Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #606 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 606 Friday, 13 August 1999 Today's Topics: NEWS: CGT Concerts in Colorado (and Utah) mellotron usage during mid 70's A tentative solution to the remasters issue Star Trek/K Belew/KC/Zappa/VU/Bowie... Re: BEAT Re: KC/VU/Eno/Zappa REVIEW: On Broadway 1995 Vote for TONY LEVIN (Keno's weekly poll) Re:Remasters about the video "defocusing, shaking and strange tracking" King Crimson / Star Trek 80's Remasters (Definitive Editions 1989) re: Sabbath using Mellotron King Velvets mellotron/tape/ending/ magma-tubular bells London Record Shops No-Man interview and AB (again) You Burn Me Up KC and Eno cd's at Ebay Sylvian / Fripp Live - CGT / Fripp Live Heartbeat Music troubles My words are all carried away Bob Muller search Broadway New King and RHCP Mellotrons etc KC CC #5&6 DUTCH ETers wanted... Cassettes for sale Some questions of K.C. That picture on the side of the Collector's Club CDs King Crimson in Germany 1973 remastered soundscapes cds?/the REAL sleepless Bill Rieflin article KC for the Playstation? Devils Triangle - The Movie Top Five A 5 ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.5b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:13:12 -0600 From: Jon Lybrook Subject: NEWS: CGT Concerts in Colorado (and Utah) Greetings All! It's been a busy summer of live music for the California Guitar Trio. Recently back from a tour of Norway (see the complete slide show at http://www.cgtrio.com/norway.htm), the CGT have some concerts scheduled for Colorado and Utah coming up very soon. This is the first time the CGT have played Colorado in several years, so it is very exciting for those of us out here in the Western U.S. to finally get the chance to see them again! Asterisks (*) indicate shows where Bill Janssen of Adrian Belew fame will be a featured artist. Be sure to check the Yamanashi News page for the latest dates and times: http://www.cgtrio.com/yamanews.htm. For those who can't make it to the shows, KGNU radio will be doing a LIVE STREAMING WEBCAST in RealAudio of the CGT on the legendary KGNU Kabaret show. See Monday, August 23rd below for details. Hope to see you out there! Jon CGT Web ~^*~^*~^*~^* CALIFORNIA GUITAR TRIO AUGUST TOUR DATES ~*^*~^*^~*~^~^* * = Featuring Bill Janssen on saxophone Thurs, August 19 - 8:00 pm Smokebrush Inn * - Colorado Springs, CO Call (719) 444-0884 for more info. Fri, August 20 Private Show - Colorado Springs, CO Sat, August 21 - 2:00 pm Penny Lane Coffee House * (FREE appearance and CD signing) Boulder, CO Sat, August 21 - 9:00 pm Boulder Theater * - Boulder, CO Tickets $8.50 at the door Call (303) 786-7030 for more info. Sun, August 22 ~ Day Off ~ Mon, August 23 - 7:00 pm MST. KGNU Radio, Kabaret Show, Boulder, CO LIVE STREAMING WEBCAST in RealAudio see http://www.cgtrio.com/realroom.htm Fri, August 27 - 8:00 pm Junction Theater, Ogden UT Call Smiths Tix at 1-800-888-8499 Sat, August 28 - 8:00 pm Fine Arts Auditorium, Univ. of Utah, SLC Call Smiths Tix at 1-800-888-8499 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 13:05:04 -0400 (EDT) From: pellegrini dot 1 at osu dot edu (Catherine Pellegrini) Subject: mellotron usage during mid 70's I've noticed on a lot of the mid 70's on the Great Deciever box set the mollotron was largely ignored. If wrote on this topic before about how the Great Deciever song played live was really done terribly. Bruford sounded ok, but didn't have as much heft as in the studio version and Wetton 's playing the bass and Fripp can only do so many things with the amount of hands a human can have by keeping up on guituar. Where was the mellotron in the '73-'74 line up? I don't hear it as evident as some say it is. I think the only time they used it was for the song Starless and possibly nightwatch. Fripp said that it was a pain to use but you have to be able to live up to expectations for fans. That's why KC in my opinion could only play songs from their '73-'74 era because the mellotron was so present in the '69'-'72 era. One more question. How come the KC never plays any old hits. I just want to know. I saw them in concert last May and they won't play any. Not even Red. Just answer me that question and I'll be satisified. When you compose a song shouldn't you want to play it just because it's fun to play? Sincerely, Jesse Pellegrini ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 13:32:35 -0400 From: Sergio Nunez Subject: A tentative solution to the remasters issue I think that the release of the newly remastered kc discs (by the way, was the old batch a remaster at all or was that just a rip-off, because they don't sound THAT good to me) is going to be delayed for a while much the same way we're still waiting for USA. One alternative might be THE COMPLETE KING CRIMSON 1969-1974, a 4-cd boxed set comprising all studio material from COURT to RED (some live tracks have already been included, with a far better sound, in DECEIVER and WATCH, so it wouldn't be necessary for the completist to have them repeated here in edited form (I do hate edits and I just wished Fripp realised that KC is never going to be easy listening and would stop releasing bits of tracks). This set would be the perfect excuse to REALLY remaster the stuff (I've calculated the songs' lengths and IT IS INDEED possible to do it), include some alternate mixes (is it just me or the balance on YPG's EPITAPH is notoriously different than in COURT?), overdubbed cuts, b-sides and FINALLY include the sought-after I TALK TO THE WIND 68 DEMO, as well as the lyrics to all songs. A later companion to this might be THE COMPLETE KING CRIMSON 1981-1984, a 2-cd set comprising the three studio albums, alternate mixes (KUDASAI, HEARTBEAT (MONO), SLEEPLESS (3 different ones) and THELA) and outtakes (BARBERSHOP and the forthcoming bits from Belew's collection. Purists might find somewhat heretic to splice POSEIDON and ISLANDS in different discs (these would be the only albums in need of such treatment, if a chronological order was to be followed), but then again they don't have to buy it. A limited edition of these sets PRIOR to releasing the discs separately would probably have a bigger interest for both the average Crimson fan and the die hard completist. Donovan Mayne-Nicholls ------------------------------ From: "Stephen P. Goodman" Subject: Star Trek/K Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 11:47:21 -0700 I had to surface for this one. Despite the years, I say that Mickey Hart (yes, ANOTHER Dead reference!) is still the most Vulcan-looking character in the music biz. Heck, he could play Spock, and did, during either a Halloween or New Year's show. I've often been surprised that he hasn't played one on any of the ST spin-offs... However, I suspect that Steve Howe's full-sleeved outfits add to his Vulcanesque appearance. :) jmooney at bigyellow dot com wrote: Actually, as the years pass, Steve Howe is looking more and more Vulcan. Manuel Fernandez wrote: >Didn't someone say that Robert Fripp is Rock's Mr. Spock? Stephen Goodman * It's the free Loop of the Week! EarthLight Productions * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios.html ------------------------------ From: "Stephen P. Goodman" Subject: Belew/KC/Zappa/VU/Bowie... Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 12:08:56 -0700 Greetings! James Dusewicz put forth: >[As an aside, RF could've gotten more VU influence from >his landmark collaborations with David Bowie. The >Trilogy that included HEROES and SCARY MONSTERS.] I can take exception to only one thing mentioned on the ET newsletter entry above, and it's that reference... The trilogy in question is actually Low-Heroes-Lodger... Adrian played all over Lodger - and not RF, as I had hoped when I'd bought it, back in '79... My initial response was only slight disappointment, not really having heard of Adrian before then. This downer was only temporary of course, as his guitar work was marvelous (keeping myself to one word). I recall being quite encouraged about the State of Rock Music then; one thing most musicians probably forget about KC/RF's influence upon the Music Biz is that they were a major force in carving out an area apart from Corporate Music and its practitioners, and thus also an assistant to the demise of that ever-hated contingent. How many of us are making our own music now because of this? Raise just one hand so you can still type, everyone. Stephen Goodman * It's the free Loop of the Week (3-1/2 years running)! EarthLight Productions * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios.html ------------------------------ Date: 7 Aug 99 15:29:52 EDT From: James Dusewicz Subject: Re: BEAT As I understand it, BEAT was a Fripp/Crimson tribute to Jack Keroac. It was released some thirty years after ON THE ROAD was published by the above author. "Neil, Jack, and me" is a reference to Neil Cassady and Jack Keroac. "Satori In Tangier" was also named after another Beat novelist's novel. Of the three quartet albums in the eighties, I find BEAT to be the most fascinating. The referece to JK can be found in FRAME BY FRAME. It has much more mature writing on it than DISCIPLINE, and is less industrial than THREE OF A PERFECT PAIR. All in all it evokes a strange air. I guess that would mean it is the best of the eighties quartet trilogy of albums in my opinion. jim campaigner at usa dot net James Dusewicz ------------------------------ From: Roozeboom at aol dot com Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 16:00:45 EDT Subject: Re: KC/VU/Eno/Zappa I have extreme difficulty believing that VU and KC would be even remotely mutually influenced in any way. To me, musically as well as (pop-)culturally, they are at opposite ends of the (or probably my perceived) spectrum. Though I have tried, I've failed to tune into the music of specifically Lou Reed. Perhaps because I attach abnormal value to, say, any sense of intonation, or key, or meter, or sonic quality, or musical-conceptual depth? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 14:54:22 -0700 (PDT) From: sean hewitt Subject: REVIEW: On Broadway 1995 Two hefty volumes of On Broadway are a fine addition to the Collectors' Club. RF goes out of his way in the sleevenotes to warn us not to expect "classic" or "definitive" versions of the Double Trio repertoire and, in truth, these versions are never as incendiary as the burning, roaring tracks Cirkus tracks recorded live in Mexico. But it's great to hear a new Crimson live recording and there are several versions here well worth hearing. The first disc actually starts a little subdued. It wasn't until Walking On Air, which is far from my favourite song. that my ears really pricked up. I'm not sure why - it's just a really atmospheric performance of it. There's a fascinating B'Boom/THRAK, with some interesting improv work - some of which was obviously the raw material for the digital cutting and splicing which produced THRaKaTTaK, but is reproduced here in its raw state. There's also a lighter Neurotica, standing in stark contrast to the nuclear-charged Mexico take, and a warped and looping Three Of A Perfect Pair. CD2 is burning all the way, starting with the best version of People (again, hardly in my top ten, but what a performance!) the band has released. Other favourites are the Eastern-flavoured run-through of The Talking Drum and the beautiful "Two Sticks" improv before Elephant Talk. Unlike Pete McClymont, I am a keen supporter of the inclusion of Fearless And Highly THRAKKed at the end. Firstly, this is the "raw" version - just one element of the track which ended up on THRaKaTTaK - and therefore of interest for that reason alone and secondly, I actually prefer its mournful grandeur. There was a melancholy edge to some of those THRAK-era improvs which sounded more like Arvo Part than Larks' Tongues - and I liked it! This keynote despairing tone is admirably to the fore in this "naked" version and it ends the double set on a low key but memorable note. Now - bring on that Projekct Four disc and let the future unfold. Cheers Sean Hewitt ------------------------------ From: "LIEDO" Subject: Vote for TONY LEVIN (Keno's weekly poll) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 16:24:33 -0600 Sorry but I wrote the address using html tags, here is the right one! original text: I know that polls are always unfair and not objective but I can't believe that the best bass player has only 3 votes out of 442 TO vote go to the following URL /use the whole URL from "http" to "Weekly" http://www.keno.org/polls/poll_results.asp?PollNumber=44&PollCategory=Rock-N -Roll&PollType=Weekly Saludos Gerardo Liedo ------------------------------ From: "Toni Suominen" Subject: Re:Remasters Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 12:38:48 +0300 Loren Karnick wrote: >in #602 was the suggestion to someone concerned over >acquiring KC now or >waiting RF's remastering, I have a question for those owning the >cds of >Discipline, Beat and Three of a Perfect Pair. I have resisted >buying them, >because the records sound thin, to my ears. When I heard the >Cirkus and >the other live versions of the eighties band, it renewed my >interest in the >eighties music. Do the cds sound the same as the records? Absolutely not! The studio records really have a bad sound, sound is really dull and thin. Really 80's sound. Toni Suominen tono at mbnet dot fi ------------------------------ From: "Christian Skina" Subject: about the video "defocusing, shaking and strange tracking" Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 14:34:48 +0200 When the VHS live in Japan 95 was released, there has been a number of complaints about the way it was shot on camera. I generally do not react to peoples remarks because I consider each one is entitled to his/her own frustration and people who are not willing to listen to another point of view, something which was not always clear in those postings, is useless to disturb with a monologue. Willing to add my opinion to the collection of vhs related postings, I have pointed out, as far as I could in that moment manage, that there is no fixed rule (thank Mr God!) about how a concert/film/video clip should be filmed. I do not think anyone has ever written Michael Jackson an email to complain about his video decisions. You take it or leave it. Just now, while posting on the DGM guest book, I have read another angry posting. Mr Todd was complaining about the "low budget" of that filming and other "annoying visual effects". I will not debate here about the decisions King Crimson and the Japanese team have made. I "know" them only through the results. I will only invite the gentleman in distress to think of others, which do not want to see every complexion detail of the musicians, nor a framed still-life shot. This time, sorry for you, folks like me were advantaged. I personally have saluted that kind of presentation and considered it a mature step forward in filming King Crimson. (I have bought 2 tapes, just in case one is damaged and later, when it became available, the Deja Vroom dvd) Were not that advanced to satisfy everyones desires and I hope artists will never try to do that. For such needs, one would better rent a hooker. Since Im a video artist, I would like to hear from Mr Todd how can he determine whats a low budget production and how a big budget can necessary add to the artistic value? I mean, do you think the Japanese team did not afford a set of good lenses and a tripod? As Mr Zappa once said (in a similar situation) : throw the record away, get some titties and a beer. (no, Im not trying to be cynical, I remembered with a kind feeling about Mr Zappas reactions to the public) Christian Skina ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 11:02:46 -0400 From: James Beard Subject: King Crimson / Star Trek Hi. I don't know if I ever posted this before, so I'll run the risk of repeating myself. There has periodically been a thread about who could play Krimson members in a movie. When I saw a picture of Patrick Stewart from Dune holding a Chapman stick, I thought 'All you need is a moustache, and you've got yourself a Levin'! The picture can be found here: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/2511/music.htm James. ------------------------------ From: "Neil Forker" Subject: 80's Remasters (Definitive Editions 1989) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 10:22:44 -0500 This is a response to Loren Karnick. The DE Remasters of the 80's records (Discipline, Beat & Three of a Perfect Pair) do sound a bit thin still. However, they do sound better than the discs that were pressed by Warner Bros. I look forward to hearing the Second Edition remasters that are, hopefully, going to materialize. If you are interested in getting a really good recording of the 80's lineup. One that doesn't sound as thin, that is. I would suggest getting 'Absent Lovers - Live in Montreal 1984' from DGM. :) Hope this helps! Neil Forker ------------------------------ From: "Susan or Matt" Subject: re: Sabbath using Mellotron Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 11:37:33 -0400 To Jim Hannigan: Good observation about Sabbath using the Mellotron on 'Who Are You?' from "Sabbath, Bloody Sabbath" as well as mentioning that Rick Wakeman played on "SBS" (on the song 'Sabbra Cadabra'). In fact 'Who Are You?' has no guitars at all: Just Mellotron, piano & the Mini-Moog! However the first time they used Mellotron was on their previous album "Vol.4" on the songs 'Changes' & 'Laguna Sunrise'. But if you the reader are really into messed-up prog-type stuff (and I know you are) check out their album "Sabotage". Trust me. By the way if anyone reading lives near a town that Roger Waters is going to be playing in BY ALL MEANS GO! Thanks for reading, Matt Hebert ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 16:14:31 -0500 (CDT) From: flaherty michael w Subject: King Velvets My fellow Velvet Underground enthusiast, James Dusewicz, made some interesting comments regarding the Velvet Underground, a band who have, directly or indirectly, influenced all non-mainstream "rock." But I believe he overstates his case: 1. The influence of the Velvet Underground on Eno is beyond doubt, but they cannot be called his only or even his main influence. Furthermore, by the time of "Pussyfooting" he was his own man with some very original ideas (all artists are influenced; the best make their own statement). 2. I doubt that the Velvets entered into the process at all, but if they did they were a small part of what by then would be a large body of works, some predating the Velvets, which Eno would be familiar with (Terry Reily and John Cage come to mind). 3. That Eno and John Cale (the most important V. U. member in terms of a possible influence on Fripp) played together after Pussyfooting isn't particularly significant beyond what Eno has never denied--yes, the V. U. were important to him, and he likes John Cale. It does not follow that those who play with Eno become effected by that relationship in a significant way. By the way, Cale and Fripp have never played on the same track (anywhere); Scary Monsters (just for the record) was not part of Bowie's trilogy. None of this means that Fripp was not aware or indirectly influenced by the Velvet Underground, but that the influence has been major (compared with, for example, John McLaughlin or Bartok) is debatable. Michael Flaherty ------------------------------ From: "Luca Mottura" Subject: mellotron/tape/ending/ magma-tubular bells Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 23:03:02 CEST Subject: mellotron >>Jim Bailey wrote: >many of the Krautrock bands were also heavy users: Tangerine Dream, >Klaus Shultze, Popol Vu, etc. I own all records by german band Popol Vuh but I cannot hear a mellotron on them. Please tell me where I can find it?? Florian Fricke played Moog Synthesizer C II S-type only (sometimes organ and fender piano). After Affenstunde and In den garten Pharaos he sold it to Klaus Schulze, and continued his career playing the piano. If you want listen to italian bands playing mellotron please listen to "Ys" by Balletto di Bronzo (1972 - reissued now by Polygram on CD). I read on a magazine that Edgar Froese from Tangerine Dream is the only musician to own all mellotron tapes. > Subject: Tape delay About the tape delay, I would like to know you a record made by italian guitarist Franco Fabbri (member of Stormy Six), titled Domestic Flights, and made with a guitar and 2 reel-to-reel Revox. Absolutely out of sale in Italy. > Subject: ending >James Dusewicz wrote: >Side one of the album then ended quite abruptly with a fast >cut. >"Nightmare"'s ending was stark indeed. I had not heard an >ending quite >like it at the time. Listen to the record The end of the Game by Peter Green, it ends abruptly. > Subject: Magma / tubular bells >>Nate Carlson wrote: >Christian Vander of Magma claims that "Tubular Bells" was ripped off >from >"Mekanik Kommandoh." (There are similarities.) Basically, >Vander claims >that Oldfield was in the studio when they recorded >Mekanik, and he >recorded Bells right after hearing Magma record >their album. Who knows? Yes , Oldfield was in the studio when Vander was recording Mekanik. But Oldfield ripped off the melody from another song: LA DAWOTSIN (COMPOSED 1971/72) and played in the same studio session by Christian!!! You can hear it on the record Retrospective Vol. 3 (published 1981/RCA/ reissued on cd by Seventh). I think Mike Oldfield is un figlio di puttana (translate into your language). Luca Mottura, Italy. ------------------------------ From: "dc30" Subject: London Record Shops Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 19:07:49 -0400 I am a Stateside Crimson fan who is about to cross the Puddle to London Town for the first time this September. Can any fellow Eters out there give me some suggestions as to interesting record/cd shops in London that have rare and live recordings of 1960's - early '70s music, such as Crimson, Soft Machine, The Nice, Family, Deep Purple, to name a few. Private e-mail responses only, of course. Also, I would welcome any tape trade lists, particularly of the '72-'74 band. Thanks, Donald Chin ------------------------------ From: "STUDER, Andrew" Subject: No-Man interview and AB (again) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 11:48:40 +1000 Just a quick rumination after the excellent interview posted recently. I was one of the many post-THRAK commentators who wondered at the role of Belew's songs in the band. Well, the album has had rather a lot of years to "mature", and listening to it again, it strikes me how well the songs- particularly the slower songs- fit in with the material. "People" and "Dinosaur" still almost-but-don't-quite-work, but hit close enough to the mark to be enjoyable. All the rest, particularly "Walking on air", have improved with age. Furthermore, although such comparisons are odious, I think the songs on THRAK easily bear comparison with the songs of earlier Crimson incarnations. Although the six piece outfit may be on the way out- or it may only exist intermittently in the future- I remembered some principles of orchestration when I re-listened to THRAK. Firstly, the benefit of having more musicians doesn't merely come by having them play all at once: it comes from having a broader palette to work with. And the power of a large group is not only apparent when it plays loudly- it's apparent when it plays softly. ------------------------------ From: flori at vt dot edu Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 23:43:36 -0400 Subject: You Burn Me Up Greetings good folk, I just bought Exposure last week and am truly in love with it. I just gots a little question here. I was looking at the Exposure pages for a track by track listing, and it listed Daryl Hall as the vocalist on "You Burn Me Up I'm a Cigarette". Maybe I'm not stretching my ear enough, but the vocal really doesn't sound like his voice at all. Anyone have any thoughts on this? thanx jdl ------------------------------ From: "chris mcgarel" Subject: KC and Eno cd's at Ebay Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 12:52:30 IST There are a few CD's on auction at Ebay which may be of interest. The first is a King Crimson show from Austin, Texas in '81: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=143234714 The second is the famous Eno/Byrne 'Ghosts' CD, featuring unreleased and alternate versions from the 'My Life in the Bush of Ghosts' sessions, also featuring Fripp on a couple of tracks: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=143237498 Finally there is a Stranglers and Friends Live CD. The friends include Robert Fripp, Peter Hammill, Steve Hillage and Toyah: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=143231003 ------------------------------ From: "SYNCHRO, RONALD VOGEL" Subject: Sylvian / Fripp Live - CGT / Fripp Live Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 07:10:45 -0500 Hi all Christian Skina asked about DGM plans to release the live Sylvian / Fripp as well as CGT plus Fripp and Gunn (Robert Fripp's String Quintet's The Bridge Between live, before and after album release). Sylvian / Fripp live was originally a Laser Disc release ( i am very glad i found a used copy of it) and The String Quintet (someone correct me if i am wrong) was released in VHS format only (LD??). While Sylvian / Fripp was not on sale anymore, String Quintet is at the moment available through DGM. It is worth to check out what they've got. I am positive they still have some LDs and lots of VHSs. Just email them and the answer comes very quick. I would also like to have a Sylvian / Fripp in a DVD format. From everything Fripp recorded since 91 the material i like the most is the above mentioned partnership work. They issued 3 CDs (The First Day, Damage and Darshan) and the above mentioned LD. The live concerts wre played by Fripp, Sylvian, Mastelloto, Gunn and Michael Brook (rythm guitar. The result is fantastic. They toured in Europe and, of course, Japan. LD show comes from Japan tour. We can see that the project was serioulsy taken in consideration by the musicians (tough Sylvian says something quite not so encouraging). Fripp considers it as having excellent results. In fact it does. The live show is fantastic. The combination between the musicians' different styles gives a fantastic mood and balance. There are not only one type of music played because Sylvian adds some delicacy and much melody. Fripp uses soundscapes extensively as well as strong guitar riffs. Unfortunately i never managed to find the Damage Cd but sure found a Italian bootleg. Some songs are different. The version also vary a lot from one show to the other, as well as if compared to the studio album. Let's pray Fripp could include the DVD release in his busy plans. String Quintet was also largely played live. Aside from the official releases (The Bridge Between CD and the VHS) there is also (ate least) one bootleg. This one is very interesting. Something like 40% of it are soundscapes and the rest is played by the Quintet. I do think, but i am not quite sure, that the boot was recorded off a LD, because the quality is very good. Commercially thinking, both releases are not subject of a DVD release. They do not have that much commercial appeal. Cost of a DVD production from an older source format still remains unknown to me. I do think that Fripp's plans unfortunately do not follow this direction, for he never mentioned or commented anything about it. Anyone knowing something about it please inform. Cheers - Ronald ------------------------------ From: Belewp at cs dot com Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 09:30:36 EDT Subject: Heartbeat These are my thoughts for the continuing discusion on the song Heartbeat. I feel it is some of the best guitar work by Adrian Belew from that period of Krimson music. I also like Bruford's drumming, sparse and complex. If the song Heartbeat came out todaythe lyrics would be laughable but they seem to fit for that time period. ------------------------------ From: "Liceo Franco" Subject: Music troubles Date: Tue, 4 Aug 1998 11:58:22 -0600 Hi I have a band, and we are a very big king crimson fans, so we "try" to play many songs of their songs. I play the flute, and I don't know the melody of "I talk to the wind". I really will thank you, if you are the flute's part. We have try, but nothing... So, congratulations for the site....thanks Bye Lina ------------------------------ From: "robert verrijt" Subject: My words are all carried away Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:22:18 CEST Hallo, Listening a few days ago "In the court of the crimson king" again a question raised to me. Hearing the words: "Said the straight man to the late man - Where have you been - I've been here and I've been there - And I've been in between" I thought of it as a quote of a Monk talking to his buddhist Zen master. And the words "I talk to the wind - My words are all carried away -I talk to the wind - The wind does not hear - The wind cannot hear" made me think of an ancient Japanese haiku. My question is: Is this only my interpretation of the lyrics written by Sinfield himself or are these words based on existing Zen-writings? I would appreciate it very much if anybody who knows something more on this subject, would react on this question. Thank you. Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 21:04:21 -0400 From: tj Subject: Bob Muller search I've been saying I really like Bob Muller who's spent time hitting things with Trey. I wanted to know more. Anything else out there? tj dc-et #2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:28:03 -0400 From: James Hannigan Subject: Broadway I too am happy with the latest club release. Complaints? All I've got are two: 1)why no information about show derivation for each song (I was at one of them); for some reason the club releases lack the meticulous liner note detail of other releases 2)why is Thrak cut suddenly? It's a bit jarring and does not allow the song to feel finished to the listener. - Jim ------------------------------ From: "stuart allison" Subject: New King and RHCP Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 03:27:08 PDT Hi all, to add more to the comment the RHCP had a KC touch to one of the songs, arecent article in a guitar mag. has a large quote (font size not word count) from John Fruschanti (bad spelling, OK give me a break), lead guitarist of Red Hot Chilli Peppers saying that his first ever concert was that of a one Adrian Belew when he (John F) was 14 and Belew became his favourite guitarist. A few thoughts on the new crim: I'm not totally up to date whether it is named ProjeKct or ?????? but after a bit of pondering I have the feeling that this new band Fripp, Belew, Gunn and Mastelotto while have close parallels to that of the Lark's Tongues incarnation. What I've heard about P4 from various sources sounds like Pat is quite an experimenter and that Gunn's low end rumbles like nothing else. Granted the actual sound will no doubt sound radically different from LTiA but this is just my opinion (and a rushed one at that). Gotta go! Stuart ------------------------------ From: aal at aws dot co dot uk Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 14:01:35 +0100 Subject: Mellotrons etc Thanks to all of you who sent me posts about the Grateful Dead. I haven't had time to check any albums out yet but I intend to reply personally when I have. In et605 there was a post > "From: James Hannigan > Subject: Sabbath using Mellotron >Believe it or not, the "fathers of heavy metal" Black Sabbath used >mellotrons on the tune "Who Are You" from on the album Sabbath Bloody >Sabbath (a record Rick Wakeman also played on)." In fact the most notable use of Mellotron by the Sabbs was on "Changes" which was either on Masters of Reality or Volume 4. John Wetton played Mellotron on Uriah Heep's "Return to Fantasy" album and this can be heard on the remastered series, although I do not recall being able to hear it on the original version. also from et605 >"From: seanr at frognet dot net >Subject: song length on Islands > Can anyone explain to me why the times on the >track listings on the album Islands are extremely >wrong. In the boxed set of Frame by Frame, the booklet has the running time for the live version of "the Talking Drum" at about 69 minutes, although the actual version is about 6 minutes. Sometimes there are just mistakes and I think that with the Islands album (originally on vinyl) that someone just couldn't tell where Formentera Lady ended. I think the total time of the two tracks matches between sleeve notes and discs. Just a thought Andrew Lehva London ------------------------------ From: "Gordon Emory Anderson" Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:05:00 -0400 Subject: KC CC #5&6 No mere hyperbole from those describing the "Live on Broadway" release. At some point while listening to it, I thought that as pure documentation alone, it is important. Years from now, when KC no exists (is that possible!), it will be a valuable thing to show that a band could sound like this. Whereas the 80s group was more or less Rock-n-Roll chamber music (by that I mean tight, almost fugue-like music), the double trio sounds almost orchestral, particularly on Thrak-era music (Vroom, in particular). That Tim Bowness guy said it best, something to the effect of the double trio reclaiming the sonic territory that (for instance) some of the Seattle bands expounded upon (I think they universally cite 'Red' as a major influence). The Live on Broadway band (and I was there: i think I can hear myself Ki-ai-ing "Yeah" in the audience) is this wall of ineluctable sound, and that comes through here. As much as I loved the 80s band, and as much as this band still had kinks and imperfections to work out (such as living up to its full potential), it has an edginess that, though implied by the 80s work, was never fully realized as can be heard here. -Emory ------------------------------ From: "Frits Jurriens" Subject: DUTCH ETers wanted... Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:13:39 +0200 [Unknown MIME type or encoding (multipart/related), contents not processed] ------------------------------ From: "Bill Colrus" Subject: Cassettes for sale Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:30:16 PDT Hello fellow Et-ers, I hate to waste space with an ad, but I am selling some Crimson and Crimson related cassettes for $3 a piece, and would love to give those on ET first crack at them. All are used, but have been treated with tender loving care and are in perfect playing condition. Here's the list: King Crimson/USA (Editions EG) King Crimson/Beat (WB cut-out) King Crimson/A Young Person's Guide (Editions EG) King Crimson/Larks' Tongues In Aspic (Editions EG) Fripp & Eno/No Pussyfooting & Evening Star (Editions EG double pack) Andy Summers & Robert Fripp/I Advance Unmasked (A&M) David Sylvian & Robert Fripp/The First Day (Virgin) UK/UK (Editions EG) UK/Night After Night Live (Editions EG) Eno/More Blank Than Frank:Songs from 1973-1977 (EG) Roger Eno/Voices (Editions EG) John Wetton & Phil Manzanera/Wetton Manzanera (Geffen) Genesis/Seconds Out w/Bruford (Atlantic two tapes) Peter Hammill/Skin (Enigma) GTR/GTR (Arista) Bill Nelson/Chance Encounters in the Garden of Light (Enigma) Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, Howe/st (Arista) Emerson, Lake & Palmer/Black Moon I also have the first FRANK ZAPPA Beat the Boots collection (again, $3 each) Freaks & Motherfu*#@%! Unmitigated Audacity 'Tis The Season To Be Jelly As An Am Saarbrucken 1978 Piquantique Any Way The Wind Blows Please E-Mail if you are interested... Thank you- Bill Colrus ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:57:49 -0400 (CST) From: ARAYA VARGAS JAIME ANDRES Subject: Some questions of K.C. 1st part. Congratulation: Thank you E.T.! The Elephant Talk page is a really gift to K.C`s fans 2nd part. Questions: 1-For whom (or what) King Crimson composed "Requiem" (last song of "Beat")? 2-What relation exist between eigthy`s King Crimson and beatnick generation (some examples: "The sheltering sky" of "Discipline", "Neal, and Jack and me" of "Beat", etc.)? 3rd part. The language problem: Sorry for my english; my bored congratulations and the strangely manners of my questions. JAIME ARAYA VARGAS Santiago de Chile ------------------------------ From: "" Subject: That picture on the side of the Collector's Club CDs Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:57:56 PDT Hi all, Now that CC#5&6 is out, it appears to me that the partial picture found on the side of each collector's club cd is from the Epitaph playback event. CC#5&6 has an obvious glimpse of M.Giles, CC#2 has bit of the Epitaph artwork. Does anyone else agree with me? Erik Varga Orlando, FL ------------------------------ From: "George Khouroshvili" Subject: King Crimson in Germany 1973 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 01:18:03 MSD Hello ETers, Recently my friends from St.Petersburg have sent me a tape with a strange KC boot: Live in Germany 1973. It begins... well with Indiscipline, then LTIA II follows. Undoubtadly both songs are from early 80's shows and it's one of the best Indiscipline versions I've ever heard. Then the real 70's show begins with No Pussifooting, Dr.Diamond, some improv, The Night Watch, Easy Money, Peace - A Theme, Cat Food. This concert also sounds pretty good even though I have a lot of those line up performances. If anyone of you is familiar with this CD, please, enlighten me where the recordings were taken from? I'm especially interested in the 1st two compositions. All the best, George PS. Last week J.Wetton's "Nomansland" & KC "On Broadway" appeared. What a great day. Mr.Wetton's concert is surprisingly good (at last he released a 10 minutes version of Starless and there is almost no Asia material - I like the band but I'm getting tired of The Smile Has Left Your Eyes), and Collectors' Club release was as good as usual. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:23:11 -0400 From: Peggs Subject: remastered soundscapes cds?/the REAL sleepless Remember back when new versions of all the "soundscapes" C.D.s were going to be released? What happened to that? I've seen no mention of them anywhere. I doubt that I'll order (re-order) any except 1999, due to the promise of extra material. I am longing for new soundscapes. Does anyone else want the original/remix (depending on your point of view) version of "Sleepless" on C.D.? The one from the original vinyl version of "Three of a Perfect Pair". With several discs out there with a studio version on it, you'd think it would be included at least as a bonus track or something. How 'bout a just-for-fun '99 run through of "Starless"? Or "Cadence and Cascade"? Just thinkin'... Greg (gcpeggstuff at usa dot net) ------------------------------ From: Godf852195 at aol dot com Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:24:16 EDT Subject: Bill Rieflin article A link to a 17 paragraph article on Bill Rieflin can be found at www.nineinchnails.net/news/ Xiclotl ------------------------------ From: Alan dot Maguire at CERT dot IE Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 17:39 +0100 (BST) Subject: KC for the Playstation? Hello ET'ers, In the light of Fripps unfortunate George Segal infatuation, and the re-mixable version of Schizoid Man on DVD I propose a merger of sorts:: How about DGM commissioning a beat-'em-up style game (like Street Fighter) where each player gets to pick which member of KC they want to be (past or present). They then battle to the death. Each KC member has their own special moves with which to defeat their opponent: Fripp has the Spit of Death, a deadly move, particularly when used in conjunction with the Intense Stare of Opprobrium. T-Lev can strike fear into the hearts of his victims with scalding jets of Cappuccino. Wetton can liquidize the innards of his bandmates with just a flick of the E string on his Bass of Holy Terror. And so on.... Early levels take place on a cramped stage in a smoky club. As play progresses the stage gets bigger, until the final showdown where all the KC members amalgamate into a huge manga type robot in order to slay the two headed beast E&G. The winner gets to write about it ad infinitum in cd liner notes a couple of years. Well...I'd buy it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 14:33:01 +0200 From: jacekc at altkom dot com dot pl (Jacek Czajka (serwis)) Subject: Devils Triangle - The Movie Hello dear ETers, In Imdb i found: "Devil's Triangle, The (1974) Cast Vincent Price .... Narrator (voice) Original music by Robert Fripp (as King Crimson) " Has anyone saw this movie? Best regards Jacek Czajka ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 22:12:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Joseph Basile Subject: Top Five A 5 Hi, Ho Top 5 cds in my tray.....Circus disk 2.I even craved the flavor.... Then Starless recorded in the burg, made just for me. Seems Clearer than the GREAT DECIEVER release, butthis could be me.....I was never a real RHCP fan. I always liked a song or two but this Californication is solid! The song Scar Tissue is good, but there is more meat here! Right on top was mentiond last ET. I don't hear a Crimson element, but it is a neat song. Out there for a while, but The Best of Pete Townshend was solid, I was a late comer to this release because this was a present this week.I was glad to see IRON MAN and WHO CAME FIRST represented on this disk. Also as a present was IN WAKE OF THE POSIDEN. I forgot how pretty of an album/CD this is. Pictures of a City! WOW! Also some Fripp Sylvain boots, or is this off limits now.....Nah, Toby's to Cool.....#5?....The Best Of SRV.... enough said. Sid Smith.... Clair Hamils VOICES is a pretty cool album/CD. Very, very unique. Warmly, Basile By The Three Rivers! ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #606 ********************************