From elephant-talk at arastar dot comFri Dec 15 10:44:00 1995 Date: Thu, 14 Dec 1995 09:27:35 +0800 From: elephant-talk at arastar dot com Reply to: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: elephant-talk at anthor dot arastar dot com Subject: Elephant-talk digest v95 #251 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 251, Thursday, 14 December 1995 Today's Topics: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #249 KC on Television Post - re; ET#249 Cover art trivia? Re: Elephant Talk #250 sampler tape Mr. Yellow Jacket; Lizard great music from Hungary Elephant Talk and Tony Levin's World Diary KC on Fridays way back when RE: Crafty Tuning on Guitar Fripp/Fleck..and.. Fleck/Fripp Re: General thoughts about KC Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #250 Fripp's shoes Frivolity Belew's Brief Stint with KC in 1970 2 Fripp Records Ordering Information for Bill Bruford's Book King Crimson newsgroup Careful with that AX Trio What Gunn's Playing, pt.3 What Gunn's Playing, pt.4 Trio Crimso Alumni Levin Re: Proposal: alt.music.king-crimson the future?? Holst, Trio: summary; broken coherency in certain KC albums Exclusive MARK ISHAM interview now on the web!! Breathless for string quartet? King Crimson gifs and jpegs RFD: rec.music.artists.king-crimson ULTIMATE LIVE RARITIES 2 Fripp/McLaughlin and KC' bootlegs in Moscow Fripp on new Iona release The First Day, USA (fwd) et question [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] POSTS: Please send all posts to toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The ET archives: WWW Home: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/et/ Topic Index: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/topics-index/etopics.html FAQ: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/et/faq.html FTP The Americas: ftp.qualcomm.com, in /pub/et Rest of world: ftp.cs.man.ac.uk, in /pub/toby/elephant-talk EMAIL Send "index elephant-talk" to listserv at arastar dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] FROM THE MODERATOR We have a serious bandwidth problem on ET. To help reduce traffic on this list, would readers please reply directly to the poster of a topic, and the original poster is encouraged to summarize responses. The following topics have been judged by ET readers to have been "done to death", so no posts about those please. THE EXPIRED LIST 1. KC on Conan 2. Fripp's approach to fan encounters 3. Things that hit Fripp on the head 4. Larks Tongues in Aspic in "Emanuelle" 5. Why and when people shout FREEBIRD. 6. What substances to ingest prior to a KC gig 7. Who is the best vocalist KC ever had? 8. Are Pete Sinfield's lyrics any good? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 7 Dec 95 12:58:19 EST From: david at visix dot com (David Charlap) Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #249 Subject: YES jconnoly at ma dot mew dot com (joseph connolly) > >Yesterdays Boston Globe said a new Yes reunion is to tour shortly. >Featuring Anderson, Squire, Howe, Wakeman and BILL BRUFORD. Anyone else >hear this?? A false rumor. The new Yes lineup is: Anderson, Squire, Howe, Wakeman and Alan White. Bill Bruford will not be rejoining Yes. For more information, read the "Notes From The Edge" mailing list. You can check out their home page on the World Wide Web at: http://www.wilmington.net/yes/welcome.html All rumors about the new tour are not beyond the rumor stage. Yes is working on the new album. No tours are likely to happen until the second half of 1996. Official Yes announcements will be visible on the YesWorld homepage: http://yesworld.wilmington.net/yesworld.html [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 7 Dec 1995 10:29:42 -0800 From: quack4 at ix dot netcom dot com (Ray Steele ) Subject: KC on Television The show in question by James Poulakos in ET # 249 was the show "Fridays". Crimson did two songs for that comedy show which I still remember well to this day (KC, not the comedy). One of the songs was indeed "Elephant Talk." The other was "Thela Hun Ginjeet." Crimson seemed to enjoy doing this show quite a bit -- moreso than on Conan. I would appreciate E-mail from anyone who has a copy of this show on VHS, as I did not tape the show then, and would like to see it again (I don't think there is any chance of syndication for this show, not on the horizon anyway.). -- Ray Steele [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 07 Dec 95 13:31:35 -0800 From: Rick Mascarini Organization: CCS - Automation Subject: Post - re; ET#249 Hello all, In ET issue #249, a number of posters discuss string gauages for use with the New Standard Tuning (NST). As a guitarist for over 30 years and a user of the NST since 1990, I have found the light gauage set of Adamas Strings (12 -to- 53, high to low) to provide even and long lasting tone. No substitutions or 'custom' sets seem to bring the same "feel" on the fretboard at least to me. Also, I can change strings (and do so very frequently) without any long "burn in" of the new strings as they settle to proper pitch. I have four different guitars I put the NST on (one acoustic, two electrics, one a guitar synth). One note, in late 1989, I initially tried the NST and kept breaking strings, had problems with intonation, strings would not stay in tune and overall, felt very alien while playing. I then reverted to the conventional method (EADGBE) for a number of months and was bored to tears! On New Years Day 1990, again I applied the NST and haven't looked back (except every now and then when I pick up a friend's guitar loaded with EADGBE). Point is, I think I was NOT READY for the NST in '89 and later had a personal conviction to use the NST. All of the above mentioned problems went away less my intent. BTW, I have not attended Guitar Craft Courses and only found out about the NST through the Fripp articles in Guitar Player (approx.'89-90 I think). I have, however, been a long time Crimsonite. And remain. Regards, RMM, Saratoga, NY [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 7 Dec 95 16:41:15 EST From: tynor at atlanta dot twr dot com (Steve Tynor) Subject: Cover art trivia? Here's a trivial question that's been bugging me for a while. On my copy of Beat (CD), the band members are listed in white with their contributions listed in pink. Except for Bruford. His name is in pink. Is there a sinister, hidden message here? Like McCartney walking barefoot on Abbey Road? (hmmm. But I don't recall any "Bill is Dead" rumors...) Or is it just a simple printing mistake? I have no idea if this was also how it was printed on the vinyl album -- all I have to refer to is the CD. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= When suddenly -- nothing happened. Steve Tynor Internet: Steve dot Tynor at atlanta dot twr dot com Tower Technology WWW: http://www.twr.com/ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 12:18:00 +1300 (NZDT) From: "Anthony \"Slug of Doom\" Hobbs" Subject: Re: Elephant Talk #250 The third instrument on "Trio" is mellotron impersonating a flute, played by Fripp. Anthony "Slug of Doom" Hobbs, GCP: musician and amateur ranter, Wellington, NZ. hobbs_a at ix dot wcc dot govt dot nz anthony at actrix dot gen dot nz "You can't arrest me, officer, 'cause I ain't drunk. I sure as hell might be half-assed-drunk, though... *hic*" (Doctors for "Bob") [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 02:59:17 -0500 From: Diaphanus at aol dot com Subject: sampler tape A while ago I sent a message to you guys out there about a free sampler tape that I thought would appeal you all fellow Crimson-heads. I just wanted to know if any of you have gotten a chance to request it and what you thought. I think it is possibly the best "unsigned" collection of music I have yet heard. I'd like to read your opinion. (If you still want one, I think you can still send your mailing address to rsmtrecord at aol dot com and you'll get one in the mail!!). Diaphanus [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 95 09:01:54 GMT From: cbackham at uk dot mdis dot com (Clive Backham) Subject: Mr. Yellow Jacket; Lizard In ET #248, someone complained about a guy in a yellow jacket making a racket throughout the concert, and said that he tackled him about it afterwards. You were a brave man, sir! Didn't you notice that he had a moody looking mate lurking in the shadows, wielding an axe? In ET #250, Marcel Safier asked: >Does anybody have a CD copy of the original Lizards EGCD4 release i.e. not >the Definative Edition version that they are prepared to sell? I wonder why you ask for this. I have the original vinyl and the definitive edition CD, and notice no difference in content. I cannot believe that the original CD would be any different. So, why would you want the inferior product? Clive Backham McDonnell Information Systems, UK email: cbackham at uk dot mdis dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 12:39:14 +0100 From: Riesz Ferenc Subject: great music from Hungary Hi ! Let me recommend you some great music from Hungary. If you like the early KC, you'll like the Hungarian group "After Crying". They admit that they like KC and are influenced by them, yet their music is highly characteristic, not a simple KC clone. In addition, they played whole [!] KC albums in their concerts (Islands and ItCotCC). A.f.a.I k., they issued three albums: 1. 'Overground Music' (1990). Play only acoustic instruments, influenced by renaissance and baroque music. Very intimate. Sung in English. 2. 'Megalazottak es megszomoritottak' (1992). More close to rock, with some jazzy spots. A real, coherent masterpiece featuring a 20-min composition. Very emotional material. Outstanding cello playing. Highly recommend to everyone. One of the best music I have ever heard. 3. 'Fold es Eg' (Earth and Sky 1994?5?). An eklectic material with some really fantastic songs. Some influence by EL&P. Good lyricsq (in Hungarian ;-). Some Frippoid guitar. If you are in Budapest, drop in a CD shop, listen, then buy ! You will not be disappointed. Ferenc [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 13:07:45 GMT From: A dot Ogden at reading dot ac dot uk (Adrian Ogden) Subject: Elephant Talk and Tony Levin's World Diary Thank you for maintaining information about Tony Levin's "World Diary", without which I would not have been aware of its existence. The album is now available in europe; the info below from both PapaBear and DGM. My copy, ordered on monday from DGM, arrived yesterday. << Adrian Ogden -- "Sic Biscuitus Disintegrat" -- A dot Ogden at reading dot ac dot uk >> ########################################################################## > From PBearRec at aol dot com Thu Nov 16 00:42:49 1995 > Subject: Re: Tony Levin enquiry > > There is finally a release date in Europe for Tony Levin's "World > Diary" - it will be next Jan. 29th. Discipline Global Mobile records, > who will release and distribute the cd for Europe, expect to receive > early pressings in the next few weeks. > > Mail-order enquirers can contact them at 73064 dot 1470 at compuserve dot com > or by mail at: > > Discipline Global Mobile > PO Box 1533 > Salisbury > Wiltshire > SP5 5 ER > UK > > (44) 1722 780187 tel > (44) 1722 781042 fax > > Thanks for your interest. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > From 73064 dot 1470 at compuserve dot com Fri Dec 1 18:33:37 1995 > From: Discipline Global Mobile <73064 dot 1470 at compuserve dot com> > To: Adrian Ogden > Subject: Tony Levin - World Diary > > Tony Levin's World Diary L12.00 available now mail order > > ORDER INFORMATION > Available mail-order from: Discipline ( GM ) - PO Box 1533 - Salisbury - > Wiltshire SP5 5ER > 01722 780187 Tel - 01722 781042 fax > E-Mail 73064 dot 1470 at compuserve dot com > Prices include postage and packing within Europe. > Payment: > Credit card: VISA/Delta, Mastercard, Access and Eurocard > (please give full name and initials as they appear on the Card and your full > address,type of card, card number and expiry date) > Cheques payable to Discipline Global Mobile, drawn on a UK bank, Eurocheques > International money orders. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 08:55:50 -0500 (EST) From: James Poulakos Subject: KC on Fridays way back when In response to my questions about the television show in which I saw KC for the 1st time, two helpful ETers came across with info the rest of us might appreciate, as I did: From: michael Jeter The name of the show was "Fridays" and it was on ABC. Amongst others, it had Michael Richards, now of Seinfeld, and Melanie Chartoff. I believe the tunes were Elephant Talk and Thela. From: "Mark Taylor (Windows NT)" Yes, Crimson were on ABC's show Fridays in 1981. The performance is available on the bootleg "Indiscipline Mining Rocks". Now I remember: at the end of "Thela...," Belew was wrestling with the peghead of his Strat, shaking and bending it to wobble the sustaining tones at the song's end. I was aghast. I was so sure these guys were making rock history. In a subtler way, they did--by influencing the musicians who admired their work. But I thought they'd take New York by storm and be big like the Talking Heads. I was such a naive guitar player then. ------------------------------------------------------------------- In vielen TV-Serien wuerden Konflikte nur mit Gewalt statt in Gespraechen geloest. My home page is now at http://www.gsu.edu/~engjcp/zero.html +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ James Poulakos [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 8 Dec 1995 09:05:07 -0600 From: "John Ott" Subject: None Subject None >From: Marcel Safier Subject: Greg Lake/John Wetton Do KC >The King Biscuit Flower Hour Presents Greg Lake CD features reasonable >versions of 21st Century Schizoid Man and In The Court of The Crimson King. >The concert is from 1981's Greg Lake Band with Gary Moore on guitar and Ted >McKenna and Tommy Eyre from Sensational Alex Harvey Band. >Also, although previously posted, John Wetton's Chasing The Dragon (not >choking the dragon eh John?) features: Easy Money, Starless and Book of >Saturday. >Nothing like ex-vocalists cashing in on the success of their former bands >eh (perhaps that's a bit harsh, but, what the heck!). Now we await Gordon >Haskell's turn, God forbid. As performers who's singing contributed to the success of the songs and co-writers of these songs, they have every right to perform them. If I saw John Wetton in a solo concert and he did not perform Starless or Heat of the Moment I'd feel cheated. I am sure I am not the only one who's first exposure to King Crimson was through Greg Lake performing Epitaph at ELP gig's. I went back to ITCOTCK and was hooked instantly. Grep did Robert Fripp a favor since I know own the entire KC catalog. So calling this cashing in on the success of their former bands a bit harsh is totally inaccurate. ELP was more commercial than KC has ever been. Greg and John perform these songs because they co-wrote them and enjoy singing them. Music is not just about money! (sorry not to reply directly toby, but I feel strongly enough about this to send to the list) peace John [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 10:05:28 -0500 From: jmshepherd at softart dot com (Jim Shepherd) Subject: RE: Crafty Tuning on Guitar >From: cdosem at halcyon dot com (Sarah Melching Christian Overbey) >Subject: Crafty Tuning on Guitar > >I have been using the new standard "crafty" tuning on my guitar since I >first read about it on ET several months ago and love it. I've tried the new standard tuning on my Ovation Custom Legend (brand spankin' new, thankyouverymuch), using DR Zebras as well. I use the Mediums. (12 to 54). I have had no problems with string breakage. I've been using Zebras on my electro-acoustic gits for about 2 years now, and I doubt I will use anything else, unless I find something better. They sound great and I've ever broken only one over the 2 year period. Great strings. Worth the price. I've not had to wait or slowly tune them up. I just tune em up, flex them a bit (by playing) and retune and I'm good to go. JS ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- "I thougth I had a terrible case of mono, then I realized I hadn't had any coffee yet." -- Scott Adams Jim Shepherd Phone: 317.843.1663 Software Artistry, Inc. Fax: 317.574.5867 9449 Priority Way West Drive Voice Mail: 317.574.5856 ext.1221 Indianapolis, IN 46240 Internet: jmshephe at softart dot com ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 10:08:47 -0600 (CST) From: Philip A Patston Subject: Fripp/Fleck..and.. How about adding the fiddle of Mark O'Connor (as we are speculating on ultimate musician line-ups). O'Connor is probably the most virtuoso fiddle/violin player out there. Although thought of as a country musician if you see his solo shows he can improvise on guitar, fiddle and mandolin in an amazing way. His sound is never corny twangy country. He blends elements of rock, jazz and classical in a unique way. His classical compositions (String Quartets and Concerto for Fiddle and Orchestra) attest to his all round ability. It will never happen but the musical possibilities such a collaboration could open up are endless..... Phil. P.S. I agree with the original message about how awesome Bela Fleck and the Flecktones are. The Woottens are amazing. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 11:35:35 -0500 (EST) From: David Lynch Subject: Fleck/Fripp > From: Jeremy Lakatos > Now, one problem would be genre. Fripp is a pretty steady rock and roll > guy, with a tiny bit of jazz in some of his music, plus the influence > of Bruford and Levin. Fleck is well entrenched in jazz and bluegrass. > I don't know if Fripp could stomach bluegrass. Fleck's a little bit country, and Fripp's a little bit rock 'n roll. Hey, why not? eraserhead at iglou dot com / Not the dippy director / Tape trades welcome See the Soap WWW page at: http://www.rahul.net/ndanger/soap/soap.html [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: benhadji at rennes dot enst-bretagne dot fr (Amir Benhadji-Schaff) Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 18:27:24 +0100 Subject: Re: General thoughts about KC Hello happy ET readers. In ET#249 Orn Orrason wrote: 1. "KC is a unique thing in the music world. It should not be classified "prog rock". Leave that to Asia." I totally agree. And I would say more: prog rock doesn't exist! KC, Van der Graaf Generator, P.F.M... are playing completly different music. There may be some links between such groups but they couldn't be classified in one category. And Asia? IMHO just commercial pop (sorry for the Asia fans). In fact prog rock puts together all the groups which don't belong to other categories and which found inspiration in classic music, jazz, and sometimes in traditional music from Europe or other areas. But I'm not completly satisfied by this definition. 2. "KC touches the darker side of your self." Why the darker side??????? KC touches my whole mind and particulary the "brighter side". It's a source of motivation, something which brings me to a higher state of stillness (even when I listen to Thrak or Red)... I could say more but the list of KC's effect on my mind would be boring for all of you. The interesting fact is that every crimhead has his own feelings while listening to KC. These feelings shouldn't be reduced to dark feelings. 3. "A KC fan is alone." Alone as a KC fan or alone generally? Well, it's true that I just have one friends who is really a KC fan, but I recently "converted" (is it the right word?) two other ones. 4. "Robert originates from another galaxy." Quite true! From a galaxy where people fear the light. During the Paris show it was hard to see him, but he stood two times for a few seconds during the terrible guitar riffs of Indiscipline. It seemed to be something unusual. 5. "ET is growing too big." That means that a KC fan is not alone on the planet. Keep listening and keep posting! Bye! Amir. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 12:29:32 -0500 (EST) From: CRIMSO Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #250 Hmm...there was a comment concerning former Kin Crimson Members playing Crimson songs on tour....Ido NOT think that these members are "cashing in".... geez, that sounds like they had the popularity of a BEATLES pop tune. The reason that these songs are played is that the particular members were an integral part of these songs and want to continue to play these!!! Wetton in an interview stated that he wouldnt play the instrumental parts of most the songs (if you listen to Chasing the Dragon or Asia tours, most of them are abreviated), for he would rather play them with Crimson Himself!! The songs he wrote lyrics for are the songs he does perform, and this is similar to what Lake does!!! my $.02 Tim Ritter [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Mathews, Thomas J." Subject: Fripp's shoes Date: Fri, 08 Dec 95 12:47:00 EST I'm curious about the shoes that Fripp has been wearing on stage this past year (he was wearing them in a hall way at least once). I've seen them up close a few times and they look like little black boxes (no, really). What the heck are those things? They look uncomfortable and disfunctional to me. Perhaps he is on to some- thing that we should all know about. Methinks a certain TrapDoor might have access to the answer (?). I pondered if this burning issue was frivolous frying of bandwidth and even asked for the advice of another ETer. He said: "go for it" (now I've gone and done it) tj [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 11:21:09 -0800 From: Rob MacCoun Subject: Frivolity Dream collaboration: I'd like to see a new guitar trio album ("Frivolity"?) featuring Robert Fripp, Fred Frith, and Bill Frisell. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 08 Dec 95 12:24:58 PST From: "Hoard, Chris" Subject: Belew's Brief Stint with KC in 1970 Ahoy Ye Crimson Net-Lubbers, Well, I guess my interest in ET finally prompted me to shell out some hard earned sheckles for Frame By Frame. Disc 4 almost justifies the price of admission in itself. I never imagined RF would appear live in his own group with Greg Lake singing "Let's all get stoned," to touch on another beleaguered thread -- but then, it's not 1969 anymore, is it? Among the surprises I discovered, the appearance of AB on "Cadence and Cascade." Wasn't he a little young at the time? Anyway, I had often wondered if there was an example of AB singing anything pre-LTIA, pre-Wetton, and here it was neatly packaged. The manner in which Fripp credited this in the booklet was a impish practical joke on the long-term KC fan. My question (as my copy of the original has long since disappeared), who was the original vocalist on the track. I think it was Lake. If it was somebody else, does anybody know why RF would have burned the original vocal track for release on this record, other than to offer we fans an amusing little confection and twist on the band's history? I'm curious if there's a story behind this. Anyway, I'm among the contingent that feels the current KC should dig back into a re-interpretation of a few gems that appeared on the first three records. As much as I dig Red and LTIA, I really think the band's played them to death in their live shows--after all, these were staples of their set ever since 1973/4 and throughout the 80s. On the other hand, I'm glad those who never saw the band in the 80s had a chance to "feel" these pieces in live performance. Another nice surprise -- to find myself quoted in the booklet one of the reviewers from 1981 when KC had then regrouped and performed the 80s LA debut at the Roxy. ********** On a more Sticky note, it was a pleasure to read Emmett Chapman's comments posted in #250. Why he's often been the target of so many witless, gossipy detractors in this and other net contexts has bothered me on too many occasions. Anyway, thanks to him for telling it like it is. Crimson fans owe him some respect. He's the father of an instrument and playing technique that has long been a major component in KC's instrumental sound. Personally, I know he can offer a lot of insight and wisdom regarding stick instruments, and music in general, so I can only hope he might be engaged in the future from the standpoint of his knowledge, rather than because some posting here compells him to respond to false or malicious banter, er, broo-ha-ha, chit chat/chit chat... --CH [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 15:40:09 -0500 From: ASFSeattle at aol dot com Subject: 2 Fripp Records Has anyone seen the Fripp album called "Network?" I saw a used copy a few weeks ago but it's gone. It was a compilation of Fripp stuff. It has a really funny picture of RF wearing sunglasses in a very out of character pose. It had an ad for the TofaPP video on the record sleeve that may not be valid any more. An interesting collectible at best. Also, saw a copy of an album called "God Save the Queen/Under Heavy Manners." Looks like side "A" is GStQ & "B" is UHM." Can any one shed any light on this? Is it an out of print import that I should jump at? Private replies please. Thanks, M. Lehman [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 16:16:37 -0500 (EST) From: Karl Myers Subject: Ordering Information for Bill Bruford's Book Hello there, I believe this is my first post. Since there have been multiple requests for Bruford's book "When in Doubt...Roll!" I will post the info for it here. I happen to own the book myself and the drum exercises are excellent and the notes for each song by Bruford are excellent (and funny- especially his rippings of Yes and Wetton) as well. Also included are several very nice pictures and other neat items. Here is the info: Music Dispatch "When in Doubt...Roll!" PO Box 13920 Item # 06630298 Milwaukee, WI 53213 Price: $13.95 (plus $3 S+H) (Sales taxes apply for residents of 1-800-637-2852 Milwaukee County [5.5%], WI [5%], M-F 9AM-8PM, Sat 9AM-2PM and MN [6%]). (central standard time) They may also ask for a code located in the corner of the order form. Tell them the code is MOD12 (Modern Drummer). Music Dispatch also sells other drum books, like Carl Palmer's, and compilations including many famous drummers. The ads can be usually found in Modern Drummer issues. Any other questions, feel free to write! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Karl Myers "Too many hands on my time, too many mophead at udel dot edu feelings -- too many things on my mind." -NP ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: dlynch at udcps dot cps dot udayton dot edu (David Lynch) Subject: King Crimson newsgroup Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 16:24:47 -0500 (EST) Several people have suggested after the original proposal that a newsgroup would best be created as rec.music.artists.king-crimson due to better propagation, fewer incidences of spam, etc. Comments? (Probably better-off sent to me or rec.music.progressive, actually.) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Fred Raimondi" Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 14:31:59 -0800 Subject: Careful with that AX I just got my copy of "Careful With That Ax" from Possible Productions, and this is a MUST HAVE for any Fripp/Crimson fan. The interviews with Robert, and the old Crimson footage is worth the price alone. I was pleasantly surprised. Fred Raimondi -- ############################################################################# # Fred Raimondi 310 314 2809 Office "Women and children can # # Digital Domain 213 917 5193 Pager afford to be careless... # # 300 Rose Ave fred at d2 dot com .........men cannot. # # Venice, CA 90291 #################################################### ############################################################################# [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 10:26:10 +0600 From: thomptl0 at seraph1 dot sewanee dot edu (Thad Thompson) Subject: Trio In the last issue of ET, Riesz Ferenc asks: >My second question: what is the third instrument on "Trio" (SaBB) (besides >the violin and bass)? That would be RF on Mellotron, using the flute tapes. According to David Cross (in the liner notes for the Great Deceiver box), BB is sitting at his kit during the song, holding his sticks across his chest. Gotta love those improvs. -TLT I've got to get dressed to go out of my mind. -King Crimson Oh my god..... it's the sun. -TLT, after a VERY late night But for what purpose was this world created? To drive us mad. -Voltaire [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 21:35:35 -0500 From: JMYandel at aol dot com Subject: What Gunn's Playing, pt.3 Hello again, it's time for another installment from the Unofficial Guide to Trey Gunn's parts series. 8^) I promise, I'll keep this one brief, because ET is getting so huge now we should just get a nice leather-bound cover to contain it! 8^) The Robert Fripp String Quintet _The Bridge Between_ (1) Kan-Non Power--He comes in after the first theme, playing the bass side of the Stick(R). When that first theme returns, he adds a thumping bass line that continues throughout the song, in some form or another. (2)Yamanashi Blues--Here again he adds bass, though it's less obvious. While the CGT pretty much hold the spotlight, Trey and Robert play on the bass side. You can hear him do a short bass glissando during the fast strumming section. (3)Hope--This was the piece that convinced me that the Stick was going to be my instrument. Trey beautifully plays the melody here, while Robert plays the back-up, and the CGT add occasional touches. The melody is all Trey, except for later on, when Paul Richards comes in w/ a Fuzz E-Bow guitar. For those who don't know what this is, it just sounds very fuzzy--very different >from Trey's Stick. (4)Chromatic Fantasy--This piece is all Trey, on the melody of the Stick. (5)Contrapunctus--Trey plays the bass line here, but it's very meshed w/ the CGT's lines. I don't believe I hear Robert. Anyway, Trey's bass line is very clean (it sounds a bit like an church organ, but quieter) and perfectly in time w/ the Trio--if KC ever happens to break up, I'd love Trey to do more work w/ the CGT. (6)Bicycling to Afghanistan--Trey again plays the bass side, but it doesn't appear until the second half of the song. He also could be adding interlocking parts w/ the CGT at the beginning of the song. (7)Blue--Most of the Soundscape is done by Trey, as is the bass line that runs throughout the tune--Robert pretty much just solos over Trey's soundscape. Now that's not to say Robert doesn't contribute to the loop, but Trey has a lot of fading in melody lines in the 'scape, and the slides at the beginning are him also. Just try your hardest to ignor Robert's soloing (gasp!), and concentrate on the soundscape--you'll here Trey building it up gradually. Also remember that the soundscape was done beforehand (at Gunn Studios, no less!), while the guitar solo and bass line are played live. (8)Blockhead--At the beginning, while RF does his backwards guitar, Gunn plays the fading-in bass line. Then, when the main theme returns, Trey has some very audible fade-ins on the melody side. Later, in the 'strumming' section, he adds the pulsating bass. (9)Passacaglia--Trey opens up w/ a very fat bass line on the Stick--this repeats pretty much throughout the piece. There is a moment, however, when Robert recapitulates Trey's opening melody, albeit two octaves higher, while the CGT does their amazing "Circulation" process (ever wonder how they get all those notes to ring out like that? That's because each is only playing one note after the previous player's note, so it appears like one smooth line. Sort of like a bell ensemble); the last two melody notes that RF plays, however, Trey doubles. Then, you can here one solitary Stick melody note, before Fripp's crunching guitar comes in--and Gunn doubles that perfectly in the bass register of the Stick. (10)Threnody for Souls in Torment--Gunn adds quite a bit here, but is too difficult to describe w/ words. The slowly fading in bass drones about halfway through the piece are Trey. That's about the only part of his here that I can really point out. The rest is too interwoven w/ RF's. Well, that includes this week's episode! 8^) Hope I've helped clear things up for someone. I will try to get another post out about some updates and corrections for my previous Gunn posts in this issue. Any comments or questions please e-mail me privately. Thanks! jonathan yandel [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 21:35:40 -0500 From: JMYandel at aol dot com Subject: What Gunn's Playing, pt.4 Hello again, just an attempt to make some brief clarifications on my previous posts about Gunn's parts. You see, I saw them finally live in Chicago on the 29th (I was the guy in the 8th row w/ the binoculars zeroed most of the time on Gunn and Levin, when he was playing Stick(R)). So, here goes....While these are mainly obervations from the concerts, I will list the versions of the songs/pieces that these are heard on. Keep in mind, that while I may say that he plays the Stick (which he indeed does on all the album versions), in concert he was playing an 8-stringed Warr Guitar(R), which had the bass strings reversed from the bass strings on the Stick--which are inverted to begin w/--so, the tuning was from lowest to highest, like a guitar. Just thought some of you might like to know, concidering that through my binoculars I was about a foot from him. Any closer, and I might have known what gauge strings he used! 8^) "VROOOM VROOOM", Thrak version. Trey and Tony engage in a short but intense bass duet towards the end. The double bassline ascends, w/ Tony on bottom and Trey on top. "Larks' Toungues in Aspic, pt.2", B'BOOM version. Halfway through the piece, when Fripp slashes on guitar, the very fast bass arpeggios are played by Trey, not Tony. Later in the piece, in a similar instance, Tony plays the famous snarly bass line that scooped some craters out of my chest during the concert. "Dinosaur", Thrak version. Right before the mellotron break, Adrian plays the oboe-like melody, while Trey's Stick harmonizes underneath. Then, while Fripp plays the mellotron part, Tony harmonizes underneath w/ bowed electric upright bass. "THRAK", all versions. I was pleasantly suprised to discover that it was actually Gunn adding the syncopated slashing chords. I had previously thought that he was merely adding bass lines, but there he was, strumming away. His technique of strumming, however, is universal to both the Stick and the Warr Guitar, as he strums across the neck, and not the body of the Warr Guitar during Thrak. I tried the same things on my Stick and it's easy to do, so I imagine that he'd keep all his parts the same. I must note here that the Thrak improv in Chicago was extremely mind-melting--during the chaotic first part of the improv, there was a good amount of random notes, w/Tony doing some nasty glissandi on his bowed bass, the drummers hitting everything but the drums, Belew playing some very eerie piano noises, and Gunn and Fripp mainly adding atmospheric effects. Then, after about ten minutes of this, Fripp, Belew, Gunn, and Levin begin the most wicked music I'd heard. While some after the show said it was remeniscent of SABB, what I really heard was strong hints of Bartok's String Quartet no.1! I'd always dreamed of hearing this magnificient piece w/ electric instruments, and w/ the four of them wailing away, I was bathed in the Silence that lay behind the music--it also wasn't the only time that night I experienced it. Sorry for my digression, just thought some of you might like to hear that. In "Frame by Frame", "Three of a Perfect Pair", "Thela Hun Ginjeet", and "Neurotica", Gunn mostly stayed very close to Fripp's parts, interlocking w/ them and so forth. Also, during FbF, the last two recaps of the main melody on the Stick (see my previous posts) were split up by Tony and Trey--Tony playing it first, then Trey answering. Needless to say, the instrumentals were the best part, w/ the VROOOMs the best numbers of the night, IMHO. They were faster, and much more intense, and in VROOOM's Coda, Fripp played much diferent harmonies, which fit w/the piece much better than his previous harmonies. I hope I get to hear that again! One small request: does anyone have Trey Gunn's e-mail address? While someone very close to the band forwarded my letter to Trey, I got no reply this past week. While I know he's been incredibly busy, I just wanted to ask him some small technicalities about Stick playing, since his approach to the instrument is so different than anyone's I've heard. Please reply privately by email. Anyway, sorry for the babbling! Best, jonathan yandel [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 8 Dec 1995 23:29:08 GMT From: crimson at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk (ET Mailing List) Subject: Trio Riesz Ferenc scribbled... > On the second side of "In the Wake of Posseidon" the piece "The Devil's > Triangle" appears to be an arrangement of the first movement (Mars, the > bringer of war) of Gustav Holst's orchestral suite, The Planets. This fact > is not credited on the album cover. Does anybody know anything about this ? That's because it isn't an arrangement of that piece of music at all, although they do sound remarkably similar, mostly aided by the bolero-ish drum rhythm. The lead lines are totally different. In point of fact, Crimson used to do 'Mars' inconcert - I believe they played it at the legendary Hyde Park gig in 1969. I suspect that they simply 'developed' it to suit their tastes. > My second question: what is the third instrument on "Trio" (SaBB) It's a Mellotron, playing on its 'woodwind' tapes. Incidentally, if you look at the credit for this (live and improvised) piece you'll see that Bruford is also given a credit despite there being no percussion present. The reasoning behind this is that he constructively used 'silence'. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mike Dickson [Team OS/2], Black Cat Software Factory, Musselburgh, Scotland mike at blackcat dot demon dot co dot uk - Fax 0131-653-6124 - Columnated Ruins Domino ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 9 Dec 1995 19:32:31 -0800 (PST) From: Sasha Alain Wolf Subject: Crimso Alumni I was in the record store a couple of weeks ago and I saw an album featuring David Cross, Keith Tippet, and two other people who's names I've forgotten. The other day I went back to reexamine the CD, but apparently it had been sold. Does anyone have any information on this album? Keith Tippet and David Cross have extremely different styles and I'm curious to see how the two harmonize. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 10 Dec 1995 12:01:58 -0800 (PST) From: Linda Murray Subject: Levin The one record that I can think of now that hasn't been posted yet with Tony Levin is Joanne Shenandoah _Life Blood_. He plays on 3 songs out of about 9. INMO the album ain't too interesting, but... Ian Halloran [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 10 Dec 1995 17:41:08 -0500 From: "Michael J. Stok" Subject: Re: Proposal: alt.music.king-crimson Organization: Pencom Systems Administration In article <4a8a6v$iv3 at news dot cps dot udayton dot edu>, David Lynch wrote: >For the last several years, the Elephant Talk (formerly Discipline) >digest has done an admirable job keeping up with discussion related >to the progressive rock band King Crimson. However, of late Toby (the >list manager) has been overwhelmed with posts. alt.music.king-crimson >would create another outlet for King Crimson discussion and hopefully >relieve the strain on Elephant Talk. I suspect that once the submissions caused by the current tour & releases has died down then things will return to normal. I certainly prefer the structure and order Toby brings to Elephant Talk - it may be big but the signal to noise ratio is high so it's worth reading through and doesn't deteriorate to the good humoured waste of bandwidth which the Yes newsgroup seems to be :-( So I wouldn't be keen on a newsgroup, but that's just my $0.02 Mike -- Mike Stok | The "`Stok' disclaimers" apply. stok at pencom dot com | Pencom Systems Administration (work) stok at cybercom dot net | Cyber Access (play) http://www.cybercom.net/~stok/ | The inevitable WWW page (?) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 10 Dec 1995 20:33:44 -0500 From: ARCHITO at aol dot com Subject: the future?? Hi Crimsoids! While looking through the most recent edition of Goldmine (12/22) to try and find a copy of the laserdisk TOAPP (which I did via Busters in NJ) I noticed this add: (pg 192) King Crimson 09/02/84 KBFH 2 LP Live Concert USD$ 265 AND King Crimson 1974 BBC trans 1 LP Live Concert USD$ 650 OUTRAGEOUS! Does this mean that in the year 1999 we will see Fripp and Co. traded over the counter (ex: Frippertronics up a fifth today), Possible Productions / Discipline Records taken over by Muzak (imagine RED turned into elevator music) or Bill Gates marketing the 'boys" (KC screensaver to be installed in all new IBM / Microsoft computers)! In the mean time, I'll just enjoy Crimso for what it is. THE BEST BAND IN THE WORLD! Ashe-o-ling! Ole-seri. Doug Abshire ARCHITO at AOL dot com Remember: no matter where you are, there you are! (Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 11 Dec 1995 11:13:19 +0100 From: Riesz Ferenc Subject: Holst, Trio: summary; broken coherency in certain KC albums Hi ! Recently I asked some questions and I wish to summarize the answers I got by private E-mail. 1. Indeed, The Devil's Triangle is an arrangement of Holst's The Planets, 1st movement (Mars). It is not credited in the album cover ItWoP, probably due to (1) copyright problems (??) or: (2) Holst's music is well known, it's in the "public domain". However, in the "Frame by Frame" boxed CD set, a live recording of this piece is called Mars and dedicated to Holst. 2. The instruments on Trio are: Cross - violin, Wetton - bass and Fripp - melotron set to the "flute" tape. IMHO Trio is a masterpiece and Fripp uses the melotron in a highly artistic manner. Bruford does not play, but credited in the authors list. I also learned that 90% of SaBB is a live material with some studio post processing. Sorry: I got so many letters that I don't list those who wrote me. Thanks again to everybody ! Another problem: KC--as a poster mentioned--never went commercial, never made compromises. Their albums consist of coherent material where the individual tracks cannot be separated from each other. This coherency is broken in ItWoP by Cat Food (CF) and in Islands by Ladies of the Road (LotR). It's surprising for me since as I understood ItWoP is a half concept album and CF is totally different. CF is good (especially Tippet's piano !) but does not fit to the album. LotR is not so good IMHO, I always skip it when listening to Islands. What was the reason for incorporating these songs ? I think it could not be commerce to increase the selling. It could not be giving a chance to other band members since both ItWoP and Islands were (almost) entirely written by Fripp & Sinfield. It could not be artistic weakness since the rest of the albums are indeed very cool. Ferenc [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca (Anil Prasad) Subject: Exclusive MARK ISHAM interview now on the web!! Date: Tue, 12 Dec 95 0:49:21 EST There's an exclusive interview with Mark Isham up on the Innerviews e-zine website at: http://www.carleton.ca/~aprasad/ It includes a wide range of topics, both musical and industry-related. If you're an Isham fan or any of the many musicians he's collaborated with -- like David Torn or Bill Bruford -- you'll likely find it pretty darn interesting. Anil Prasad aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 12 Dec 1995 17:31:42 +0100 (MET) From: The Scop Subject: Breathless for string quartet? Somewhere, maybe in Mr. Tamm's book, I read one could imagine that "Breathless" from "Exposure" could be played by a string quartet. Now my question: Has anybody tried this, i.e. written down the scores for a string quartet? (If so, I could save the labor and do something else, e.g. write scores for "Red" :-) ) Could you mail me directly, please, as I don't want to waste Bandwidth with this :-) Cheers, The Scop The Scop johakorn at indy1 dot biologie dot uni-freiburg dot de [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 12 Dec 1995 17:06:57 -0500 From: ASchulberg at aol dot com Subject: King Crimson gifs and jpegs I'd like to dress up my King Crimson and Fripp cassettes and am in search of downloadable gifs and jpegs. I would appreciate receiving any pointers to locations where these images may be available. If you will privately e-mail me, I will collect this information for later posting in Elephant Talk. Thanks. Arnie Schulberg ASchulberg at aol dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 12 Dec 1995 18:41:13 -0500 (EST) From: David Lynch Subject: RFD: rec.music.artists.king-crimson [[ Note from Toby: this posting is FYI only. I have no objection to a newsgroup. Please repond to David directly, or on the relevant newsgroups. - Toby ]] REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD) unmoderated group rec.music.artists.king-crimson This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) on the subject of creating an unmoderated Usenet Newsgroup, rec.music.artists.king-crimson. RATIONALE: rec.music.artists.king-crimson There has been a mailing list dedicated to the music group King Crimson for several years, Elephant Talk, moderated by Toby Howard (toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk). However, since King Crimson's reformation in 1994, discussion of the group has become increasingly common on Elephant Talk and on the rec.music.progressive newsgroup. The creation of rec.music.artists.king-crimson would make discussion of the band easier. Further, the mailing list, Elephant Talk, has been overwhelmed with messages, to such a degree that Toby has been compelled to place a moratorium on certain topics to conserve bandwidth. Elephant Talk has at present over 2400 subscribers. A newsgroup would ease these problems. Finally, a newsgroup would provide an unmoderated forum for discussion, in contrast to the moderated mailing list. This newsgroup is not intended to replace Elephant Talk, which will continue in its current form, though it is expected that the creation of rec.music.artists.king-crimson will ease the problems that have grown out of increased mailing list traffic. The creation of r.m.a.k-c would by no means prohibit the discussion of the band or its members on rec.music.progressive, but would simply provide a forum for those fans who would like an additional forum specifically devoted to King Crimson and its individual members. The proposed newsgroup is open to any and all discussion relating to King Crimson and solo/outside projects by any of its members. Expected topic of discussion include (but are by no means limited to): * Reviews of concerts/albums/videos/etc. by King Crimson * Reviews of the same by any of the individual members of the band, past or present * Information regarding the band's touring schedules and discography * The band's history and its place in music history * Equipment and technology used by King Crimson and its members * Issues related to KC-fandom * [and related frippery] CHARTER: rec.music.artists.king-crimson An unmoderated newsgroup which would provide a world wide forum for the discussion of the musical group King Crimson and the activities of its past and present members. To provide a new forum for the discussion of all issues related to King Crimson and its music. END CHARTER. PROCEDURE: This message initiates a discussion period to consider the creation of a rec.music.artists.king-crimson newsgroup. Discussion will take place on news.groups. If discussions are made in other newsgroups, they should always be cross-posted to news.groups. * This is not a call for votes. Please do not attempt to vote now. A call for votes (CFV) will be issued approximately 4 weeks after this RFD. When the CFV is posted, there will be instructions on how to mail your votes to the independent vote-taker. DISTRIBUTION: This RFD is in accordance with the Guidelines for Newsgroups Creation, and has been cross-posted to the following relevant newsgroups: news.announce.newsgroups news.groups, rec.music.progressive, rec.music.misc eraserhead at iglou dot com / Not the dippy director / Tape trades welcome See the Soap WWW page at: http://www.rahul.net/ndanger/soap/soap.html [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 12 Dec 1995 20:49:50 -0500 From: Throatspro at aol dot com Subject: ULTIMATE LIVE RARITIES 2 I thought the ET network might appreciate being warned about a "live import" CD by King Crimson entitled THE ULTIMATE LIVE RARITIES, VOLUME 2. I'd never encountered or heard VOLUME 1, but I was attracted to the disc by the fact that it featured two Jamie Muir performances. (Muir is the only band member featured on the cover art.) The main body of the disc consists of selections from a 1972 Oxford concert, followed by a bonus track improvisation recorded in Bremen, Germany. This is one of the worst quality bootlegs I've ever heard. The sound quality of the Oxford material is execrable--you can't hear a word Fripp is saying during his commentary on Track 2--and the music is barely clear enough to help one identify which piece is being played. It is impossible to comment on the quality of performance. The bonus track suggests that the entire disc should have been culled from Bremen--perhaps that was VOLUME 1?--because the mono sound is moderately better. This improv runs for over 25 minutes (it sounds like a rambling postscript to a Larks 1 rehearsal) and I'm glad to have it, but I can't say the money was well spent. I haven't heard it yet, but a friend has been enthusing about a double CD called MARCH FOR NO REASON, which he says contains the "closest-to-soundboard-quality" recording of the almighty '69 KC yet released. I'm sure this would be much happier investment for those so inclined. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 13 Dec 1995 11:34:30 +0300 (MSK) From: "Borisov Yu.A. (SFCSIC)" Subject: Fripp/McLaughlin and KC' bootlegs in Moscow Hi, dear ETers and many thanks to Toby for his excellent manage- ment, incredible patience and hardiness. My name is Nicolay, I am from Moscow, Russia. I really love King Crimson but my favorite is JOHN McLAUGHLIN. I wonder if these two so charismatic persons like McLaughlin and Fripp was working together so- mewhere at one time? Email me please if you know something about it. Few ET issues ago I have read the dream on desired Fripp/Metheny col- laboration, but IMHO the combination Fripp/McLaughlin (or McLaugh- lin/Fripp) seems significantly more impressive. I think following information may be placed here as the kind of news: Quite recently a curious bootleg Crimson collection has been ap- peared at Moscow famous audio/video black market ("Gorbushka"). It is named "25 Age of King Crimson" and consists of 6 CDs. They are selling separately, not as box set. *1st CD (Crimson collection 1st movement. Vol.1) includes "In the Court of the Crimson King" + 4 tracks from "Lark's Tongues in Aspic" (except "Exiles" and "The Talking Drum") Total time 74:27 *2nd CD (Crimson collection 1st movement. Vol.2) includes "In the Wake of Poseidon" + 6 tracks from "Starless and Bible Black" (except "The Mincer" and "Fracture") Total time 72:35 *3rd CD (Crimson collection 1st movement. Vol.3) includes "Li- zard" + 4 tracks from "Red" (except "Providence") Total time 74:28 *4th CD (Crimson collection 1st movement. Vol.4) includes "Is- lands" + following tracks: 1) Providence (from Red); 2) Exiles (from Lark's Tongues in Aspic); 3) The Mincer (from Starless and Bible Black) and 4) Fracture (from the same) Total time 72:31 *5th CD (Crimson collection 2nd movement. Vol.5) includes "Dis- cipline" and "Beat" completely. Total time 72:57 *6th CD (Crimson collection 2nd & 3rd movement. Vol.6) includes "Three of a Perfect Pair" and "VROOM" completely. Total time 71:49 That's all. Thus, there are not "The Talking drum" (I don't know why) and "Thrak" as the last album. I am not taking into account "Ear- thbound" and "USA" as they are not in CD version in Europe or USA. Each CD costs only 15000 roubles (or 3,3 USD approximately). The- refore you pay not more than 20 USD for the almost complete discograp- hie of your favorites. This is not propaganda or apologia of piracy but perhaps just a bit of INDISCIPLINE. I prefer to buy an official editions not bootlegs. Nevertheless I only would like to say that this is the way for those persons who have not too many money and can not live without Crimson music. Sorry for my broken English and mistakes if occur. Best wishes in New Year and Happy Xmas to all! Thank you for happy Space of ET Nick. sfcsic at mx dot iki dot rssi dot ru (Nicolay Shienok) Coordinational Scientific Information Center of Russian Space Forces [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 13 Dec 95 15:37 GMT From: ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk (Ron Chrisley) Subject: Fripp on new Iona release Pardon me if this is old news, but I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere. Saw a new Iona CD, "Journey into The Morn", yesterday, and thought I would look at it, since Fripp was on their earlier "Beyond These Shores". Yes, Fripp is on this one too! Under "Special Guests": "Robert Fripp: guitar synth and Frippertronics on 'Divine Presence' and 'The Search'" The CD is a very good one, but Fripp's presence is minimal and his contributions could have been made by someone else. FYI, the CD contains a track that is 11:38 long... The CD itself is over 77 mins long. -- Ron Chrisley (ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk) http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/ronc/index.html Chill. Serve. Enjoy. Repeat. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 13 Dec 1995 20:05:13 -0500 (EST) From: Gideon B Banner Subject: The First Day, USA Been listening to Sylvipp/Frian "The First Day" a lot. This album gets better and better. A few notes: Sylvian, although his voice is a bit weak, it seems, comes up with some great rhythmic use of his lyrics (e.g. Jean the Birdman). Trey Gunn is really incredible. Not obtrusive at all, comes up with a definite texture for each song, holds the beat very well. Same for Jerry Marotta: very rarely is he heavy. His strength seems to be in providing interesting rhythmic permutations rather than neat riffs or fascinating beats (I'm comparing him with Bruford). And Sylvian and Fripp -- wow. Fripp's solos are, as always, incredible -- riding perfectly over every change, they continue beautifully, continually changing. I'm still having a bit of trouble pulling his and Fripp's parts apart, which attests to their great musical relationship. Is that final song simply Fripp doing soundscapes? It certainly sounds very similar to A Blessing of Tears, but there are parts at which I cannot believe that merely one person is making all of those textures simultaneously. Could it be Fripp and Gunn together? And where does David Bottrill come into the mix? (I suppose I should buy the live album.) I listened to USA for only the second time a little while ago. My first listening was a while ago: I just thought it wasn't that interesting, a bad recording. But it really astounded me this time. Especially the version of "Asbury Park": Wetton and Bruford are heavy and tight together, Wetton's mellotron seems more of an instrument than a useless background filler to me, and Fripp's solo... Well, what words describe such a solo? Seamless runs, screeching rises, amazing. A couple of questions came to mind, though: where and when was this recorded? Still working on B'Boom, it's not getting any easier.... [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 10 Dec 1995 00:34:29 -0500 From: 103320 dot 3650 at compuserve dot com Subject: E T subscrib & question Boy I really would like to know what kind of signal processor these guys used on the guitar solo in Walking On Air !! Sounds like an evelope generator or something. Where could I get one of those cool toys???!! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] The views expressed in Elephant Talk are those of the individual authors only. Elephant Talk is released for the personal use of readers. No commercial use may be made of the material unless permission is granted by the author. Toby Howard, Elephant Talk editor. http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/staff-db/toby-howard.html toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]