E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 292 Friday, 19 July 1996 Today's Topics: mellotron mania Mellotrons and Yes Tape emergency Hello you say Satori, I say Sartori Thrak Attack mellotron on starless (et#291) 21st CSM single availability Philly Tour date and ticket sales Nights in White Satin YPG and ND!! Yes, we have mellotrons Art, Kilgore Trout and The Wall FS: 8/8 Horde ticket KC in Nashville That Darn Mellotron Sound fripp is a composer, hendrix a player More Savoy, THRaKaTTaK YES and the mellotron Adrian in Nashville Nell = Moonchild Thrakattack = Infrared Roses Satori In ET The Roches "Keep on Doin" "Knights" in White Satin Mellotrons in the 90's etc Hershey HORDE Addition Fripp in Paideuma Twenty-first Century Schizoid Man CD Single - US KC/Fripp Monster Vinyl Auction List Thanks friends! Mellotrons? Yes! more about mellotrons Re: Music speaks through the musicians...etc... "The Double Trio" Tickets wanted for San Diego show Hideyo Moriya(CGT) with E.X.T.H in Abiko city, Japan RE: How to get your Girlfriend to Appreciate King Crimson ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk UNSUB/ADDRESS CHANGES: Send a message with a body of HELP to et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk, or use the DIY list machine at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/list/ ETWEB: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ (partial mirror at http://members.aol.com/etmirror/) THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmeister) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest 3.0 package. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 20:14:39 -0700 From: Darryl Alford Subject: mellotron mania During my first year of college (in 1972), a recently made friend looked through my records and noticed the first KC album. He suggested I might enjoy Premiata Forneria Marconi (PFM). Well, he was absolutely right. I highly recommend their first two records, which are very difficult to locate, but if you enjoy the mellotron, you will be richly rewarded! See you Bay Area fans at the Berkely KC show! Big D ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 11:53:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: Mellotrons and Yes Only because someone was so wrong about it in the latest ET, I'm addressing the non-KC issue of whether Wakeman used mellotrons on albums other than FRAGILE, which the poster assured us was not the case. Wakeman uses 'trons on CLOSE TO THE EDGE: the orchestral soudns during And You and I' (Eclipse/Apocalypse sections); and on the main riff for Siberian (one of my favorite 'tron bits). Trons on YESSONGS -- especially easy to hear on his Six Wives solo. And TALES FROM TOPOGRAPHIC OCEANS is veritably *drenched* in Mellotronia. Which leaves me wondering if said poster even knows what a 'tron sounds like. No trons on GOING FOR THE ONE or TORMATO -- yet another reason why these are lesser albums ;> -S. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 11:54:49 -0400 (EDT) From: nfn02489 at naples dot net (John Morris) Subject: Tape emergency I need help! Recently, I was grooving to my old EG Classics tape of USA, and my less-than-perfect tape player chose to eat it. Is there any way to fix a tape that is snapped in one spot? I know I fixed my Red tape with a piece of tape, but it does not seem to be working with USA, it slows the tape down. Also, is there anywhere else I could attain a new copy of USA? I love it, and I don't have enough dough to snag _The Great Deceiver_ at the present moment. John ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 10:48:55 -0700 From: Mark Kluth Organization: TMI Subject: Hello Hello from Balmy Minnesota. >From: terry kroetsch f >Subject: to stop a thread... >Please, I beg of you, do not start a girlfriend/wife thread. Nobody cares >about this. Keep your boyfriend,girlfriend,spouse to yourself. Terry, what do you say you leave the self-righteousness at the door. You do not speak for me as much as I do not speak for you. I do, in fact, care that my wife likes KC, and she cares, and she would like some positive affirmation from other women- I would suggest that you skip over messages that do not interest you instead of attempting to mold this list into what YOU want. On a much more important note, I bought B'Boom the other day- and on the first play my mind was instantly transported back to the State Theater in Minneapolis from last June 16th. I can close my eyes and see the show all over again... what a deal. The only thing I don't like about B'Boom is their rendition of Matte Kudasai- too fast and very forced. Seeing as how Matte Kudasai is 'our song' (sniff), my wife was particularly disappointed. Oh well, we did get to see Adrian play it with the Psycodots on his last swing through Minneapolis and it was spectacular. And for the person who asked, I believe Matte Kudasai is Japanese for "my beloved" or equivalent. Also, we can count on a new KC fan- a friend of mine who's a "modern rock" snob snickered when I brought B'Boom over last night. I practically had to force him to play it- during Frame by Frame he said "Boy, this sure doesn't sound like a live recording"... halfway through Red he proclaimed "Hey, these guys are pretty good... very technical"... and finally I could see the light go on in his eyes during "Lark's Tongues...". He practically begged me to leave him the CD's so he could listen again- I had to break his heart and take them back home. Another Fripp success story. And here's my $0.02 about KC CD availability: at Best Buy in Maplewood, MN. they have an EXTREMELY large selection of KC CD's- 4-5 BINS FULL- at least 1 copy of most titles, ~$12.99 each. No THRAK ATTACK or 21csm single yet, tho. The salesperson refused to look up potential release dates for me. Circuit City in Maplewood has B'Boom & VROOM, that's it- at about $1 more than Best Buy. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 12:07:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: you say Satori, I say Sartori regarding this "Satori in Crimsoland' business, I get the impression that the original poster doesn't 'get it' when he chides the banner-maker for 'mispelling' sartori. As far as I can remember, the title 'Sartori in Tangier' (which is gibberish on its face) is an anagram, though for what, I've never learned. Discipline-era KC used anagram-titling for 'Thela Hun Ginjeet' too, as we probably all know ('Heat in the Jungle') . THe person who made the banner was able to refer to the KC title *and* to hoped-for enlightenment by using the correct word 'satori'. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 08:58:56 +0100 From: ggc Subject: Thrak Attack >From DSMRNGDO at aol dot com Well I finally got my hands on Thrak Attack and here are my thoughts. 1. I love it! the disc liner suggests this is what a KC show might be like if the band dare to go off for an hour or so. Well I'll be in the 14th row in Berekely, and I dare you. This is free form jazz meeting intense rock and roll, and I love it. 2. Any of you who do love it need to immediately find you local high tech Deadhead and have them supply you with their favorite soundboard bootlegs of tapes with intense Drumz/Space. Don't ask why, just do it. Please don't be cynical. You know how you feel when others won't give KC a chance. 3. If you know any Deadheads who liked the Drumz/Space aspects of GD shows. Turn them on to this. They could use a musical shot in the arm these days....See you in Berkeley. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 11:52:45 -0600 From: kjh857 at lulu dot acns dot nwu dot edu (Kevin Holm-Hudson) Subject: mellotron on starless (et#291) Yes indeed, the string-sounding instrument at the beginning of "Starless" is a mellotron. For further detail regarding the instrument, I quote from a thesis on Rick Wakeman by Nick Peck that I downloaded off the internet: >The mellotron is a unique instrument. Invented in the late sixties, it works by >having an internal rack filled with strips of 1/4-inch recording tape. Upon >>each strip of tape is a recording of a particular instrument at a particular >pitch. Pressing a key causes the corresponding tape to be moved past a playback >head. One can thus change the sounds by changing the tape racks. In effect, >this makes the Mellotron the world's only analog sample playback device. . . . >The default tape rack that came with the instrument contained choir, string >>section, and flute sounds. So there you have it. I seem to recall reading somewhere that the Spanish-guitar bit at the beginning of the Beatles' "Continuing Story of Bungalow Bill" is _also_ a mellotron, that the lick was actually from a demo tape that came with the mellotron (played in this case on a single key). As for who plays it on "Starless," I'm fairly certain it's Fripp on the studio version (Cross had left by the point that the studio work was done--though he appears on the live-improv "Providence" which was recorded earlier); as for the versions on _Great Deceiver_, if memory serves correctly Fripp plays the haunting intro solo on one version and Cross plays it on the other. Whichever one is *not* playing the solo at that time is playing the mellotron. (Both Cross and Fripp played the instrument, though in later gigs Cross was edged out of violin duties more, in favor of mellotron.) Hope this longish post clarifies things. Khh ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: JPRICE at TrentU dot ca Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 13:16:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: 21st CSM single availability Hello ETers, For all who can't find the 21stCSM single locally, myself included, I've ordered it from: http://www.cduniverse.com I'm not endorsing or advertising, (heck, it hasn't even arrived yet, but I have recieved e-mail confirmation that it has been shipped) just stating a fact. As of last week, it was the only on-line CD store I'd found that listed it as in stock. If anyone's interested, I'll post again when it arrives. I'll -defenitely- post again re: this if there are any problems. J. P. Co-FAQ guy ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 14:50:08 -0400 From: campopia at ride dot ri dot net (Anthony Campopiano Jr.) Subject: Philly Tour date and ticket sales Greetings: Concerning the Philly date slated for 8/26/96 at the Mann Music Center, I want to pass on the info that the tickets went on sale Saturday morning 7/13/96. I was in Philly over the weekend and a friend had been trying to secure tickets for two weeks prior to my being in Philly. He had been calling the Mann daily with no success. In fact they told him on several occasions that Crimson was not on the summer performance list. He and I had many go arounds on this issue, until we learned that the tickets went on sale Saturday. In the mean time he and I travelled to New England and ordered tickets on Monday morning. We shopped around and found that "John's" (609)742-0502 had some great seats available in the center section 14 rows from the stage at $45. per seat. I wish you good fortune as you seek to secure your tickets, and for those who will be fortunate enough to see this incarnation of the band enjoy! P.S. I've personally been a devote of the band since 1969, and have seen them numerous times in the Northeastern area of the US. THRAKattack is absolutely wonderful, and I agree with many other Crimson enthusists that capturing the band's improvisations whenever possible only adds to the love affair that one has with this talented group of musicians. Sadly, I think that any comparisons made between Crimson and other bands or musicians, although very subjective and biased are at best only comparisons. We are often very quick to compartmentilize ideas and all sorts of things into our Western world view. Whatever the case music speaks, and we listen. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 14:43:46 +0000 From: khoffman at giantfood dot com (Kurt Hoffman) Subject: Nights in White Satin Hi Guys, Sorry about the end of the millenium snafu. Guess a little too much Prince left over from the bad old days when I was a janitor in a DISCOtech. Anyway, in 291 Steve Smith points to the well known mellotron in Knights (SP?) in white satin. I believe that that song did not in fact employ mellotron, being recorded with a symphony orchestra. I'm not sure, though, in that I must have sold that album somewhere along the way, whether or not there was a mellotron as well as the orchestra; but I think the sound he was speaking of was an orchestra. By the way, I was in a band in the 70's (did they really happen?) that had a mellotron and they were a bitch and a half to use and upkeep, being almost impossible to keep in tune as tapes stretched and motor speed fluctuated (part of the charm of the instrument in its own way, but when you want an A and you get a C or an E flat instead the charm can wear off quickly), especially in light of the fact that the mellotron's motor was set up for European current, not US. I believe that Fripp and Co. had the same trouble sometimes over here (you can sure hear it on some of the boots). Anyway, the point to all this is how much improved technically the mellotron on Thrak seems to be, but I hate to say it but it seems to have lost some of it's evil charm in the technical improvements. But yeah, Steve, dead on about Mr. Anderson! And as to Henry Finke's request to let Eartbound die again... oh that's right, you want to keep ET clean and free of foul exclamatories. Kurt ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 15:33:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "NAME \"angus low\"" <3DR3LOWA at vmsa dot csd dot mu dot edu> Subject: YPG and ND!! Hello all! This is one of the two (I think it is three now.....) from North Dakota... I am living in Milwaukee now and have come accross two copies of The Young Person's Guide to KC--complete with booklet and **dare I say** NEAR MINT condition...I would be asking $35.00 for either--as they are collector's items and this would be with postage included...I also have two copies of USA~--one really great and the other fair --one is an ISLANDS release and the other is from EG--I am taking any offer on either of these so please email direct if interested...... Also to Trey Gunn: ....North Dakota would be a great place for a KC concert---great acoustics... it's flat....and it would be a great relief from those crappy Neil Diamond impersonators we have twice a year....but if you do play there: 1. --play in Grand Forks (NOT FARGO) at the Chester Fritz--5000 seat auditorium---BEST ACOUSTICS IN THE WORLD...((We have had Wynton Marsalis,Mingus, and Jethro Tull play there and it sounded great---hell! George Carlin said he liked the sound of CF too--not much of a singer though... 2. --if you do go to Grand Forks, DO NOT come in July or December. We have the bi-annual "Buffalo Chip" tossing contest (first prize a year's supply of potatoes-second prize, the buffalo chips themselves....). July might be ok, but I would not want to risk the chance of an overzealous fan to hit Robert in the head with a buffalo chip in December; they freeze up quite solidly and he could get hurt. ;-) Seriously though.....North Dakota......really! Rmrmber email direct about those records! Colin ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 15:18:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Brooks A Rogers Subject: Yes, we have mellotrons This is in response to a person in the previous ET that Yes "rarely" used mellotrons (even suggesting that "Fragile" is the only Yes album with it). Do people just not know what the hell a mellotron souds like or something? I have to say that EVERY and I mean EVERY song on the albums "Close to The Edge", "Tales from Topographic Oceans", and "Relayer" have got the mellotron all over it, either using the strings, choir, or flute settings (Patrick Moraz even used it as a "sampler", installing tape-looped sound effects on it). For the albums "Going for the One" and "Tormato", Wakeman replaced his mellotron with a birotron which used an 8-track tape system yet the sounds are pretty much the same. Sorry this e-mail is so impassioned but when I see horrible mis-truths spoken, I must tell it like it is, baby..... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Emuguy5830 at aol dot com Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 16:14:27 -0400 Subject: Art, Kilgore Trout and The Wall uhm, Well, I suppose I should apoligize to Olivier M. Any jagged comments I threw at you are humbily withdrawn. It should be known that my limited command of the english language (slippery devil) prevented me from lucidly stating my point and cunfusion, distress and chaos naturally ensued. To Chris M's comments in 290: Yes, technical proficiency is very important, just as important as one's emotional attachment to their art. I'll try my damndest to clearly and intelligently state my FINAL WORD (I promise) on this subject. What must be behind any great piece of art is technical skill and the desire to impart an artistic vision on the world. The artist's beliefs/ideals naturally come into play. So do his emotions. It couldn't be any other way. It is not so much that the artist is trying to cram his emotional views down his audience's collective throat (like Waters did with Final Cut). Artists (use the term lightly) that do this, quite often, have emotional problems. Rather, the artist should present his art. He should say "I put a lot of my soul into this. So here it is. Either you can dig it or you can't." The artist can't force his audience to symathize or empathize. He can't force them to follow his systems of beliefs. (Odd, I happen to be listening to The Wall as we speak . . .) He can, however, use art to present both of these and, in doing so, hopefully, entertain his audience. I truly believe in art. I believe in art for art's sake. I'm emotionally envolved with it. I can't seperate myself from it. I feel VERY strongly about it. Emotions are not solely behind the creative act, I know. In the music industry, there are very few true artists, but there are a lot of people who put their emotions into their "art." Sometimes it's good, mostly it's not. I fear that the artist is becoming increasingly rare in society as a whole. When you look at the best-sellers, it's all a bunch of re-hashed, mellodramatic crap. Popular musicians care no more about art than they do about their ability to treat audiences as thinking people. So it is rare (exceedingly rare) to come across a KC or a RF. I have a great amount of repsect for KC. They've maintained their artistic integrity in an increasingly ignorant society. The industry has not corrupted them like it did to poor Kilgore Trout and it has not driven them insane like it did to Syd Barret. For that alone, one should have a certain amount of respect for them. cheerfully insane, Matt C Post--if Chris, Olivier or anyone else would like to carry on this discussion, I suggest we resort to private channels. I'm sure the other ET'ers are quite fed up with our rantings. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 16:24:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Bradley Earl Shelbourn <00111549 at bigred dot unl dot edu> Subject: FS: 8/8 Horde ticket i will be unable to attend the 8/8/96 Kansas City Horde show at the Sandstone...the ticket is for section 11, seat 20 something (it's reserved seating) & i'd like to sell my ticket to a deserving crimson fan...email brad at 00111549 at bigred dot unl dot edu for details and negotiations ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 96 15:26:54 CDT From: Paul Gelpi Organization: The University of Alabama, Tuscaloosa, AL Subject: KC in Nashville ETers, Let me apologize in advance about this quick post. Lately I have been having trouble with my e-mail account and have lost several items by accident. A few ETs back (maybe 3 to 5 by now) in a post I asked if any other ETers were going to the Nashville HORDE show to let me know if they liked. Another ETer did reply to me but the note was deleted before I could reply. I seem to remember the phrase "we will be the bespectaled and bemused ones." I did not intend to be rather rude and not reply, so if you care to please re-contact me. Thanks to Dan and Toby for their indulgence in this matter. Happy Listening. Paul Gelpi pgelpi3 at ua1vm dot ua dot edu ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: MARK dot KEEN at ROCHE dot COM Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 17:13 -0500 (EST) Subject: That Darn Mellotron Sound Well, I never feel comfortable posting in ET, but sometimes one needs to speak out. Being one of those rare beings (a keyboard player who likes KC) I feel compelled to reply to "Sir James" @ psu.edu. Yes and KC took the mellotron, which was strictly a studio hot house flower/ white elephant piece of machinery, on stage in order to reproduce their studio sound live. I do not agree with Sir J's assumption that it played a meaningless role in Yes or KC's music any more than Rickenbacker basses were meaningless to Yes and Gibson guitars were meaningless to either band. It was the instrument that defined and delimited their sound. No more and no less. The Mellotron was also a gruesome machine to tune and maintenance (I've posted on Mellotrons and Chamberlins before; you can find the post with the new ET search engine). Subsequently, good digital samplers (probably sampling mellotrons!?!) have taken over and can be triggered from a guitar (as we've all seen Adrian Belew demonstrate in live performances of "Dinosaur"). A company called ARP was selling a synthesized "string machine" keyboard in the 70s but I think it was either of limited availability in Europe or not available at "professional (ahem) discount". I remember a friend of mine had just acquired a new copy of George Harrison's *Dark Horse* album and was playing it at his apartment. "How do you like the mellotron on this album?" he asked, I said, "That's not mellotron. It's an ARP." He checked the credits on the album. "You're right!" He was impressed, but not convinced. He made me sit with my back to his stereo while he played me five or six tracks from the album and made me guess whether the "strings" were mellotron or ARP. As I recall the album tracks were about 50/50 split using either keyboard. Anyway, I correctly identified the keyboard used in each case. He was stunned and could never understood how easily I could differentiate between the two. Simply, the mellotron sounded more "natural" or "smoother". I cannot tell you haw disappointed I was hearing the "Symphonic" version of "Heart of the Sunrise" because the "real" strings did not support the "crescendo" before the last coda of this tune. In summary, I feel and can present more evidence to support the fact that the mellotron was a VERY important keyboard to Yes and King Crimson during the 70s. Because why else would the technical crews and musicians of each of these bands put up with such a cantankerous, unpredictably fickle, impossible to tune instrument for so long? FOR THE SOUND! (And the Mini-Moog wasn't much better!) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 15:43:49 -0700 From: "J.P.Lewis" Subject: fripp is a composer, hendrix a player Sorry, I have to disagree with this (quote below), and I don't even really see the comparision between Fripp and Hendrix. Hendrix played basically the standard blues rock, perhaps with an occasional jazz influence, and with some unusual chords. There are many other rock guitarists that use unusual chords -- in any guitar magazine there are columns by nameless long-haired people who are all proficient players. Hendrix was gifted in playing relatively simple compositions in a way that was energetic and sonically 'on the edge'. Although Fripp has shown that he can be pretty good at this stuff too I think of Fripp as a very innovative composer, and Hendrix was not this. KC often does *compositionally* (*and* sonically) what Hendrix did sonically, i.e. exploring the border between structure and chaos. After the 70s KC Fripp has arguably invented several types of music; something which relatively few composers can say - frippertronics, late 70s style. - the 'discipline' style of playing - the league of crafties, which I see as a new type of music in that it uses a number of relatively inexperienced players. IMHO. Of course, one can mention minimalism, other precedents. Nevertheless, I see both 80s KC & frippertronics as being not quite like anything that came before (as well as being very cool) > Hendrix, by the time of his death, could play in virtually any style > of his choosing, whether it be blues (influenced by Buddy Guy and ... > though he couldn't read a note, he was quite simply one of the > greatest STUDENTS of the guitar of this century. > > I don't think there can be any doubt that Hendrix is #1. But certainly *----------------------------------------------------------------------- j.p.lewis i n t e r v a l r e s e a r c h palo alto ca zilla at interval dot com 415 842 6113 http://www.idiom.com/~zilla ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: 17 Jul 96 00:38:48 EDT From: "Robert C. Parducci" <76206 dot 3036 at CompuServe dot COM> Subject: More Savoy, THRaKaTTaK It seems like we were all there, doesn't it? I scalped a ticket after work for the first show Friday. Truly amazing! I have no memory of Mr. Cigarette Lighter, but thank you just the same for bringing forth some many accounts of this show from ETers. It was a joy to see and hear the Discipline material performed by this quartet (still is!) What caught my ear, though, was the new material introduced, esp. Manhattan n/k/a Neurotica. IMHO, this piece is much better sans vocals, and I believe KC feels the same way. (Will an instrumental/live version be released?) I remember amidst the shouts of "Bruford!" and "Crimson!" before the show somebody shouted "Wakeman!" KC crowds never seem to change. The second night I went back with some friends, one of whom took the two drink minimum as a dare. Picked up THRaKaTTaK at Nobody Beats the Wiz for $12.99, which btw is the amount I paid for B'Boom, thank you very much, also from NBtW. This is my type of music. I will not attempt to describe it, so just go buy your copy now. Incidently, parts of THRaKaTTaK sound disturbingly similar to a recording I made in 1989, DeaFeaRS, so you'll be hearing from my attorneys! Other things I'd like to know about: Did anyone else purchase the Alley Cats "Escape from Planet Earth?" They opened for KC in Central Park. Is there a transcription available for Larks' Tongues in Aspic, Part II? I believe Darryl Hall called this one of the greatest compositions of the 20th Century. I think it would fit in well with contemporary piano literature and should be performed as such. Also, years ago, I heard what was most likely Frippertronics on late night NYC radio, a piece that featured the guitarist glissing up the neck of the instrument repeatedly until it became single tone. I own most of Robert's early solo efforts, but I have not been able to identify this particular piece. Finally, I would be interested in hearing from ETer's who have actually played in a band at something approaching a professional level. It is easy to play Monday morning quarterback and whine about how KC never plays anything the *true* fans want to hear, but quite another to consider things from their perspective. BTW, I played keyboards with LEGEND, 3-time winners of the Apollo Theatre's Amateur Night contest, before one of the most demanding audiences on the planet. Robert C. Parducci 76206 dot 3036 at compuserve dot com <>There's a party tonight <>You're invited <>Bring a friend if you like <>Get there right on time <> <>LEGEND: In Our Own Time <>http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rcp ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 23:00:56 -0400 From: Us Subject: YES and the mellotron I have a few other examples of YES using the beloved mellotron. It is on "Siberian Khatru" from CTTE, all over the YESSONGS album (listen, it's there), and in Tales From Topographic Oceans, particularly on "The Ancient, Giants Under The Sun". So there. Now I feel better. -Dave- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Otherroad at aol dot com Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 21:26:18 -0400 Subject: Adrian in Nashville Last weekend I attended the NAMM convention in Nashville. For those of you unfamiliar with NAMM, that stands for National Association of Music Merchants. It's for that arm of the music business that deals specifically with the making and marketing of music instruments. I work with an incredible acoustic guitarist named Richard Johnson who is a clinician for Taylor Guitars and that's why we were there. Anyway, on Friday Richard and I were wondering the convention floor when we ran smack into Adrian Belew and his manager Stan Hertzman. I'd spoken to Stan a couple times on the phone, so it was nice to meet him and put a face to the voice. I got to talk briefly to Adrian. He's always been a wonderful guy to talk to and I've always admired his ability to maintian a friendly demeaner and appear interested in what your saying even if you tend to ramble on a bit, which I probably did a little of. Besides Adrian we also caught such great musicians as Phil Keaggy, Laurence Juber, Bela Fleck, Victor Wooten, Future Man, Mark O'Connor, etc. Can't wait for the next NAMM. BTW, I noticed in the last issue quite a number of people complaining about not being able to find THRaKaTTaK or other Discipline discs at their area stores. For those folks, I would encourage you to pop over to our site at The Artist Shop . We have the entire Discipline catalog with cover graphics and soundbites for each album. The prices are pretty good and the service is pretty quick. BTW, although the THRaKaTTaK soundbites have only been up for a few days, hits on the soundbites have quickly outstripped every other soundbite in the store! Gary ************************************************************** Gary Davis The Artist Shop The Other Road http://www.artist-shop.com OtherRoad at aol dot com SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!! ************************************************************** ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 11:34:45 +0300 From: Tefkros Symeonides Subject: Nell = Moonchild Emerging from lurker mode to make pointless comment... A couple of nights ago I watched Nell. It was not as good as I expected, but Jodie Foster was excellent as usual. Anyway, what would have suited the film PERFECTLY would have been, yup, Moonchild in those "dancing in the forest" scenes. Those opening guitar chords have always tingled my spine, and THIS is exactly how they could have been immortalised. Well, I guess you could call me a real King Crimson freak for imagining I was hearing those chords when watching the trailer for the movie a couple of years ago (unfortunately I missed the movie itself on the big screen). Anyway, keep on thrakking, Tefkros ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 22:54:57 -0500 From: Chris Berg Subject: Thrakattack = Infrared Roses I picked up Thrakattack a few days ago... I carried it around with me for days and days... I played little games like... not looking at it for a whole day then... looking at it... to see if I still liked it. I did! Anyway, listening to Thrakattack brought to mind that thread comparing King Crimson to the Grateful Dead. The Dead put out an album in '91 or '92 called Infrared Roses. It's a cool collection of Drum/Space segments of Dead shows over the course of maybe six months. It's nearly identical in form and concept to Thrakattack (or, considering the chronology, Thrakattack resembles Infrared Roses). I really enjoy this sort of formless music. Someone said that Thrakattack could be the sound track to the "wildest movie ever created" and I'd have to agree. This sort of music does have that sort of emotional appeal. Frank Zappa once said that the only time the general public would accept dissonant / free form music is when they get to apply it to a picture on a movie screen. The movie provides the anchor that gives the music its "form." Anyway, I think that it's interesting the Dead and KC get those comparisons. I'm a huge Dead Head and I recognized the similarity to the two bands approach right away. I'm sure that there are a few people on this who would feel that labeling King Crimson "Grateful Dead-like" would be akin to labeling the members of KC pedophiles :) Chris ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 01:24:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Watcher Of The Skies (John P Mohan) Subject: Satori In ET Satori/Sartori. Sigh...this is not the first time this issue has been discussed on the list. Satori (without the extra R) is a term often used in Buddhist and other Eastern disciplines to describe a state of extreme spiritual enlightenment. The term is usually reserved for the most fantastic and supernatural experiences, such as visions of light, out -of- body experiences, etc. The spelling on BEAT is "Sartori In Tangier" with the extra R. This is most likely a pun on Adrian's part. Adrian had obviously been influenced by Beat literature to the point that he based a whole album around it. Case(s) in point: - Neal And Jack And Me: referring to Neal Cassady and Jack Kerouac. There is a point in the song where Adrian lists off four Kerouac titles in French: "En Route (On The Road)", "Les Souterrains (The Subterraneans)", "Des Visions du Cody (Visions of Cody)", "Satori =E0 Paris [the lyrics in the liner notes print "Satori" again with the extra R] (Satori In Paris)". - Heartbeat: I believe there is a Neal Cassady poem by this name. Incidentally, Neal Cassady was the central character in _On The Road_ and _Visions of Cody_, where Kerouac went into much detail regarding the love affair between Cassady and Allen Ginsburg. - Sartori In Tangier: obvious. - Neurotica: The first literary publication to sponsor Beat writers was entitled _Neurotica_ and was published in New York in 1948-51. Adrian's line "I have no more to say" might be a reference to John Clellon Holmes' _Nothing More To Declare_. - The Howler: a reference to Allen Ginsburg's poem "Howl". The remaining songs have me stumped: "Two Hands", "Waiting Man", "Requiem". I'm pretty sure "Requiem" is a Beat poem but I don't know who by. These might be more obscure references or embarassingly obvious ones. Again, can anyone pinpoint them? Sorry to be so aggravatingly thorough, but perhaps this will clear up some questions about this issue - at least for a year or so before it rears its ugly head again. One final thought - Adrian really did his homework when he was writing those lyrics! JP. ---- JP Mohan Grinnell College Grinnell Iowa mohanjp at ac dot grin dot edu ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: nhi695 at abdn dot ac dot uk Subject: The Roches "Keep on Doin" Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 13:36:39 +0100 (BST) The Roches "Keep on Doin". Be warned this is not a Crimson sounding album and I don't imagine many "Crimso's" would "Dig?" it. Its basically a lot of twangy acoustic guitar with female harmony vocals. Not that that is a bad thing (if you like that sort of stuff). I bought it as a "Crimhead" and put it down as a mistake after the first listen. Fripp, Levin and Bruford are all credited with playing contributions. I can't remember hearing one beat of drum/percussion on the album (but maybe I blinked) and Tony's bass was audible on one track. Now Fripp is definitely there and he contributes some nice Frippy stuff. So Frippoholics may well be satisfied by this album, otherwise Be Warned! Jase. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 09:39:34 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: "Knights" in White Satin Okay, sorry about the accidental typo in my Mellotron post. I know it's "Nights in White Satin" -- don't know what I was thinking. There's a nice moment on the boot "Celebration of the Lizard" (also available as "Formentara Memories") where Boz laughingly quips about the "Mellotronium" while Bob and Mel try to get their beasties in tune... Steve Smith ssmith at kochint dot com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 07:47:44 -0700 From: Dennis dot Montgomery at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (Dennis Montgomery) Subject: Mellotrons in the 90's etc Also add: Swedish bands Anekdoten, Anglagard, Landberk and outstanding English metal band Cathedral KingCrimson*Tull*GentleGiant*Greenslade*Edith*Marillion*Ethos*Minutemen******* * _______ *Sepultura*Queen*Beatles*Focus*Cathedral*NiademsGhost*BlackSabbatH T / \ a h | (. \ \ "Every day a little sadder, a little madder, someone get me w o \ >\ | a ladder" ...and who says Greg Lake writes awful lyrics? k u-- > |< | w g / >/ |Dennis Richards Montgomery:Software Engineer:Sun Microsystems i h | (. / / n t \_______/REM*SFF*ELP*PFM*801*Eno*Yes*Eloy*12thNight*SydBarrett*SexPistols*d Industry*IQ**Anekdoten*VanDerGraaf*SadLovers&Giants*OldGenesis*KateBush*Zappa* >Bands who have used the mellotron in the 90's (aside from KC, and >these are just the bands that I know of) include: 1). the Red Hot Chili Peppers on "BloodSugarSexMagic" ("Breaking the Girl" and the coda to "Sir Psycho Sexy"); 2). Soundgarden on "Superunknown" ("Mailman", to chilling effect); 3). Pearl Jam on "Vitalogy" (couldn't tell you the song); 4). REM on one of the songs from "Monster"; and, finally, 5). an obscure band called the Indians who did a song called "Look up to the Sky" that is unbelieveable. If you come across their eponymous album, it's worth it just for that song. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 11:45:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Kurt Kleinschmidt Subject: Hershey HORDE Addition For those of you who didn't know, Neil Young & Crazy Horse are scheduled to appear at the HORDE show on 8/23 in Hershey PA, which is also King Crimson's final HORDE apperance. As far as I can tell this is Neil and the Boys only HORDE date. There are still tickets available. If enough of us show up maybe we can get Mr. Fripp and/or Mr. Belew to add their influence to Down by the River, or possibly we can get Neil Thraking. Something to think about... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: KnKreutzer at aol dot com Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 15:12:08 -0400 Subject: Fripp in Paideuma Don't recall anyone here mentioning it, but Robert Fripp's name pops up a couple of times in a most unexpected recent source: the Spring/Fall 1996 issue of *Paideuma* (25.1-2), an academic journal of Ezra Pound scholarship. The context is an article on "Music and Poetry Which Evoke Nature: David Sylvian and Ezra Pound," by an Italian teaching assistant named Cristina Guenzi. Admirers of Sylvian's lyrics will want to track this article down. Kenneth Kreutzer Kent, Ohio (KnKreutzer at aol dot com) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: 17 Jul 96 18:03:00 EST From: "Gilbert Kirk" Subject: Twenty-first Century Schizoid Man CD Single - US Dan - ET #291 had this request: >From: Christie >Subject: 21CSM Single >Can anyone tell me where I can get my hands on the aforementioned CD >single? It's making me crazy reading all the reviews posted and not be >able to hear the dang thing. If you have telnet capability, a copy can be ordered from: telnet musicexpress.com for a mere $12.88 (US) plus $3.00 (US), shipping and handling. It can be found under the (A)rtist category of King Crimson and is listed as Virg367522. Gilbert Kirk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Salehouse at aol dot com Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 18:43:35 -0400 Subject: KC/Fripp Monster Vinyl Auction List I've split the KC list off from the master list for ease of navigation. Point your browser towards: http://members.aol.com/garagesail/website/kcfripp.htm For those that are browser impaired, here's what's available: King Crimson (memorabilia) Red - 26"X24" Poster of the album cover (Wetton, Bruford, Fripp), A few thumb tack holes, but very good condition January 1986 Guitar Player - Fripp on Cover with Story Robert Fripp After King Crimson 14 Page Interview plus Flexidisc with Fripp doing Easter Sunday on one side and Alan Holdsworth showing off the SynthAxe on Non Brewed Condiment. Flexidisc is still attached to magazine and has never been played. Magazine in Excellent condition. Musican Magazine - June, 1981 - Cover Story and Photo: Robert Fripp Interviews Joe Strummer - Excellent Interview - Cover has come off magazine but cover and magazine are both in good condition Modern Drummer - June 1983 - Cover Photo and Story on Bill Bruford - 11 page interview with Bill plus transcripted drum solo from "Neurotic" on the KC "Beat" Album. Excellent Condition Electronic Musician - June 1987 Issue - Interview with Fripp titled "Zen and the Art of Fripp's Guitar - 9 Pages in Length - Excellent Condition Mode & Musik - French Edition - Volume 1 No. 1(1980) - 2 Page article on Fripp and 2 Page article on the Specials, Excellent Condition Synapse Magazine - Summer, 1979 - Posterized Color Picture of Fripp on Cover - 4 page interview - Excellent Condition Guitar Synth and Midi - A GPI Collectors' Edition - Andy Summers, Robert Fripp, Frank Zappa, Al Di Meola, Allan Holdsworth, John McLaughlin - Excellent Condition (7") Fripp, Robert - Marriagemuzic/Heptaparaparshinokh, Editions EG British Import in original sleeve, excellent condition High Bid is presently $20.00 BY ACT161 12" Starless and Bible Black - Island UK import copy - Lyrics on Sleeve - Excellent Condition Starless and Bible Black - Atlantic Records - Lyrics on Sleeve - Name written on jacket and tear in jacket, vinyl in good condition- Excellent Condition Lark's Tongue in Aspic - Island Records Uk import, name written on sleeve, excellent condition Red - Island Records UK Import, Excellent condition High Bid is presently $5.00 BY ACT116 Islands - Atlantic Records, Name on Jacket - Fair Condition The Young Persons' Guide To King Crimson - 2LP set complete with photographic insert, Island Records UK import, Excellent condition (Some Former Crimson members) Blueprint by Keith Tippett - Produced by Robert Fripp, RCA UK import, jacket Good condition, vinyl excellent condition McDonald and Giles - Cotillion Records - promotional copy (This one says "Sample Copy") Name on jacket, Blemish on front cover, and sticker that didn't come off, Otherwise Good Condition High Bid is presently $7.00 BY ACT126 Pete Sinfield - Still - (original lyricist for King Crimson) - Manticore Records UK import featuring former KC members Greg Lake, Mel Collins, Keith Tippet, John Wetton, Boz, and others, name written on jacket, Very good condition High Bid is presently $19.00 BY ACT126 (The following are Fripp and Eno Recordings) Fripp and Eno - Air Structures - (Bootleg 2 record set Live at the Olympia 1975), Excellent Condition High Bid is presently $25.00 BY ACT161 Fripp and Eno - No Pussyfooting - Island Records UK import Name written on cover, Excellent Condition Frippland Robert Fripp - Exposure - Polydor Records - LABEL AUTOGRAPHED BY ROBERT FRIPP, Mint condition High Bid is presently $20.00 BY ACT133 I just found a second copy of Exposure. This one is a promo copy on label in Excellent Condition Let The Power Fall - Editions EG - Mint Condition God Save The Queen/Under Heavy Manners - Polydor Records - Excellent Condition Daryl Hall - Sacred Songs - RCA Records - Guitar and Produced by Fripp, Mint Condition Colin Scott - Import Records US pressing featuring "Bob Fripp" on guitar, Excellent Condition High Bid is presently $5.00 BY ACT161 Peter Hammill - Fools Mate - The famous Charisma Label UK Import - "Bob Fripp" on guitar and is he ever. Name written on top right of jacket. Very Good Condition High Bid is presently $8.00 BY ACT161 For Fripp Related, see Blondie Bill Bruford - Feels Good to Me - Polydor Records, with original sleeve of B&W session photos, VG+ Condition Bill Bruford - Gradually Going Tornado - Polydor Records - VG+ condition Bill Bruford - One of a Kind - EG Polydor - Original insert included VG+ Condition All the rules are on the web site. Happy bidding, mark ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 18:29:15 -0700 From: Fripp at siscor dot bibnal dot edu dot ar Organization: BIBLIOTECA NACIONAL REPUBLICA ARGENTINA Subject: Thanks friends! This messsage is only for give my thanks to all information what I received from you. (excuse my english please!) :( Thanks newsly Gabriel (Fripp) Buenos Aires-Argentina ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 17:46:46 -0800 From: james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz (James Dignan) Subject: Mellotrons? Yes! From: jwc146 at psu dot edu (Sir James) >...as a HUGE and LONG TIME YES fan I must correct a mistake that has been >repeated a few times here at ET. YES' use of a mellotron was NOT >significant. I'd like to know where the mellotron was supposedly played... NOT SIGNIFICANT??? As one James to another, Yes's best track - "And You and I" - would be as nothing without the wonderful mellotron part swelling up around 4 minutes into the piece! oh, and while I'm ranting... Dan! good to see you keeping up the high standards set by Toby - keep up the good work! James down south (who thinks the crescendo leading from the single chorused guitar in "Starship Trooper" is one of the pivotal moments in prog rock) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 11:06:51 +0100 From: Gareth Subject: more about mellotrons Mike Tanigawa and Sir James ET#291 write about the mellotron... Just to remind myself a) what a brilliant album Close to the Edge is, and b) to check out Wakeman's use of the Mellotron, I subjected my 7 year old son to it last night. There is fairly hefty use of mellotron on I Get Up I Get Down. I couldn't check out Tales from...because he wasn't particularly impressed by CttE, asking for Asia instead (he only likes the cover, honest, and he does like Crimso. But then BBs drumming is not so much to the fore, just "demon snippets", unlike on Fragile where his drumming is totally excellent). I then went through my record collection, digging out bands using mellotron. Though not extensive, this collection was put together based on bands' family trees and the range of keyboards used. Barclay James Harvest used both mellotron prototypes and a 400 Brand X feature a mellotron on the back cover of Moroccan Roll, though it isn't listed in the instruments played by Robin Lumley Camel Caravan The Enid Focus Fruupp Genesis Gentle Giant Greenslade (check out Pilgrims Progress and Chalk Hill on Bedside Manners...) Gryphon King Crimson!!! I didn't check out Magma ?? Pink Floyd - Wish You Were Here (look at photos of the band live) Pulsar Refugee (Patrick Moraz) ??Triumvirat Rick Wakeman solos Six Wives, Journey.., Myths and Legends of..., White Rock. He also plays a Birotron on Criminal Record. I think there was an article in the British music press, many years ago, about this being made by a company owned by Wakeman. It looked like a mellotron painted black, and on the record it produces sounds pretty much like a mellotron Yes!!! Mellotron is often misspelt in sleeve notes. Now about this "no one uses a mellotron like Crimso..." I had the fortune to play a mellotron 400D in a music shop in Tooting, south London, in 1981, but I couldn't afford it and didn't have the foresight to take out a loan to buy it. They had a couple of 400Ds and one of the split keyboard-upright piano mark 1 mellotrons. Anyway, they can only be used for long chords because there is a perceptible delay between hitting a note and getting a sound out due to the mechanics of the tape loop). Fast runs are impossible. This is probably why they became pretty nearly extinct, superceeded by the insipid string synthesizer. They can only be used in a certain way. It was the lines written by Fripp that make Crimso mellotron different. Long live the mellotron GP ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 15:03:56 +0100 From: brugger at physik dot uni-erlangen dot de (Alex Brugger) Subject: Re: Music speaks through the musicians...etc... Hi everybody! My post commenting on the above mentioned subject has caused loads of responses, some of which go deeper down into the topic as was my intention. But first of all: Olivier, I _never_ meant to frame you, or indeed anyone else! I'm very sorry that you felt attacked reading my message! I kept my message rather short and I did that on purpose. I could write a lot about ethics concerning the creation and the reception of music or indeed any art. I avoided doing so, because everybody has, and should have, their own attitudes towards all that. Of course creating art is intellectually a very complex act, no question about that. And of course I do respect anybody's ideas as to how they feel about creating art. The same holds for the listeners, they should approach the music open-minded, and with _their own_ ethics/attitudes. What is recorded on CDs is music, not ethics. Of course you should look beyond the surface, but to do so, you need your own intentions and your own feelings as a starting point. One should not eat anything _without thinking_ what whoever writes on album covers, be it whoever it may be, some PR manager of whatever band or Robert Fripp. As John Ott wrote in his response: > While I agree that we tend to over deify pop icons (...) In fact this is basically all, I wanted to say. There was quite a bit of talk going on concerning a 'musical entity' and that KC can only play that music that 'wants to be heard' etc... and some these things had just a bit too much of a spiritual air for my own taste, so I thought why not give a little push towards the down-to-earth direction. And that's all. To finish, here's a little quote of a Bill Bruford interview as published in ET some weeks ago which in a way fits to what I wrote above: ---------------------- 'AT: You used the word "ethics" a moment ago. To what extent do you have to be acquainted with Mr.Fripp's theories in order to be able to play in King Crimson? 'BB: (laughs) Not at all. But of course, I have grown up with Robert, and watched him develop. I suppose my intuitive feelings about music happen to coincide with his more intellectual reasoning about music. What he thinks I feel, to be simple about it. (...) 'AT: And as to listener, how much do you think he or she should know about those theories? Does it help to understand the music, or is it unnecessary? 'BB: It should be completely unnecessary, the music should work entirely on its own. And indeed, I think it does.' ---------------------------- Bye, Alex ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 16:49:36 -0400 (EDT) From: whitmd at email dot uc dot edu (Mark D. White) Subject: "The Double Trio" I must recommend the bootleg "The Double Trio" for anyone who may have been a tad disappointed with "B'Boom". IMHO, it's a much more energetic, compact recording, with pristine sound and slightly more appealing packaging. It's on the Oxygen label, OXY 053, total time:73:22, recorded live at the Nakano Sun Plaza, Tokyo, Japan, October 5, 1995. Track list (exactly as appears on the CD, spelling and track ID warts and all): 1 Instrumental intro 2:08 2 Vroom Vroom 4:51 3 Frame by Frame 5:13 4 Dinosaur 6:57 5 One Time 5:45 6 Red 6:12 7 Drum Solo 1:53 8 Vroom 6:47 9 Sex, Sleep, Eat, Drink, Dream 4:43 10 Elephant Talk 6:21 11 Indiscipline 6:44 12 The Talking Drum 3:14 13 Lark's Tongues in Aspic Part Two 6:32 14 Walking on Air 5:57 Once again, HIGHLY recommended. Mark D. White Cincinnati, OH ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 15:07:32 -0700 From: Ron Chrisley Subject: Tickets wanted for San Diego show I'd like to go to the San Diego show. Does anyone have any advice for me? Should I buy tickets from the boxoffice, or will they be terrible seats? Does anyone have a good seat ticket they can't use? Anyone want to meet up? Is anyone going from the La Jolla area that can give me a lift (I am only visiting here for a few weeks, and am thus carless and clueless...). Thanks for any help, Ron http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/ronc ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 19 Jul 1996 11:20:04 +0900 From: tsuyoshi at ask dot or dot jp (Tsuyoshi Yamayoshi) Subject: Hideyo Moriya(CGT) with E.X.T.H in Abiko city, Japan Greetings, I'm fairly new to the list, and please forgive my clumsy English. I was very lucky to have recently seen Hideyo Moriya(CGT) with E.X.T.H at a free concert on a small stage in my home town, Abiko city, Japan. The show took place on July 13th (Sat) in Abiko Civic Plaza lobby. Abiko city is 30km (19 miles) from central of Tokyo and also, HM's home town. Unlikely downtown Tokyo, it has quite a nice natural environment with some green and water. Once a month, the city government sponsors a free concert providing an opportunity to play for musicians (mostly amateur) who live in Abiko. The Civic Plaza is located in the ESPA shopping mall and that public space is utilized for an art gallery and a computer school usually, so the stage was provisional and very small. The show began at 5:30 pm and HM with E.X.T.H played as the second act.(There were totally three groups played at that night. The other two were amateur musicians) According to hand out program, E.X.T.H is Akihiko Fukuoka, Yasuo Miyagi and Keita Saito. They all joined The Guitar Craft course hold in Yamanashi pref in Japan in 92. It was originally 5 member in E.X.T.H and did the opening act for the Robert Fripp Soundscape tour in LA in Jan 95. Afterward,in summer 95,formed as it is now. It was awesome perfect show. HM lead E.X.T.H very gently and reassuringly. Most of audience(there were only 30) might not have been familiar with KC and CGT but gave them BIG compliment. The master of ceremonies, confused before the show, had asked if they were professional musicians, now he realized his mistake and fervently requested an encore (good job!). The audience gladly assented. Two E.X.T.H's originals and some of the song we might hear in Guitar Craft related album (sorry I can't specify which) were played for the show. E.X.T.H use all Ovation guitar but HM's didn't look like the other three. BBE, Eventide, A-dat, MACKIE line mixer were seen in HM's effector rack and PA system was a small RAMSA. --Tsuyoshi /Japan tsuyoshi at ask dot or dot jp ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: "Abma, Joyce C." Subject: RE: How to get your Girlfriend to Appreciate King Crimson Date: Fri, 19 Jul 96 07:57:00 EST Here's a suggestion: Locate a soundproof room with audio visual equipment and comfortable chair. Secure the girlfriend to the chair and prop the eyelids open, making sure to apply eyedrops to prevent damage. Administer a euphoria-inducing substance, show films of kittens, flowers and rainbows (every girl loves these things), and play some Crimson from every incarnation. (Warning: the girlfriend may resist at first, but you must insist that you know what is best for her and that taste is an absolute, not a relative,personal thing, which you possess a monopoly on.) The King Crimson will soon be a stimulus evoking a pleasant response, and your "problem" is solved. Oh, you wanted a serious reply? As others have posted, it would be real nice to see writing reflecting the possibility that women (yes, even American women) can and do "appreciate" K.C. and the possibility that the elephant talk list does NOT have an exlusively male audience. No one would write something like "how to get your black friend to appreciate KC". Also, although I happen to rank KC (creativity/talent/innovation/challenge, etc.) high(est?) on my list, ultimately musical preference is a matter of taste. She may never be "convinced". But try locking her in the car with some John Zorn (Painkiller, for instance) cranked, THEN switch to the Crimson - she'll think it's mainstream by comparison. See you at Merriwether (1st row!!!!) (P.S.: I violated a personal pact not to post about gender because I think the topic should take a back seat to posts about King Crimson music & personnel, the actual reason for the existence of this excellent forum. Posts from women that are defensive (women DO SO like KC) do less for downplaying the gender differences than the posts from women containing informed discussion of the music/players. (IMHO.)) Joyce ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #292 ********************************