Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com
Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com
Sender: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com
Precedence: bulk
From: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com
To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com
Subject: Elephant Talk #600


               E L E P H A N T    T A L K

        The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp
              and King Crimson enthusiasts

                        Number 600

                   Monday, 19 July 1999

Today's Topics:

   NEWS: Adrian Belew Tour - 2nd Half

   Congratulations to ET
   Captain Fripp Kirk
   Prog BBQ, come taste the music!
   Technique vs. Inspiration/Classical Composer influencing Fripp
   Does the 'King' have a new Tool?
   Reduced Vinyl Format
   The Sound of a Tree Falling
   King Crimson/Star Trek
   Arguing aesthetics; John McLaughlin; Crimheads as Trekkies;
   Re: FFWD
   Michael Giles unreleased album
   The despair
   RE: Lizard
   ALBUM REVIEW: Jamie Muir & "The Music Improvisation Company"
   Micheal Giles activities
   Age requirements
   Are We Too Serious??
   D & D, Trek, and KC!! But not KFC.
   one more Fracture comment
   Crim n' Dead - plus little bits
   star trek and cheerful insanity
   Some comments and opinions
   Adrian Belew and Mike Keneally
   JON ANDERSON ONLY HERE/TOPICS IN GENERAL
   Re:technique vs. inspiration
   Fracture (The Song, & Incredible piece of Artwork! )
   Taping - what's cool...what's not cool!
   Thela Hun Gingeet
   Lurkers come out to play, Fracture, No Chrim '99?
   Technique vs. Inspiration
   Fracture again...
   Cirkus...the band
   out of print CD's
   Crimso/Dead ET conection and Russian USA CD
   KC re-remasters: should I wait or not?
   kc sheet music
   Money Making...Disco Faking
   Commercial - bad!, Obscure - Good?

------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A ---------------------

POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com

To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: 
   Send a message with a body of HELP to
     admin at elephant-talk dot com 
   or use the DIY list machine at
     http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/

To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription:
   Send a message to:
     help at elephant-talk dot com

ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/

Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at
     http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm

Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at
     http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.htm

You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at
     http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm

THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) 
  Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands.

The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors.
ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.5b (relph at sgi dot com).

------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A ---------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Jul 1999 16:54:01 -0500
From: "Rob Murphree" <rob at murple dot com>
Subject: NEWS: Adrian Belew Tour - 2nd Half

ADRIAN BELEW SUMMER 1999 COMING ATTRACTIONS/SALAD DAYS TOUR
SECOND HALF

July 16  Coach House, San Juan Capistrano, CA
July 17  The Roxy, Los Angeles, CA
July 19  Zephyr, Salt Lake City, UT
July 21  Bluebird, Denver, CO
July 23  Viele's Planet, Springfield, IL
July 24  Fitzgerald's, Chicago, IL
July 25  Blueberry Hill, St. Louis, MO
July 26  Blue Bird, Bloomington, IN
July 28  Ark, Ann Arbor, MI
July 29  Graffiti, Pittsburgh, PA
July 30  The Tralf, Buffalo, NY

For more tour information, please visit:
www.murple.com/adrianbelew/tour.htm

Thanks.

Rob
_______________________________________
Rob Murphree's Official Adrian Belew WWW Site
www.murple.com/adrianbelew

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1999 21:40:02 -0400
From: "Andy Dean" <andy at kcroyalsfan dot com>
Subject: Congratulations to ET

Hello,

I just wanted to congratulate Toby, Dan, and everybody else behind the
scenes at ET Web on having reached ET #600.  Thank you all, and may we all
THRaK on for another 600.

--Andy

P.S.  When the year 2000 rolls around, will this newsletter
change its name to "21st Century Schizoid List" or something
like that?  Just curious.  :)

_________________________________________________________________
Sign up for your FREE KC Royals E-mail and you could win a laptop at www.kcroyals.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 06:01:13 -0600
From: Kevin Holm-Hudson <kholmhud at nwu dot edu>
Subject: Captain Fripp Kirk

T. Murphy/Chicago wrote:

>As I went into my 15 minute dissertation on what it was
>like to enjoy music that few people like and how lonely
>that liking can be...one of my guests pissed on my parade
>by saying..."Ya know what? You KC fans are a little too
>much like Star Trek fans. Think about it."

[snip]

>we had 5 or 6 fans behind us, all talking about the pros
>and cons of Belew, Wetton etc etc. in a most serious
>overtone. My partner quickly compared them to Star Trek
>geeks arguing over Picard and Kirk. ...God..I had forgotten
>about that moment until it was brought up almost 4 years
>later.

Eesh--this was a bit too familiar. When my wife kindly
accompanied me to Fripp's last Park West Soundscapes show
(was it January 1998?), she slyly remarked about how the
audience (all admittedly earnest young and not-so-young men)
looked like a "Star Trek convention". Somewhere along the
line she also remarked how some of the fans even looked a
bit like Fripp himself (very short hair, wire-rimmed specs,
serious expressions), or like members of the "Heaven's Gate"
cult....

We are still happily married. :-)

On a related note, I wonder what is wrong with serious
discussion of the merits of KC personnel as you
described. Admittedly, the only comparable situation I can
think of in rock, ironically, might be the Grateful Dead (I
remember some Deadhead friends and I discussing the
particular contributions of Bobby, Brent, etc. to a
particular show after we'd seen them). But what's wrong with
that, as a harmless pastime? Don't baseball fans do this all
the time? (Mind you, I'm not looking forward to any
discussions about "Belew's soloing average" or Boz's "career
errors", but you never hear hardcore baseball fans being
compared to Trekkers....)

Maybe the attraction we all have here is for the notion of
Fripp and company (or Garcia and company, for those who are
also Dead fans) taking us along to boldly go where no rock
audience has gone before...

Khh

Kevin Holm-Hudson
School of Music
Northwestern University
711 Elgin Rd.
Evanston, IL 60208
kholmhud at nwu dot edu

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 09:17:25 -0400
From: "RayRaupersJr." <RayRaupersJr dot  at prodigy dot net>
Subject: Prog BBQ, come taste the music!

I've enjoyed so many recent posts, and the latest idea of a
prog BBQ seemed to gel them together into a very possible
setting:

The pig turns on the spit and smoke filters through the
maples overhead.  Musicians plagued by their stereotypical
insecurity complex's are standardly invoking their belief of
a heirarchy of musical appreciation; while allowing
non-musicians to experience the same music in some sort of
child-like innocence, which the musician claims to have left
behind on their ascending course of disciplined practice and
corresponding judgmental activities (reward and
responsibility).

Meanwhile some guy with that obvious non-musician attitude
is delighting in the beer, the music and the eyes of the
ladies, attempting to engage guests in conversation with an
inquiry of "Who's better? "Herman's Hermits or Mike
Nesmith?"  "Whose Mike Nesmith?" comes the reply.

Prog fans of both levels are concerned, what should be
played for this all to "general public"!  (Yet another level
on the heirarchy, ohhh so much to manage!)  And somewhere
lurks the fear of the women element!  Dear me, they surely
can't dance to a thrakattack!!  Why do they always have to
dance?

Meanwhile the cook and host whom owns an extensive Crimson
collection follows "Asbury Park" with the Stray Cat's "How
long You Want To Live Anyway?" Seemingly unaware of his
blasphemy, now believes it permissable to put on some
"Captain Beefheart"!  I mean Captain Beefheart???  Hey wait
up you guys, you know that Michael Nesmith is actually a
very fine musician!  (The cook is looking for his copy of
Johnny Cash, "A Boy Named Sue"! )

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 15:21:26 +0200
From: Rainer Straschill <moin at eikon dot tum dot de>
Subject: Technique vs. Inspiration/Classical Composer influencing Fripp

Linking two recent post/threads in ET:

I've actually never heard before of Zappa being influenced
by Paganini (we're talking about Nicolo, the violinist who
was suspected to have a pact with the horned one, right
?). David Way, can you list a source where Zappa referenced
to Paganini ?

Interestingly, David Lumenta cites Bartok and Stravinsky as
Fripp's major classical influences - both of whom do hold
true as for Zappa influences (see for example the Bartok
excertp on Make a Jazz Noise here or the Stravinsky
reference in Titties&Beer (CD version) - actually, to link
back to Paganini, a song discussing pacts with the devil...)

For Zappa's interest in the Beatles, see the We're only in
it for the Money cover...

        Rainer

--
        MOINLABS GFX and Soundworks
Your choice in professional weirdness !!!
http://www.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de/~moin

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 08:46:25 -0500
From: wviland at thin-film dot com
Subject: Does the 'King' have a new Tool?

I've been a Crimson fan for a long time.  I purchased
several copies of there major releases as the vinyl wore and
was elated with the release of the higher quality albums.
Now, of course, CD's.  Anyway..... this is just to point out
that I've listened to there music over and over again.  I
never get tired of it.  In my opinion there is no group of
musicians that come close to there power.  "Long Live The
King!"

My brother is somewhat of a garage band musician.  To this
day I have never succeeded to convince him to buy even one
Crimson recording.  I have several extra's but if I gave
them to him he would probably shelve them.  He is always
bringing me stuff to listen to.  One of the most recent was
a band called 'Tool'.  I've enjoyed this band or at least
its 'Aenima' recording (I think thats correct).  I hear many
sounds seemingly inspired by the 'King', especially track 5.
Is the spirit of the 'King' becoming part of all I enjoy or
can anyone else hear the likeness?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 10:01:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Chris Van Valen <crv1 at is2 dot nyu dot edu>
Subject: Reduced Vinyl Format

Hi EYMs (&Ws)

Much ralk in ET #599 regarding "reduced vinyl
format"....what is this? Is it a new type of CD
manufacturing/material, or what? Private replies are OK.

Congrats to Toby et al on issue 600!

CV

If you have an unpleasant nature and dislike people this is
no obstacle to work. - J.G. Bennett

And it's potato, potato, potato. - Mike Keneally

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 10:53:04 -0400
From: "roscoee" <roscoee at gateway dot net>
Subject: The Sound of a Tree Falling

Dear Crimsonheads,

     Do any of you feel the urge to investigate Terre Roche's solo project,
The Sound Of A Tree Falling?  It's a beautiful collection of
songs--exquisite guitar playing, that sweet soprano voice, and arrangements
reminiscent of material from the Roches' Fripp-days.  Mr. Fripp does not
show up on the disc, but she does thank him in the liner notes.
     It's not Exposure, but it's a set of songs worth the attention of
anyone who was ever moved by that voice all those years ago.
     Apparently, it's only available through her website.  I encourage all
to check it out.

Sincerely,

Terry Cook
roscoee at gateway dot net

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 12:43:00 -0400
From: Manuel Fernandez <destruye at cantv dot net>
Subject: King Crimson/Star Trek

With regards to Mr. Goodcracker/Murphy's remarks about
somebody comparing KC fans to Trekkies: Unless you were
wearing pointed ears and acting Vulcan-like while explaining
your problem to your friend, I think there's no point.  It's
ridiculous, because any activity involving a group of
enthusiastic people will be subject to friendly discussion.
Baseball fans, Porsche drivers and yes, Trekkies do it all
the time, why can't we?

As for the lonely business of Fripping-out with enthusiasm,
I can only say that it gives me pleasure and I don't have
offer explanations about it.  So shouldn't you.  Just be
happy that you like this noise and tell everyone to
Fripp-off !

Manuel.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 10:50:31 -0700
From: "Scott Steele" <scottst at ohsu dot edu>
Subject: Arguing aesthetics; John McLaughlin; Crimheads as Trekkies;

>Tastes are personnal and should not be discussed!

Tastes are personal, and should be discussed; but
discussions should not be personal, and should not be
offensive.  (That's just what I think.)

>Last Sunday July 4th, I saw the REMEMBER SHAKTI with John
> McLaughlin band!

Time for Fripp and McLaughlin to meet over chocolates and
coffee, while Fripp bootlegs the conversation and posts it
in a public place; the Diary if not a major magazine where
Vic Garbarini works.  Please sir, add this to your list of
things to do?

I wish JM had brought Shakti to my corner of the world.
From everything I hear, the newest (touring) version of
Shakti with U Srinivas on mandolin is quite amazing.  They
are in Europe now.

>As a guitar player I am inspired by Both Robert Fripp and
> John McLaughlin.

Me too, I am glad we have them both.

>"Ya know what? You KC fans are a little too much like Star
> Trek fans. Think about it."

ROFL!  Live with it!  Love that bald pointy-eared bass player.

>....is this format turning into a parody of ourselves
> without us even knowing it?

It could, if we don't know it.  If we know it, it might not, but it still could.

>Concerning David Hudson's critique of "Fracture" in issue
> #597, which was greeted with such hostility in #598: It is
> interesting that not one of his respondents acknowledged
> that there may be some truth in what he wrote.

There is truth in what he wrote, for him.  But this
discussion of music (or any aesthetic) is subjective and
should be recognized as such.

>(stepping into Allan Holdsworth's shoes, before you scoff).

Cavernous, echoing shoes.  Vast hugeness thereof.

>Is "Sugar,Sugar!" next

Oh, sugar sugar . . .  scree kronnnngg  - S.

scottst at ohsu dot edu

------------------------------

Date: 14 Jul 99 14:38:32 EDT
From: James Dusewicz <campaigner at usa dot net>
Subject: Re: FFWD

I picked up FFWD quite some time ago.  It is not unlike the
"ambient" music Brian Eno an RF do on No Pussyfooting.  I
have only played it once. In places it is downright scary
and haunting.

jim

campainger at usa dot net

James Dusewicz

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 11:44:09 PDT
From: "Jonathan Dann" <jond50 at hotmail dot com>
Subject: Michael Giles unreleased album

In ET #599, Dann Chinn mentions that he has heard that Michael Giles was
recording his first solo album.

I'm sure Dann and other ET readers will interested to learn
that Michael in fact recorded his first solo album in 1978
but as far as I am aware the album has never been
released. Does anyone know any different about this?  The UK
record label Voiceprint were set to release this album 5
years ago but for whatever reason the album didn't appear.
Here's the information about the album as listed by
Voiceprint in their 1993/4 catalogue:

Mike Giles - "Departure"

Mike Giles was the original inventive and unique
percussionist in King Crimson.  This is his first solo album
recorded in 1978 featuring the combined talents of his
brother Peter Giles, Geoff Richardson (Penguin Cafe
Orchestra, Caravan), John G. Perry (Caravan, Quantum Jump),
Ian Carr and many others.  Another in our long lost album
series, "Departure" is now issued for the very first time in
any format.

It's an obvious suggestion of course that DGM could do an
excellent job in packaging, mastering and releasing this
album should it prove feasible to do so.

Jonathan

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 16:19:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: Art Cohen <upsetter at shore dot net>
Subject: The despair

While catching up on "ET", I came across

: The rest of the band was very sorry when it occurred.
: Wetton joined Uriah Heap. ... McDonald helped found Foreigner.

Wow! They must have been pretty upset!

--Art

(Sorry, couldn't resist!)

* --------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    National Ska & Reggae Calendar
                  http://www.agitators.com/calendar/
* --------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 13:54:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Tanigawa <tanigawa at cadence dot com>
Subject: RE: Lizard

>On a different note: had the happy opportunity to sit down
>with 'Lizard' playing over the headphones, and to reconnect
>to this classic: it really does take you into an entirely
>different timeless space and environment

Haskell did a good job on the vocals, but "Lizard" was
somewhat held back by his bass playing.  In particular, the
performances by Mel and others on "Bolero - The Peacock's
Tale" while excellent, gave the impression of being severely
restrained.

I disagreed with Haskell being replaced on the "Cadence and
Cascade" remix (from "Frame By Frame").  On the other hand,
I thought Fripp made the correct decision to replace him
with Tony Levin on "Bolero".

The drummer Andy McCullough did an excellent job, especially
on the instrumental break of "Cirkus".  I have no idea what
he is doing today.  He did subsequently appear on the four
Greenslade albums.  I think he also joined Fields and one of
Arthur Brown's groups, but I don't know if there was any
recorded output.

The first two Greenslade albums "Greenslade" and "Bedside
Manners are Extra" are worth looking for.  Most of the songs
are dark and moody, with wry humor (and suitably bad
singing!) by keyboardist/vocalist Dave Lawson.
Unfortunately the last two albums show an annoying trend
toward the mechanized theme music that was later heard on
1980's adventure films.

The "Poseidon" and "Lizard" bands disintegrated before they
had a chance to tour and would not have been ready in time
for the major festivals.  But somewhere there must exist
auditions, rehearsals, and alternate versions.  These should
be considered for future DGM club releases.

Mike

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 23:21:35 +0100
From: "Cameron Devlin" <devlin at devlin-web dot demon dot co dot uk>
Subject: ALBUM REVIEW: Jamie Muir & "The Music Improvisation Company"

Well... I was shocked.

After hearing probably close to 50 different King Crimson
improvisations, I had no idea that improv can be associated
with this as well.

With King Crimson, the improv always has a noticeable
melody. It's basically composition through
performance. Everyone tries something and if it doesn't
work, they don't do it again. Everyone always listens to
each other to get into the same key. And they're always
brilliant.

With 'The Music Improvisation Company', there seems to be a
real "I'm going to play this and you have to join in with
me" feel to all the musicians, with the exception of Jamie
Muir but only because he stays in the same levels and speed
(when it gets quiet, he becomes quiet. When it gets fast, he
speeds up). Otherwise, no one is listening to each other (or
at least, don't seem to be). There's also a level of
amateurism (if that word exists) portrayed by the group that
surpasses anything I've heard before. The guitar must have
been turned up far too high as all the plucking of the
strings can be heard over anything else that happens to be
playing.

Of course, this could be seen as genius to other people, so
I'm not going to say it's rubbish: just disappointing.

If there is anyone here who managed to find the LP and liked
it, Incus Records have recently released 1968 to 1971,
probably a compilation of tracks. Get their catalogue:

Incus Records/Compatible Recording & Publishing LTD
14 Downs Road, London E5 8DS, England

Thanks,
Cameron Devlin

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 19:16:36 -0400
From: "John Ott" <johnott at earthlink dot net>
Subject: Micheal Giles activities

: "D. Chinn" <dchinn at btinternet dot com>  writes:

< quote >

Regarding queries about Michael Giles' activities...

I heard a while back that Michael Giles was recording his first (!) solo
album for DGM.

I'm not sure who's playing on it, apart from Jakko Jakszyk. For those of you
who don't know him, Jakko was formerly with 64 Spoons, David Stewart/Barbara
Gaskin, The Lodge (with John Greaves, Peter Blegvad, Anton Fier), and Level
42 (stepping into Allan Holdsworth's shoes, before you scoff). He also
recorded various solo releases on Stiff Records and Voiceprint (including
some collaborations with Steve Jansen, Richard Barbieri and Mick Karn), has
consistently swung madly between the art-rock and '80s pop scene, and is one
of the few guitarists to successfully follow the Holdsworth lead (Francis
Dunnery also used to do it pretty well). Oh, and he's Michael's
son-in-law...

It at least suggests that there'll be some high quality musicians on the
album. But with a DGM release, you could have guessed that already.

Has anyone else heard anything?

< end quote >

I had not heard about the project you mention.  Thanks
for the info.  Mike Giles does play on the new Ian McDonald Album
that is scheduled for release on July 19
You can order online at
http://www.camino.co.uk/sales/
later
John Ott
DC-ET

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1999 17:22:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ben Goldwasser <momur at yahoo dot com>
Subject: Age requirements

Hi, I was born in 1982 and I listen to King Crimson
relgiously.  Am I too young?

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 10:05:15 +0800
From: Shane Brady <cpbrady at merriweb dot com dot au>
Subject: Are We Too Serious??

T. Murphy wrote

"....is this format turning (us) into a parody of ourselves
without us even knowing it?"

  Fear not Mr. Murphy, I'm well aware of being a
self-parody. Or from another angle, if some thing grabs your
interest and imagination you're likely to ponder different
trajectories and meanings to it, that others without the
interest will find silly,a waste of time etc. If you were a
Trek fan you'd possibly still be pondering what exactly
you're friend was implying. Or from another angle

 " It's the 20th Century. Whatever you can do to have a good
time let's get on with it. As long as it does'nt involve a
murder..."  -Frank Zappa (you know, the guy who over
theorized his music and wrote a lot of unlistenable crap.)

            Shane Brady.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 02:46:49 +0000 (GMT)
From: Jim Sheridan <jimsheridan at yahoo dot com>
Subject: D & D, Trek, and KC!! But not KFC.

A recent poster began by criticizing the playing of Dungeons and
Dragons, and then worried about the "Trekkie"ish behavior of Crimso
fans -
 > While we were walking to the parking garage
 > afterwards, we had 5 or 6 fans behind us, all talking about the pros
 > and cons of Belew, Wetton etc etc. in a most serious overtone.

First of all, anyone taking ANYTHING seriously is open to parody. Heck,
there are geeky grad students all over the world arguing over the
merits of books that were written over a HUNDRED years ago!! What
dorks!! They should get lives or jobs (Yes, I am one!!)....I DO
understand that if one is not a fan of literally any thing (say
cooking), then other people having an in-depth discussion of that
(cooking) thing - debating over spices and different types of pans or
the like - might seem frivolous. Good for them. They do not have to
join in. However, your last sentence above seems a bit off-base; the
majority of posts I read here are people genuinely interested in
talking music, and specifically the fine points of KC. Do you not
believe such a thing is possible? Music can move people in a very
powerful way. I am very fascinated by it, and thoroughly relish
intelligent and in-depth analysis of it. As long as no one gets hurt by
it!! Does your Trek-fearing friend have any thing he/she takes
seriously? Perhaps they could draw an analogy there and be comforted,
or just happily believe that they are cooler than most and concerned
with more important things. It's a free world. Do the big words or
technical terms throw him/her off? They go away if you think hard about
MTV.....Jim S

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 00:05:32 -0400
From: James Hannigan <jjh210 at stern dot nyu dot edu>
Subject: one more Fracture comment

No one has mentioned (that I can recall) the quiet part
right part before the heavy guitar chords. I've heard live
versions of this (Arlington) in which the song sounds like
it's going to go over the cliff; the music is suspended in
air. The improv is quite tense and exciting.

Jim

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 09:07:59 +0100
From: aal at aws dot co dot uk
Subject: Crim n' Dead - plus little bits

Just a few thoughts before I hit my main point.

To Jesse Pellegrini, Sting's real name is Gordon Sumner.

There was an apology from a poster for his poor English
because it was a foreign language to him. Don't apologise,
your efforts are appreciated. But I do feel there is a poor
standard of grammar and spelling from many of the English
speakers who contribute, which makes may of the posts
difficult to interpret. Could we all please make more effort
to check before sending our messages (I know, I am bound to
have done something really stupid down below).

Fracture debate: Just because Fracture parallels LTiA I and
is simplistic does not mean it is bad. Fracture is also
cacophonous in places (as are LTiA II and Red) but none the
worse for that. From the current line-up I felt that VROOOM
was a variation of Red as it follows the form and the
sleeve-notes do indicate that the middle section was
originally written for Red. Again, I don't intend this as a
criticism and, since it was done on Three of a Perfect Pair,
I don't see why we shouldn't have LTiA IV on the next album.

I know the line-up squabble is a dead thread but perhaps I
can get away with this. I would like to see a line-up of
RF's choice, augmented with a new musician(s) who I've never
heard of and will roundly be criticised as the wrong
choice. And this line-up will produce the music RF
visualises in a way none of us expect and most of us will
love.

My main point regards the Grateful Dead. I am writing from
London and I suspect that many ET subscribers in the US do
not realise that the Dead are almost unheard of in this
country, as to a great degree are KC. Both have a fanatical
following but currently both have little more than cult
status, even though (from my understanding) the Dead were,
before Jerry Garcia's death, one of the biggest grossing
acts in the States - if not the biggest.  In fact I was
surprised that JG's death actually made the TV news over
here.

I would actually like to know a lot more about the Dead. I
think this would have to be private posts unless there was a
point of real public interest for ET readers. A friend, also
interested but with no knowledge of the music, told me that
one problem with the Dead is that although they have been
prolific through the years, they have never released a truly
great studio album. Every album has its weak points but some
of the songs are real classics. Thus the strength has been
in the live recordings, which omit the worst songs. Is there
any truth in this? I would like to know what are the
recordings which would truly show how good the Dead
are/were.

I'm sorry that this post is a bit long but I look forward to
receiving some informative answers from across the pond. And
are there any Deadheads in the UK.

Andrew Lehva
LONDON

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 08:44:59 -0700
From: Kevin Rowan <krowan at aibs dot org>
Subject: star trek and cheerful insanity

In ET #599, T. Murphy wrote:

> Sooo I ask, without trying to anger up anyone's
>blood.....is this format turning into a parody of ourselves
>without us even knowing it? And does that question make
>sense? And are we all a little toooo serious in our
>attempts to impress each other and /or Fripp?

Crimheads are like trekkies? While an interesting
hypothesis, I would be surprised if anyone who receives this
newsletter would agree with it. We compare lead singers like
they compare Kirk and Stewart? What about fans of Genesis?
or Chicago, or Pink Floyd after Syd Barrett left? Sure, all
those bands are a lot more well known, but I think you could
make the same comparison to those groups. I also find it odd
to compare a 30 year old progressive rock band with a 30
year old TV series (and it's spin-offs), but that's probably
just me. Just me again would say that, as a fan based group,
Trekkies are much more fanatical for their cause then
Crimheads are.  If you ever say the movie "Trekkies" I think
you'd agree.

I also have a question. There's been some talk about what
Micheal Giles is doing these days. I was wondering if he's
the one who sings on The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles,
and Fripp. I figure it must be because it's definately not
Fripp, and I don't think Peter Giles did anything but write
some songs and play bass. If it is Micheal, why don't you
think Fripp had him sing instead of Greg Lake? Obviously
Mr. Lake has the better voice, but still, just wondering.

-kr
Kevin J. Rowan
Office Manager
American Institute of
  Biological Sciences
107 Carpenter Drive
Suite 100
Sterling, VA 20164

(703) 834-0812  x100
krowan at aibs dot org

When you see beyond yourself
Then you may find peace of mind
Is waiting there...

	-George Harrison

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 12:44:05 -0400
From: Jim Bailey <jbailey at corporate dot southam dot ca>
Subject: Some comments and opinions

Hello folks,

Just thought I'd pop my head up after a long period of
lurKing , and comment on a few recent posts / threads.

> Ah, but isn't this as it should be?  You know, bands that let you
> tape?  Hey, I still bought the new CD at the show (plus a T-shirt).

One idea for bands who wish to allow taping could be a
requirement that those wishing to do so purchase some form
of legitimate product (i.e. a tape, disc, t-shirt,
etc.). While I'm sure that most do, as Mark has admitted,
I'm equally sure that there is a percentage of freeloaders,
however small that number may be. Such a "premium" might,
one hopes, at least provide some income for the performers
from that faction.

> Having Jon Anderson with his fairy voice singing the Lizard song was a
> mistake.  I think the whole song would have sounded better with a more
> tenor like voice.

I would disagree with this opinion. Anderson's voice goes
very well with the somewhat idyllic nature of the lyrics. I
tried to imagine it sung by John Wetton, and thought that it
would be akin to seeing Swan Lake performed in hobnail
boots.

>While reading the comments of J A Sontag regarding the
>Philadelphia Crimson shows of the 80's I started to think
>of what made the Beat show so special.  IMHO it was the
>opening band, none other than Jon Anderson of Yes.

Gee, perhaps KC should've brought him back for their
encore. They could've done "the Lizard song." ;-) (Prince
Rupert Awakes, for those who may not know the album too
well)

>The process of stretching the song to unrecognisable shape is the
> attraction.

It might also be thought of as a "theme and variations," an oft-used
form in classical music.

I now bid you adieu, and close my shell until the next
time. My best wishes to one and all.

Jim Bailey

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 15:33:53 -0400
From: Gary Davis <artshop at artist-shop dot com>
Subject: Adrian Belew and Mike Keneally

Hi, folks:

Here's a note I got from a friend of mine at Taylor guitars
that I thought would be of interest to some of you.

Gary

>Return-Path: <DAGOAIM at aol dot com>
>From: DAGOAIM at aol dot com
>Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 03:36:34 EDT
>Subject: Adrian Belew and Mike Keneally
>To: artshop at artist-shop dot com
>
>Hey Gary----Speaking of Adrian Belew, King Crimson, and Mike Keneally, I
>thought your readers/customers might like to know that the Summer '99 issue
>of Taylor Guitars' quarterly publication, "Wood&Steel," features Part 1 of
>Keneally interviewing Belew. Lotsa "inside-type" questions about Belew's
>songwriting, work with Crimson, his new CD, his "thing" for the sound of
>trains in the distance, etc. etc. A must for Belew-heads and Keneally-maniacs
>alike. Registered owners of Taylor guitars get the newsletter for free, but
>we send quantities of them to our dealers for non-owners to pick-up for free.
>The Summer issue should be at all authorized Taylor dealers in about 10 days.
>Anyone wanting to know where the nearest Taylor dealer is should visit our
>website (www.taylorguitars.com) and click on "Dealers". Part 2 of the
>interview will run in the Fall issue, due in early October. It's a pip, and
>I'm sure all will enjoy the entire two-parter. That's all for now. Hope
>you're doing well.
>Sincerely,
>John D'Agostino
>Director of Public Relations
>W&S editor, Taylor Guitars
>
>
**************************************************************
                          Gary Davis
The Artist Shop                              The Other Road
http://www.artist-shop.com          artshop at artist-shop dot com
phone: 330-929-2056			   fax:330-945-4923
              SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!!
**************************************************************
       Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at
            http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm

------------------------------

Date: 15 Jul 99 13:59:40 -0700
From: "David Voci" <david_voci at tcibr dot com>
Subject: JON ANDERSON ONLY HERE/TOPICS IN GENERAL

Hello Friends,

In 599, Ms. Pellegrini wrote about Lizard:

>.  Having Jon Anderson with his
>fairy voice singing the Lizard song was a mistake.  I >think the whole song
>would have sounded better with a more tenor like voice.  >I thought Gordon
>Haskell was Sting because Sting's real name was Gordon.

With all due respect, I would like to put forth that in my
life of music listening, I never cared much for
Yes,Genesis,ELP etc...

The reason I say this is to set up this comment and that is
that I think Jon Anderson's voice here is perfect and that
if fits beautifully with the overall theme of Lizard/Side
2. The Lizard LP on the whole, in my opinion, is a concept
piece so the deviation from the other vocalist on this track
sits pretty good with me. Jon's vocal timbre seems to fit
perfectly with the quasi medieval/old world theme of this
disc/song/concept.  To me, the song 'Lizard' is a
culmination of all the things that Crimson has been building
up to since releasing their 1st LP and probably the end of
what I consider their first style.  Corresponding to another
point made in 599 about taste/opinion:

Like fingerprints, there are no two people who will ever
agree on everything musically...Fracture is a prime example
of this...I personally never liked much the version that was
on Starless and BB/Nightwatch but after further listens to
the versions on Great Deceiver, this song has slow, evolving
appeal...very moody/almost ambiental and the kind of song
that took awhile to really appreciate.

The news about P4 is exhilarating, especially seeing that
this will start shipping on Aug 16 from DGM in LA.

A point I find curious on Fripp/Eno's 'No
Pussyfooting'(another great synthetic/electronic gem long
overlooked but now owned)and subsequent Soundscape releases
is the technique of using one or two A77 Revox tape machines
for delay and other sound modification. I am a huge Klaus
Schulze fan and on many of his 'Golden Age' analogue/space
recordings, this tecnique was utilized heavily(I think he
used only one). I can't remember if he takes credit for this
idea or if Eno started this...maybe someone even before Eno?

Quite frankly, if I were to hear any of the Soundscapes w/o
knowing who it was I would of never guessed Fripp...very
synthetic and in the floating/electronic/ genre.

Nice Eulogy on 'Blessing of Tears' in memoriam of Mrs
Fripp. Albeit late, Rest In Peace.

Why was Soundscapes 1999 Live in Argentina re-released with
a different cover and extra song? I have the 94 release.  In
closing I'd like to paraphrase Paul Stump from his book 'The
Music's All That Matters', copyright 1997:

>>"If progressive rock as a discrete genre can be said<<
>>>to have had a starting point, IN THE COURT OF THE<<
>>>CRIMSON KING is probably it."<<<

Have a good one,

dv

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 17:57:59 EDT
From: Nanajest at aol dot com
Subject: Re:technique vs. inspiration

Perhaps if anything,the problem isn't a surplus of
discipline, but in fact not enough of another kind;the
discipline to remain concise.This is available to virtuoso &
novice alike;despite aspirations to the romantic,inherent
authority of "the Noble Savage".

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 18:09:33 -0500 (CDT)
From: w7wilsonet15 at webtv dot net (R. Wilson)
Subject: Fracture (The Song, & Incredible piece of Artwork! )

Hello, Fellow E.T. readers,as a Dedicated King Crimson fan,
and Lover of truly unique musical artwork,let us lay this
"Fracture" controversy (If that indeed is what it is) to
REST!  I Respect All of Your Opinions, first off. "Fracture"
as it is, the last cut on "Starless and Bible Black" is
without a doubt, an incredible piece of music! If you're a
musician, try and play it sometime. It certainly isn't a
whizz.Should it be orchestrated, YES, I for one would love
to hear some other Crimson cuts orchestrated! And, finally,
if Robert Fripp, Bill Bruford,John Wetton, and,David Cross
thought it worthy of making the Disc,well,Say No More...I
Love all eleven minutes & fourteen seconds of it.Thanks.

Krimsonite  Eternal,  Ric Wilson.

http://community.webtv.net/w7wilsonet15//
Ric Wilson/

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 23:04:29 EDT
From: CohenMark at aol dot com
Subject: Taping - what's cool...what's not cool!

I have been having some fun with my recent posts regarding
Crimso Heads whom are Deadheads, where I discussed the fact
it's all us Deadheads whom have been recording King Crimson
all these years.  My last post, I mentioned that I taped
Ozric Tentacles.

First of all, I can't tell you how many people e-mailed me
wanting to trade tapes.  Many people e-mailed me their tape
lists.  God, there is a lot of people whom read ET whom
collect and trade tapes of King Crimson and Robert Fripp as
well as The Dead, Phish, Zappa, Ozric's, Yes, Floyd,
Genesis, Tuna and much esoteric progressive stuff that I
still have to check out.  I don't do very much trading in
the last few years.  I wish, I had more time to trade tapes!
I rarely record live in the field anymore as I'm so busy.  I
know so many people who do, I can get pretty much anything I
want anyway.

For the last several years, I've been focusing on my
legitimately released CD collection.  Collecting Legit CD's
involves no work on my part!  No setting levels, baby
sitting tape recorders, labeling tapes, cataloging.  God, I
did a lot of that in my day.  One day hopefully not to
distant, I hope to get back to collecting and trading tapes.
But when I do, it's gonna be on CD-R.  Right now I'm looking
into the best way to accomplish that.  I want to archive my
reels and master cassettes on CD-R for long term
preservation.

I was troubled by one thing however.  One individual out of
many whom e-mailed me his tape list (I will not mention his
name), had a collection that consisted entirely of
commercially mass produced bootleg CD's.

He and I are kind of approaching this from a little bit
different perspective.  I collect live concerts!  I have NO
commercially released bootleg CD's!  I am not passing
judgment on this individual for having them, but I myself
personally do not support the selling (or buying) of illegal
recordings.  This is strictly a moral thing.

I vigorously defend the right of tapers to record shows.
Therefore, I believe that this music must be traded freely.
When somebody gets a hold of some tape, puts some bogus
title on it and mass produces it out of Italy where they do
not enforce bootlegging laws, and then distributes it for
profit, and it shows up in the record stores in Greenwich
Village, I have a problem with that.  I go to all those
stores, I see all those bootleg CD's, but I never buy them.
The only person whom has a right to profiteer from the music
is the artist!  We fans should not support anyone whom sells
that music.  But we have a right to trade it between
ourselves for free until such a time as the artists chooses
to release that particular performance, then if we are such
good fans we should buy it!  Don't you think!

That's why someone like Robert is so paranoid about people
recording shows.  What he does not realize is that this
activity accounts for a tiny segment of the overall picture
of the taper scene.  99.9% of which is traded back and forth
with no money trading hands.  99.9% never ends up on a
commercially mass produced bootleg CD's.  It's this tiny for
profit segment that gives us tapers a bad name.  As someone
whom records in the field and defends my moral right to do
so as a preserver of musical history, I am very sensitive to
this.

I am not scolding this person!  But you have to understand
that, the people whom have become my friends over the years
are many, many tapers within Grateful Dead circles (whom I
used to tape with at countless GD concerts all over the
United States) whom have recorded a zillion concerts of
countless artists including King Crimson and Robert Fripp.
These people use only the state of the art field recording
gear.  There is more music out there to collect than there
are lifetimes to gather it all up.  I've seen a great many
vast, vast mind boggling collections of live music.  It's
absolutely endless!

My point is that, It is more fun trading music, recording
concerts live if your inclined to do so, making tapes and
making friends of the people you trade with.  That is what
it is all about.  How do we expect to convince Robert Fripp
that his position needs re-consideration and the many bands
today such as Ozric Tentacles whom let you tape are much
wiser if we then go BUY black market CD's?

All this music is out there and very available AND FREE.  It is not necessary
to buy it and support the commercially released bootleg CD money making
rackets.

Having said all that, I've really enjoyed corresponding with
all of the ET readers whom have e-mailed me.  I've met a lot
of really cool people on-line.  I myself have only been
on-line for about a year although I've been into computers
for many years.  I've been a hard-core Crimso/Fripp fan
since the late seventies.  In the future, I want to share
with ET'ers my stories about recording Crimso/Fripp years
and years ago?  I have some fun stories to tell which I
think most ET'ers would get off on.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Jul 1999 08:58:06 -0400
From: Scott McMahan <scott at softbase dot com>
Subject: Thela Hun Gingeet

Two questions about Thela Hun Gingeet:

a) Has the entire recording made at the time Belew was
telling his experience ever been released, or a transcript
thereof?

b) What is the first line in the chorus, that sounds like
"watery main"? I've never been able to figure it out, or to
find lyrics with the chorus.

Scott

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Jul 1999 17:02:16 -0400
From: s craig stamm <sstamm at wvu dot edu>
Subject: Lurkers come out to play, Fracture, No Chrim '99?

Hello once again fellow Crimheads,

Lurking, lurking, lurking.  Perhaps that is the point that
Eb was trying to make.  It seems to me that Eb was trying to
get some of the more interesting posters out of lurk mode in
order to get (to Eb's liking) posts that are more
challenging.  However, it should be noted that one person's
"waste water" is another person's "soup".  Anyway, we'll
miss Ebs caustic wit that tends to "right" a sometimes
listing "boat" of responses, but there will probably be
another poster to take on the Eb role.  Even if Eb has
unsubscribed (is it true Toby?), I'll bet even money that
he/she is reading us on the net....  Patience here is the
key.  Not all of life or ET is wonderful, so you have to
sometimes give ET time--sort through what you like and don't
like, and I'm sure if you are a true Crim fan you will be
enlightened!  Long live ET and wow, #600 looms!  A big
thanks once again to Toby, Dan, Mike, Steve, and all that
are involved in creating the best place on the web for KC
fans!!!!

Fracture topic.  Well, this started as a somewhat critical
note, and was followed by a couple of shotgun barrels of
emotion, and as the dust began to settle finally the
excellent post (IMHO) by Greg Karl appeared in ET #599.  I
have always loved Fracture, and rather than "Starless and
Bible Black" (the title cut) this piece seems to sum up the
album well.  Fracture is a wound, and this night wounds time
(and space).

Disappointment.  The DGM e-mail post shows that the lock
will not fully open.  More ProjeKcts and no Crim.  The DGM
newsletter lists the projeKcts under King Crimson and
discusses the fall sabbatical and archives, but no "real"
Crim for 99?!  How much longer until the muse appears?!!
Are the marketability of the projeKcts themselves (the
clamor for box sets) going to hold back the emergence of the
King!  I'm beginning to wonder, oh self proclaimed marketing
weasel.  Now that the Seal tour may end soon, perhaps Tony
can save the day!!

Mood swings.  Ok, I'm in a sh*tty mood.  I probably should
retract this post--I have little to really say, but still
the SEND button calls.  Oh, what the heck....

Don't judge me too harshly by this mess,
Craig

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jul 1999 16:17:21 -0500
From: NAUDETE dot MANTOVANI at monsanto dot com
Subject: Technique vs. Inspiration

     Hi all.

     I do like Yes, Genesis, KC, Gentle Giant, Zappa, Ozric
     as well as Deep Purple, Black Sabbath and even
     Metallica. Like as well hundreds of other different
     groups and singers which play not only rock or prog
     rock.

     Liking music is for sure being open minded without
     analysing too much if it has technique or not. Living
     in a country like Brasil gives me the opportunity to
     listen to nearly everything from Prog Rock, New Age,
     Pop Music, lots of different brasilian music, etc...I
     use to listen to KC and related stuff something like
     half of the time i spend listening to music. I am a CC
     member and so on.

     I learnt how to like music just listening to it and
     feeling it. I do like some crap just because it reminds
     me of something good i felt in the past. After spending
     25 years listening to rock music i recently changed my
     mind about the Moody Blues and started to buy their
     CDs.

     Music is technique, feeling, inspiration,
     heart... Cannot be analysed being focused in only one
     subject.

     Ronald Miklos Vogel

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jul 1999 16:04:49 -0500
From: NAUDETE dot MANTOVANI at monsanto dot com
Subject: Fracture again...

     Hi all

     Fripp wrote in one of his soundscapes CDs that how an
     audient feels the music may vary everytime he listens
     to it, just because it is another day or the guy's mood
     has changed a little bit from one hour to the
     other. Soundscapes are just like that. It can be also
     applied to Fracture and all other KC / FRipp
     work. Listening to music and liking it or not is a
     private feeling that everybody has.

     Analysing Fracture with a musician's eyes is something
     totally different. If someone wants to go further on
     technical analysis, do so. But please, do not mix it
     with liking the song or not. If you do not like it,
     just say "i do not like it", but spare us of technical
     stuff. IMHO as a non musician i find the song simply
     amazing and that is enough for me.

     Ronald Mikos Vogel

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 09:34:52 -0500
From: Sean Redefer <seanr at frognet dot net>
Subject: Cirkus...the band

Listen:

    I have recently acquired a BMI sampler cd called Planet
Stereo: best of 97/98.  I was surprised to find a track on
the cd by a band called Cirkus.  Does anyone have any info
about this band and if they have any connection to KC?

thank you,
sean

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 08:00:35 PDT
From: "Alfred Dodson" <adodson19 at hotmail dot com>
Subject: out of print CD's

Greeetings,

If interested i have some Adrian belew, king crimson, the
bears, etc. CD's that are currently out of print that are
available. e-mail with what your looking for.

adodson19 at hotmail dot com
bye

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 15:34:20 -0400
From: Erik DePoy <depoy at ix dot netcom dot com>
Subject: Crimso/Dead ET conection and Russian USA CD

I initially met up with Bert Hickson, former ET subscriber
and fellow Deadhead/Crimhead, on a Grateful Dead BBS out of
Darien, CT. Not only did we become email pals, we
subsequently met up for two Crimson shows on Broadway in
November 1995. We then attended the New York Epitaph
playback in March 1996, and in December 1997 we saw both
Soundscapes performances at the Bottom Line in NYC. As Mark
Cohen pointed out recently, the Crimso-Dead connection among
ET subscribers seems to be strong indeed.

	Secondly, when I was in Moscow in May I bought a
copy of USA on CD. As you can imagine, I was quite surprised
and excited to see it on sale, even moreso because I somehow
misplaced my LP copy of USA. More interestingly, it seems to
have been taken from the source tape (or perhaps a copy of
the USA cassette- was one ever released?). It was not copied
from the LP because there are no pops, cracks, or hisses. It
may have even been copied from a Japanese CD. Again, does
anyone know if one was ever released in Japan?

	As a side note, someone in Finland is selling this
Russian USA CD on Ebay. Last bid I saw was $20.50, and the
CD cost 40 rubles in Moscow (about $1.75). Tidy little
profit, eh?

	Erik DePoy
	New York City

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 16:43:05 -0400 (CLT)
From: "Miguel Farah F." <miguel at antonia dot webhost dot cl>
Subject: KC re-remasters: should I wait or not?

I'm pretty new to King Crimson, and I'm currently in the
buying frenzy that's natural for a new fan. After getting
ITCOTCK, Sleepless, Cirkus, The Nightwatch and Absent Lovers
(thank you CD Now for your discount coupons), plus VROOOM
and THRAK, I felt it was time to begin buying the oldest
studio albums (ITWOP upto TOAPP)...

                                           then comes
dgm-news #1 tellling us that RF and DS are re-remastering
those albums. I already bought LTIA, Red and Discipline, and
now I don't know wether it would be wiser to simply buy the
last six albums I don't have (Beat, ITWOP, Lizard, Islands,
SABB, TOAPP) right away. The older editions ("definitive
remasters" by E.G.) are pretty cheap (11.47 bucks at CD
Universe) and are available now - the re-remasters may or
may not be better, and we don't really know *when* they'll
be available (and wether they'll be modified by RF).

I'm still bitter at what happened to me when I bought my
Genesis albums in 1994 - bought them all, and TWO months
later, the remasters appeared... you can guess I don't want
to repeat that fiasco.

I am a patient guy, so I can wait *if* we can be assured
that the remasters will be worth the delay.

So, I'd like you older fans -based on your previous
experience in waiting, quality improvements and all that- to
tell me wether I should exercise my patience (and in the
meantime focus my money on the boxed sets, which I also
want) or simply buy the E.G. editions.

Thank you.

--
MIGUEL FARAH              //   miguel at webhost dot cl
#include <disclaimer.h>   //   http://www.webhost.cl/~miguel
<*>
"Trust me - I know what I'm doing."
- Sledge Hammer

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 18:09:41 -0400
From: "derek vanek" <derekrachel dot vanek at worldnet dot att dot net>
Subject: kc sheet music

i am looking for the sheet music for "I talk to the Wind" an
old KC peice I just love.  I am a flutist and want to play
the flute part.  Any info on where sheet music can be
located will be appreciated!! My email is np4micu at att dot net.
thanks, rachel vanek

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 21:06:30 EDT
From: Belewp at cs dot com
Subject: Money Making...Disco Faking

  I got into Krimson about 2 years ago and have listened to
every albumn,and one of the things I like best about Krimson
is the fact that they've changed so much from formation to
formation and yet retain a familiar vibe. Changing has also
allowed them to cover a lot more ground then if they would
have stuck with one group of people. I view Krimson as a
multy faceted vision shared by whoever is fortunate enough
to plug into it. My point is that change is part of Krimsons
life blood and whoever admires the band should expect and
even embrace it.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 08:58:11 -0400
From: Gary Weimer <gweimer at one dot mail dot net>
Subject: Commercial - bad!, Obscure - Good?

I have a hard time with a continuing thought in this group.  Why do
people want to criticize KC for any sort of commercial success?

> How often must we be subjected to "Heartbeat"?
> This Top 40 hit would be better performed by "Foreigner"

It's as if a "hit" were a kiss of death.  I've always felt
that part of what made KC who, and what, they are is the
ability to work on every level.  They go from subtle to
complex, from intricate to simple.  Is "Easy Money" really
all that different "Heartbeat"?  They both have a fairly
simple structure, and an appealing sense of rhythm.  Yet one
is considered a classic, the other an embarassment?  I don't
think so.  You can't manufacture a hit, only promote one.
The fact that a song hits the mainstream is due, primarily,
to the fact that LOTS of people like it.  "Heartbeat" is one
of my favorite KC songs because of it's simplicity, and I'm
one of those who favors the 73-74 line-up overall.

Sometimes I think the fanatical legions of KC fans
borderline on becoming the worst enemies of the band - too
much nitpicking.

And, by the way, a couple friends of mine once did a calypso
version of "Sugar, Sugar" that wasn't all that bad!

------------------------------

End of Elephant-Talk Digest #600
********************************