From elephant-talk at arastar dot comFri Feb 9 14:25:45 1996 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:53:20 +0800 From: elephant-talk at arastar dot com Reply to: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: elephant-talk at anthor dot arastar dot com Subject: Elephant-talk digest v95 #258 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 258, Friday, 9 February 1996 Today's Topics: "Lark's tongues..." Re: KC & The Dead Fripp/KC in Feb. Guitar magazine New Standards another poll larks' tongues in aspic (et post) KC plays too fast Fripp Community Value of Centipede LP The Multimedia Album Fripp on Arabic album? Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 [Fwd: [Fwd: [Fwd: Rude Tony?]]] KC-Bootleg "81 To 99" Larks' Tongues In Aspic origin Re: Poll NPR Double Trio Hoopla Old Standard Tuning significance of the title, "Lark's Tongues In Aspic" BritProg - Grateful Dead Islands cover Swarm of drones Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 Drumless rhythms Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 EG CD Numbers the fame test Patricia Leavitt Guitar articles [Fwd: [Fwd: Eno/Sinfield CD.]] Dead and Crimson meaning of larks tongue? [Fwd: Fripp guitar effects] Fripp at RFH Next albums Re: Levin "snub" at NAMM ET Web needs your creativity King Crimson and what else? Iain Ballamy/Earthworks Interview Now On The Web Interesting review of THRAK [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] POSTS: Please send all posts to toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The ET archives: WWW Home: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/ Topic Index: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/topics-index/etopics.html FAQ: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/faq.html FTP The Americas: ftp.qualcomm.com, in /pub/et Rest of world: ftp.cs.man.ac.uk, in /pub/toby/elephant-talk EMAIL Send "index elephant-talk" to listserv at arastar dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 02 Feb 1996 16:42:44 +0000 From: username at eirenet dot com (Enter Your Real Name Here!) Subject: WANTED! FRIPP APHORISM POSTERS. please contact. MR. J O'CONNOR. 5 CITY VIEW WAY BANDUFF CORK,IRELAND. REGARDS. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 02 Feb 1996 13:44:01 EST From: "PODOJIL, MARK EDGAR" Subject: "Lark's tongues..." I recall reading that Jamie Muir blurted out the words "larks tongues in aspic" during a rehersal for said album. Given what I know of Muir (ie very little) he seemed to be, before becoming a Benadictine monk, a little deeper in the insane realm than most people. Thus was quite spontaneously able to capture the perfect title for our "most beloved" KC album. There was a question as to the origin of the title some issues back I think. "Being the lion in the lute Being the lion locked in stone..." mark podojil, ramblin' man chachacha! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 02 Feb 1996 14:41:14 GMT From: "Hickson, Robert D." Subject: Re: KC & The Dead Response to Bill Matthews: KC & The Dead I have certainly recognized the similarities between Fripp's soundscapes and the Dead space jams. At some of this year's KC shows I could have sworn that some of the taped soundscapes between CGT & KC were Dead tapes (I know I was mistaken). I believe both bands, at times, are working toward similar ends via differing means. Like it or not, the Grateful Dead are the definitive 'freeform rock' band - according to many critics and commentators. While referring to KC's explorations into uncharted territory, one article included in 'The Great Deceiver' reads "no other band, except perhaps the Grateful Dead..." In the (US) Public Television R&R series, Pink Floyd's former manager describes early Floyd space voyages of being like that of no other band - except perhaps those of the Dead. The rhetorical "they" say "it's not the destination, but the journey that counts." The Dead had a vague idea of the destination and just hit the road, open to whatever they may have encountered. Fripp, I suspect, sat and thought about the destination (for 3 days? or would that be 7 days?). After an appropriate period of contemplation he studied his atlas and mapped out a specific route. As a process of validation, he consulted with his travel agent, but they had philosophically opposing routes (the travel agent undoubtedly seeking to take complete financial advantage of the weary yet dedicated traveler)...I will cut this tale short to save on band width...but I swear I can hear Adrian saying (for the 19th time) "Are we there yet?" To which RF cautions "Don't make me pull this car over!" [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 15:50:12 -0500 (EST) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: Fripp/KC in Feb. Guitar magazine In the latest issue of Guitar magazine here in the 'States, there's a set of profiles of 'outsider' guitarists -- Fripp, Belew, Zappa, Branca -- who influence many without themselves becoming well-known outside the music and fan worlds (I think they kinda had to shoehorn Zappa in to fit this definition, but anyway). The profile of Fripp is dead-on, both appreciative of his intellectual and musical gifts as well as amusedly critical of his occasional lapses into Fripp-speak and oracularity, and the syncophancy that surrounds him. Some amusing Fripp-related anecdotes are also included in a sidebar. The treat for musician KC fans is the transcription of VROOOM for two guitars and two basses. It appears to be very accurate. Btw, Belew notes that the band used Guitar's trasncription of 'Three of a Perfect Pair' >from a few months back to re-learn the song for a recent Japanese tour ! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 15:03:53 -0600 From: penseur at intellex dot com (Ed Poe) Subject: New Standards Two things: First, a good mnemonic device for the NST is "Californian Guitarists Drop Acid Every Gig." (From the CGT page in the THRAK tour book) Second, on this gibberish about tuning drums to those specific notes (yes I said gibberish) the important thing to remember is not which particular frequencies to which you tune your drums, but the fact that you pay enough attention to tune them *at all*. There's no particular harmonic secret to the NST, nothing magic or especially Frippy, just that it facilitates a certain type of playing for a guitarist. So tuning your drums to these arbitrary six pitches isn't going to give you some special unity with the spheres in your playing. Listening to your drums closely and tuning them to whichever frequencies work best with *those* drums will work wonders for your sound, as will careful study and mastery of the intricacies of any instrument. Do you want a dead *thud* out of them? A sharp *crack*? A long *riiinnnnnggg*? By adjusting the tuning, you can achieve those tonalities, and give yourself a much more specific sound, which you can also modulate by adjusting head tension and playing style. It will also help you to understand how your drum sound fits into the context of a larger band. The interview with Bruford and Mastelotto in Modern Drummer had Mastelotto saying some interesting things that point this out: He was accustomed to going for a high, ringy sound out of his drums - appropriate for playing in large arenas which required a sharp sound to carry through the mess of a large, guitar-heavy band. This turned out to be the harmonic territory that Bruford already used, so Mastelotto sought out (and found) a different tuning for his drums that filled out the lower, boomy end of the drum spectrum. So you don't need to tune to those six pitches, but you *should* tune to something - it's up to you to determine what. Sorry for the length of the post, but I've been watching this discussion for a while and had to throw my $.02 into the fray. - e - - - - - - - - - - - - "When I was five years old, my mother informed me that I was a genius. This, of course, came as no surprise to me." - Nicholas Slonimsky - Musician, Composer, Historian, Lexicographer [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 02 Feb 96 16:10:47 EST From: Michael Ruesenberg <100603 dot 144 at compuserve dot com> Subject: another poll here is another poll that you might be interested to notice. it's a poll by the listeners of my radio programme jazzcity (WDR Radio 5 in Cologne). I call it beta version because the audience-participation this year was less than in over 20 previous years I had the chance to do a similar programme, called in between. JAZZCITY presents: INNOVATION AWARD 1995 (Beta Version) 1. MICHAEL RIESSLER Momentum Mobile 2. Courtney Pine Modern Day Jazz Stories 3. Django Bates Winter Truce (and Homes blaze) 4. STEVE COLEMAN AND FIVE ELEMENTS Curves of Life PERFORMANCE AWARD1995 (Beta Version) 1. JOHN MCLAUGHLIN After the Rain 2. STEVE COLEMAN AND FIVE ELEMENTS Curves of Life 3. JOHN SCOFIELD Groove Elation 4. KING CRIMSON B'Boom 5. GATEWAY Homecoming Internet address: http://www.wdr.com/Hoerfunk/hfkst/jazz.html [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: A Suffusion of Yellow <96mat at williams dot edu> Subject: larks' tongues in aspic Date: Fri, 2 Feb 96 18:25:59 EST If it has not already been mentioned, larks' tongues in aspic was one of Caligula's excesses. Andrew [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 02 Feb 1996 16:35:12 -0800 From: "J.P.Lewis" Subject: (et post) KC plays too fast I saw KC twice during the current tour, and both times I felt that they were playing the 80s songs too fast, as if they were trying to keep up with the way that they played these songs 10+ years ago. As a result the old songs didn't have the same groove that some of the newer songs had. Sometimes things sound heavier when played slower, and things always sound better when the tempo is comfortable enough that the elusive "groove" can be explored. wish they'd slow down just a bit. (also which I could hear Fripp more) j.p.lewis interval research [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 20:56:52 -0500 (EST) From: Rodney Cord Subject: Fripp Community Hello to all ETers, I must say that I am thrilled to know there are some musically discerning palates out there. None of my friends see the worth of the Fripp catalog. When I play some, they generally shrug and request Bryan Adams. (Which I wouldn't be caught dead with) BTW, anyone know what a complete set of Belew solo CD's would be worth if ALL were autographed? And why aren't Lone Rhino and Twang Bar King available as CD? 'Desire...comes close, but ultimately leaves some of the best out. Cheers, rhino "Well, I'd like to spend about a hundred million a year on sewers--but I'm not quite sure whether it's practical." [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Organization: Brooklyn Psychogeographical Association Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 23:54:36 -0500 From: dmandl at panix dot com (David Mandl) Subject: Value of Centipede LP >From: Scott Tatina > >Anyone have any idea what the Centipede LP goes for. > >Scott I just bought a copy in good condition (I guess VG+ would be a conservative rating) for $15. That seemed like a very reasonable price, especially considering that it's a double LP. I was thrilled to find it. I'd never seen an actual copy of the record before. --Dave. -- Dave Mandl dmandl at panix dot com http://www.wfmu.org/~davem [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 00:32:20 -0500 From: Joornon at aol dot com Subject: The Multimedia Album Buy It, it's very rare, they only pressed about 150 copies of trhe vinly when it was released in the late 70's, It's a short story by science fiction writer Robert Shefflield. 25 minutes of original Eno. Also, look up a movie called Sebastiane, by Derek Jarman. 70 minutes of vintage (again) Eno, very hard to find. Caused riots at the Cannes festival in 1977 due to it's homoerotic content. bye for now, Jhon ps, When you get one, would you please email me privately and let me know so we could arrange some duplicatory actions? 8-) Hjon................... [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 03 Feb 96 01:16:13 -0800 From: Bert Rubini Organization: HCC Subject: Fripp on Arabic album? Hello. Has anyone out there heard the album "Sidi Mansour" by an artist named Cheika Rimitti? This album was recommended on another discussion group I belong to; Fripp plays guitar, and I think that Rimitti sings in Arabic. I haven't heard it myself but it sounded very interesting and wanted to know if anyone could give me a review, positive or otherwise. Is it worth getting a copy? Also, I'm having trouble finding it, any sources? Reply to Elephant Talk or by private e-mail as you think appropriate. Thanks in advance -- Bert R. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 01:09:48 -0500 From: recengnr at athens dot net Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 With all of the talk concerning tuning drums to C-G-D-A-E-G, which for the guitar has been called the New Standard Tuning, would someone care to expound on the benefits of doing such a thing deliberately or otherwise (preferably one of the posters)? Tom Lewis Athens, GA [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Frank DeMarco Subject: Rude Tony? Status: U X-Mozilla-Status: 0001 In ET digest v95 #257, Merleh1234 at aol dot com wrote: >Got back last week from the NAMM show in Anaheim, Calif., home of the >national association of musical manufacturers. Tony Levin from KC was >there, doing some clinics for one of the manufacturers. > >Went up to him to congratulate him on wonderful performances, like the one >I saw in Ft Lauderdale (Sunrise Musical Theater). He barely glanced my way >when I spoke and said "yeah thanks," and promptly and rudely turned away >from me. > >I guess Fripp isn't the only one who doesn't adore his fans. After a stunning KC show at Cleveland's Nautica Stage last summer I had the privilege (through mutual friends) to hang out for a while with Tony Levin. We were backstage for a little while, where Tony and other band members amiably chatted with fans and signed autographs, and then afterwards we spent some time talking with Tony at the hotel bar. I found him to be a very friendly, down-to-earth person, and was therefore surprised by your post. I'm sorry you had that experience, but my main point is this: It's ill-advised to make sweeping judgments about someone (e.g., "I guess Fripp isn't the only one who doesn't adore his fans") based on one encounter. Haven't you ever had a bad day, a day when you just didn't feel like being friendly or outgoing? Are our musical heroes not permitted to be human like the rest of us? It seems to me that we have some pretty unrealistic expectations of celebrities. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 21:53:04 +0100 Subject: KC-Bootleg "81 To 99" From: removed at users dot request (GW) In a local second-hand recordstore I found (and bought) some strange, KC-related records: A few Fripp-Eno records (with Peter Gabriel, Daryl Hall, Phil Collins= a.o.), a KC "Sleepless - The Dance Mix" - EP (!!) an this really strange piece of vinyl: "81 - 99", "Adrian Belew, Robin Hood, Tony Levin and Bill Bruford brings you= ... the Elephant talk and some other nice love songs" It=B4s a bootleg of a 1982 KC-gig, probably in South America, which= sounds like it was performed in a phonebooth and recorded with a toy- taperecorder. Adrian Belew talks with the audience (he tells them= =20 that "Matte Kudasai" means "please wait for me" and so on). The tracks printed on the label are: "This Side: Right Side, Red Side, Discipline Side. Other Side: Left Side, Sun Side, Elephant=B4s Side " ... But every Crimhead can identify them as: Discipline, Thela .., Matte .., The Sheltering Sky, ET, Indiscipline,= LTiA II and FbF. Has "81 to 99" ever been a name of a band or project ? Why was this KC-bootleg sold with this name ? Was it the fear of Robert Fripp=B4s Revenge ? (Robin Hood =3D RF= ??) I mean, what sense makes a KC-bootleg without "King Crimson" printed= on it ? Who would buy it ? (Except strange people like you and me ... ;-) Ciao GW [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 16:33:29 -0500 From: "Weissenburger - Jeremy S." Subject: Larks' Tongues In Aspic origin >In ET 256 Matthew Carton wanted to know "What The Hell Does It Mean": It is my understanding is that Jamie Muir named the song. After hearing it in its total form, he was asked what it sounds like, and he said, "Why, Larks' Tongues In Aspic, of course." And so they named it that. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, folks. Would you rather they named it "Instrumental #1?" --Jeremy [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 00:25:42 -0200 From: Tefkros Symeonides Subject: Re: Poll So anyway, guys, your response is great but I can't start calculating the results until you tell me what you think about 1. The voting system 2. Whether collections and box sets should count RSVP [ Direct to George please, NOT to ET. -- Toby ] Tefkros Symeonides [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 03 Feb 1996 17:12:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Watcher Of The Skies (John P Mohan) Subject: NPR More King Crimson sightings (or would it be hearings?) on National Public Radio today - the first minute or so (before the vocals start) of Inner Garden I, and then, a few minutes later, the last few seconds of One Time. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 21:45:55 -0500 From: HARRY3HAVE at aol dot com Subject: Double Trio Hoopla Spare me the endless accolades heralding the new Crimson lineup. I've been following the band since ITCOTCK days and have seen all previous lineups perform live on numerous occasions. The most recent incarnation is by far the worst both live and in the studio, though still entertaining at times. RF needs to get wise to the excess baggage which is encumbering his band, ie: Pat and Trey. These two overzealous space fillers only detract from the brilliant compositions by filling every lingering groove with mindless rhythmic riffing. Watching the double trio live is like attending a Crimson show and having two non-essential hangers-on play along with the band. The first Chicago show sold out in minutes but the second swing through town some months later featured empty seats at showtime. Evidently I'm not alone with my analysis in the windy city. Respectful Regards, Harry B. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 22:20:48 -0500 From: Mark2u at aol dot com Subject: Old Standard Tuning Thanks to fellow ET'er Taylor for a good catch. Yes, I was in error - the "old" standard guitar tuning is based primarily on 4ths with one major 3rd (not Major 3rds with one minor 3rd as I hastily wrote earlier). Sorry about that. We don't need more misinformation floating around. Mark Stevens [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 00:20:14 GMT From: dutch at cwnet dot com (Czajkowski, Doug) Subject: significance of the title, "Lark's Tongues In Aspic" In ET 257, there was a answer to a post concerning the significance of the title, "Lark's Tongues In Aspic", by Les L: > I cannot say what Robert Fripp, or KC had in mind when they gave the the > name "Lark's Tongues In Aspic" to their work. However I take it to mean > that the music sounds exactly like what title implies. Think of the lark, > a bird who sings a pretty song, now think of that bird's tongue in a jelly > made from meat gelatin. A pretty nasty picture, if you get the idea. So > the music is not pretty, but harsh and grinding. Definitely meant to > disturb the listener. Not that disturbing is negative, but used as a > motivation to expand one's listening ear. This post reminded me of the composition, "The Lark Ascending". It's a pastoral classical piece by English composer Vaughan Williams. At the beginning of it, there's a violin "solo" that sounds a lot like the violin part at the start of LTiA. I wonder if LTiA is a sarcastic "wink of the eye" at the Williams tune (at least conceptualy). Les's observations reflects the contrasts between the emotional impact of the light, pastoral Williams tune compared with the somtimes brutal LTiA. Thanks to Tony for a great job! [ Who's the Tony guy? -- Toby :-) ] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 11:53:25 GMT From: fsteama at macline dot co dot uk (Mike Goode) Subject: BritProg - Grateful Dead I agree with Bill Matthews mailing re the Grateful Dead. I too have never understood why they were not considered a 'prog rock' outfit. In the UK we have a band of similar age (yeah, they're old!) called Man, who suffer the same fate. To my ears, a Man live gig is very firmly in prog rock country, but I guess that this depends upon your definition of what a progressive (rock) band actually is. Man are a band who love to improvise and experiment. And like the Dead, they are most at home doing this on stage. Surely to experiment is a major requisite of being in a progressive band. I fear however , that 'progressive' in the context of Yes, 'old' Genesis etc actually describes a form of music firmly stuck in the early Seventies. No doubt, the music was truely progressive way back then - now however, nothing could be further from the truth. The rub: We can argue 'til the cows come home about all this. One fact remains - King Crimson must be the only band who have remained faithful to the progressive tag throughout their career. They were progressive in the early Seventies and they are progressive in the Nineties. It is very misleading to put KC in the same box as the likes of Yes and co. Don't do it! PS. If Man play down your way go see 'em! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:48:50 -0500 From: upsetter at cybercom dot net (Art Cohen) Subject: Islands cover Alicia wondered: : I have my dad's 1972 vinyl copy of Islands and the cover's completely : different from the regular starry-sky found on all the Islands I've seen, : even in the inner part of YPGT. Mine is all white with greenish, : multicoloured blotches scattered throughout (a bit like the SaBB cover, : actually) with the name of the band and record on the spine and the lyrics : and pictures on the inner sleeve. : : Was this the original cover, with the starry sky used in all reissues or is : mine something of a rarity? IMHO this sleeve is more fitting to this lovely : record than the one currently used. As far as I know, the "Starry" cover was the original UK (European?) release, and the "Blotchy" cover was the original American release. I have no idea why this was done, since neither one of them is particularly attractive, in my opinion. (Actually, the two covers of "Islands" are probably my two least favorite KC album covers!). Anyone know why they decided to change the cover? --Art Boston Ska home page: http://www.profane.com/ska [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 14:40:24 +1100 From: keens at pitvax dot its dot rmit dot EDU dot AU (Jeremy Keens) Subject: Swarm of drones this double album (sequal to throne of drones) is full of mesmerising and satisfying dark ambient music - few if any beats and very dense. robert fripp's track 2000II is 7:10 long and brilliant. till now i had thought that the difference between 1999 and blessing of tears represented fripp getting 'control' of the frippertronic beast. but this track, while >from the argentina shows, would be at home on blessing, indicating the control was over what went into the disks - 1999 was designed to the fractured object ot is. jeremy [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 04 Feb 96 22:56:24 EST From: Matt Dawson Organization: University of Louisville Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 Hello fellow Crimsonites, I trust everyone is doing well! I just wanted to post that I have in my posession a high quality VHS tape of a Crimson concert in 1984 in Japan. I was wondering if anyone was interested in trading Crimson material. I also have a copy of the Frejus concert "The Noise" live in 1982. If your interested you can e-mail me personally. Thanks. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:36:27 +0100 From: "Riesz, Ferenc" Subject: Drumless rhythms Hi ! There was some discussion recently about the major role of drums in rock music. Well, drums seem to be indispensible instruments indeed, but it's not necessary to have drums to make music rythmically powerful. Listen to any Crafty Guitar albums !! No percussive sound but incredible rhytms ! Or consider Mike Oldfield: he rarely uses drums in his early recordings. Ot listen to Bach: some of his keyboard pieces (especially some pieces from Goldberg variations or Art of Fugue) sound like a locomotive ! RF [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:15:39 -0800 From: Tolin.A/Apple at eworld dot com Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #257 >Merleh1234 at aol dot com wrote: >Got back last week from the NAMM show in Anaheim, Calif., home of the >national association of musical manufacturers. Tony Levin from KC was >there, doing some clinics for one of the manufacturers. >Went up to him to congratulate him on wonderful performances, like the one >I saw in Ft Lauderdale (Sunrise Musical Theater). He barely glanced my way >when I spoke and said "yeah thanks," and promptly and rudely turned away >from me. >I guess Fripp isn't the only one who doesn't adore his fans. I wouldn't say that of Tony. As far as I can heard in the last 15 years (in interviews, comments from his collegues etc...) he is quite different from Fripp. For example, months ago I wrote to PapaBear asking about his CD avalability here in Italy, and he replied to me personally explaining the situation in a very amicable way. I think that anyone has days up & down, and when you're always under the "lights" sometimes it's hard to smile to everybody. I work most of the day meeting people who ask me questions etc..(I'm not a rockstar...) and me too, sometimes, feel ungry and behave rudely. It's life... In fact I have a rule: I never go to talk to my heroes when I have the possibility, I know that the thing you described could happen. Just my two cents...... Ciao Andrea [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:20:38 GMT From: cbackham at uk dot mdis dot com Subject: EG CD Numbers In ET #256, matottls at craft dot camp dot clarkson dot edu (Loren S. Matott) asked about a jump in the EGCD catalogue numbers between Lizard and Islands. I would just point out that King Crimson were not the only band on EG Records. Other noteworthy artistes on EG were: Roxy Music, solo Roxy spinoffs (Bryan Ferry, Brian Eno, Phil Manzanera/801), and Bruford. I think ELP were on EG in the early days, but their catalogue has since moved. I'd guess that the first missing number in Loren's list is Roxy Music's first album. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: David Oskardmay - Imonics Corporation Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:45:06 -0500 Subject: the fame test Merleh1234 at aol dot com writes: >Went up to [Tony L.] to congratulate him on wonderful performances, like >the one I saw in Ft Lauderdale (Sunrise Musical Theater). He barely >glanced my way when I spoke and said "yeah thanks," and promptly and >rudely turned away from me. >I guess Fripp isn't the only one who doesn't adore his fans. OK Merleh, here's your "are you ready to be famous?" test: 1. Lock yourself in a room for 4 days. 2. Hire about 50 people to come up to your room at random times of the day or night and say one of the following: a) "Hi Merleh, I'm so glad to finally meet you! I really love your work!" b) "Can I have your autograph?" c) "Thanks Merleh for that excellent show you did in Tuscaloosa. Do you remember me? I was the one in the 7th row (seat 24 left-center) wearing the chartreuse fedora and green suspenders." 3. You will be graded on your responses based on content, diction, poise, politeness, autograph legibility, and attention span. Let us know how it goes! BTW, I don't intend this to be flame-bait or to ridicule anyone, but after you've taken this test, you'll have a bit more of an idea of what our "heroes" public lives are like. Replies via email only please... davido at imonics dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: bullj1 at westatpo dot westat dot com Date: Fri, 02 Feb 96 16:08:03 EDT Subject: Patricia Leavitt In an earlier post, someone saw Patricia Leavitt's name on a Crafty recording and asked who she was. She's attended numerous Guitar Craft seminars. She performed (on guitar) with a Crafty group from D.C. called The League of Locals in the late 80s. She subsequently shifted focus to singing (and songwriting). And she does a mean version of Dylan's Sub..Homesick Blues with upright bass. Joan Bull bullj1 at westat dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:08:15 -0500 Subject: Guitar articles From: "Andrew J. Wilson" Organization: Bolt Beranek and Newman Inc. In the newest issue of Guitar (formerly Guitar for the Practicing Musician) there are articles and/or interviews featuring Fripp, Belew and Gunn, and a transcription of VROOOM. In the interview with Belew, he says that KC relearned Three of a Perfect Pair from a transcription in an earlier issue of the same magazine, which thrilled the editors to no end. There is a picture of KC on the cover. Andrew [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: jmc at sdr dot utias dot utoronto dot ca (James MacKenzie Crawford) Message-Id: <199602052101.QAA02069@gambit> To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Eno/Sinfield CD. I've finally got the story straight (sorry for the long post): The Eno/Sinfield CD is called "In the Land of Clear Colours." It's the narration of a story (or excerpts) by an author named Robert Sheckley, narrated by Peter Sinfield, set to some ambient music by Brian Eno. Inside the booklet are brief bios of the four individuals involved, Sheckley, Sinfield, a woman named Leonor Quiles who did the illustrations, and Eno. It originally came out in 1979, and the CD release has been digitally remastered. The story is an interesting tale of a human settler trying to integrate into society on a different planet, and Sinfield's narration is well done. The illustrations are elaborate pencil drawings of people. The overall feel of the CD reminds me of Rick Wakeman's Journey to the Centre of the Earth, only much less irritating. It appears on the Voiceprint label as a UK release. From what I can gather about the CD rerelease, the illustrations are only an experpt of the artwork found in the book accompanying the original LP, which was limited to 1000 copies. This release has come up a dozen or so times in the Brian Eno Digest (according to its search engine). Here are the most enlightening quotes: -------------------------- Brian Eno Digest. H-141 Wed. May 25, 1994 Jeremy Ashcroft: jeremy dot ashcroft at almac dot co dot uk .. The Multimedia Album. It's a project based around a book called "In A Land Of Clear Colors" by Robert Sheckley. I only have the record itself, but the complete package (limited to 1000 copies) was supplied with fourteen prints from the book, drawn by Leonor Quiles. The album itself features music by Brian Eno and narration of highlights from the text by Peter Sinfield. According to the sleeve notes, the project was to be first presented at the World Science Fiction Convention in Brighton, England in August 1979. It's a Spanish release - on the Mensajero label - and my copy is numbered 146. ... -------------------------- Brian Eno Digest. H-141 Wed. May 25, 1994 Charly Rhoades: charly at hal dot com and http://www.hal.com/~charly Subject: (A Humble Attempt at Tracking) Eno-Sign in Sheckley's In a Land of Clear Colors These are notes on Eno appearances in the recording of Robert Sheckley's "In A Land Of Clear Colours" (originally released in 1979 I think, and re-released on CD by Voiceprint in 1993). The CD line notes contain no track listings, although the recording does indeed present definite, distinct tracks. The CD is divided into 11 tracks. Eno's music is mostly used as a bed, over which narrator Pete Sinfield recites the prose. There are ten distinct instances of these background passages throughout the disc. In addition, two tracks are completely and singly instrumental, with no narration. In a more general (and highly subjective) view, I think I can identify three recurring themes used throughout the recording: - A Clearing (from "On Land") - an ominous theme (often associated with Durnish/the wind) - another ominous mystery-theme I believe most of the musical passages are based on these three themes. I have marked instances where (I think) these themes occur among the dozen Eno passages. I have marked Eno-music appearances in the following list. I use the track numbers and the timing indexes as reported by my CD player. I have also taken the great liberty of providing a short label for each piece, to help place the music event in the context of the story. Tk Start End Total Label ---------------------------------------------------------------- 01 (02.12) *Instrumental I (Intro) 02 05:10 to 06:12 (01:02) -Durnish's Warning 06:39 to 07:34 (00:55) The Extraterrestrial Exploration Corps 08:29 to 09:33 (01:04) -Durnish Warns Again 11:13 to 11:45 (00:22) Flute Memories 03 03:00 to 06:37 (03:37) -Durnish and the God of Discord 06 (01:10) %Instrumental II 07 03:18 to 05:16 (01:58) %The Halucination 09 00:09 to 00:52 (00:43) *The Dance for Food 01:06 to 03:27 (02:21) %Slaying the Bear 11 00:53 to 03:51 (02:58) *With the Animals 12 01:00 to 02:21 (01:21) Winter ------------------------------------------------------------ 19:43 Passages marked with an asterisk (*) seem to be based on a motif that was later released in 1982 as "A Clearing" on _Ambient_#4:_On_Land_. Passages marked with a minus sign (-) seem to be based on a motif often associated with Durnish, a character in the story. Passages marked with a percent sign (%) seem to be based on a single mysterious theme. -------------------------- Eno-L Digest # M-011 13/Oct/93 Rubli at udlapvms dot pue dot udlap dot mx Subject: Solo Album REC,Eno/sinfield,Gull Tw. There are 3 version of this eno/sinfield record: 1.- In a land of clear colors, isued as an LP with a picture booklet a very short number of issuing. Issued by El Mensajera, a spanish company in Ibiza, Spain. 2.- From Ibiza the CD-only issue of the above mentioned record, 3.- In a land of clear colors, issued recently by an english comopany called voiceprint, I really don't know if this could be considered as a bootleg, the contens, though divided in more cd-tracks, is exactly the same as above. There are two very obvious Typo errors, which only use to happen in bootlegs (the name of schekley on the cd, and the name of the graphic artist, is it Guilles or Quilles ?) -------------------------- Some people did e-mail me some info as well, but I found the most data at Eno archives. Thanks for the responces. I hope I've removed some of the mystery around this Crimson alumnus collaboration. James Crawford [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:46:25 -0500 From: carol boehmer Subject: Dead and Crimson Reply to "Bill Matthews" and elephant-talk group members, I have also been a Deadhead sine the '60's and am also a Crimson fan. I believe one of the differences in the approach to the music is that, although the Dead are extremely talented musicians, they began as a jugband, and they have played music from the roots of American culture. They are not British rock. The approach bythe British bands in general is more contained. The Dead began playing the halls so that people would have a place to dance. Dancing is not part of Crimson in general, although!!!!!, at the House of Blues in New Orleans at the show in Nov.,'95, a group of Deadheads down front were dancing happily. I was up in the balcony, and could only watch, wishing I could get through the crowd and join in. The magic of a Dead show getting you to the place you want to be, and meeting the people you need to meet, does not happen at any other show. I do have to correct you, though. They don't just "do it on stage" anymore. The large group of people with whom I trade tapes have all expressed that the mourning has not ended. As much as I like Crimson, I do not believe that the adoration is on the same level at all. Perhaps this is because the KC band members are "British" and remain more aloof. Perhaps because there is really very little interaction with the audience. I don't know. I liston to KC when I want to hear music studio style, once a week or so. I listento Dead at least 4 hours a day or more. It is the background to my life. Just IMHO. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:38:38 -0500 From: George_C dot _IV_Wiles at emh3 dot arl dot mil (George C. IV Wiles) Subject: meaning of larks tongue? On recent postings as to the meaning of Larks Tongues in Aspic, I was under the impression that it was an anagram, like Eno's Kings Lead Hat (Talking Heads) and Thela Hun Ginjeet (Heat in the Jungle). Perhaps I'm mixing my trivia! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Peter" Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:11:24 +0000 Subject: Fripp guitar effects Hey, I just bought a DOD DFX94 delay/sampler pedal, and I'm amazed at how much Frippertronic-like stuff I can do with it. Recommended, even if it does kill a 9-volt battery for every 3 hours of use. I remember Fripp saying something in an interview about using "a couple of volume pedals" in his setup. What can you do with two (or more) that you can't do with one? Pete [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 19:07 GMT From: ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk (Ron Chrisley) Subject: Fripp at RFH Fripp will be givin FREE soundscape performances at the Queen Elizabeth Hall, london on the 7th-10th on March! Info courtesy of The Wire maazine. Ron Chrisley (ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk) http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/ronc/index.html Chill. Serve. Enjoy. Repeat. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 23:35:22 UT From: "Captain Zenith" Subject: Next albums I heard that The next couple of King Crimson albums are going to take totally different directions so Fripp can see how many fans he can lose. Has anybody else heard anything on this? Doesn't he know by now that with the exception of the threesome (Discipline, Beat, Three of a P.P.), all the albums are already pretty much different? What's up? Captain Zenith [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:16:13 +0800 From: John dot Lukes at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (John Lukes) Subject: Re: Levin "snub" at NAMM Regarding the incident where Tony Levin is supposed to have "snubbed" a fan at the recent NAMM, I wasn't there, but I much prefer giving people, especially those whose work takes them into the "limelight" of public scrutiny, the benefit of the doubt. The benefit of the doubt might be that the compliment on the recent KC tour actually was an interruption to a conversation that Tony was already involved in -- external or internal, so he didn't really hear what was said, but realized something was said so gave it a cursory response, "Yeah, thanks." (Now what were we saying... Now what was I thinking....). Just a thought. But either way for me, it's enough that he's a top-notch bassist and stick player, who sings great harmonies and gets along with five other great musicians well enough to have played night after night with them, traveling a large part of the world on a tight schedule, and still was able to give "over-the-top" performances on cue! I never require these professional musicians to be world-class public relations experts. Besides, his clever "tongue-in-cheek" post to E-Talk, about the rude noise-maker in the yellow jacket behind him, tells me two things: (1) he cares about his fans enough to post to an on-line fan digest, and, (2) he doesn't take it all too seriously. But then again, these are just stories I'm making up, just as others have made up stories about what a Robert Fripp or a Tony Levin thinks of their fans based on an isolated event. (He wouldn't shake my hand so this means that he...., He didn't smile so he....) As one of our engineers here at work likes to say, "Hey, don't base your case on only one or two data points." This is modern lingo for, "Don't jump to conclusions." -JOHN [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: E#KIRKD at ccmail dot ceco dot com Date: Wed, 07 Feb 96 16:55:01 CST Subject: ET Web needs your creativity Fellow ET-heads, Toby and I are working on a MAJOR revamp of the ET pages. The time is right to breathe new life into the pages, and Toby has asked me to take charge of this, which I graciously have accepted to do. What I'd like to ask the ET readers is for ideas for a new background to replace the current one found on most ET pages. The only guidelines are: 1) the background should have something to do with ET, RF or KC. 2) it should not distract from normal reading of text on the page (you may suggest alternative text colors if you wish). 3) it should be 10K or less. 4) it should still look reasonably good, or adequate for those poor souls with 16 color monitors (the current background barely works at 16 colors). We will likely still use the current background somewhere else, but we think a change would be good for the main page at the very least. So get those creative juices flowing and send me your suggestions. I'll give you until the end of February. Meanwhile, if you have any ideas or suggestions for the new look ET Web site, please let me know about those too. Take care, Dan e#kirkd at ccmail dot ceco dot com DanKirkd at aol dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:50:37 -0500 From: Superfuzz6 at aol dot com Subject: King Crimson and what else? If you would, please respond with your opinion of the best King Crimson album or the one that I would like best. I currently own the cassette Lizard which I bought because it was cheap, and I had heard interesting things about the band. My favorite on the album is Prince Rupert Awakes and really the whole second side. It really opened me up to a new (to me) kind of music, and I would be very grateful if you could tell me of anything else that sounds like this that I would appreciate. Thanks a lot, Drew Long (Superfuzz6 at aol dot com) [ No posts on this to ET please, but provately to Drew -- Thanks, Toby ] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca (Anil Prasad) Subject: Iain Ballamy/Earthworks Interview Now On The Web Date: Wed, 7 Feb 96 19:55:11 EST An exclusive interview with British sax phenomenon Iain Ballamy is now available on the Innerviews webzine located at: http://www.carleton.ca/~aprasad/ In this candid, in-depth interview, Ballamy discusses: - Earthworks and working with Bill Bruford - Loose Tubes - His collaborations with Django Bates - Billy Jenkins & The Voice Of God Ensemble - The state of modern jazz - Life as a struggling musician - The "philosophy" of music And much, much more. If you're a fan of this eclectic musician, take some time to check it out. Please use a Netscape browser for proper results. Anil Prasad http://www.carleton.ca/~aprasad/ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Ian McKay" Organization: S.A.C. Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:36:44 +0000 Subject: Interesting review of THRAK I was scanning through some old issues of a free British musicians magazine -- MAKING MUSIC -- while round at a friends house recently when I came apon the following _interesting_ review of THRAK in the September 1995 edition. Apologies if this infringes anyone's copyright. Ian McKay %%%%%%%%%%%%%%% KING CRIMSON THRAK (Virgin) Play this to one of the cartoon punks sitting on the Kings Road waiting to be photographed by a passing Japanese tourist and he will in all probability shake his head sadly and mumble sonething about fighting the punk wars of 1977 for nothing. But what care we for the opinions of a speed-addled punk parody? Even allowing for past work with the Orb on _FFWD_ and The Future Sound of London on _ISDN_, Robert Fripp has continually ploughed his own prog-rocky course regardless. And it's only the addition of more lyrically song-orientated Adrian Belew (although he plays guitar like a demented mangle operator) to the last bunch of Crimson recordings that have made any real difference, as far as I can here. Fresh from his recent live _Damage_ outing with David Sylvian, Robert Fripp nicks most of the rhythm section from that project to add to this, the fourth recorded output from King Crimson. Bill Bruford's thunderous output is aided (although I'm arsed if I can see why) by Pat Mastelotto, and the god-like Tony Levin is also (once again rather pointlessly), beefed up by Trey Gunn. And what we get is a mixes bag ranging from the sublime to the pointless. Opening with _Vrooom_ (one of three versions on this particular theme), which is a typical Crim racket-ridden plank spanker, it's not long before Belew's presence is being felt; _Dinosaur_'s atonal, clanky beginning turns into a long lost Beatles choon (actually this is a lie but Belew has a habit of making most of his songs sound like long-lost Beatles choons). Unfortunately we are soon plunged back into prog-rock hell and _B'Boom_, wherein an ambient noodling start becomes (whisper it) a drum solo, aaarrrggghhh. But the good (a discordant energetic _Thrak_) and the stark (lovely ballad _One Time_) easily outnumber fillers like _Radio 1_, which sounds like that great big whale-chasing pole from _Star Trek 47_, and the awfully bland _Inner Garden Pts I & II_ which is inexplicably split into tracks 1 and 6(?). If you want to hear the best this line-up has to offer, check out _Discipline_. _THRAK_ has some good moments but is frankly just too patchy. ANDY BASIRE [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] The views expressed in Elephant Talk are those of the individual authors only. Elephant Talk is released for the personal use of readers. No commercial use may be made of the material unless permission is granted by the author. Toby Howard, Elephant Talk editor. http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/staff-db/toby-howard.html toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]