Thrush". One small invisible track at the very end. Low point: no recording dates. Tracklist: 1 - 4 Ghost (Part 1) 5 - Deception Of The Thrush 6 - Hindu Fizz 7 - ProjeKction 8 - 12 Ghost (Part 2) The box itself bears the name "King Crimson - The ProjeKcts". That should avoid the confusion surrounding the release of Space Groove. Laurent Masse masse at geocean dot u-bordeaux dot fr ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 18:52:11 +0200 From: "Christian Skina" Subject: question for the Know All What happened to the CC releases of Soundscapes? Thanks Chris ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 12:52:29 EDT From: SPBrader at aol dot com Subject: DGM pricing In ET613, Ronald Chrisley raised a number of points querying the apparent price difference between UK and US prices for KCCC releases. As with many rants about the comparative costs of individual items, between the UK and US in particular, the inbuilt additional costs of being a British based business are ignored to make sensationalist points. Just a few issues that drive up the 'non-product' costs: 1. DGM staff may not be paid more in the UK but it will cost more to employ them. 2. Telecommunications costs are higher here. 3. Utilities costs are higher here. 4. Land based costs are much higher here. 5. Storeage/distribution costs are higher here. 6. Business taxation is higher here. 7. Media costs are higher here. 8. Printing costs are higher here. 9. Fuel costs are higher here. 10. Capital equipment costs are higher here. DGM cannot operate in isolation of those economic factors. Now there is a solution of course. We export the work, and the jobs it generates, to a lower cost economy. One last thought on the so-called price fixing cartels that are supposed to operate in the music industry in the UK. If they are and thus ripping of consumers to a massive extent, they would be hugely profitable and yet I don't see too many companies from this sector in the Top200 stock listings. Simon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 13:15:21 -0400 From: "Dan B." Subject: Calling Howard B.; Centipede (Please excuse this first part, must get this out of the way: Howard Brotine: please send me an email as i have lost your email addy--your tape will be ready to go.) In the interim (as i wait for a CD issue of Centipede's 'Septober Energy'--might be a while on that one!), I have made a decent transfer of this double-album onto 90 min. casette. Being that is from an old LP(s) there are a few pops and crackles noticeable in the very quiet passages (especially in the beginning 'spacey' percussion part). I am offering this for trade as I hope this is 'acceptable' since this is OOP & unobtainable and i feel the music is worthwhile and rewarding for those interested in the early Crimson: there are some extremely powerful musical moments in there. (Imagine a crazed 50 piece orchestra blaring [in certain sections] with drumset(s) and group vocals added. (I'm sure Frank Zappa would have liked this piece(s) if he had ever heard it.) Please email me if interested. (Technical stuff: a Linn Sondek turntable was used, and a reEQ [done to the best of my abilities and limited equipment was used: a Roland VS840 digital portastudio for 'processing' as well, was done.) It sounds pretty decent and 'balanced'. I await a 'professional' undertaking of this project, and will be at the front of the line if this is ever issued on CD (preferably with the participation of Mr. Fripp and Mr. Singleton and their array of TC Electronics, etc., gear.) Timing: Side 1 (21:25) Side 2 (23:14) -------- Side 3 (20:53) Side 4 (18:29) P.S. Maybe Mr. Fripp will share his views on this ancient project; he has two credits inside the original record gatefold: "produced by Bob Fripp" "Producer.Robert Fripp" (so's ya get a 'Robert' and a 'Bob' in there!) -- "I don't want to spend my life explaining myself. Either you get it or you don't." -- Frank Zappa ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 19:57:58 CEST From: "Macahan The Unifaun" Subject: Genesis tab site Hi all! So sorry for non-KC-content but since I've already had some request for the URL for the Genesis tab project, I suppose there are some of you that are interested in it. For guitar tabs: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Villa/1848/guitar/ http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Villa/1848/ is the main site, but it doesn't work on Communicator, I think. And let's see some action in KC-tabber land!!! /Macahan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 11:33:48 -0700 From: "Scott Steele" Subject: Theremin; Ghost Dance >My band uses Mellotron samples here and there and we have also faked a >Theremin using an analogue filter module feeding back on itself. Cool. We have a *real* Theremin though, built from a kit. www.kspace.com/gone >The Michael Giles / Jamie Muir CD is called Ghost Dance on Piano Records, Cat No. ( Piano501) David Cunningham appears on this too. It's great. - S. np: Billy Cobham, Mississippi Knights Live scottst at ohsu dot edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 20:59:21 EDT From: MongoBoy at aol dot com Subject: Adrian Belew Regrettably, erroneous posts were made in ET#613 by more than one party. Both posters direct us to RF's diary (entry for Sat, Sept 11, 1999). In his entry RF tells the sad news that Adrian has decided to "disengage from King Crimson." Further on however, RF notes, " The Double Duo has reformed, with the same personnel as before, so that it may record & tour to furious & unfettered acclaim before ceasing to exist, at a later time to be decided. This is the first Crimson reincarnation that has reformed before it began for the first time. Hey! this is Crimson." Perhaps we should read the entire story before posting this sort of news. I was quite saddened to read ET#613 but happy after reading RF's diary. Best to all, Matt Lehman Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 23:30:21 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: Trey Gunn's 'Raw Power' Don't recall having read anything so far about Trey Gunn's new archival release, 'Surfacings One: Raw Power,' a limited edition release on the First World label. I purchased this via a link on Trey's site some weeks ago and have been enjoying it since about two days later. It includes a variety of unreleased music from 1990-1996. The disc includes material from Trey's early cassette-only release 'Raw Power,' the first recordings he ever made with a tapping instrument (the Stick, of course, at that time) back in 1990. This material holds up every bit as well as he hopes it will - it's terrific. Also included are outtakes from Trey's two DGM releases 'One Thousand Years' and 'The Third Star,' including a 10 minute version of the title track from the first album (longer than the album's 3 minute version, but not as long as the 22 minute original take reported by Trey. How could more of a good thing be bad? The final source of outtakes is from a previously unreleased recording by a band called Believe What You Please, which featured Gunn with percussionist Bob Muller and trumpeter Dave Douglas, the latter known for his work in the jazz world with folks like John Zorn as well as his own many bands. There are only two tracks from this band, but they are well worth hearing - Gunn's music with an acoustic, breath-filled instrument in the lead is quite remarkable, and readily brings Asiatic modes to mind. Dave is a friend of mine and has recently made his first album for the record label for which I work, so it's especially fun to hear him in this context. Sound quality is good throughout, and according to Trey's notes, this is the first in a series of 'Surfacings' releases for material that "just wouldn't fit" elsewhere. Something like a one-man Collector's Club, perhaps. Based on this installment, I'm along for the ride... Steve Smith ssmith36 at sprynet dot com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:54:08 +1200 From: "David MaClennan" Subject: Fripp diary entries wanted I've been archiving the Fripp diary entries from the DGM site, but I've been without a computer for the past month or so. Consequently I'm missing a chunk of these. So if anyone has the entries for August 4-24 available as a Word document please get in touch with me - I'd be keen to get them. Thanks, David Maclennan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 22:05:19 +1000 From: "Rob/Dianne Dunkley" Subject: "Melotrone" I'm currently reading a biography of Peter Sellers by Peter Evans (The Face Behind The Face), and have just come across a page or two about what Spike Milligan called "The Case of the Mighty Melotrone Organ". Sellers owned this for a period (I think in the 1960's) and Milligan described it as "If you wanted the sound of marching feet in size ten boots accompanied by Chopin and a portrait of Salavador Dali shaving under water while whistling 'The Blue Bells of Scotland' this was the machine to have" (he also talks about tapes later on). >From what I know of the beast this seems to fit, even allowing for the spelling (Melotrone >> Mellotron). The instrument was apparently then given to a pianist, Alan Clare, who, due to lack of space, on-forwarded it to Princess Margaret & Lord Snowdon (after a brief return to Sellers) who subsequently supplied it to Robin Douglas-Home (a writer, pianist & nephew of an ex-UK PM). I wonder what happened to it then??? Any other well known connections? Rob D. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 19:16:44 +0200 From: izyrp at odn dot de Subject: Mogul Thrash Possibly the first recordings of Mr Wetton (correct me if I'm wrong) playing superb bass with "Mogul Thrash" in 1970 are available from http://www.disconforme.ad , a small record company from Andorra (!). This is where Spain meets France, isn't it ? Mogul Thrash were a six-piece containing three brass/woodwind-players (Collosseum,Blood, sweat & tears or early Chicago coming to mind) and played mainly compositions by their guitarist James Litherland from "Colosseum". Also more of interesting stuff on disconforme's Website. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 14:44:46 -0400 From: Jim Bailey Subject: Yeah, wha'apened? >Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 10:12:36 PDT >From: "Peter Drubetskoy" >Subject: Hm.. >Just a correction - in ET#610 Jim Bailey's post "Live in Japan" seen in a >new light" appears under my name for some reason, well, that's not me. >Cheers, and sorry, Jim... >Peter. That's ok Peter, 'tweren't your fault. Quick! somebody unchain Toby from his desk and give him an extra-large, extra-strong coffee (or perhaps just let him sleep for twelve hours, that should work). Our lad must've fallen asleep on the delete key. It kinda' confused the heck out of me, too. (the real) Jim Bailey ------------------------------ Date: 14 Sep 99 13:43:49 -0700 From: "David Voci" Subject: Barry Godber in Milano Hello Friends, Would like to mention here a showing of KC's first LP cover artwork by Barry Godber(RIP)in Milano, Italy. If my memory serves me, there is a huge version of this album cover drawing in the Galleria as you walk from the Duomo(famous church)to La Scala(famous operahouse)in Milan Italy...When I was a teenager in the 70's, we used to walk through this area and I remembered this mural lately in thoughts Crimson...If any ETites have seen this please verify as this struck me as funny being in this area, but then again, Europeans are pretty progressive so this probably has a reason for being there... The painting is above the walking area and high up in the rafters/ceiling(I can't think of the exact word for this in architect-talk). Did KC commission Barry to paint this or was this work already out and in museums/shows/art galleries and KC just decided to use it for ITCOTCK? Second point...Why does it seem to me that there are just too many repackaging of KC material CD's? For a guy who takes umbrage with record company tactics/milking the musicians/fans of their money and generally one who criticises endless the business ethics of the music world in general it seems that we have a case of light to medium hypocrisy here. Cirkus/Nightwatch/Frame By Frame/Concise/Compact/Abbreviated/Young Persons(was this the first?)/etc... Just an observation as it seems to me that RF keeps re-releasing the same stuff over and over again. 'Night Watch' could have easily fit onto one CD if discreet editing occurred. No bitching intended but how many times does this happen even with normal catalogue stuff, Santana's first three, for example... new tracks added, additional artwork etc but they expect you to rebuy the bloody things with the added material...Big Business is Big Brother is Waiting for your Money...(Is it 'Easy Money'?) Puns suck but had to, best of times, dv ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 19:10:29 -0400 From: "Zachary J. Griffin" Subject: BELEW IS NOT LEAVING KC For those reporting Adrian Belew leaving King Crimson. I suggest you read the diary entry marked at the time of 20.28 on Saturday September 11th. In a nutshell, it says that after a direct conversation between Fripp and Belew. Belew decided not to leave the band and they will still meet in October to record. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 23:12:41 EDT From: DKjb001 at aol dot com Subject: DGM and lyric questions... this is my first post, and i wasn't sure whether to direct this to dgm or et. knowing the aims of dgm, i was rather alarmed when i recently purchased "sometimes god smiles..." and then discovered the "for promotional use only!!" warning label inside. had i purchased this directly from dgm, this would be less of a concern. however...i purchased it for, i believe, $6.99 US from best buy...(a terrible corporation to support in the first place, but that's a long story...)anyone know...is there cause for concern? i was somewhat disturbed by this. last, but not least...do any et-ers out there know of the lyrics for "starless" --the version on CIRKUS ? they're quite different from those on red. (if yes, please send me an e'mail: ...thank you) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:37:37 +0800 From: Brady Drum Company / Chris Brady & Craftsmen Subject: PJ Crook stuff? Hello There! Does anyone in ET-land know if (and where) I could obtain a book of P.J. Crook's artwork?? The Pieces I've seen on the latest KC covers (I feel) go well with the vibe of the music, and are excellent works in their right. Shane Brady ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 11:23:44 +0200 From: Stephane Berland Subject: You've got to hear that once in your life ! Hi there, Looking for information about the mp3 file format, I came across a really strange (and somewhat hilarious) retro version of "21st Century Schizoid Man" played by the (don't hold your breath) "ROTO ROOTER GOOD TIME CHRISTMAS BAND". You can download it on the band's web page : http://hometown.aol.com/dbscdslps3/page/rotoaudio.htm Direct download at : http://members.aol.com/DbsCdsLpsX/schizoid.mp3 Enjoy :) Stephane Limours, France ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 10:58:18 IST From: "chris mcgarel" Subject: No Self Control and the birth of Discipline I've just been listening to No Self Control by Peter Gabriel and it occurred to me what an important track this is for prog and post-prog. Fripp and Levin playing together against a backdrop of Steve Reich-ish gamelan-like vibes. And this was before Discipline. Surely this track either was heavily influenced by Fripp's vision for the 80's KC or it shaped it entirely. That would all depend who had most musical input on the track (always difficult to guess with so many great guest appearances on Gabriel's work). Along with Talking Heads and Byrne/Eno I reckon Peter Gabriel's 3rd album needs to be considered a seminal work in the reshaping of prog, coming out of the punk/new wave period. I must listen to the rest of this album again to see if it all stands up in this light or is it just that track. Wouldn't it be great to hear the Double Duo play No Self Control with interlocking guitars replacing the vibes? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:43:17 +0100 From: paul dot williams at eu dot nabgroup dot com Subject: Samples KC idea? In order to assuage the thirst of the audience that wants to hear old KC stuff in a live or even recorded environment, I was wondering as to whether RF has ever, or would ever consider using old KC samples as part of his guitar setup. Transposing the old 'sounds' into a new musical creation? Could be a fun projekct incorporated within new KC creations? An Epitaph / Warr guitar / Vdrum cocktail perchance? I'm fairly certain that it could be achieved given the current sampling technologies available to the serious music and studio professional Just an idea Paul Williams ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 13:20:23 -0700 From: Andre LaFosse Subject: Some interesting Bruford news... This comes from the Mark Nauseef/Miroslav Tadic website (http://shoko.calarts.edu/~snakes), under the "News" section: ------ Mark is currently enjoying a break from touring and concentrating his energy on creative and logistical aspects of our new group. The line-up of this (still unnamed) band is as follows: Bill Bruford and Mark Nauseef on drums and percussion Steve Swallow on bass David Torn and Miroslav Tadic on acoustic and electric guitars We are looking forward to start working together toward the end of the year, and expect the band to take full flight during the year 2000. ------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 18:59:45 -0400 From: David Beardsley Subject: Re: Cale and Young Why this appeared in ETalk, I don't know but here's my 2 cents: > From: flaherty michael w > > 1. The work John Cale has done with Lamont Young has not been released His name is La Monte. > because Young has demanded that Cale and Tony Conrad sign papers giving > him sole writing credit for what were group improvs. Cale and Conrad have > (rightfully, in my opinion) refused, My impression is that La Monte is the composer and those guys were performing under contract. > and so the music goes unreleased. No. It's unreleased because La Monte hasn't had a record contract in years. > Reports have it that Young has also put himself up and Cale and Conrad > down in the mixes. Whos reports? Tony Conrad? Come on man - he changes his story from interview to interview! -- * D a v i d B e a r d s l e y * xouoxno at virtulink dot com * * J u x t a p o s i t i o n N e t R a d i o * M E L A v i r t u a l d r e a m house monitor * * http://www.virtulink.com/immp/lookhere.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 07:36:05 +0800 From: Brady Drum Company / Chris Brady & Craftsmen Subject: P.J. Crook stuff part 2 Hello Again, please regard my earlier post looking for P.J. Crook stuff as laziness. A quick net browse revealed 'P.J. Crook- Monograph 93', 63 color reproductions in hardback for 20 pounds. Anyone else interested e-mail: p dot j dot crook at virgin dot net Shane Brady (Insert quote by somebody famous here) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 19:44:47 -0500 (CDT) From: flaherty michael w Subject: And then Belew came back and ... ... everyone was happy. On the 20.28 of Robert's diary entry for 11 september, he says that Adrian's back. Before (or, more likely, as) people rip me apart for "making a mistake" (oh, my God!), let me quickly add that when I posted the original message this section was not yet listed on the diary (whether through the "fault" of DGM or my crappy computer, I have no idea). Michael Flaherty ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 06:08:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Punksatan Bobby Subject: Pavlovs dog Yes that is Bill Bruford and he plays on 2 Pavlovs Albums, "Pampered Menial" and "At The Sound Of The Bell". Quite a good group, the singer has a extremely high pitched voice. Check it out... Rafael Maria di Liumbard Chairman of NotWorthShitProductions and Holy spirit of St.Lois ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 06:22:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Punksatan Bobby Subject: RE: Mellotron Smellotron In ET 613 Brad Wilmot Wrote disliking of the mellotron as an istrument. I'll just say this, When Yes Tured with a live Synphony Orchestra on the "Tales From Topografic..." tour, it wasn't anywhere near the exellence when before and after they played the same tunes with the "Tron". There is something extraordinary about that noisy, dirty sound. It makes the grandour in Symphonic music and else... Adrian playing stringsounds on the guitar, ok, sounds nice, but it is NOTHING compared to the "Tron"-sound. Ok you can make good "copies" of how it sounded, but there is also the mistuning, it's limitations (8s playability), and and monstruosity as an instrument, sitting behind a "Tron" is like sitting behind Brufords rig, you feel as a king, All of this plus more made the "Tron" parts of KC and other bands all that they are. The "Tron" IS Symphonic/Progressive-music. At least I think so... Rafael Maria di Liumbard Chairman of NotWorthShitProductions and Holy spirit of St.Lois ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 12:48:56 -0400 From: "merella" Subject: Re: Bruford Interview and Mellotrons I just finished the Amplifier interview with Bruford and was rather surprised by his comments on Jazz. Bill sounds exasperated about the American unappreciation of it's "one indigenous art form". I think the key word here is indigenous. Is it a Biblical qoute that states: "A prophet is never recognized in his own country"? I guess I share a parallel sentiment with Bill. I find it odd that the British never really warmed up to King Crimson. I think Fripp said somewhere that the '73-4 lineup had little use for Britain or Europe and had their greatest success in The States. This may have changed with the '80's lineup (I don't know). It seems things foreign are more alluring. I think jazz will always be underground and is probably better off so (though it would be nice if the musicians performing it could make a decent living). Even if jazz is more appreciated abroad, I'm sure Celine Dion, Michael Jackson and Co. are selling the big numbers. I'm glad that Bruford brings his group to the U.S. but why travel all that way to play a music in it's place of origin yet "nobody knows about"? Maybe foreigners playing jazz will rekindle it's interest here! I loved Bill's decription of contemporary jazz as "hot tub jazz" (hee hee). Concerning Mellotrons: I was browsing around a used bookstore and while thumbing through a biography on James Joyce I found he actually used a Mellotron to compose music for his series of poems "Chamber Music"! ENOUGH ALREADY! Mark Merella ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 09:15:00 +1000 From: Glenn_Coxhead at neca dot nec dot com dot au Subject: Overseas Collectors Club Subscribers Just wondering if non UK and US subscribers to the Collectors Club have received releases 5 & 6, King Crimson On Broadway - Live in NYC 1995, yet? I've been eagerly awaiting its arrival since first hearing about it in July but as yet have not received anything. I've emailed DGM several times and have received no reply! Also, has anyone received anything about re-subscribing yet? I was anticipating some sort of notification in the mail but again I haven't seen anything as yet! Having been a subscriber from day one I certainly don't want to miss a release! Any help would be most appreciated. Glenn Coxhead Melbourne, Australia ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 12:58:13 +0100 From: "Mark Graham" Subject: Sailor's Tale - help wanted. I'm trying to figure out how to play The Sailor's Tale. Does anyone have any tips, tabs or whatever? I could certainly use some help - especially with the solo! Cheers all, Mark (bleeding fingers) Graham. BTW - Are any KC/RF tracks available as sheet music? And if not, why not? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 20:38:08 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: Mexico Problems Redux > From: Art Cohen > Subject: Mexico problems > > >However when I tried to run it, it pulled up Netscape and in that > >window, I got some weird HTTP syntax error. [snip] > > I had the same problem. I eventually had to take the long URL that the > media player was trying to open in Netscape and copy and paste it into > Internet Explorer before I could play the file. I had been exchanging messages of frustration and woe with Dan Kirkdorffer (bless this hero forever) ever since the day after I first posted to the DGM Guestbook about having no luck playing the Mexico City file. During the course of trying to get the damned thing to play, I downloaded it in its entirety twice (at 4 or so hours apiece), downloaded, installed, uninstalled and reinstalled the Media Player *four* times, "Smart Updated" my Netscape browser twice, and uninstalled and deleted Internet Explorer 4.0 altogther to make the Media Player recognize Netscape as my default browser. I changed directories, erased spaces, renamed files. And none of this worked. Dan was baffled and I was simply increasingly irritated. But one thing was positive - it couldn't be because I wasn't using Internet Explorer, because Dan and any number of others had been successful with Netscape. So when I saw Art's message (above), I decided that perhaps I'd better give it one last shot in the manner he described. I took 90 minutes to download Internet Explorer 5.0, so that I could launch the Media Player, capture that faulty URL and paste it into Explorer. You can imagine how little I was surprised when I launched the Media Player and it pulled up not the default Netscape window but a shiny new Explorer window. (I'm guessing that IE 5.0 took the liberty of changing my system settings and defaults, just as I see it's "conveniently" imported all of my Netscape bookmarks.) And suddenly I could register the Mexico City file with my e-mail address, and now it's playing on my system, flawlessly except for some nasty skipping when too many things are going on at once in my processor. Guess I'll be buying a CD-R burner soon just to get this beast off of my hard drive... if only to make room for more. Yes, okay, I'm happy the damned concert finally plays. I'm sure I'll be really happy with the performance in an aesthetic sense when my sense of indignation wears off. I bear no ill towards DGM at all and will gladly pay for the rights to download, listen to and view whatever they choose to make available, now that my system works. But for what I went through and what I had to do to solve the problem, I have to hope that Microsoft ultimately gets *bent over the table* in their anti-trust suit. And that's my last word on the subject. Steve Smith ssmith36 at sprynet dot com NP - King Crimson, "Larks' Tongues in Aspic, Part 2," 'Live in Mexico City' (DGM) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 20:44:06 -0400 From: "Bill Duhigg" Subject: e-music I finally got my 100Mhz PC to play the "Mexico City" file without skipping and dubbed it to a cassette. Thanks, Mr. Fripp, it sounds great. Do any of the in-the-know DGM/ET folk know how many licenses have been granted, i.e.: how many earnest, hirsute, be-spectacled types have successfully downloaded and played LiMC? A suggestion: Instead of selling LiMC (and other downloaded concerts) on a traditional CD, gather together many show files, the Media Players, DGM promo stuff, etc., on a data CD for those can't do the download or want backup copies. Thanks, Bill ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 08:10:15 -0700 From: Mike Reed Subject: Mexico City Download After a week and a bottle of tums I was finally able to download the file. The suggestion to use Go!Zilla for the download was the trick - thanks to whoever it was that put that word out. BTW, the concert is great and the sound quality ain't all that bad - suprisingly good, from what I'd heard and was expecting. Keep up the good work! Mike R, Texas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 01:42:02 -0500 (CDT) From: david craig Subject: Mexico City for Mac OS: Virtual PC? I'd like to have a go at using Virtual PC 3 [Win 98] to listen to the Mexico City show. While DOS is old-hat to me -- that's why I use a Macintosh -- Virtual PC is not. I would _very_ much appreciate help/instructions from anyone who has successfully installed the MS media player into VPC, and been able to listen to the otherwise useless .wma file I've downloaded. I suppose personal replies are appropriate here. Once I have successful instructions, I will re-post them to the list, or at least, submit them to Dan for inclusion in the FAQ. Thanks and regards, David Craig ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 15:09:11 -0400 (CLT) From: "Miguel Farah F." Subject: Live in Mexico City - do you have trouble downloading it? Hi all. I've set up a small WWW page that has some useful items for the Live In Mexico City concert: 1) a front and back cover for CD (the one Daniel Mora offered in ET 612, included with his permission). 2) The concert, in a ZIPped file. Also, the same file, split into 2M segments. If you have a slow or unreliable connection, and haven't been able to download the 32meg file, this is it! 3) Both winamp 2.24 and 2.50c, taken from ftp.winamp.com. The URL is http://www.webhost.cl/~miguel/KC/ -- MIGUEL FARAH // miguel at webhost dot cl #include // http://www.webhost.cl/~miguel <*> "Trust me - I know what I'm doing." - Sledge Hammer ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 18:49:18 EDT From: Ctao at aol dot com Subject: Major Bad Karma for Those Who Burn... ...CDs, that is. From a transmission medium controlled by the artists (KC, in this case) to one controlled by the consumer (one-off CDs). I fail to see how anyone who has any knowledge of the issues and personalities involved could, at this late date, publicly approach ET with the request for the collusion of another in illegally obtaining a pirated CD of Mexico City, or any other recording, for that matter. Folks, the technologies involved don't change the issues involved. Did KC surrender the rights to this material somewhere? If so, excuse me. But I sorta doubt it they did. For the uninitiated, Fripp has written clearly and copiously on the subject of bootlegging, recording in general, and many of the attendant issues brought on by the "age of mechanical reproduction" (as Walter Benjamin referred to this age of technology). Ignorance of these ideas is completely understandable, but may not excuse this level of rudeness and outright treachery. Harshly, Conor D. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 20:28:38 EDT From: TheGreatDeceiver at aol dot com Subject: Mexico City? I'm too lazy! I have a better idea. How about taking Mexico City and slapping some really cool art work on the cover and Robert can then write ten pages of liner notes. Then I can go into Tower Records and slap down my $17.95 or $24.95 or whatever of hard earned money and be on my merry way. I'm much too lazy to have to hassle with all this. Thanks but no thanks for this free-bee, but I'd just as soon pay for a real release. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 09:44:41 +0100 From: Simon Innes Subject: More on the Mexico City download Dear all, Forgive me if I am repeating something already posted, but some people may be having problems with transferring the Mexico City download onto CD if they are using the *latest* version of WinAmp (2.50) - this version will not create the WAV file, coming up with a message to the effect of "cannot create WAV from DRM enabled WMA" - in other words, because the WMA file has copyright management WinAmp will not allow transfer to other formats. In the context of copyright, this is probably quite correct practice; however, as DGM have publicly stated that it is OK to make CD copies for personal use only, it is worth pointing out that version 2.24 (as directed by Warren Melnick in ET #613) does not impose this restriction - work on the WMA support was obviously still in progress when this release was issued. Follow the link given (ftp://ftp.winamp.com/pub/winamp/winamp224_full.exe ) to get version 2.24. For those interested, I found that WinAmp was able to make the WAV file with no problem on my PII 266 under Win95, even running in the background while Delphi 5 consumed vast amounts of resources compiling in the foreground. And a big thank you to RF and DGM for making this great concert available in so innovative a manner! Happy listening, Simon Innes. ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #614 ********************************