Errors-To: et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk Reply-To: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Elephant Talk Digest #376 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 376 Tuesday, 20 May 1997 Today's Topics: Meeting with King Crimson RE: Tatooed Punk congratulations & question New Toyah CD / Sylvian tour progs available trey gunn/california guitar trio What's good about King Crimson Re: Epitaph shipping delayed Untitled Forgotten Krimson Instrumental KC w/ AB Videos Fw: Epitaph in Q Pete Sinfield's headache Six of One... Bruford/Towner Updates Re: G3 Tour Info Lizard/Islands Re: Elephant Talk Digest #374 Trey Gunn Band/California Guitar Trio in Baltimore 6/3/97 Crimzeal v. Aerosmithism? PETE SINFIELD Epitaph & Bryan Ferry... Fripp the Miles of rock Guitar? Well..... Schizoid Noise, Devices, etc. ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk, or use the DIY list machine at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/list/ to ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: et-help at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk ETWEB: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ (partial mirror at http://members.aol.com/etmirror/) You can read the most recent seven editions of ET at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig-bin/newslet.pl THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmeister) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest 3.0 package. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- From: Toby Howard (ET Moderator) Subject: ET problems Hi all. My apologies, but due to some system things at ET Towers beyond my control, a lot of ET posts got squirrelled away in a queue somewhere. Consequently there's a backlog of material to post, which I'm getting through now. In order to keep each digest < 50K there'll be a few ETs coming out in rapid succession. Could I make a plea: could people please hold off on posting stuff to ET for a while, until the backlog is dealt with? I'll put a note in the appropriate edition to say when things are clear again. Thanks for your cooperation Toby ------------------ Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 20:41:56 -0400 From: Barry Gordon Subject: Meeting with King Crimson Hope all is well. My family were up to New York from North Carolina for a vacation last week. Once in town ,I checked the paper to see what was going on around town . It floored me to see that the original members of King Crimson were to be in town at HMV records for a listening party and autograph session. On the next day ,We arrived an hour early to find several hundred people already in line. Fripp,McDonald, Giles, and Lake were introduced to a rousing ovation of around 700 people. The band set down in front of microphones in a press conference type setting. Each member spoke about their wonderful experiences being a part of this band. Greg Lake said "20th century schi man" was recorded in one take , and the album was recorded in one week. Robert Fripp corected him by saying it was 8 days which brought a roar of laughter. Fripp mentioned that he waited for the right time to release this live material which took over 20 years to decide. My 14 year old son and myself talked with all of them . My son mentioned to R. Fripp that he has an exact copy of his black Les Paul. Robert asked him if he can play ? He replied that he did .Also, my son also asked him if there is music available . R. Fripp mentioned that there is none , and there never will be, but you may find in Japan a book of their first album. Giles, Lake, and McDonald were very nice; especially Ian McDonald. Ian told me he is working on a solo project. We recieved autographs on our copy of the new album, and an old copy of "In The Court. R. Fripp did say that he would play with these blokes if they would want to. Also, the new K.Crimson is going into the studio in a few weeks to start recording. Best wishes, Barry Gordon ------------------------------ From: "Del Engen (Exchange)" Subject: RE: Tatooed Punk Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 18:58:19 -0700 My longtime friend Elizabeth Davis from the punk band 7 Year Bitch has had the Discipline design tatooed on her shoulder since about 1990, and is a big Krimson fan. --Del ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 May 1997 09:33:22 -0500 From: Matthew Walburn Subject: congratulations & question congratulations for this web site; i strogly believe is one of the most complete on the net.. keep up the good work... I'm graduating from berklee right now , I'm a drummer and I read recently that Bill Bruford released a three CD's rom audio files with samples and more related to his playing . the problem is they didn't (modern drummer) say how could you get this cd box set ... maybe you can help me please respond to: jrduque at pop dot estudent dot berklee dot edu thank you very much and god save the king..... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 1997 10:00:34 -0400 (EDT) From: skantere Subject: New Toyah CD / Sylvian tour progs available Friends, Did anyone else notice the new Toyah CD called "Phoenix"? It appeared late April - early May in some US online music stores (cdnow, cdconnection etc.) It's released on Receiver label. Is it yet another compilation or what? Does it feature Bobby Wilcox? Toyah's web sites, both Tellurian and Ieya, don't mention it at all. By the way, CDNOW has the long-discontinued Ophelia's Shadow on CD, It's an import, but modestly priced at 14.99. Expect a long wait. I waited for mine for more than a month, but it's well worth it. I seem to recall Possible Productions mentioning that there's uncredited Fripp playing on it (he's credited for composition). Does anyone know if it's true? I'm still totally unfamiliar with earlier Toyah's work. There seem to be at least two Best-ofs currently in circulation, one on Connoisseur label and other on Nectar Masters. Half of the tracks differ. Is there any hard-core Toyah fan on this list who could suggest which is better in terms of track selection, sound quality? Another recent arrival to CDNOW: Sylvian/Fripp "The Road to Graceland" tour program! (also Sylvian's "In Praise Of Shamans"). I wonder if someone important at CDNOW is our fellow ETer. Hey, good fellow, why don't you put a note on the list when you manage to acquire something hard-to-find of our common interest! Best to all, Sergei Kantere Moscow, Russia ------------------------------ From: "Mike Stack" Date: Tue, 6 May 1997 12:01:51 +0000 Subject: trey gunn/california guitar trio Hi there. I'm back again. Anyway, I heard from TGunn just recently, and he sent me these dates for his minitour in the Northeast US. jun2, birchmere, wash dc jun3, somewhere in baltimore jun4, philly, tin angel (2 shows) jun5, nyc, probably the bottom line jun6, boston, paradise I know that CGT is with him at the Paradise, at least according to it's homepage. Anyway, figured some of you would be interested. "i like the downtown druggy kids who spraypaint walls and trains, i like their lack of training, their primitive technique. i think sometimes it hurts you when you stay too long in school. i think sometimes it hurts you when you're afraid to be called a fool." -lou reed/john cale ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 May 97 11:30:54 -0700 From: Christopher Jepson Subject: What's good about King Crimson In the last issue, someone suggested that people write about the reasons they like KC. I think this is an excellent idea... In order to really do justice to the topic I would probably have to spend too long thinking about it and write too much, so I'll just put down some first thoughts. (I should probably point out that I like the 1969-74 KC best.) 1. Emotional range. I like that fact that KC music so often (and so effectively) seeks to convey the sonic equivalent of the Elysian fields and the lower circles of Hell. 2. Intensity. This is obviously related to point 1. It seems to come mainly in two varieties -- heart-piercing beauty (which generally seems tinged with sorrow) and ear-bleeding kerrang. 3. Strangeness. I have always felt alienated from mass-market culture, so I like to hear quirky and idiosyncratic approaches to music that involve challenges, surprises, and individualism. Beyond this, I also happen to have a taste for music that is outright weird and bizarre (but still emotionally intelligible). This is why I like Lizard so much. (I may be one of the few people who really likes Gordon Haskell's vocals -- I think they fit the music perfectly.) 4. Complexity. KC music has an intricacy that rewards repeated listenings. A better word for this quality might be "intelligence" because complexity for its own sake can be pedantic. Now, to go off on a tangent -- Does anyone else like Strawbs as much as I do? I have always thought that there is some similarity between them and KC, which is weird, because most of their music certainly does not sound much like KC at all (although anyone who likes ITCOTCK should listen to "Down By the Sea" from _Bursting at the Seams_). I think the connection is related to point 1 above: Strawbs music often seems to evoke the celestial and infernal (although oriented more towards the former, and less towards the latter, than KC). Perhaps Strawbs is to folk as KC is to classical/jazz. It would have been interesting if David Cousins had wound up as vocalist/lyricist for KC sometime around 1972... Bye, Chris Jepson ------------------------------ Date: 06 May 1997 07:11:20 -0400 From: Andrew Krein Subject: Re: Epitaph shipping delayed From: PossProd at aol dot com To: wx12ak Subject: Re: No Subject We currently have a manufacturing delay holding up Epitaph. It came out only in New York state so far ( for the CD launch attended by the band). We hope for our stock today or Monday. November Suite is being shipped from Europe, so again we are waiting for stock to arrive. Sorry for the delay I received the above message from Possible Productions after inquiring at to the status of Epitaph and November Suite. I guess you had to make the trek to New York if you wanted it in a timely fashion, or pay the ridiculous import prices. Why are these things always available in Japan or Europe long before they are available in the U.S., if they are ever available here. Examples: Live in Japan 1984 and 1995 laserdiscs, Yes' Keys to Ascension video, Steve Hackett - Genesis Revisited and many other releases from the Crimson, Yes, etc. family tree. Andy Krein --PART.BOUNDARY.noaardc.4e52.336f124d.0001-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 1997 20:04:50 -0400 From: bcormier at global2000 dot net (Bill Cormier/Carol Henry) Subject: Untitled Forgotten Krimson Instrumental Dear Robert and fellow E.T.ers, Perhaps one or many of you can help me. In The E.T. 363, Questions for Tony Levin issue, I posed the following Question to him: Question 2). During the 1982 Crimson tour the band played an unamed instrumental to open some shows , two I know of were The LANDMARK Theatre in Syracuse, N.Y., and at Stoneybrook College ,N.Y.. It began with wonderful mid-tempo swirling guitars from Robert and Adrian and you playing a beautiful melody line over them. This continued for a time until the band came to a full stop, suddenly Robert tore into a rapid ,staccato assault with the band quickly joining him. This part of the piece reminded me of a wild ride on an out of control rollercoaster, until it came to a manic ending among jubulant cheers from the audience. I assumed this tune would end up on the follow-up to BEAT, but was surprised to find it missing from THREE OF A PERFECT PAIR. My question is what was this great tune? did it have a name? what became of it? . Are there any other Crimson songs written during your tenure in the band that were performed live but never recorded/released ? ( good candidates for a Crimson rarities collection maybe!) His Reply being; "This question stumps me. Maybe we made the peice up as we went? There have been many ideas and pieces dropped along the Crimson path to finished recordings. Some of them very good." I was surprised to hear this from Tony since I have heard two recordings of this piece from seperate shows,in both cases the arrangement is identical, so it is doubtful it was free improv. Judging from what I have gleened from the dates this piece was played on:2-25-82, landmark Theater,Syracuse,NY & 2-28-82,Stoneybrook L.I., it appears that this tune may have only been performed on this very brief eleven day tour,and was forgotten by the time the band hit the road again the following July,since it never pops up again( as far as I know.) Does anyone in the E.T. Family know what this great tune was and what became of it? Thanks for putting up with my incredible geekiness on this, but hey,thats part of what E.T. is all about! -- ( Too much time on his hands) Bill Cormier PS.Any votes on a "Best of Savoy `81" release? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 May 1997 21:35:16 -0500 From: Rob Murphree Subject: KC w/ AB Videos Hi ETers, I'm trying to put together a list of commercially released King Crimson Videos with Adrian Belew as a member. I'm aware of "The Noise" and both "Live in Japans" (both 80's & 90's). Are there any more? Any information as well as release dates would be appreciated. Thanks -Rob Rob Murphree's Adrian Belew WWW Site rhino at dbtech dot net ------------------------------ From: Ed Mayall To: et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Epitaph in Q Date: 08 May 1997 12:53 You'll need to be quick: a review of Epitaph is on the QWeb site at: http://www.erack.com/Qweb/_reviews/_ALBUMREVS/_REREL/rerel2.htm#eight Worth investigation. There's an equally favorable review in May's Mojo. Ed ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 May 1997 22:47:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Dixie Gene Ross Subject: Pete Sinfield's headache Greetings, Will reading, in ET, of Pete Sinfield missing the listening in New York due to illness I remembered a poem I read that he wrote in a paper back book entitled "Under the Sky - A Collection of Lyrics & Poems" : headache if you're stumbling about with your head on a stick if you bite at the world when you just need to lick if your overglazed ears are about to implode from the grating of gears for the next episode. if the trumpeting mouths and the fingernail screams of this tubular screams of this tubular world squeeze your cheeks till it seems that you can't feel the sides of your life through the glare while the taste of your days is too acid to bear. . . . . . Alka-Seltzer doesn't help much. Pete Sinfield Here's to you Pete. I hope you feel better, Dick Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 May 1997 20:40:15 +0200 (MET DST) From: petter ekre Subject: Epitaph playback in USA? Dear Elephant Talk and fellow Crimheads from around the world. In the May issue of Record Collector there's a huge article about KC, mentioning the Epitaph Playback in London. The article says that the crimsons enjoyed the evening so much that they're seriously discussing to repeat the occasion in the states. I live in Norway, and unfortunately I couldn't attend the playback in London. But since I'm going to the states this summer I'm desperate for information about any crimson happening that might take place. If YOU know anything, please mail me at At last: Am I the youngest(21 y.) crimhead attending Elephant Talk? Am I the only norwegian attending Elephant Talk? Is the 4 volume Epitaph box different from the 2 volume(design etc.)? Yours sincerely, Hans Magne Ekre ------------------------------ From: "Heilbronner, Michael" Subject: Bruford/Towner Date: Sat, 10 May 1997 15:40:00 -0400 I read somewhere that Bruford and Ralph Towner recently released an album (perhaps it's under Towner's name only??). I haven't seen or heard it, and am wondering whether I heard a rumor or just live near lame music stores. If you know anything about this project and can provide any input regarding (i) the content and quality; and/or (ii) it's availability, I'd appreciate your emailing me. Thank you. Mike Heilbronner ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 May 1997 22:33:16 -0400 From: Gary Davis Subject: Updates Hello Friends: We have a new label to greet in The Artist Shop. It's an independent label out of London called Red Hot Records . Red Hot features some incredible music by David Cross. Does that name ring a bell? It should. David Cross is a violinist and was part of a phenomenal King Crimson line up that also featured Robert Fripp, Bill Bruford, John Wetton and Jamie Muir. David has his own band now and is putting out some ferocious progressive music. Red Hot also features one of my favorite bands from the 70's, Jade Warrior. Their latest album, Distant Echoes, is one of their all time best and one that I've played over and over. Red Hot also has a new progressive band called Relativity. Their lead guitarist/vocalist sometimes makes me think of Freddy Mercury. And then there's the Peter Hammill/Guy Evans album, Spur of the Moment. This is a wonderful album of instrumental improvisation and was the first collaboration between the two since their Van der Graaf Generator days. Speaking of Peter Hammill and Van der Graaf Generator, towards the end of this month Fie! Records will be putting out a re-release of Van der Graaf Generator's first album, Aerosol Grey Machine. The Artist Shop is taking advance orders on this now. We are also taking advance orders on the next Asia official bootleg, Live in Koln, which is due out at the beginning of June. You'll find it at . There you'll also find the official bootlegs released just last month, Now - Live in Nottingham and Live in Osaka. Browse on over to our New Artist page where we'd like to introduce someone new to you. His name is Paul Adams. This multi-instrumentalist takes the concept of independent music to a new level as he not only composes, perform and produces his music and releases it on his own label, but he also makes his own instruments. On the New Artist page you'll find his two albums, In the Land Where I Come From and Wonder Dancing on Global Bop, both well worth your attention. If you've visited the New Artist page before, you'll recognize acoustic guitarist Richard Johnson. Richard has a new website that you'll want to check out at . From his home page be sure to follow the link to his 'gigs' page. Richard is a clinician for Taylor Guitars and has a whole slew of clinics coming up in May and June all throughout the midwest and the south. These clinics are usually half clinics/half concerts so you'll enjoy it whether or not you play guitar. Besides, these clinics are usually free, so how can you resist a free concert by a great musician. The Artist Shop has recently struck up an arrangement with Expos=E8, a quarterly progressive rock magazine. Anyone even remotely interested in the music found in The Artist Shop will love Expos=E8. And now you can= subscribe to it directly through The Artist Shop. Just check it out at . You'll find information there plus a link to Expos=E8's own website where you can check this periodical out further. It's an excellent way to find out about new music. So how are things in your town? Gary ************************************************************** Gary Davis The Artist Shop The Other Road http://www.artist-shop.com OtherRoad at aol dot com SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!! ************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 May 1997 22:02:35 -0400 From: goedhart at citenet dot net (Bernie Goedhart) Subject: Re: G3 Tour Info >For those with no Web Access here are the G3 tour dates from the Satrani Site: > >June 1997 >Date Day Venue City/State >18 Wed Blockbuster Sony Center Camden NJ [SNIP] You can add one more to the list: Montreal, Mon. June 16, Molson Centre. Jordan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 05:33:10 +1200 From: David Maclennan Organization: Ministry of Commerce Subject: Lizard/Islands Nice to see some support for KC's two most underrated (even by some hardcore Crimheads!) albums - Lizard and Islands. I've always loved both of these albums very much. Lizard, in fact, was my favourite KC album for a long time (these days it's either Red or S&BB - can never quite make up my mind which!) There are many special things about Lizard, from its gorgeous sleeve (the intricacies of which are completely lost when reduced to CD size, of course) to the music itself, which I feel is the best of the first 3 KC albums. I particularly like the jazz overtones. Hard to pick favourite moments: Jon Anderson's contribution is definitely one, as is "Lady of the Dancing Water" (even prettier than "Cadence & Cascade", IMHO). Also love Fripp's distant guitar solo on "Battle of the Glass Tears". And then of course there's "Bolero" (but NOT the FbF version!). Lizard is in a sense KC's "Unplugged" album, being largely acoustic (a fact that few people ever seem to mention). "Formentera Lady" and the title track are my favourites, along with "Sailor's Tale". It's a bit under-produced, perhaps, but this doesn't detract from it at all. It's my favourite KC album for chilling out to (the others are generally too intense for this!) David Maclennan ------------------------------ From: airshift at webtv dot net Date: Sun, 11 May 1997 14:11:01 -0700 Subject: Re: Elephant Talk Digest #374 Pete Sinfield also wrote the lyrics for the highly underrated/forgotten(but not by me) ESPERANTO-DANSE MACABRE-1974 on A&M records. Should be on cd, it's that good. On back of lp there is a picture of Pete on floor next to entire band. If you never heard it is really progressive with great violin i/e. Early ELO meets King Crimson. You are right about PFM Pete did words for Photos Of Ghosts,The World Became The World. cheers, Rand Kelly ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 May 1997 13:58:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Adam Levin Subject: Trey Gunn Band/California Guitar Trio in Baltimore 6/3/97 Baltimore Progressive Rock Showcase Series Orion Sound Studios 2903 Whittington Avenue Baltimore, Maryland Tuesday, June 3rd 1997 7:30 PM On Tuesday night, June 3rd, Trey Gunn, best known for his work as a member of King Crimson will perform with his band along with the world renowned California Guitar Trio in the initimate setting of the Orion Studios Showcase Room. Admission will be limited to 150 for this all ages show. It is expected to sell out quickly. Admission: $15 (plus $1 for Visa/MasterCard purchases) Reserve your admission with cash or Visa/Mastercard at: Of Sound Mind Savage Mill 8600 Foundry Street Savage, MD (301)497-6488 Hours: Wed 12-6/Thu 12-8/Fri 12-8/Sat 12-8 Of Sound Mind will be closed the week of May 11th Please see http://prog.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ for directions to Orion Sound Studios and more information about our concert series. -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 May 97 16:34:31 UT From: "William Hearne" Subject: Crimzeal v. Aerosmithism? I read a post to ET containing the comment about hearing Formentera Lady performed live being hopeless. I have heard (but do not own) several cd bootlegs containing Formentera Lady live (and material from Lizard as I recall), and they were very enjoyable despite the quality of the recordings. I have seen a cd version of Earthbound advertised for sale somewhere and wish I had it despite the quality of the recording. In fact, upon acquiring my vinyl version of Eathbound shorlty after its release, I was not in the least upset with the sound quality, realizing the record for what it was. I never fully bought the story that it was taken off the market solely for that reason. I believe a substantial portion of Crimaudience would purchase a live set from this period despite sound and/or performance shortcomings, and I hope Fripp will continue to make live performances available even if the quality is not up to the then-available standard, much less the current standard. Like most avid fans, I would not be discouraged from purchasing a recording that is not of the highest standard available at the time of the performance so long as the essence of the artists' performance is not obliterated by noise or distorted beyond recognition. The level of a fan's enthusiasm is inversely proportional to the quality of a live recording he or she will accept, and I suspect that the average level of Crimzeal is higher than, for instance, the average level of Aerosmithism. That is, the general public market standard is not necessarily applicable to live Crimson material from the Island era. I think all ETers will agree that given his past actions (including remastering studio cds at his own expense), Fripp might well be the most trustworthy artist with regard to releasing the best available product. I for one would not hesitate to purchase a legitimate live cd from the Islands era if Fripp is involved in any way. I suspect a legitimate live cd from the Islands-era will depend largely upon Fripp's inclination, Fripp's availability, and the performance of the Epitaph set in the marketplace, rather than the existence of perfectly pristine tapes from that era. Lake Hearne ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 9:39:41 -0400 From: DAN at ELIZPL dot ORG Subject: PETE SINFIELD All this talk about what Pete Sinfield has doing had my memory jarred. I knew that I had seen postings concerning his career, then I remembered where I saw it...If anyone is still interested, I suggest they check out the ELP Digest on the web, back issues, issue number 4.19 (1994) In it Peter himself gives a career synopsis and tells several stories... I think people will be surprised, and at times stunned at what Peter has accomplished in his illustrious career............. Thanks go to John Arnold for his great ELP website and digest. Thanks Toby & Co. Dan Conrad ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 20:11:55 -0800 From: Stephen Arthur Subject: Epitaph & Bryan Ferry... With all of the excitement surrounding the new release "Epitaph", I would like to pose this question to the ET population. Was Bryan Ferry ever considered to join the "Double Trio" in 1994. I know he would do such a great job having spawned such great bands like Duran Duran, ABC, Decephe Mode. Fripp must have considered him! I have all his albums too! steve ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 20:07:19 -0400 From: "Gordon Emory Anderson" Subject: Fripp the Miles of rock Guitar? Well..... Joe said...... >Maybe we can start calling Fripp the "miles davis of guitar" hehe. The problem with this is that Fripp plays "too many damn notes" (as Miles accused Coltrane of doing). I think a better analogy is to call Fripp the John Coltrane of Rock Guitar, except there may be two problems with this. 1.Any one familiar with the level or artistry and impact of John Coltrane will feel uncomfortable comparing any live human being to 'Trane. 2. Is mere "Rock" a developed enough artform to contain a comparison like this? (Isn't this like saying "__________ is the Michelangelo of silly putty") Let's face it--I love rock and you love rock and it covers some emotions/human experience that other genres are not well prepared for. But the blistering cord changes being improvised over in "Giant Steps" have no equivalent in rock. Sorry. But in the e nd, a close look at Trane and Fripp do yield some interesting comparisons. And by the way, my fathers' offer some issues back to invite Fripp over to play some Monk or Trane changes still stands--(I am perenially trying to convince him that rock does indeed have some excellent musicians making important music.) Oh yeah, what's all this crap about The Sex Pistols being equated with punk Rock? Anyone really familiar with punk will know that the Pistols were merely an enfatuated british imitation of the New York scene. Punk Rock starts with Lou Reed, John Cale, and the Velvets, later Iggy, and eventually patti smith and what not. The pistols caught some of those bands and developed a sort of synthetic posers clown-makeup version. Hell, they even said so themselves. In this respect, Yes is a hell of a lot more important than the Sex Pistols, though perhaps not more important than the Velvet Underground. -Emster. (How about THIS for "stirring up the hornets' nest"?) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 11:35:00 -0700 (PDT) From: George Korein Subject: Schizoid Noise, Devices, etc. What is the sound in the beginning of CSM? What makes the wind sounds in "Devil's Triangle"? On "Discipline" and "In the Wake of Poseidon", Fripp is credited with "guitar and devices". Is devices referring to his effects, or something else? Is it meaningless? I think I will go for the Tony Levin look once I am old enough to grow a moustache. The Stick or the Keyboard seem like more likely instruments for someone as intellectual as Fripp -- they would give him the ability to play more at once. Fripp seems like a piano player. And yet, he is an amazing guitar player. Crimson influence seeps in where you least expect it -- the Stone Temple Pilots guitarist says he loves 80s Crimson and Kirk Hammett said recently that he had begun listening to Fripp. ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #376 ********************************