E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 291 Monday, 15 July 1996 Today's Topics: Music Speaks Thru The Player? 21CSM Single CD of the Month club revisi Women and King Crimson CGT Transcriptions... Re: Ring Modulators, Mellotrons ... to stop a thread... Rime of the Ancient Sampler Re: THRaKaTTaK NewVisions video Fripp plays Hendrix, Crowds annoy Fripp, LOG Re: Elephant Talk Digest #290 THRaKaTTaKeD mY kLipSHOrnS mellotron on starless? Ten Seconds...... Satori/Sartori/Krimso Rerun of Crimson on Conan? 21st csm in America? Rambling on... More on the origins of Prism "You're looking for WHAT...? Concerning Music and possibly beyond mellotrons, guitarists and PSG Summing Up - Go See This Band! Women & KC; FAQ suggestion; Phila Tour Date RE: Elephant Talk Digest #290 Big Thrak Attack; The Savoy..... Mellotrons in the 90's etc Re: Hendrix Wild Colonials & Sound 21st CSM single and THRAK ATTACK THRaKaTTaCK gestalt Under Heavy Manners rare? Fripp On Ure Album/Earthbound Bald Spots and Amazing Guitars fripps gear. KC members' "folk album" with the Roches crimso Re: backward messages and Haaden Two Satori In Crimsoland Berkeley Ticket For Sale ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to et at cs dot man dot ac dot uk UNSUB/ADDRESS CHANGES: Send a message with a body of HELP to et-admin at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk, or use the DIY list machine at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/list/ ETWEB: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ (partial mirror at http://members.aol.com/etmirror/) THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmeister) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest 3.0 package. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- From: I'd like to make another call to all posters to take a second to modify the subject lines of their posts before mailing them. On days when I'm too busy to check subjects like "RE: Elephant Talk Digest #290" will slip through like they have in this issue. This is especially useless in the bulletin's we send out. Thanks for your attention. Dan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 10:14:12 -0500 From: Chris Mitchell Subject: Music Speaks Thru The Player? This discussion on the merits of music playing the musician and vice versa is quasi-interesting, but let's not get carried away in argument. Listeners have the choice of caring about the artist's motivation or not, and that's the way it should be. In the rock world, too much "music" is made from an explicit emotional standpoint, such as, the anguish of failed love, the anguish of being a misunderstood adolescent, the anguish of being socially conscious..etcetc. Perhaps I'm not alone in not being able to hear the music for all the emotional intention coming from these artists. Crimson stands apart from that area by A) focusing mainly on quality music, and B) not slamming their emotional intent down our throats. Yes, I am moved by certain songs from the KC book, but I think that's because I have the choice. It's not like The Final Cut, mentioned by Matt C., where you must be in tune with Roger Waters' intent to even remotely enjoy it. However, I realize that *music* is the actual issue, and I am as interested as anyone in the genesis of the music, whether it be VROOOM or Stravinsky's Firebird Suite or Monk's "Ruby My Dear." And in getting behind all this different music, you find out that all the top artists have their own view of the process. There is no absolute. For Fripp or McLaughlin or Jarrett, technique is learned then forgotten, so that music can speak through them. But consider John Coltrane, surely a technical and artistic heavyweight. All the interviewers in the 60s wanted to know how his playing reflected social disorder, oppression, rage, all of these things they had heard in the music. And Coltrane almost always shrugged it off and talked about scales, or harmonic substitutions, or how it was playing with Elvin Jones. Emotion undoubtedly played a part in his acts of creation, but he was careful to remind listeners of the earthly work involved, the long hours of practice, the techniques and so forth. This from the guy who made Love Supreme sound like it was issued from heaven. Just my two pennies. Chris. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 19:14:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Christie Subject: 21CSM Single Can anyone tell me where I can get my hands on the aforementioned CD single? It's making me crazy reading all the reviews posted and not be able to hear the dang thing. On a related note, I found THRaKaTTaCK at both Virgin Megastore and Tower Records in SoCal. On sale for $13.99 at Tower, go get 'em, it's a great CD. Talk about glorious noise. Christie ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: 11 Jul 1996 10:55:00 -0500 From: "Jonathan Block" Subject: CD of the Month club revisi All this talk of an official bootleg of the month club reminds me that I posted some ideas in March 1995 (ET #176) about this. I don't want to reprint the message so you can check the Web archives if interested. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: rhea at sas dot upenn dot edu (Rhea A Frankel) Subject: Women and King Crimson Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 13:03:58 -0400 (EDT) Hi. I want to correct the misconception that pops up here occassionally that women don't like or can't appreciate King Crimson. I'm a 21 year old women who has been a Crimson fan for the last three years. I've seen them three times in concert already, and I plan to see them in Hershey for the HORDE show and in Philly this August. I'm really excited about the Philly show, because I'm bringing two friends along (both female) who are just getting into Crimson. I just want you all to know that we are out here. And I'm not the only woman at these concerts either. Rhea Frankel ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: drl at eng dot cam dot ac dot uk Date: Thu, 11 Jul 96 18:08:10 BST Subject: CGT Transcriptions... Just a quickie: anyone know where to get hold of a transcription of Yamanashi Blues played by The Robert Fripp String Quintet on Unknown Public 5: Eclectic Guitars? Failing that, anyone want to have a go at transcribing it with me? I've got all of eight bars worth done already 8) Ciao, David (drl at eng dot cam dot ac dot uk) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 10:58:02 -0700 From: Michael Tanigawa Subject: Re: Ring Modulators, Mellotrons ... other than Yes and early Genesis, my favourite use of Mellotron outside King Crimson comes from a (sadly) little-known band called Greenslade - a trio of tracks called Time, Tide and Catalan. The Moody Blues were also frequent users of the beastie. There are a number of bands that have used the mellotron more recently (ie, 80s and 90s). One that springs to mind is XTC, who used it to great effect on the 1983 song "All you pretty girls". However no-one, and I mean NO-ONE uses a mellotron like King Crimson! A couple of months ago KFJC (Foothill Junior College; Los Altos Hills, CA) broadcast a mellotron retrospective "Tales of the 8-second Orchestra". Unfortunately I did not have a tape recorder running at the time. There were some surprises, such as the Bee Gees' "Every Christian Lion-Hearted Man Will Show You". It was mentioned that Andy McCullough (from the "Lizard" album) played drums for Greenslade. They seem to be one of the great forgotten progressive bands. Their records are impossible to find in the local stores. At Tower Records in Mountain View, there is a "Dave Greenslade" bin which has been empty for many months. Caravan uses a mellotron in the 22-minute piece "Nine Feet Underground". Also Cream in (I think) "Badge". But the mellotron in both of these examples is very easy to miss. Mike Tanigawa ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 16:46:44 -0400 (EDT) From: terry kroetsch f Subject: to stop a thread... Please, I beg of you, do not start a girlfriend/wife thread. Nobody cares about this. Keep your boyfriend,girlfriend,spouse to yourself. I sure don't care about it and know plenty female KC enthusiasts. On to musical things: Doc Severin's cover of ItCotCK is HYSTERICAL! *------------------------------------------------------------------- always signal, never start a sentence with *Personally, I...* and say thankyou, thankyou, thankyou, thankyou, thankyou, thankyou, thankyou ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 17:52:05 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: Rime of the Ancient Sampler >Anyone interested in the Mellotron, as one reader apparently is, should check >out a CD called "Rime of the ancient sampler", whereon the likes of Pat Moraz >and others do tunes on the Mellotron. I wanted to love this record, and lord knows I tried, but it seems like everyone involved decided to make the wussiest string synth disco garbage or limpid ballad drivel they could muster, even, to the best of my recollection, Patrick Moraz (sorry, Gary!) and Mike Pinder. In fact, the only artist who even attempted to exploit the Mellotron's equally valid proclivity to produce evil, malevolent scarescapes was some yahoo name of David Cross... But even DC couldn't surpass his own glory years plunking those keys for KC. All joking aside, no one has ever been more adept at using the Mellotron than Crimson. The instrument may be best known for "Strawberry Fields Forever" or "Knights in White Satin," but no one can beat Mssrs. Fripp, Cross and Collins for sheer noise terror with this unruly keyboard. Just check out "Mars" on _In the Wake of Poseidon_, "Sailors Tale" on _Islands_ and _Earthbound_, and virtually the entire second side of _Lizard_ (IMHO one of the finest and most underrated expanses of music ever, once Jon Anderson stops his damn yawping) to hear what this instrument can really do. Of course, I could be totally wrong. Steve Smith ssmith at kochint dot com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 15:40:05 -0700 From: gondola at deltanet dot com (E.B.) Subject: Re: THRaKaTTaK Just a quick note: It surprises me to hear so many people complaining about not being able to find THRaKaTTaK. I'm in California, and I found the disc quite easily at my local Wherehouse (a very poorly stocked mainstream record chain). In fact, there were FOUR copies, even though the only other Crimson discs stocked were Thrak and the Vrooom EP (one copy each). Shrug.... My two cents? The disc is well worth buying, but it's for fans only. And even this longtime fan admits that there will be plenty of records this year I like better. (My fave records of 1996 so far include Patti Smith, Golden Smog, Beck, Bob Mould and Stereolab, none of which have much appeal for this list, I fear.) Regards, GB *---------------------------------------------------------------- "Insanity is a blue St. Bernard, waiting patiently and faithfully by the door." - overheard (unfortunately) on an IRC channel ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 16:03:11 -0700 From: ca dot qc at bdi dot hcc dot com (CA QC) Subject: NewVisions video Does anyone have a video tape of the VH1 New Visions show from years back featuring Robert Fripp and a League of Crafty Guitarists? It appears that I lost my copy :-( --Thomas B please respond to me privately at ca dot qc at bdi dot hcc dot com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 20:12:37 -0700 From: Josh Emery Subject: Fripp plays Hendrix, Crowds annoy Fripp, LOG Hi all, >this woman who was clapping to "Sheltering Sky", to the >point that many people were "ssshh"ing or started yelling by >the end of the song. You are lucky thats all that happened. At one KC show I was at they started Sheltering Sky and when Fripp played the first solo licks a few people in the audience clapped. He looked right at Adrian and nodded. Adrian took over and RF played no more during Sheltering Sky. We only got to hear half the song. >"Hearing the opening chords to 'Purple Haze' moved me more than the >entire canon of the classical guitar". Dave Ewing quoting Fripp I remember reading or hearing this also. >But, all of a sudden, he broke into Hendrix's "Foxy Lady", playing the >first 10-15 seconds or so A friend of mine was at a Frippertronics show and during the questions and answers someone asked Fripp something about Purple Haze chord structure and RF immediately demonstrated it. My friend was shocked "Out of nowhere he just ripped Purple Haze. It was amazing." Whether he liked him or not the count is up to 2 Hendrix tunes he can play. Buy thrang thrang gozinblx. I could go on forever about how listening to this disc transported me back in time but I'll keep it as short as possible. A month after I graduated from High School I saw TLOG at Club 57. I loved KC and new absolutely nothing of TLOG other than RF was in it. When the band finally comes on (very late) Fripp announces this is a dance band you are on a dance floor, how about a little dancing. And away they go. It was incredible. Fripp rips as he does in no other band through all of it. Talk about high energy. Fripp was soaking wet. He was wearing a tight tee shirt under a sport jacket and it was soaked. He moved the entire time and left the stool on more than a few occasions. No one danced. It was one of the first shows in the US - when they came back at the end of the tour everyone danced. Anyway two songs into the show Fripp says "You call this dancing?" We were all packed so close to the stage no one could move. There was a guy close to me who was worshiping. I'm serious, hands folded in front of his face - eyes closed. He did that the whole show and if anyone yelled things out at Fripp (there were some who did not approve) the worshipers eyes would open, look in the shouters direction and the expletives would fly. I've gone on way too long. BUT my point is I have TLOG studio cd and 3 or 4 boots (including one of the last gig in which Fripp states he enjoyed playing in TLOG more than any other band) and none come close to thrang thrang gozinbulx. I'd forgotten all of this 'til I put that cd on. Josh P.S. In the thrang thrang gozinbulx liner notes a quote from Fripp's journal says "Barry cannot afford the $290 for a new organ." At the show you could see his organ was literally falling apart, keys were missing it was a wreck. On one of the boots Fripp says something like this is where I get to win over the audience with wit... when any fool can see we don't have enough equipment. We do however have a spare snare. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 21:31:03 -0400 (EDT) From: CRIMSO Subject: Re: Elephant Talk Digest #290 The story from the Gentleman who discussed a banner satori in Crimsoland, Im sure one thousand people will reply...so i will make it 1001 and assure him that Crimso was an accurate "nickname" for our beloved band in the 70's....this also can be accurately described in detail by reading the fascinating road and press clippings accompanying the Frame by Frame box set....so there you have it....tootles Tim Ritter Electromechanical Territory Manager Parker Hannifin ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 21:36:41 From: cbarber at gnn dot com (CHARLES BARBER) Subject: THRaKaTTaKeD mY kLipSHOrnS Ladies, Gentlemen, Crimheads and Honored Guests, *************WARNING************* If you are daring and fortunate enough to have ordered and received your copy of THRaKaTTaK, to preserve the integrity of your household, take the following precautions before letting "the cat out of the bag" and assaulting your domain(s): 1. Put kitty away in the bathroom. Otherwise you'll either kill the poor creature, or diminish the nine-lives factor greatly. 2. Nail, or super glue everything of value down, because as I have witnessed, the artwork will leap from your walls and observe the laws of gravity, and/or loose items will follow the same route in a similar manner. something like Newtons fourth law of nature (AKA the 'Fripp factor'). 3. Advise your neighbors that an earthquake is forcast for the immediate area and it would be wise to go visit the shore, hurricane or not. But if you are really fortunate enough to have KC litterate neighbors, invite them over for a gin and surprise them with your new found 'toy'! 4. Be very sure that your sound system is well tuned up and oiled properly. Failure to do a pre-launch check may be fatal to your system. The reward in this is a smooth liftoff into the uncharted reaches of outer space! 5. Enjoy!! Imagine the best soundtrack to the wildest movie ever created; thus you have THRaKaTTaK! See you at Hershey Park, The Merriweather, and The Mann Music Centre. CJB ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 18:39:35 -0700 From: "J.P.Lewis" Subject: mellotron on starless? Is the mellotron the string-sounding instrument that opens Starless? (for those saying KC is not god, of course, but listen to this composition.) Also, who plays this instrument. *----------------------------------------------------------------------- j.p.lewis i n t e r v a l r e s e a r c h palo alto ca zilla at interval dot com 415 842 6113 http://www.idiom.com/~zilla ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: "Fred Raimondi" Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 18:48:05 -0700 Subject: Ten Seconds...... For any of you who haven't heard the "Ten Seconds" album. DO IT NOW!!!! This albums kicks ass and is a MUST for any Crimson/Fripp fan. Robert Does a lot of playing on the record, the compositions are really cool, and I defy anyone to sit still during the opening strains of the tune "Realside". You can order it from the good people at Possible Productions....... Later...... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 19:22:04 -0700 From: Malcolm Humes Subject: Satori/Sartori/Krimso Jason Smith writes: >I was talking with a Crimson fan before the show >(who incedentally was also a deadhead...anyway) who displayed for me with >a gleam of pride the banner he made for the evenings performance. It was >about 4x3' and read "Satori in Crimsoland". To me this made absolutely >NO sense so I gave a polite "how nice" smile. The "Satori" was obviously >a misspelling of "SaRtori" (the album "Beat" features the proper spelling >which anyone unsure could EASILY consult) but "CRIMSOLAND"? No idea. My >friend told me that this was a reference to Crimson (obviously) and that >the band was known sort of endearingly as "Crimso" in the 70's. I was >just wondering if this were actually the case. These guys were nice and >pretty cool, but I've met my share of people who SEEM to know things I >later find to be complete falsehoods. I also tend to be skeptical of >ANYONE who grossly misspells a song title that is easily consulted, >especially when in making a banner to be displayed AT the bands show. Do >any more experienced Crimsonites know if this was a truism or a falsehood? Well, if a bunch of guys say they loving knew Crimson as Crimso then it's true, at least for that set of people, right? ;^) Anyway, the Young Person's Guide and Frame by Frame booklets I think detail a story of some letter or press using that term in the late 60's or 70's and the liner notes have perpetuated that term. I thought maybe it was Krimso though. Has a better ring to me than the occasionally used CrimHeads at least... Regarding Sartori and Satori, have you checked a dictionary? I've oft wondered about the Crimso song title as it seems to me to perhaps be a typo or at least a word play. Sartorial has to do with mens clothing. Satori is spiritual enhlightenment. The Crimheads in Clevelend were more likely interested in Satori and experiencing it I think, than in men's clothing. Though given Fripp's snappy dressing I would imagine the Crimson song could be about his clothing, or maybe spiritual enlightenment through clothing? - malcolm mal at emf dot net http://sunsite.unc.edu/mal/MO/philm/ - Philm Freax photo gallery preview ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 22:32:43 -0700 From: Bob Makoski Organization: Exhibit A Subject: Rerun of Crimson on Conan? So far in this season of TV reruns, I have yet to see the Conan O'Brien show with King Crimson as the musical guest being rerun. Anyone out there have any idea when it might be shown? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 00:27:34 PST Subject: 21st csm in America? From: alstew at juno dot com (Al Stewart) Hello again, I'd like to thank you all for the answer's to my previous questions. I'd like to now ask where I can purchase this C.D. ep of the 5 version's of 21csm? Is it available in America, or will it be soon like Thrak Attack which I just bought 'off the shelf' here in Connecticut? Thanks, Al Ps- I will have to make a comment at some point reguarding Religion & Music as I understand it from a Biblical point of view! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Thu, 11 Jul 1996 21:18:26 -0700 From: Stan Jones Organization: Simple Logic Subject: Rambling on... ETers, A couple of thangs. The tongue drum: There was a rather in-depth article in (I believe) Wood Craft magazine on constructing your own tongue drum. I was at a party, probably around 1988, and the fellow who's house we were at had the mag there. Never got back in touch with him, so lost track of the issue, but if someone's really interested they could seek it out in a library. That was pretty vague, ehh? The bazillion bestist most goodist guitar players in all the universes: Please people, don't even go there! Art is such a personal thing, never a competition (if indeed it's art). Best at what, finger picking, tapping, speed, riff writting? You can't compare any gutarists, its a matter of personal tastes, who you happen to like listening to at the moment. These lists of 'bests' are either reader or writer polls, THEY MEAN NOTHING. An interesting interview (a little dated) can be found at http://www.moosenet.com/keneally.html . Its Mike Keneally's home page, if you don't know of him, check it out, he's probably the best guitar player in the world (couldn't resist). I shall surface again at the appropriate moment. Stan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Gongwoman at aol dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 03:02:31 -0400 Subject: More on the origins of Prism Greetings fellow Pachyderm Yappers: I for one was ecstatic when I heard Bill, Pat & Adrian come out and do Prism at the close of the Berkeley show last year. I am a big fan of Pierre Favre and was quite pleasantly surprised to see my favorite band take on one of my all time fave percussion pieces. For anyone who is not already privy to the creative work of Pierre Favre and who would like to hear the original version of Prism as well as a plethora of other amazing compositions for four percussionists, may I suggest that you go out and find "Pierre Favre Ensemble - Singing Drums" 1984 ECM Records. It's a wonderful listening experience with incomparable performances by Pierre Favre, Fredy Studer, Paul Motian, and Nana Vasconcelos. You will not be disappointed. Happy listening! Karen (gongwoman at aol dot com) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: George Wiles/G33 Subject: "You're looking for WHAT...? Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 07:54:13 -0400 I've been in many stores looking for Thrang Thrang, but since few stores maintain a Crimson section, much less a Fripp or a League of Anything section, I've had no luck. Could you successful purchasers please tell me how you found it filed? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Olivier Malhomme Subject: Concerning Music and possibly beyond Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 15:26:05 +0200 (MET DST) I am rather surprised of some of the reactions displayed after my posting about the (I believe) senseless debate on who should play or not what and when. Wich post tok us to the roots of Mr Fripp considering about Music (as I understood it), basically through his belief, the work of Gurdjieff before him, and the way suppose (since we don't know the man we are just supposing on the basis of what we heard of him, OK?). I never meant in no way that KC was a god. I am still not used to people accusing you of things they so strongly hate that they see them everywhere. Like Matt C. said, I'm not interested in myths. Nor in religion since I appears not being involved in any, and especially not in the one pretending using Man as a substitute for God (any God). Obviously I was not followed by everyone wich is fair, and attacked by some for untold reason, wich is not fair. To add a few things to what Matt said, things that are just connected to my own opinion: When I say music in a being, it is not as a god or whatever, but rather in a platonician sense, if I may say so (Platon would not agree). I see it a living being. That's all. I personnaly do take a lot of interest in the way people "do" what they do wich is the most important thing to me. Why do I think so? Because Art (or whatever) in just the form of a complex set of events incuding the artist, the world that generated him (or her), the kind of "Art" engaged, the degree of commitment, etc. So I do not only respond to art emotionnaly. To me stopping at the emotionnal stage, is like deciding wether someone is interesting or not only by looking at his (her) face, or breast, or ass or whatever. Definetely the form used by the person, certainly not the whole. You just have to dig deeper to find if you share/want to share lore important things with this person or not (even if we do act like we only care for the surface, sometime). So let us go deeper inside the music, if we could have the same involvement in litening that there is in transmitting music (sorry, I do stick to transmitting). If we were more mature, achieved human being, perhapswe could happen to know the one playing. In fact some are able to do that. Listening to Glenn Gould speaking of Bach or Schoenberg shows a real hearted, deep knowledge of the men,one you can only access through their music sonce it is obviously difficult to meet them otherwise. Most of us are not able to do that. I am not. But I work on it, to be able to know more the people whose work I like, and that I grew to care for, even I don't know them. I hope to manage, and one day, to be able to MEET them THAT particuliar way. Well Ok, t'was long (and brillig). I am not expecting everyone to agree with me bur please consider avoiding faming me for things taht were not said. Olivier Malhomme ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 09:52:29 -0400 From: jwc146 at psu dot edu (Sir James) Subject: mellotrons, guitarists and PSG First off I would like to correct something that has now appeared in the last couple of issues. A question was asked about who uses mellotrons. Well obviously KC, early Genisis, and most importantly (and perhaps more than anybody else) the Moody Blues, who used it all the time, but as a HUGE and LONG TIME YES fan I must correct a mistake that has been repeated a few times here at ET. YES' use of a mellotron was NOT significant. I'd like to know where the mellotron was supposidly played. It is known that Tony Kaye, in both the early years and the 80's, did NOT use one because he disliked them. Yes, Wakeman used one, but it's use is SO rare that it is not even worth mentioning, and again he also disliked useing them. And I am pretty confideant in saying that FRAGILE was the *only* album he used one on. So don't look to YES for a mellotron. On to other business: >Well what has Howe done that >could be considered inovative (and >progressive) since 1975? ;-) Well I admit, it has been a while, but he did have a few more years, and he had a resurgence in 1989, and now with the *new* epic YES songs, we can now see just how far into progressiveism he has gone. Also and most importantly in this conversation, his level of progressiveism has no relevance to his ability as a guitar player. He could be playing pop songs and it really wouldn't matter. His proficientcy has nothing to do with the type of music he wishes to play. I think Mr. PSG has confused these two concepts, as he went on and on about this, yet the fact remains one is independent from the other. AS far as the legitamacy of 'sloppy' play, well I guess this is a similar conversation to those who deem extreme abstract/modern art as art and those who say that 'my 5 year old child could paint this.' I guess it depends on how conservative or liberal a person is. Well once again, thanks for all the posts and responses, it is greatly appreciated!! Buh-bye for now!! Jim ************************************************************************* "I was driving on the freeway and I saw a hitch hiker holding a sign that said 'heaven,' so I hit 'em...he seemed like a nice guy, so he probably made it." --Stephen Wright ************************************************************************* ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Khosatral at aol dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 10:06:39 -0400 Subject: Summing Up - Go See This Band! Touching on Fripp worship, Thrak Attack, HORDE tour etc. .... Bear with me, this is going somewhere. B'Boom has been in heavy rotation for me lately. It seems to fit with a hectic summer. Despite the DAT limitations, I really been drawn into these versions and know them very well. By chance I was stuck in traffic and came upon a tape of Thrak and old KC material I made in preparation for a KC gig last August. I popped it in. Much B'Boom overlap. But I found myself missing some of the density of the B'Boom versions. I have not heard (much less seen) Thrak Attack. The descriptions, though, tell me it is even further evolved. Conclusion 1: This line up is creating--yes creating--something wholly new using old stuff as a guide. Late night, open window breezes suggested Lizard the other night. With the aid of a very fine alt, one of those perfect moments intrudes. Fripp's jazzy vamping very much prefigure the space Belew will fill. The horns and woodwinds, the space Fripp will later take. All of it anticipates the current crop of pseudo-eclectics like the Dave Matthews Band (I recall that my first intro to DMB was in a Time or Newsweek mag review which actually compared him to Fripp. How wrong they were.) But this also explains why it is not insane to expect some percentage of HORDE goers might "get" Crimson. Conclusion 2: Fripp & Co. have been about 20 years ahead of their time. From this comes the declaration that as much live material from this line-up as possible must be released. That and anyone who can has a near duty to go see this growing, mutating beast in action. Fripp is not holy, but this thing he is coaxing along is damn special. Kho ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 10:13:23 -0500 From: Lisa Wetherby Subject: Women & KC; FAQ suggestion; Phila Tour Date Hey. Long time lurker, first time poster. In #290, Mike Clark requested girlfriend-warming tips relevant to KC. As a woman who was turned onto the band by my boyfriend -- now husband (be careful, this may be cause & effect!) -- I'd have to say that my route into being INTO the band was definitely Adrian. (No apologies to the purists!) Since I also like Talking Heads/David Byrne, it may be that the lightheartedness of some of Adrian's songs (Motor Bungalow) the quirkiness of his subject matter (Lone Rhinocerous) or his emotionality (as opposed to Fripp's intellectuality?) would also appeal to Mike's lady friend. Although I REALLY HATE to support any dichotomy along the "women are emotional/men are intellectual" line -- how many women do YOU know who proudly demonstrate their gastrointestinal rumblings? -- I have to admit that I FELT a strong connection to Adrian's solo (and Bears) music that eventually led me to appreciate the rest of KC. I saw them at the Tower last year and was absolutely blown away by the double trio. But even before that I would willingly slip a KC disc/tape into the old player. Actually, since my husband also likes the likes of Trent, and more recently, Rage Against the Machine, I have been known to beg for Crimson. I love the serenity of "Mate Kudesai (sp?), "I Talk to the Wind," etc. and the fun of "Catfood." I also think the lyrics are at least as important to me (gasp!) as the music. Maybe that's a girl thing? Check it out with yours. Two last things: Why not put things like "What language is Mate Kudesai?" and "What does Thela Hun Gingeet mean?" on the FAQ? They (local radio -- WXPN, to be specific -- the ET Tour Dates list, and various other sources) seem finally have reached a consensus that KC will be playing the Mann in Phila on the TWENTY SIXTH of August. Hopefully tickets will go on sale soon! lisaw at weightman dot com >>>>>> "It's sad that a family can be torn apart by something as simple as a pack of wild dogs." -- Jack Handy. <<<<<<< ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 96 10:20:30 EDT From: "MODERN ANGEL O:)" Subject: RE: Elephant Talk Digest #290 Just a quickie: Someone who posted (and by the time I get to the end of an issue I can't even remember my _own_ name. My apologies. ;) ) corrected the spelling of someone's spelling of his "Satori In Crimsonland" banner, noting that it should've read "sartori", as this was the way it was spelt on "Beat". I've seen the "r" spelling on some pressings of "Beat" and on the "Frame by Frame" box, but I think the former spelling, sans "r", is the one intended. While Mr. Fripp is, no doubt, a natty dresser, I think it was enlightenment, and not fashion sense, that he had in mind when titling the song (perhaps a nod to Burroughs?). Just a thought. Paul ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 10:24:22 -0400 From: "Gordon Emory Anderson" Subject: Big Thrak Attack; The Savoy..... Although we've all probably heard enough on Thrak Attack, I'll nevertheless share (ie, force-feed) my experience with it. Having bugged the Red Bank NJ store about it for about a month now, they finally got it in and I snagged it. From the start, its visual appearence tells you it is different from all previous KC releases. Basically, I have two main comments about it. First of all, because it has no guaranteed meter or tune, and because it is totally improvised, you find yourself listening very carefully. With a regular beat, there is a tendancy sometimes not to listen as deeply because, let's face it--the future of that beat at least is known. It is a "low entropy" piece of information. In the case of Thrak Attack, you find yourself constantly on the lookout for the ideas of six individuals as they come whizzing past. So it sort of transcends the concepts of "good' and "bad", if for no other reason than because it holds your attention for a solid hour. Another thing I noticed, and which caused me some dissatisfaction, is that many times during the record the band seemed to avoid forming a gestalt. I got the impression that no one wanted to commit to any one idea that was emerging, almost out of politeness or something. Sometimes something really cool was happening, but it still it seemed the band did not want to get on board this thing and let it go where it would. Although there are great ideas all over this thing, Thrak sometimes seems almost noncomittal. My guess is that the band members love this group so much, everyone is afraid of stepping on toes by pushing out in a certain direction. This ties in with previous comments on this list that this version of KC has by no means explored its full potential yet. As for the Savoy, last year at Town hall in NYC, Belew stated something like "can you believe its been 12 years?" I couldn't help but think the feeling of some of those early dates still resonated in his mind. -Emory. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: mcarton at bancroft dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 08:26:42 -0400 Subject: Mellotrons in the 90's etc Alex Brugger's takes on mellotrons in ET 289 was as follows: >other groups with mellotrons: >old: Yes and Genesis used to use them; Rick Wakeman used two at a >time at his >concerts. >new: .....hmmm, I'm not from Sweden, but come to think of it I only >know Swedish >bands that use mellotrons these days. I haven't heard Anekdoten, although they do sound a bit interesting. Bands who have used the mellotron in the 90's (aside from KC, and these are just the bands that I know of) include: 1). the Red Hot Chili Peppers on "BloodSugarSexMagic" ("Breaking the Girl" and the coda to "Sir Psycho Sexy"); 2). Soundgarden on "Superunknown" ("Mailman", to chilling effect); 3). Pearl Jam on "Vitalogy" (couldn't tell you the song); 4). REM on one of the songs from "Monster"; and, finally, 5). an obscure band called the Indians who did a song called "Look up to the Sky" that is unbelieveable. If you come across their eponymous album, it's worth it just for that song. As an aside for those of you here in the US who don't yet have "THraKaTTak" (or however the hell you spell it) -- you guys are missing out. I picked it up at Camelot Records at Embarcadero 2 in San Francisco. It is superb. Log off your email and buy it now. mfc ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: mcarton at bancroft dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 08:24:42 -0400 Subject: Re: Hendrix It's been awhile since I have posted anything here, but I wanted to take the time to respond to jwc146 at psu dot edu (Sir James)'s comment in ET #288 in re: Hendrix: >. Why is he [Hendrix] #1--yes I realize he started an >entire new genre or style, but c'mon, the man couldn't even read >music! I >am sure there are alot more proficient guitarists out there, >IE--ROBERT >FRIPP. Fripp could play Hendrix stuff, but could Jimi play Fripp >stuff--I >don't think so! Now, I don't wish to flame jwc@psu (is that Penn State, by the way?), but that statement is too completely bizarre to even comprehend. Beethoven, Ludwig Bloody Van (to name a famous musician) couldn't hear his music -- does that make him any less a genius? Keep in mind, I am not a HUUUUGE Hendrix fan, although I certainly appreciate his brilliance, regardless of whether he could read music or not. As it is, many of the great musicians of the 20th century couldn't read music -- Django Reinhardt (hell, he couldn't even read or sign his name), Muddy Waters...some would even put Pat Metheny down as a great musician (I wouldn't), and he, admittedly, cannot read a note. Hendrix, by the time of his death, could play in virtually any style of his choosing, whether it be blues (influenced by Buddy Guy and Robert Johnson) or jazz (influenced by Django Reinhardt, Wes Montgomery & Charlie Christian). Had he lived, he would probably have mastered classical and cross-picking long before anyone else. Sure, RF can play Hendrix, if he so chooses. That RF is a genius and should be rated higher than #51 on that stupid and superfluous list goes without saying. But Jimi could play any damn thing he pleased. And he did. And though he couldn't read a note, he was quite simply one of the greatest STUDENTS of the guitar of this century. Hendrix, like Fripp, like McLaughlin, like Montgomery, like Christian, like Reinhardt, like Hubert Sumlin, like Maybelle Carter, like Joe Louis Walker, like John Scofield -- hell, even Steve Hackett and Steve Howe -- did not simply start "a new genre or style". All of those above-mentioned artists took everything that they had around them and molded it all into their own particular vision. I don't think there can be any doubt that Hendrix is #1. But certainly the androids who make lists up should know a little bit more about music before they put RF at #51. (Like, I'm sure, he gives a rat's ass about any such list in the first place). Anyway, thanks for letting me put my $.02 in and delay my workday by forty-five minutes. Now for some coffee... Matt Carton [This post was not censored, but please refrain from flames or foul language in future posts. We'd like to think we're a family digest :^) - Dan] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 09:59:13 +0100 From: ggc Subject: Wild Colonials & Sound >From DSMRNGDO at aol dot com I'm interested to hear what people thought of the sound on the recent tour through Europe. On last years tour I thought the sound at the Warfield was just satisfactory, the same is true for the show later in the year at Zellerbach in Berkeley. As this is a open air tour with larger venues, I wonder what is in store as they will probably use the system already in place for the HORDE shows.This means they will almost assuredly rent a separate system for the west coast + Mexico run to start, and another set of equipment for the close in the east. I hope the sound was great in Europe. Nothing is more frustrating than to go to a show and see a band that is clearly wailing, only to hear muffled madness,( Do you hear this Mr. Clapton, Mr. Petty) This is clearly not the place to chince. the musice will only sound as good as the system can reproduce. Trey if you're checking this, may I recommend Ultra Sound in San Rafael CA. On a different note, Vernon Reid is no longer being listred as the opener for the Greek in Berkeley. It is now being listed as Wild Colonials. Anybody know anything about this? Is VR in this band? Yes I would love to get together with a couple of other ETers in Berkeley count me in.Personally I hope KC would just do almost a show of all improv. Keeps them on their toes, if they play for us this band won't last long, they need to play for themselves and let us enjoy it. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 13:34:07 -0400 (EDT) From: whitmd at email dot uc dot edu (Mark D. White) Subject: 21st CSM single and THRAK ATTACK I just picked up the 21st Century Schizoid Man single and THRAK ATTACK at Everybody's Records in Cincinnati, OH. The single is great - actually, I think I like the Earthbound version the best (I expected to like the 1969 one the best, but we all make mistakes). The single was an import, but the THRAK ATTACK may have been domestic - there was no IMPORT sticker, and it only cost $12.99, but then again, this store does often sell imports for domestic prices - don't look a gift horse in the mouth! I see a lot of posts to this list from Cincinnati, so if anybody out there can get to Everybody's, they at least had it once - they can get it again (Harry's a big KC fan!). Mark D. White Cincinnati, OH ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: ETmirror at aol dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 20:13:30 -0400 Subject: THRaKaTTaCK gestalt In a message dated 96-07-12 10:33:39 EDT, Gordon_Emory_Anderson at notes dot cc dot bellcore dot com (Gordon Emory Anderson) writes: > Another thing I noticed, and which caused me some dissatisfaction, is that many > times during the record the band seemed to avoid forming a gestalt. I got the > impression that no one wanted to commit to any one idea that was emerging, > almost out of politeness or something. Sometimes something really cool was > happening, but it still it seemed the band did not want to get on board this > thing and let it go where it would. Although there are great ideas all over > this thing, Thrak sometimes seems almost noncomittal. Hmmm... this one moves me to post (hey I'm allowed too :^). I think it important to remember that THRaKaTTaCK is a compilation of many middle sections of live THRAK. Fripp has seemlessly put them end to end and it is easy to forget that what you are listening to is not in fact one long piece. Therefore when it seems like perhaps the band doesn't commit to one idea that emerges, its in part due to the limitation they are setting. However, interviews with band members posted here have revealed that there are collective ideas that guide each night's performance of the middle section. Maybe they'll play a quiet section, maybe Fripp will lead, maybe Adrian will play more MIDI piano. As improvs go, I hear more "No Warning"-like performances in THRaKaTTaCK than "Providence"-like performances. Back to you, Dan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 23:07:37 -0400 From: gut at lglobal dot com (Michael W.) Subject: Under Heavy Manners rare? I just picked up(on Vinyl) Under Heavy Manners/God Save the Queen. To my understanding, this is not available on CD at this time. I know that two of the cuts are on God Save the King, but the rest are not. Does that make this album rare? Was picking up a EX+ copy for $5 CDN a bargain? Along the same lines, does anyone know the reasoning behind the track selection on God Save the King? Why not all the tracks from League of Gentlemen? I don't think that album(LOG) in its entirety is available on CD. Thanks for any responses & info. Mike Michael Wiegand Grand Unified Theory gut at lglobal dot com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: Enoboy at aol dot com Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 22:27:51 -0400 Subject: Fripp On Ure Album/Earthbound I recently, on a complete whim, bought a new CD by Midge Ure. For those who may have forgotten, Mr. Ure replaced John Foxx in the later version of the seminal band, Ultravox. I have been half listening to the CD and just looked at the liner notes. YES, a Robert Fripp is listed on 2 tracks playing "Soundscape" guitar. One track has real Fripp soloing;the other is useless. Any theories as to how Ure and Fripp hooked up? BTW, this album is not recommended and should only be purchased by the most diehard Ultravox fans!!!! As an afterthought, why does discussion of the album "Earthbound" keep coming up, like some zombie rising from the dead? Even at the time it was released, and I was there then, it was regarded as THE WORST KC album of all time. Let it die again!!!! Protect yourselves and purchase "Great Deceiver". Henry Finke ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Sat, 13 Jul 1996 07:47:45 -0400 From: sid smith <106050 dot 2211 at compuserve dot com> Subject: Bald Spots and Amazing Guitars A review of the second gig at the Shepherds Bush Empire appeared in a UK national paper, The Sunday Telegraph on 7th July 1996. The UK mainstream press rarely give bands like KC the light of day, concentrating on bands with a much broader appeal. However, they've come up trumps on this ocassion, giving Crimson one of the most positive and witty reviews that I recall seeing outside of the music press - or even within the music press come to think of it. The journalist who gave the thumbs up was Tobias Hill. Under the witty headline of Bald spots and amazing guitars the article includes some choice quotes such as; "Because more than anything else, King Crimson are a serious guitar band. You can tell from the audience. They mime chord changes on their leather trousered knees while Fripp, Belew, Levin and Gunn play like the Four Axemen of the Apocalypse." "Technically brilliant and nearing 30, King Crimson are one of the great rock dynasties", "There are expressions of joy and reverence on the faces of men wonen and children - well no, not children, actually. Not many wonen either, come to think of it. The audience King Crimson attract all look remarkably like King Crimson: from above, the dance floor is a blinding sea of bald spots" "What they (the audience) want is amazing guitars. And for the most part, amazing guitars is what they get. King Crimson play without putting a chord wrong all night." The two column review also contains an almost regal photgraph of a firmly seated Fripp taken at the gig. Nice one Sunday Telegraph. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 1996 23:06:40 +1000 (EST) From: Sean Curtin Subject: fripps gear. Greetings all Elephant talkers. This is my first letter to EC mag. Well after buying THRaKaTTaK and listening to it and thinking it's great I couldn't help but notice in the linear notes that it says Fripp uses Fernandes guitars. To my knowledge he is currently using a Tokai les paul copy and various effects after he was told he was nuts to cart around his les paul custom. Could some one enlighten me here please. Oh if this is in the FAQ, please excuse me. One more thing. Who really cares what Fripp thinks of Hendrix. You either like or dislike someone, does it really effect the music? Read you around ET readers. Sean Curtin 83 Piper St, Tamworth, NSW, Australia. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: GKobal at aol dot com Date: Sun, 14 Jul 1996 22:59:54 -0400 Subject: KC members' "folk album" with the Roches I'm surprised to find very few references to RF's work with the Roches, those goofy folk-trio sisters who cut a few decent albums (particularly "The Roches, 1979", "Nurds", and "Keep On Doing, 1982"). "The Roches" and "Keep On Doing, 1980" were produced by Fripp. In addition to Terre Roche's wonderful soft voice at the close of Exposure's side one (Mary), and her searing screeches on Exposure's side two (Exposure, I May Have Had Enough) you can find some outrageous late-night party chatter between the sisters (all three? I'm not sure) on the original vinyl edition on the League of Gentlemen. I was very disappointed in the CD reissue of LOG, I cannot justify why all of the vocals were deleted. Can anyone justify this for me or at least console me that LOG will be reissued with all original content. When it first came out I was 16 and was the best "punk"-derived music at the time. It blew my mind and still does. I'm going out to pick up the new live one tomorrow. Anywho, back to the Roches, and in particular, their record "Keep on Doing". Produced by Fripp, the record features Bruford, Levin, and Fripp along side the sister's acoustic guitars and singing. There is some gorgeous moments on this disk and Fripp keeps peeking through with some very poignant playing (check out "Losing True") and even a bit of Frippertronics. Fripp enthusiasts should have this disk in their collection, and I think it' should also be included in Possible Productions catalog if it's still in print. On another note, take a listen to Daryl Hall's Fripp-produced disk, "Sacred Songs". My copy is Japan import -- paid $50 for it and it's worth every penny. Fripp takes over the album completely on almost every cut. Why was this pulled from general release so quickly after being introduced in 79(?, or was it 80?). It is a very strong "pop" album, peppy tunes, great performances. I'll be waiting patiently to see KC at Horde on Randall's Island. Saw concert date listings for August -- I can't get to Asbury Park, only when I listen to USA. Is there a possibility for the Longacre again or some such venue. This night wounds time, GPK ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 17:08:35 +1200 (NZST) From: james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz (James Dignan) Subject: crimso >Greetings fellow Crimheads! I had a small question that I was hoping one of my >more "mature" comrades could clear up. [...] My friend told me that this was a >reference to Crimson (obviously) and that the band was known sort of >endearingly as "Crimso" in the 70's. I was just wondering if this were >actually >the case. Whassat? Speak up, sonny! "Mature"??? >From the booklet that accompanied "The Young Person's Guide to King Crimson" (compiled by someone called R. Fripp...) "1968: August 18 - International Times, letter from Rory O'Flute: "Who wants to read about Jim Morris an his doors on all dem Bossom Tomes an dat King Crimso when ye've herd bands like 'Blast'?" This letter gives King Crimson their nickname of 'Crimso'" James ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 12:05:22 +0100 From: brugger at physik dot uni-erlangen dot de (Alex Brugger) Subject: Re: backward messages and Haaden Two Hi everybody! ".....computer.....digital recording.....hmmmmmmmm" as for myself, slightly older-fashioned ideas would (and actually have) come to mind first, concerning decoding backward msges. no, I'm not giving anything away, but all you need is a tape deck, just your normal ordinary tape deck. and I'm not saying more...... :-))) Alex PS: speaking of backward messages - does anybody know whether the murmur on Pink Floyds One Of These Days (the _original_ version on Meddle! they used a different source on all later live recordings!) has any meaning when played backwards??? I _think_ I made out something like "this place has been..." but is it a fact or is my mind telling me things that are not there??? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 12:33:42 +0100 From: bigbang at alpes-net dot fr (A. Leroy) Subject: Satori In Crimsoland >At a KC show in Cincinnati, june '95, I was talking with a Crimson fan >before the shown (who incedentally was also a deadhead...anyway) who displayed >for me with a gleam of pride the banner he made for the evenings performance. >It was about 4x3' and read "Satori in Crimsoland". To me this made absolutely >NO sense so I gave a polite "how nice" smile. The "Satori" was obviously >a misspelling of "SaRtori" (the album "Beat" features the proper spelling >which anyone unsure could EASILY consult) but "CRIMSOLAND"? No idea. Am I right in thinking that the misspelling was originally Adrian Belew's ? The original book (I think it was by Jack Kerouac, but I'm not sure, although "Beat" was obviously a tribute to Kerouac, lyrically) spelt it "satori". "Crimso"... Long story ! Originally, that was a spelling mistake in a news- paper review. Some fans liked that, they throught the typo made the name sound nice. So even since then (early 70's), KC is known as "Crimso" to its fans. In conclusion, this banner makes sense. I think "Satori" means "peak" or "climax" (in whatever language) so it really sounds nice. A. Leroy [Let's end this thread and have it added to the FAQ. - Dan] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Date: 15 Jul 1996 09:59:43 -0700 From: "Smith, Paul" Subject: Berkeley Ticket For Sale I seem to have one too many tickets for the 7/26 Berkeley Show. It's for Section C, Row 1 ($39). Anyone intrested please e-mail. On another note, I finally broke down and bought The Great Deceiver Box set last week... WOW. Not much more to say than that... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #291 ********************************