From elephant-talk at arastar dot comMon May 13 06:41:37 1996 Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 09:38:10 +0800 From: elephant-talk at arastar dot com Reply to: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: elephant-talk at anthor dot arastar dot com Subject: Elephant-talk digest v95 #276 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 276 Thursday, 9 May 1996 [I did not receive this until Sunday 12, May, hence the delay--kbibb at arastar dot com] Today's Topics: Bootleg Amnesty Bill Forth interview transcriber wanted DISCOG/ KC-TOUR correction /EXPOSURE-PAGES RE: KC On the Radio World Diary Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 Crimson on the local news KC in Montreal/Islands cover/Zappa Re: Eartworks Fireworks, Waterworks, Airworks.... This is getting really silly.... Brass Band version of RED My Future Radio Show Rimitti + Robert Fripp Re: Dick Ross' INDOOR GAMES The Physical Thrill of Listening Richard Pinhas Crimson On Radio Earthworks The Physical Thrill of Listening Single of "People" Ian McDonald 11-21-95 Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #274 Djam Karet home page Re: anything you like Re: The Last Post King Crimson set-list 1996 Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 Improvisation Fripp off merchant ESC + TG Tourdates for ET Fripp and Glenn Gould Crimson in Seattle KC in Cologne and Dortmund Wetton & KC "Damage" Found Crimson Improvs Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 (fwd) Islands/Wood 4 sale sylvian/fripp's Damage info THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK Administrivia: POSTS: Please send all posts to toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk UNSUB/ADDRESS CHANGES: The DIY List Machine is back! At www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/list/ Visit the *new* ET on the web at www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ or the partial mirror at http://members.aol.com/etmirror/ For all administrative issues, such as change of address, withdrawal from the list, etc., send a message to the following address: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk ** If you want to opt for new 'ET BULLETIN' service, where instead of the whole digest you receive a short email announcing the latest edition is out, and where to read it on the web, email me, toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk, saying: "ET BULLETIN -- YES". ** The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest 3.0 package. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 08 May 96 13:29:01 EDT From: Discipline Global Mobile <73064 dot 1470 at CompuServe dot COM> Subject: Bootleg Amnesty Discipline Global Mobile is looking for the complete 1969 Crimson recordings made for the BBC. We are interested in hearing from anyone who has the studio and live stuff on bootleg, and in particular original vinyl transcription discs. Anything else from the '69 band is of interest as we are working on completing the archive for that period. Let us know the tracks and sound quality, title of bootleg etc. There are odd tracks we might be interested in copying and all material would be returned with no questions asked. Contact us directly please, not ET. By the way we have an unreleased original 1/4 track desk recording from the Filmore-West, Dec. 69 which Ian McDonald sent us. Any significant contributions could well earn a credit on forthcoming releases. Hugh O'Donnell Office manager DGM ------------------------------ From: aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca (Anil Prasad) Subject: Bill Forth interview transcriber wanted Date: Thu, 9 May 96 0:16:11 EDT Hi Folks, The Bill Forth interview is a go. I'm hoping some kind soul out there in ET-land will be interested in transcribing it. If you''re into all things Frippian, you'll probably enjoy the task. And you'll also be helping to get what's sure to be a fascinating interview out to a lot of people. The bottom line is that I'm swamped with work at the moment, but I'd like to get this interview out to people in a quasi-timely fashion... BTW, in the coming months you can also look forward to an interview with Tony Levin. Thanks, ~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~ Anil Prasad aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca ~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~ The INNERVIEWS webzine has expanded! It's your ticket to exclusive, in-depth and _illustrated_ interviews with some of the world's most interesting and innovative musicians! http://www.carleton.ca/~aprasad/ (Netscape enhanced) New! Iain Ballamy, John Gorka, Mick Karn, Lonely Universe & David Torn Coming soon: Alain Caron, Tony Levin, Kit Watkins & Victor Wooten ~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 18:00:58 +0200 (DFT) From: "C. Kazzer Anglistik" Subject: DISCOG/ KC-TOUR correction /EXPOSURE-PAGES Hello all, DISCOG: The Flying Lizards: Fourth Wall album 1981 was put out on CD. The details are:: CD 1995 Jap. Virgin/Toshiba-EMI VJCP-17502 Robert Fripp on Guitar on 3'31 Glide/Spin 2'49 Lost And Found {Fripp/Cunningham} The cd contains three bonus tracks from maxi singles and its generally very good quality. KC-TOUR: The Germany -dates listed mention a concert at CHIMITZ for the 15th of July (June? - i have forgotten the exact date) This apparently seems to be a misprint for C H E M N I T Z, a town in the South of Eastern Germany, a location pretty easy to reach also for fans from the Czech Republic. EXPOSURE-PAGES: An Update of the EXPOSURE-PAGES will be out any day now at http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/exposure/expoweb1.htm It includes more details of the "who plays what"-kind from the FOUR FROM EXPOSURE 12", and some other minor changes. Enjoy, Claas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 08:28:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Ryan Sutter Subject: RE: KC On the Radio Just a quick note about KC on the radio. About a year ago a local classic rock Minnesota radio station (KQRS 92) was doing a Rock N Roll A to Z and I waited anxiously to here some Crimson figuring they had to at least play CoTCK or Schiziod Man but I wanted to know for sure so I called the station. They not only weren't going to play any, but they acted like they had never heard of KC. If KC isn't even part of the history of rock and roll to most people, I guess little or no airplay is to be expected. Ryan Sutter ------------------------------ From: Jose dot Douglas at turner dot com Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 09:45:03 -0400 Subject: World Diary Hi all, Anybody get Tony Levin's World Diary yet? I got it in the post last Friday. I found it very interesting; slow and relaxing, There's one song that sounds kind of KCish; not slow or relaxing! All in all, an excellent CD. Check it out.... Cheers, Jose Douglas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 09:38:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Sean Malone Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 >> Is Robert Fripp the Howard Roark of guitar playing? < >Well, while they are the quintessence of their respective crafts and have >gone to considerable lengths to preserve the integrity of their work >against a vampiric public, their personal philosophies seem to be miles >apart. I have to agree on this point, however it's an interesting comparison. Roark on the other hand was not concerned with the public at all; it was never a factor in his thinking. Roark's output was functional, as his buildings were utilized by their occupants while maintaining a form that best suited that function. The appraisal of music is necessarily subjective in an aesthetic sense, though the constituent elements in the creation of music are objective. > I wonder, did Robert ever consider blowing up the band to keep >sinister fans from debasing his work? Perhaps in a new novel, Atlas Thrakked, the characters can posit Who is Robert Fripp? sm Hmmmm... well, barring any fatal >explosions, it'll be great to see KC in KC! > Sincerely, > Kurt Colville ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 10:24:14 -0400 From: vanvalnc at is2 dot nyu dot edu (Chris Van Valen) Subject: Crimson on the local news Hi all This past Friday night(5/3) I sat down to watch the 11:00 news on Channel 4 (local NBC affiliate) and they featured a special report on how so-called "Healthy" or "Low Fat" foods sometimes aren't as they seem. There was music which started way in the background, but when it welled up, it was "Cat Food"! I nearly fell out of my chair. If you have an unpleasant nature and dislike people this is no obstacle to work. --J.G. Bennett Catch "Forever Knight" on the Sci-Fi Channel every Monday at 8PM and midnight, EDT. --Lucien LaCroix ------------------------------ From: "AndrTheta Godin" Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 11:47:49 +0000 Subject: KC in Montreal/Islands cover/Zappa I Whole heartadly agree whith the gentleman who felt that KC should return to Montreal. I saw them at the Saint-Denis (drove ten hours from Moncton, New-Brunswick to get there) last year and let's just say that I was praying for the concert to never end. The Saint-Denis is a wonderful theatre and the Montreal crowd was very enthusiastic yet extremely respectful. The best crowd I'v ever had the privilege to be a part of. About the "multicolored clouds" cover of Islands, I have seen it in a used record shop being sold as a special limited collector's edition of Islands. It was three times as expensive as the "blotchy" version. For a certain time now, I'v been curious to hear what Zappa and Fripp have had to say about each other. I read a 1984 Zappa interview where FZ confessed that he had never heard of Fripp but did mention he was a big fan of Alan Holdsworth. Does any know of a more recent article where Zappa has more to say about Fripp? And even more interesting, has anyone heard or read Fripp's coments on Zappa? Mr. Monday ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 09:34:43 -0600 From: Bryan Basham Subject: Re: Eartworks Matt C writes: > Easily influenced, I bought the band's first album and > Stamping Ground. Great music! Yes, in deed. Their first S/T album is by far the best, IMHO, but I also own the other two (that I know about) "Dig?" and "All Heaven Broke Loose". Have you heard of these, Matt? > I'm still waiting for Earthworks to get back together and do some > more recording. I don't know. Anyone else? -Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:35:31 -0500 From: "John R. Nash" Subject: Fireworks, Waterworks, Airworks.... Just a thought... The California Guitar trio was extremely well-received by the open-minded King Crimson audience. I cautiously suggest that Earthworks might also be well-received as an opening act some time in the future. A possible snag would be Bill's tired forearms, but maybe he could ask Pat to help . The jump in musical styles from KC -> Earthworks is larger than from KC -> CGT, and I know some ppl who say that they "don't get jazz" (dig?) and will dismiss it offhandedly, but I still have a reasonably high opinion of the average KC fan. I'd love to see it, and it could give Earthworks a jumpstart and maybe even recoup some of their financial losses! Discuss. :-) -==-John R. Nash-==-nash at chem dot wisc dot edu-==-UW-Madison Chem. Dept-==- --- "When in doubt, roll!" --- ------------------------------ From: andyw at informix dot com (Andrew Wallace) Subject: This is getting really silly.... Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:59:12 -0700 (PDT) Hey everybody.... a couple of things from ET 275 and before: Several times I have seen folks say something to the effect of "I hope that KC doesn't become popular - I wouldn't enjoy them if they did". This is, to me, a truly annoying, selfish and even mentally weak thought. The idea that someone else enjoying something would cause your enjoyment to lessen is really silly, at best. Is your enjoyment of KC lessened by the fact that I like KC? I would guess so, because I also like many other bands that get denigrated here - Blues Traveller, Joan Osborne, 90125-era Yes among them. Hey, have a spine and stand up for your preferences! Stand up on your chair, and proclaim to the world "I'm damn proud to love King Crimson, no matter WHO else likes them!" As to airplay, ItCotCK and "Schizoid Man" are classic Rock staples in St Louis (where I lived for 13 years), and there have been a few invasions of the airwave by KC here in the SF Bay area, notably "People" most recently. I'm all for more airplay! I'd rather find Discipline or Thrack on my car radio than anything by Morrisey, anyday! Let's all pop Thrack in our CD players at the same time, and at exactly 12 midnight, May31, hit play and turn it up! andy -- Andy Wallace If my employer wanted to say this Menlo Park, CA stuff, they would, with no help web: http://www.scroom.com from me. e-mail: andyw at scroom dot com Rosewood Chapman Stick #922 andyw at informix dot com Linux - Genetic Mandate, or Lifestyle Choice? ------------------------------ From: max dot bracco at iol dot it Date: Mon, 06 May 96 22:09:25 Subject: Brass Band version of RED Hi Crimso Enthusiasts ! Have you ever heard of a big band version of RED ? It really exists, played by the EITHER ORCHESTRA on the CD "The half life of desire" ( Accurate Records AC - 3242) released in 1989. It's 11 minutes long and focuses more on the enigmatic sharpness of its armonic content rather than on the tremendous rythmic ferociousness of the original. It's a eleven piece band, with interesting arrangement of the brass section and even a fully expanded interlude that adds new melodic developments to the famous 24 bars killing bridge. HIGHLIGHTS : the majesty of this epic tune takes full advantage of multicolor sounds of the seven brass instruments, showing once more that Fripp is a genius of armonic avant-garde. Of course the killing electric sounds of the original showed a powerful rage that can't be equalled, but hearing these riffs in radically different instrumentation is really intriguing. DOWNHILLS : rhythm section shows some weakness, while playing the main theme. But nobody could bare comparison with Mr. Bruford's razor drumming. And the guitar player/arranger John Dirac even dares to take a psychedelic solo, inspired by Jerry Garcia rather than by Fripp himself. (Mortal sin ? Let's forgive him). The rest of the album is hard boiled avant-jazz in NY style, with some biting originals written by members of the band and a Miles Davis cover : it's well worth your bucks if you can find it. Last curiosity : in the line up is featured the now well known keyboardman John Medesky of the band Medesky, Martin and Wood. If anybody has ever heard this record, I'd like to hear opinions about it and if there are other jazz versions of Crimson songs. I'd also be glad if somebody can give me informations about availability in Europe of Crimson Videos (Pal VHS not LaserD). Thank you and bye MAX from Italy max dot bracco at iol dot it ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 May 1996 16:30:32 -0400 (EDT) From: MY BLOODY VALENTINE Subject: My Future Radio Show Hello again. I just wanted to thank the ETers for their tremendous response and suggestions for my show next semester. It will probably be on the air from around mid-september to early December. After that, if I am allowed to repeat it (this is an experiment of sorts), it will be on from the first week of February until early May. I will give the times when I know them. This will be my last postimg to ET until August, as I am headed home for the summer and have no e-mal account. I might be getting one, so if I do, I'll let you know where to reach me. If not, I'll see you in August! Have a good summer everyone, and thanks so much for your generosity and help. If you're driving thru Worcester next fall..tune to WCHC 88.1 for some cool stuff. Until tomorrow and tomorrow, mikael ------------------------------ From: Margus Laidre Subject: Rimitti + Robert Fripp Hello! I would like to sugggest for those still uninvolved a "new" release by famous algerian ra=FF singer Rimitti. I'm sure that many of you have her Sidi Mansour album (1992) on which=20 among others also Mr. Fripp is playing. In 1995 appeared four unreleased tracks from the same album featuring Robert Fripp (tracks 1 and 4) and Flea. The tracks are lasting from 9:45 to 19:39. Here Fripps guitarplaying (both frippertronics and=20 soundscapes) are much more obvious than on Sidi Mansour. It is definitely one of the most interesting things I have heard in recent times. So check it out!! It is produced in France by Absolute Records/Silences (catalogue nr ABSOLCD 5) Regards,=20 Margus ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 11:58:53 -0400 From: COSMICAC at aol dot com Subject: Re: Dick Ross' INDOOR GAMES I LIKE IT! Will you tell us just ONE MORE RED NIGHTMARE, Dick? Brad Trushin P.S. I recently obtained A WIERD PERSON'S GUIDE, Vols I and II. I plan to post short reviews in the near future, because these compilations have some wonderful and historically significant KC obscurities which all ET'ers should know about. Some of the material has been alluded to in previous posts, but I would like to put it all together with some perspective. Wasn't there somebody who recently requested reviews for a compilation? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 00:54:29 -0400 From: DanKirkd at aol dot com Subject: The Physical Thrill of Listening In ET #275, Joel Palmer wrote: >Since 1971 when I first discovered KC and through the present moment, >listening to Mr. Fripp has often resulted in a physical "thrilling" >sensation of shivers and goose flesh. The thrill typically begins in my >scalp at the top of my head, travels down my back and out to the >extremities, often lasting several seconds. Some passages more reliably >produce the thrill than others (for example, White Shadow, St. Elmo's >Fire, Book of Saturday/Exiles, Wave, VROOOM VROOOM Coda). The feeling >can be exquisitely uncomfortable! [snip] >So I put it to the list: Who thrills you? Is this a >highly-individualized matter of taste & experience, or can a particular >sound consistently thrill just about any careful listener? - Joel Palmer Funny enough "The Thin Wall" by Ultravox always gives me that sensation when it goes into the keyboard section following each chorus. Always. Also the final swell in Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D Minor gives me the chills. Even when the CGT play it. However, my chills start in the spine and work up to the top of my head. I do get goosebumps on my arms too! Dan ------------------------------ From: r dot derousse2 at genie dot com Date: Mon, 6 May 96 04:49:00 UTC 0000 Subject: Richard Pinhas In a recent Elephant Talk, Bruce Codere wrote: >& finally, does anyone out there know the name of the French band whose >guitarist is/was Patrick ______, & who put out a track Hommage to KC on >either a solo or group album. I never bought the album when had the chance >& it's begun to haunt me. I would really appreciate anyone's help. I suspect that he is talking about the band Heldon and their guitarist, Richard Pinhas. Here is a review of a Pinhas album by Mike Taylor from an old edition of Gibraltar. (Does anyone know the status of that mailing list, BTW? It's been ages since I received anything.) >_L'Ethique_, however, finds Pinhas back in fine form with furious doses of >his Fripp-influenced guitar (on "Dedicated to K.C." for example) and his >layers of pulsating moog. Guests on various cuts include members of >Heldon >(as usual) and Weidorje. We find simple melodic experiments ala side one >of _Chronolyse_, more icy works ala _Iceland_, and aggressive blasts of >guitar and synth ala Heldon. --Mike Taylor 3/94 I have this album and enjoy it very much. --Roy ------------------------------ From: leslabb at prolog dot net Date: Sun, 05 May 96 21:34:24 -0500 Subject: Crimson On Radio In ET 275 Mikael spoke the following: >>In ET v95 #274, Darius commented on hearing King Crimson once on the >>radio. I myself have heard them on very few occasions; several times I heard >>ItCotCK and Schizoid Man on WYSP-FM in Philadelphia, which was a Classic Rock >>channel at the time. Also, I have heard Schizoid Man and People(?) on WMMR-F >>in Philadelphia, which plays a mix of classic and modern rock. Once I heard >>The Sheltering Sky on WXPN-FM, which is the University of Pennsylvania's >>station. So they don't get too much airplay, which is partially fine by me. Since WXPN 88.5 made themselves available in the Harrisburg, PA area(Call letters in the Harrisburg area are WXPH 88.1) it has become my favorite radio station. On numerous occasions I have flipped on the radio to hear our favorite band. Songs ranging from ITKOTCK to Walking On Air. In fact last winter they had a countdown of the 100 most progressive albums of the last 50 years. Crimson's first album came in at #13. WXPN also broadcasts two great programs; ECHOS (broadcast on Public Radio International affiliates) M-F 11:00pm-1:00am Stars End Sunday Mornings 1:00am-6:00am (After Midnite Saturday) Both of these programs regularly feature Fripp Soundscapes and collaberations and are highly recommended. Les Les Labbauf Email: leslabb at postoffice dot ptd dot net There is a fun and easy to use fixpack for WIN95, it's called OS/2 Warp PotHead Pixies Unite:http://prog.ari.net/prog/Bands/Gongwyatt/gonghome The Banana Moon Observatory: http://www.colloquium.co.uk/www/gong/banana-moon-observatory.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 20:58:31 -0400 From: tomhowie at nylink dot org Subject: Earthworks Matt C. writes: > I'm still waiting for Earthworks to get back together and do > some more recording. Does anyone know what the state of this band is? Is > there a future for Earthworks after RF decides to split the current KC? > What are the other musicians (Ballamy, Bates, Harries) doing? Why doesn't > Bill play chordal drums in KC? Does it sound like I'm rambling? Bill hung Earthworks up after "Stamping Ground". At least that was his latest pronouncement. So, unless Bill changes his mind (as he is given to doing), you won't see any new Earthworks recordings. Have you got them all? "Bill Broford's Earthworks" (the first), "Dig?" (the second), "All Heaven Broke Loose" (the third), and "Stamping Ground" (live - the last). Also, check out his fusion work, under the name BRUFORD: "Feels Good To Me", "One of a Kind", "Gradually Going Tornado", and "The Bruford Tapes" (live). Then, there're his two albums with Patrick Moraz: "Music for Piano and Drums", and "Flags". Bill was also in the premiere version of UK. Isn't amazing how the progressive rock community interbreeds? Anyone know which Gong album Bruford was on - if any? What other albums has he contributed to (beside Chris Squire's "Fish out of Water" and Wakeman's "Six Wives of Henry VIII")? I'm curious. Tomas "Life's Short, Take A Nap" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 15:19:40 -0700 From: rpeck at pure dot com (Ray Peck) Subject: The Physical Thrill of Listening From: Joel Palmer >Since 1971 when I first discovered KC and through the present moment, >listening to Mr. Fripp has often resulted in a physical "thrilling" >sensation of shivers and goose flesh. I've been shopping for multi-kilobuck speakers lately, using Show of Hands as one of my test disks (those guitar-string transients are pretty darn killer). Last week, listening to a pair of Thiel CS7s for the second time, I put on LTIA. Now, I've never thought of it as being a great recording, it's always seemed rather compressed on my equipment. On LTIA Pt. 1, when the guitar and bass came in, I convulsed and literally fell on the floor. I'm buying those speakers! ------------------------------ From: "Robert A. Bartz" Organization: SUNY Fredonia Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 21:01:56 +0000 Subject: Single of "People" > Darius writes: > I keep waiting for "People" to turn up as a single... It already has been, actually. I have a promo single CD of it from Virgin Records number DPRO-12782. It's a 3:47 edit, and a fairly decent one at that(shame if your song's over four minutes it doesn't get played, except for songs like "Hey Jude", Golden Earring's "Twilight Zone", a fantastic song, and George Thorogood's "One Bourbon One Scotch One Beer"). Speaking of KC on the radio, my brother once heard back in Pittsburgh on WYEP "Larks Tounge in Aspic Part III" of all things! Other than that, I haven't heard them myself. However, the station I worked for over the summer, WDVE-FM, had copies of ITCOTCK and Discipline, BUT I had never seen these particular versions before, or since. The copy of ITCOTCK was released by Polydor(!), out of West Germany. The copy of Discipline was on Warner Brothers, I believe made in the US. So, were these the original releases before Fripp and Tony Arnold remastered(or disastered, depending which one) them? I'm curious since I never heard about these versions of the CDs before. Bob -- Bob Bartz bart6443 at oak dot ait dot fredonia dot edu http://www.lm.com/~rbartz Go Pens and Red Wings! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 16:57:55 -0400 From: ABershaw at aol dot com Subject: Ian McDonald 11-21-95 Hi all, I'm Alan and I've been lurking about for a little while and have enjoyed the list very much. I'm a soundman here in CT and a longtime "tape hoarder" of KC and others. I love the current lineup and anxiously await some 96 shows. I write to you in hopes of some info about the appearance of Ian McDonald & friends. He performed at Irving Plaza in NYC on November 21st of last year. KC were also in NYC that night at The Longacre. I recieved a videotape of this performance(He did "In The Court of the Crimson King") but the camera remains on Ian throughout the performance, so I am unable to tell who the musiscians are. Was anyone there or does anyone know for sure who the band was? It's quite good. I welcome any correspondance or info. Thanks! Alan B ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 16:53:33 -0400 From: recengnr at athens dot net (none) Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #274 >Date: Sat, 27 Apr 1996 00:53:17 -0400 (EDT) >From: Darius >Subject: Consider the "alternatives" . . . >What does the "alternative" label mean? Nothing. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 14:41:36 -0600 From: dabshire at csn dot net (Douglas Abshire) Subject: Djam Karet home page Eters might want to check out the Djam Karet home page at www.csn.net/~dabshire in that Djam Karet's music has compared to early Pink Floyd and Crimson. Although NOT KC nor an imposter, IMHO many ETers might enjoy this electronic / prog rock music. It has been mentioned in ET before. Enjoy! Doug Abshire ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 16:32:09 -0400 From: Mformlios at aol dot com Subject: Re: anything you like Hello all! Thanks for some REALLY interesting responses to my first posting, especially to Joan Whoeversheis :) Not only did I get caught at what I was doing....(what WAS I doing, according to the three different responses I got?), but I was shown the many different faces of the super-passionate people on this list! I'm not the sort of person to be taken at face value ('least my mommy sez), and, being an NYU film school graduate doesn't help any either. The best I can offer you is the following: Regarding the 1972 tape in Santa Monica: If you reread my original post, REALLY reread it, the following points are being made: 1.) "I can actually TALK about bootlegs!...WOW!" (Kitschy, but...hey!) 2.) "I have a crystal clear audience master" 3.) "Does the band want to put it out?" Nowhere, NOWHERE does it say that I wish to trade this "particular" (read the quotes) tape. What will it accomplish for me to trade or give this tape to anyone other than RF or legitimate band members? Uhhhh....read on: It will most certainly eventually end up in wide circulation, diminishing its value AND/OR It MAY end up being put out on bootleg CD for someone else's profit. I can't see that. There are other, circulating performances to collect besides this one, if that really is your thing. Wolverhampton Civic Center 1971, and Offenbach 1981 come to mind immediately. The early BBC performances, particularly those in 1969 are a must. Talk about the entire issue of collecting! One should certainly look at the BBC first. At least those performances went out with the band's recognition. Actually, I was sort of surprised that no one could/was able to answer the historical side of the letter. It seemed that people were either looking for, or were against the idea of trading tapes. Funny, I don't recall that being in the letter. Aren't a list of tour dates from this era available? I truly enjoy reading Elephant Talk. When the people care, really care about the band it shows. As before, I welcome Email. Regards, Mark D. Forman Mformlios at AOL dot com ------------------------------ Date: 05 May 96 16:20:56 EDT From: Ian Moffatt <101507 dot 2054 at CompuServe dot COM> Subject: Re: The Last Post Hello to all, This may be the last post as I have the chance of a rapid posting, all the best to all, see you soon, if not already please join The Classic Rock Society, they're on our side and they need our support!! Slainte Mhath Ian ------------------------------ From: tjlever at ibm dot net Date: Sun, 05 May 96 19:17:03 Subject: King Crimson set-list 1996 I have just returned from the 2nd King Crimson convention at Wimborne in the UK. This is co-ordinated by Book of Saturday (UK King Crimson Fanzine). Several items of interest... 1. Last Friday, John Wetton played with the David Cross band in London. Set list included Starless and Exiles. A version of Exiles is to appear on the next David Cross Band CD. Robert Fripp in the audience. 2. KC will play other USA dates besides HORDE later this year 3. Had a nice chat with a representative from Discipline (sorry, forgotten his name). He mentioned that Robert flew out of the UK today, to the USA, get together with Adrian to formalise ideas etc. for the forthcoming tour. It appears that Robert is interested in dipping into the KC back catalogue for numbers to play this tour. I don't know if there will be time for any new numbers to be written, arranged rehearsed before the fist dates in Italy in a few weeks time. If this is the case, and given that Belew does not like to sing other peoples material, what would we like to see / hear in the set this yeat. Chap from Discipline confirmed that Robert does read Elephant Talk, so we have the opportunity, albeit brief, of possibly influencing the set for this tour. Rumoured is an instrumental version of, wait for it, Schizoid Man!. Personaly, I have heard this enough times and would like to hear the present line up tackle some other tunes such as Fracture or Pictures of a City. Well just my 2p worth (UK equivalent of USA 2cents worth) Looking forward to the UK dates.... Trevor Lever tjlever at ibm dot net ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 Date: Sun, 5 May 96 14:49:21 -0000 From: WOTAN > Hi everybody. I picked up an old LP of "Islands" the other day, but it >doesn't have the usual Milky Way cover. It is a white cover with >multicolored clouds. I have not seen this anywhere else. Is it worth >anything? Anbody? Thats the original cover. Hang on to it. - Sez **************** Visit General Music 101 +===+ o +===+ at | | /|\ | | http://www.concentric.net/~selzler/ |~~~| Co-"=|~~~| |___| / \ |___| - The Road Goes on Forever - **************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 01:38:23 -0700 From: rexj at ix dot netcom dot com (Rex Jackson) Subject: Improvisation Ray Dittmeier actually said in public: >I suspect that if they did it, you'd be disappointed. Probably no >more than 10 minutes out of a typical two-hour improv show would be >very good IMHBSHO, i.e., "in my humble but strongly held opinion"). >Of course, it could vary, and on a really good night they might just >manage a good two-hour show, but it would be rare. As you get more >people into a band doing free-form improv, the chances go way down >that everyone will be in top form on any given night, free of >distractions, concentrating on the music, in tune with (in the mental >sense, not the musical one) what the rest of the guys are doing, >etc... I think six is too many to get results that are anywhere near >consistent, no matter how godlike the individual musicians are. I have to at least mention my tenure in the front row at Grateful Dead concerts over the last ten years. In the lineup I grew up with there were six musicians. Later, there were seven for a couple of years. None of the musicians was "godlike", but they were all great listeners and were willing to lead or follow as the music made it's demands. They played two sets a night for nearly 100 nights a year. Earlier in their career the number of nights-per-year was nearly double that. A LOT of the night was always improvisation. Until late in their career there was no setlist. Some nights were magic and some were less than spectacular, but they were proof that a rock band can improvise every night for close to 3000 shows over 30 years and never alienate their fans. If the Dead could do it, Crimson could do it. Many jazz musicians do it for every night of their career. There is no lack of skill in the current lineup. It's just a question of facing their fears and sticking to their obligations. I'd love to see Crimson touring seasonally for many years to come and honing their skills as improvisational musicians while we look on. I don't really expect it to happen, but I certainly wish it would. >I would hope that if they decided to try it, they'd at least have some >rehearsed album material ready--"Plan B," you might say--in case the >improv stuff isn't working. But wouldn't that defeat the point? -- "Sanity is a one-trick pony. When you're sane you only have one trick - Rational Thought. But with insanity, the sky's the limit!" ------------------------------ Date: 06 May 96 05:20:18 EDT From: "Jim A." <100753 dot 322 at CompuServe dot COM> Subject: Fripp off merchant Am I alone in thinking that Fripp is the master of the rip-off? How can anyone release a sound check album (VROOOM), a 'proper' album (THRAK), a live bootleg album (B'BOOM) and then a load of versions of 1 track that appears on all these albums (THRAK ATTAK)? 4 albums (1 double) of the same material in 2 years. Hmmm, someone's out to make a killing methinks. I wonder if the next offering is a 'best of' from the last 4 albums? The thing that compounds this rip-off theory to me is that in 1985 he released a personal best of album (NETWORK) consisting of 20 minutes of music on cassette format!!! The word prolific certainly does not spring to mind. I think we should all get together and make a stand by NOT BUYING this re-hashed garbage. Good Day, Jim A. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 13:50:47 +0100 From: Udo & Cathy Subject: ESC + TG Tourdates for ET Below are the tourdates of Tony Geballe and the Europa String Choir ITALY TOUR 1996 --------------- May 18th DRAGON'S PUB, Via Piemonte 15, CREVACUORE (Vercelli) May 19th IL MALTESE, Piazza Coracco 1, CASSINASCO (Acqui Terme) May 20th IL MAGAZZINO DI GILGAMESH, Piazza Moncenisio 13 Bis, TORINO May 21st TEATRO MIELA, Piazza Duca degli Abruzzi 3, TRIESTE Tel 040.365119 May 22nd ARBA (near Pordenone not yet confirmed) May 23rd (not yet confirmed) LA BAMBA, POORDENONE May 24th AL VAPORE, Via Fratelli Bandiera 8, MARGHERA (Venezia) May 25th OFF May 26th (confirmed! but may be shifted to the day before) GARAGE 56, UDINE May 27th Workshop at School of Music 55, TRIESTE May 28th OFF SLOVENIJA TOUR 1996 ------------------- May 29th SESKOV DOM, KOCEVJE May 30th CLUB GAJO, LJUBLJANA May 31st SATCHMO CLUB, MARIBOR June 1st MAONA CLUB, FIESA (Piran) Course ------ After this there will be a one week course with Tony Geballe (Guitar, NST, Rhythm and the body) and Cathy Stevens (Alexander Technique) in the foothills of the Italian Alps, a unique setting. The ESC will also be present for the whole week. For details please contact the registrar, Roberto Duse: Duse at spin dot it Europa String Choir: Cathy Stevens - 6 String Electric Viola Udo Dzierzanowski - Guitar and Chordclouds Alessandro Bruno - Guitar and E-Bow ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 15:43:45 -0400 From: efuruiti at usp dot br (Edson Furuiti) Subject: Fripp and Glenn Gould Hello, E-talkers! This is my first post to the list, but I won't give you that first-time-I-ever-heard-KC speech: actually, I don't remember (shame on me). I like the list a lot, even though as a non-musician I think it gets a little technical in excess (for instance, the standard tuning saga). Thanx for the nice work, Toby! I recently saw a canadian film on the life of Glenn Gould. For those unfamiliar, he was perhaps the greatest J.S.Bach piano performer ever, and a very eccentric sort of person. One of his eccentricities was never performing live, and to this concern he said the following: "To me, the ideal audience to artist relationship is a one to zero relationship. That's where the moral objection comes in. First, I'm not at all happy with words like 'public' and 'artist'. I'm not happy with the hierarchical implications of that kind of terminology. The artist should be granted anonimity. He should be permitted to operate in secret as if were unconcerned with or, better still, unaware of the presumed demand of the marketplace; which demands, given sufficient indiference on part of a sufficient number of artists will simply disappear. Given that disappearance, the artist would then abandon his false sense of public responsibility, and his 'audience' or 'public' will relinquish its role of servile dependency. They will make contact, but on a much more meaningful level" This idea of the "anonymous artist" seems to me very similar to Fripp's reactions to public exposure in general, as exposed by several of you previously. But what if we 'relinquished our role of servile dependency' to Fripp and 'made contact on a more meaningful level'? Peace (a word) Edson Furuiti ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 96 15:04:03 EST From: Bob Gottesman Subject: Crimson in Seattle I notice on Ticketmaster's home page that tickets are on-sale for Crimson in Seattle on 7/20. Are there any other non-Horde USA dates? (seattle is too far from NYC) *------------------------------------- Name: Bob Gottesman E-mail: Bob Gottesman Date: 05/07/96 Time: 15:04:03 This message was sent by Chameleon *------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 20:29:10 +0200 Subject: KC in Cologne and Dortmund From: removed at users dot request (GW) I've got tickets for the King Crimson shows in Cologne (June 9.) and Dortmund (June 13.) and would really like to meet fellow ETers there ! My wife refuses stoudly to accompany me to that concerts. It's the sad old My_Wife_Hates_King_Crimson - story ... So, please don't leave a KC- addicted alone ... :-) Ciao GW removed at users dot request or removed at users dot request ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 May 1996 01:24:21 +0200 From: Dirk van den Hout Subject: Wetton & KC Hi there, Wouldn't it be nice to get John Wetton & KC on ONE podium during the concert in The Hague on Saturday June 29th ?? John Wetton will be playing the Parkpop' Festival in The Hague on Sunday June 30th !! So he will be in town on Saturday ... Maybe a Very Special Guest appearance ??? Dirk -- Currently playing: For Ever Live by IQ !@#$% Dirk van den Hout %$#@! !@#$% E-Mail: d dot van dot den dot hout at tip dot nl %$#@! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 21:46:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Bryan Reelfs Subject: "Damage" Found Hi all! This is my first post to the list, and hopefully I'll be able to give a little back for all the great info that I've gotten. Spurred on by all of the recent discussion of the Sylvian/Fripp "Damage" CD, I did a little hunting and finally found it. Well, all of my searching turned out to be quite worth it. Rather than bore everyone with yet another review, this post will hopefully bring good news to anyone in the states still looking for this disc. The place I bought it from keeps its inventory in back, with just one booklet photocopy of each title on the shelf, so I asked the guy how many copies he had in stock and he replied, "Oh, four of five"!?! So, if anyone is interested, I will be glad to pick up a copy (while supplies last ;-))and ship it anywhere in the U.S. The price was a $35 out the door, and shipping will cost me $2. I'm not sure if all of the copies are this way, but the ones he has are 24K gold discs (for less refraction ;-)) and come with a slip case and 32-page color photo booklet. Anyone interested can email me personally at jestrtear at earthlink dot net. *-------------------------------------- Bryan Reelfs "Even Jester's Cry..." Marillion-"Script for a Jester's Tear" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 12:26:13 -0400 From: alan s cohen Subject: Crimson Improvs >> If any band in existence could provide an interesting couple of hours of >> mostly improvised rock music, surely this one could. > >I suspect that if they did it, you'd be disappointed. Probably no more >than 10 minutes out of a typical two-hour improv show would be very good >(IMHBSHO, i.e., "in my humble but strongly held opinion"). Of course, it >would vary, and on a really good night they might just manage a good >two-hour show, but it would be rare. As you get more people into a band >doing free-form improv, the chances go way down that everyone will be in >top form on any given night, free of distractions, concentrating on the >music, in tune with (in the mental sense, not the musical one) what the >rest of the guys are doing, etc... I think six is too many to get results >that are anywhere near consistent, no matter how godlike the individual >musicians are. > Remember in the '70's, the Larks Tongues era band would do 2 free improvs every show, many of which showed up on The Great Deceiver. I was hoping they'd return to doing something like this. I know that when I saw them last June, I was disappointed at the lack of improvisation, except for "THRAK" (just how far away is June 25, by the way?). And "When I Say Stop, Continue" was an improv. So these 6 can do it. I hope we hear more in the future. Alan *------------------------------------------------------------------------------- i000371 sends (ALAN COHEN)... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 23:03:31 -0600 From: eric at webpro-1 dot com (Eric D. Dixon) Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #275 (fwd) >On 4/28, Justin Weinberg wrote: > >> Is Robert Fripp the Howard Roark of guitar playing? < To which Kurt Colville responded: >Well, while they are the quintessence of their respective crafts and have >gone to considerable lengths to preserve the integrity of their work >against a vampiric public, their personal philosophies seem to be miles >apart. I wonder, did Robert ever consider blowing up the band to keep >sinister fans from debasing his work? Hmmmm... well, barring any fatal >explosions, it'll be great to see KC in KC! Certainly, Fripp is no Objectivist, but his ideas about music & the musician's relationship to it and the audience have reminded me of Rand's writings more than once. Particularly in Atlas Shrugged, during Dagny's first visit to Galt's Gulch, where Richard Halley expounds on the relationship between the musician and the audience. That speech seems particularly Frippian in retrospect. Eric D. Dixon eric at webpro-1 dot com Hey you! Yeah, you! Check out my homepage... http://www.webpro-1.com/staff/edd/eric/brickpage.html "Paradise is exactly like where you are right now, only much, much better." -- Laurie Anderson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 12:16:03 +0200 (MET DST) From: Lars Carlestam Subject: Islands/Wood 4 sale Dave wrote: > Hi everybody. I picked up an old LP of "Islands" the other day, but it > doesn't have the usual Milky Way cover. It is a white cover with > multicolored clouds. I have not seen this anywhere else. Is it worth > anything? Anbody? Have seen it (though it was a while ago), it doesn't seem to be exceptionally rare (not in Sweden anyway), so I am afraid I can't tell you if it's worth anything. I have a CD for sale/trade: WOOD "Against the Grain" which includes a nice cover of "Red" with just bass, drums and electric violin. Anyone interested? /Lasse ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 May 1996 14:19:52 -0700 From: Music Library user Subject: sylvian/fripp's Damage For any U.S. ET readers who are still desperately seeking the live Sylvian/Fripp album *Damage*...I have access to two new copies that I'd be willing to snap up. The retail price is seventeen bucks, not bad for a gold disc and seperate color booklet in a little box! Unfortunately, I don't have a set e-mail address (I'm using a computer at school at the moment!). If anyone interested in getting a copy of Damage would please *telephone* me at 423-673-0662 (Knoxville, TN). We can work out details from there. And of course, I can only help the first two interested parties... In the meantime, awaiting thrakattak and some US theatre dates...And apologies for no electronic address, I'll get one someday. Chris Mitchell University of Tennessee ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 10:50:11 +0100 (BST) From: NN399 at lamp dot ac dot uk Subject: info Dear Sir/Madam, Could you put me on your mailing list? Secondly, I have great difficulty in locating music scores of King Crimson Music. My internet port seems to freeze and record stores in the UK aren't very helpful. Can you help me? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 08:46:30 -0400 From: ASchulberg at aol dot com Subject: THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK Last fall, after the concert tours were done and the (ahem) footwear had been collected and listened to, I built a little compilation tape which I called THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK THRAK. Each version of THRAK is complete rather than being a compilation of the improvisational middles. One thing I noted after listening to Adrians Guitar As Orchestra album was the resemblance between many of those pieces and some of the improvisations in THRAK. No doubt Adrian was playing with some of those ideas and working on them on the tour. Has anyone else noticed the similarities? As for the wailing about KC on the HORDE tour- hey, whiners, get a life. Id go see Fripp and Company no matter who they were with (Lawrence Welk Orchestra, a troupe of mimes). Whats the problem? Arnie Schulberg ASchulberg at aol dot com ------------------------------ End of Elephant-Talk Digest #276 ********************************