Elephant Talk #232 (as text)

30 October 1995



From: relph at mando dot engr dot sgi dot com (John Relph)
Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 11:04:24 -0700
Subject: Alice _Charade_
I don't remember if it has been mentioned, but the singer Alice has released
a new album entitled _Charade_.  The album features the Warr guitar playing of
Trey Gunn and the guitar playing of The California Guitar Trio.  _Charade_ is
a moody album, with lots of ambience.  I think of her as Italy's answer to
David Sylvian.  Good stuff.  Nice packaging as well.  The album was released
by WEA International (wea 0630-10417-2).

	-- John
--
They don't call it the Net of a Million Lies for nothing.

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 19:25:03 +0100 (NFT)
From: "C. Kazzer Anglistik" <kazzer at rzaix340 dot rz dot uni-leipzig dot de>
Subject: DISC: EXPOSURE-DIFFERENCES
Hello everybody,

I'm another one of those people who by now have all the three different
versions of EXPOSURE, i.e. the original album(s), the remixed CD version,
and the Definitive Edition. It has been noted by many posters before that
these are all more or less different from one another, and there's been
quite a number of posts about some of those differences.
I still believe that, although all versions are enjoyable in their own
right, the remixed/remastered versions would probably not have had the
impact the 'original' recording had.
Anyway, how about collecting the posts on EXPOSURE (including the articles
/interviews on the album submitted by previous posters) and including
them in the ET web-page to make them accessible to everybody? Would that
be possible, Toby? I'd volunteer to do the collecting & searching of back
issues.The same thing would be possible - &, I think, pretty useful - for all
the other albums/songs that underwent changes (e.g.: Matte
Kudasai, Sleepless, etc.).

So here, for a start, is another of those EXPOSURE posts:

The track times given are those of my CD-player and those stated on the
LP(s). The LP has a total length (if I added everything up properly) of
44:57 mins, the Remix-CD comes to a total of 45:56, and the Definitive
Edition to 43:47 mins.
Both LP 'versions', the one with and the one without the inner grooves
(side one: 1981 - IS THE YEAR OF THE FRIPP; side two: THE AIM IS FREEDOM
CONSCIENCE AND TRUTH), seem to be identical. I figure that it was only
the first editions that had the inner grooves 'inscribled'. The LP(s) are
generally 'rougher' in mix, which is apparent in the rawness of e.g.
"Disengage", also the 'white noise' seems to have been removed or lowered
in the mix on the subsequent versions of the album.
Both the remixed and the Definitive Editions appear to have some reverb
added, while the Definitive Ed. has a notably wider range of sound and
clarity. Slightly longer track times could be due to the CD-versions'
accounting for the silent intervals between the tracks as belonging to them.
In the following I will give a track by track listing which doesn't claim
to be complete or anything:
1. "PREFACE":
LP: 1:20, Remix: 1:15, DE: 1:15;
This track appears to be identical although I think the Remix/DE has
slightly  shorter 'pauses' between music/noise
2: "YOU BURN ME UP I'M A CIGARETTE":
LP: 2:23, Remix: 2:23, DE: 2:25;
Again the tracks seem to be identical. D. Hall sings.
3: "BREATHLESS":
LP: 4:41, Remix: 4:39, DE: 4:43;
There is this 'fiddly' guitar which starts the track; then the song
'breaks down' and resumes. Here the Remix/DE versions have the fiddly
guitar from the beginning of the song again, the LP doesn't. Apart from
that I didn't notice any real differences.
4: "DISENGAGE":
LP: 2:46, Remix: 2:53, DE: 2:54;
The vocals on the LP seem much rougher (P. Hammill sings) & the phrasing
is notably different in the first part of the song. The middle seems
identical while the Remix/DE versions have a long "Disengage" sung just
before the song ends which is not on the LP. Both, Remix and DE have a
slow constant fade at the end, the LP version ends rather abruptly.
5: "NORTH STAR":
LP: 3:06, Remix: 3:14, DE: 3:12;
This track is slightly longer on both Remix and DE (fade is slower and
longer)
6: "CHICAGO":
LP: 2:12, Remix: 2:11, DE: 2:18;
The vocals and the vocal phrasing are notably different (P. Hammill
sings) esp. at the beginning (DE and Remix being the same). The DE
version has a longer fade at the end.
7: "NY3":
LP: 2:16, Remix: 2:17, DE: 2:19;
These tracks appear to be identical apart from the Remix/DE not having
the distinct keyboard(?)-sound which runs throughout the LP-track
8: "MARY":
LP: 2:06, Remix: 2:10, DE: 2:09;
Mrs. Roche takes a deep audible breath on the Remix/DE which isn't on the LP
9: "EXPOSURE":
LP: 4:25, Remix: 4:26, DE: 4:27;
The Remix/DE start into the song with two splicings of "It is
impossible...", the LP has only one. The LP has Gabriel (?) growling away
very deeply underneath the track (very much like on "Exposure" on his 2nd
LP), the Remix/DE don't. After about 4 minutes into the track T. Roche
ads a little extra shout on the LP and the song ends with the chanting of
" R...E...Ex" while Remix and DE just end with "...U".
10:"HAADEN TWO":
LP: 2:53, Remix: 1:56, DE: 1:57;
The beginning on the Remix/DE is shorter as well as the intervals between
the tape splices. There is this keyboardy sound again on the LP (like on
NY3), and there are more taped voices on the LP than on the Remix/DE
versions. These are: Eno: "It was an incredible little piece - very, very
impressed by it." Bennett (& sbd. else): Ahh, (garble) how wonderful."
Eno: "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find
interesting. Abandon (?) it." Bennett:" More good advice could hardly be
packed into one sentence than that is there." Unknown woman's voice:
"Both those things were true, that's -(?) definitely true." Deadly
laughter + "Oh dear."  This is the track with the reversed quote from
Monty Python: "One thing is for sure, the sheep is not a creature of the
air."
11: "URBAN LANDSCAPE":
LP: 2:35, Remix: 2:35, DE: 2:35;
This piece seems to be identical on all editions
12: "I MAY NOT HAVE HAD ENOUGH OF ME BUT I'VE HAD ENOUGH OF YOU":
LP: 3:50, Remix: 3:38, DE: 3:38; The LP-version has this keyboardy sound
again on one channel, which seems to be absent from the Remix/DE for most
of the time. The fade at the end is much shorter on the Remix/DE versions.
13: "FIRST INAUGURAL ADDRESS TO I.A.C.E.":
LP: 0:03, Remix: 0:06, DE: 0:07; This seems identical again
14: "WATER MUSIC I":
LP: 1:27, Remix: 1:19, DE: 1:19;
On the LP there is a longer part of music played before and after the
Bennett tape.
15: "HERE COMES THE FLOOD":
LP: 4:01, Remix: 3:52, DE: 3:55;
The Remix/DE seems to have some reverb added, the vocal phrasing seems
slower for much of the song than on the LP-version.
Remix/DE start with Frippertronics & piano to turn into piano & vox
running right through to "If again the seas..." There it has a pipe-like
sound until the end of the chorus. Then its Frippertronics, piano & vox
until "The actors...", then piano & vox until at "If we break..." the
fiddly guitar comes in & stays throughout the chorus. At "If again..." we
have piano, vox and the pipe-sound again. At "...to survive"
Frippertronics come in and the song fades out quickly. The LP is very
similar until "hollow shoulder" where Frippertronics come in and stay
until about "...riding high". At "...as the nails..." the fiddly guitar
comes in and stays through the first chorus (!). At "If again.." there is
a pipey sound but its very different from the Remix/DE version.
Frippertronics come it at "... to survive" and stay until "Don't be
afraid...". At "And if we break.." the fiddly guitar enters again & stays
throughout the chorus. The pipey sound is there again at "If again..."
The rest is very similar to the Remix/DE-version, only the LP-version has
a slower fade at the end.
16: "WATER MUSIC II":
LP: 4:16, Remix: 6:26, DE: 3:55;
The different track times are self-explanatory. Interestingly Mr. Fripp
seems to have been very indecisive about the appropriate length of it.
17: "POSTSCRIPT":
LP: 0:37, Remix: 0:39, DE: 0:40;
The Postscript sounds the same to me in all versions.

This has become quiet a long thing by now & still I'm pretty sure I've
missed a couple of things. There are still plenty of copies of the
original record version about in 2nd hand-stores. Its fun to listen to
the different versions simultaneously, try it.
Enjoy,
Claas

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 19:43:04 +0100 (NFT)
From: "C. Kazzer Anglistik" <kazzer at rzaix340 dot rz dot uni-leipzig dot de>
Subject: CAMILLA/D.SINGLETON/Technical Side of KC
Hi all,

I recently got E-mail from Toby Campling-Richards of Camilla's Little
Secret (the band that had the 'random access' vinyl single out, feat. R.
Fripp, who is also featured on their album 'The Steps') saying that the
album just got licensed in the states. (If you don't know the band, please
check recent issues of ET)

I also asked Toby wheater he & David Singleton would be willing to answer
some questions - if there are any - from ET-posters. He said, he'd love to &
that David Singleton probably would also.
As recent on-line adventures turned out rather dissappointingly I thought
compiling a list with questions would be the best thing for all parties.
So, if there is any interest out there please e-mail me privately.
David Singleton is busy touring - I think - with KC, so there won't be
any decisive answer before he returns.

P.S.
David Singleton has been involved with Robert Fripp & KC for many years
now, mainly in the fields of production, mixing & sound engineering (e.g.
Frame by Frame-box, Sunday all Over the World, RFSQ, Soundscapes, .... -
check your collection). So, if it all works out this would be the chance
to talk & ask questions about the technical/production-side of RF's work &
KC.

Cheers,
Claas

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 22:04:31 -0500 (EST)
From: FISHBOY <AACUNZO at ccmail dot sunysb dot edu>
Subject: thoughts on B'boom
Hello,

First off, thanks to everyone who gave me advice on what Fripp solo albums
are the best.  I'm going to pick up Exposure one of these days, as that was
clearly the album people recommended most.

On to the meat of my post - a few scattered opinions/musings/questions about
B'boom.  I am really impressed with this CD, and since I lent it to a friend
I've been going through withdrawl (but I had to spread the music).  It's really
odd that they would put out something from their first shows together, where
you can clearly hear in spots that this is a band finding its feet.  It
was obvious to me in "Red," where you can feel these 6 top notch musicians
fighting to fill the space formerly occupied by 3.  The piece doesn't
"breathe" as much.  (Still great to have a live version of Red, though!)  I
can't wait 'til the inevitable next live album (hey, this is the first time
Crimson has put out a live album without breaking up or being broken up
already!), though, where a lot of this stuff will be ironed out (not too much,
I hope) from all the time onstage together.

"Heartbeat" is great, IMHO.  Blows away the studio version; a lot more
emotional.  "Talking Drum/Lark's II" is sssoooo intense!  Belew's singing is
fantastic throughout the CDs.  I get the impression that "Thrak" is a living
organism when I listen to it (I think someone else mentioned this as well).
I love the extended ending of "Frame By Frame."  "Sleepless" doesn't stand
up to the studio version in my opinion.  In the middle section of "Red," it
sounds like Levin is picking the solo (using his fingers I guess; I don't
think he likes to use picks), whereas I'm pretty sure when I saw them on
the Thrak tour, he bowed an upright electric.  Incidentally, that is one of
the nastiest bass sounds I've heard!

All in all I really enjoy these CDs, and I think the "official bootleg"
title was appropriate, because that's what it feels like - an unpolished
recording of entirely live performances, although in great sound quality.
At first I wondered "gee, how many times is he gonna release this stuff?"
but I have to say it's a great idea - since the fans want it, put out the
material in official sound quality so the band profits and not the
bootleggers.

Later everyone,
Andy Acunzo
aacunzo at ccmail dot sunysb dot edu

P.S.  I wrote this post a few days ago.  Since then, I have purchased
tickets to one of the NYC shows.  Once I heard the price, I seriously
considered passing on it.  $50 a ticket!  Unbelievable!  (Not to mention
the $5 surcharge.)  But for some reason I ordered them anyway, even though
I already saw King Crimson on this tour.  The esteem in which I hold Fripp
and co. has just dropped significantly, though.  Charging your fans $50 to
see you is outrageous.  They didn't even play for 2 hours when I saw them in
the spring (about 100 minutes).  This doesn't diminish the music they make
together of course, but it now seems to me that they couldn't care less about
their fans.  (Incidentally, only 3 shows were on sale, 11/20, 11/21 & 11/22.
After the post from Possible Productions a few issues back I was led to believe
they'd be playing the weekend of 11/24-25 as well.  Maybe they wanted to
see how they'd sell first before they put more shows on sale.)

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 22:05:18 -0500 (CDT)
From: "James J. Warren" <JJWARREN at ualr dot edu>
Subject: please post this to Elephant Talk
TWo questions for subscribers to ELEPHANT TALK:

1) Should I wear earplugs to the King Crimson Concert (i'll be attending
the Nov. 4th, Saturday night, date in New Orleans at the House of blues)?

2)  What are some of the highlights (esp. improvisations) I should be on
the lookout for that night?

PLease e-mail me direct with your responses, as I'm not able to subscribe
at this time.

							THANKS
							-JJW
							jjwarren at ualr dot edu

--------------------------------------*-----------------------------------------
l  James J. Warren	             * *
l  jjwarren at ualr dot edu  * * * * * * * *   * * * *   "Maybe I'll just sing awhile
l  Little Rock, AR	    ASTROS FAN!!    *      And then give you a call
                                    *    *         Maybe I'll just say hello
                                 *    *   *        And say maybe that's all...
                              *            *                    YES/ritual
(opinions expressed here are solely my own; not the Astros', Yes', UALR's, etc)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 23:17:00 +0000
From: asphodel at interport dot net (Erik Gilbert)
Subject: Previously Unreleased Fripp
Swarm of Drones, a just released double CD compilation, includes a
previously unreleased Robert Fripp track entitled '2000 II'.  This track is
taken from the '1999 Soundscapes Live in Argentina' recordings and is
exclusive to this compilation.

Contact asphodel at interport dot net for more information

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 20:17:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Isaiah Singer <isinger at ocf dot Berkeley dot EDU>
Subject: Boot Beg:  Berkeley
	Since I'm sure there will be more than enough reviews of the show
in this issue, I'll limit my "criticism" of the Berkeley show to one word:
Transcendent!
	What I wanted to ask was, if anyone made a decent tape of the
show, could I convince you to give me a copy?  I don't have much in the
way of boots for trade, but of course I'll give you blanks and travel any
reasonable distance to minimize your trouble.
	Please e'mail me, please!
		Innumerable Thanks,
			ISAiah Singer

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 18:09:06 JST
From: ohsawa at csg dot sony dot co dot jp (T. Ohsawa)
Subject: H. Moriya (CGT) Interview
Hi Everyone,

This is a continuation of the translation of the interview with Mr H.
Moriya, a member of CGT.
Please first read the translation I did before (few numbers back).

AA. You don't use music sheets on stage. What about when you are practicing?

HM. We use them sometimes when we bring our ideas to CGT. Other than that
we use them for classic music piece. Like the piece by Bach which we
recorded in our new album. We used music sheets during the practice for
that piece. At that time Bert, who is an authority in classic music and
good at music sheets, have written the music sheets for each part.

AA. Tell me the process you go through to complete an original music piece.

HM. Basically, a member who believes that certain riffs and a progression
of chords may become a song brings those idea. Then ideas are added by the
member himself or by others. It is clear from the authoring credits given
in the new album. I do not think the description in the first album was
appropriate. Because we are a band with three members, I don't think we
should play a song that is composed by one member only.

AA. Have you done any special treatment in the arrangement of music pieces
because you play with instruments that are of the same music scale? For
example, I feel that you have done quite a bit of thinking as to the
exchange of different parts of a music piece among the members.

HM. We distribute parts so that each member is able to play the parts that
they are good at. For example, quick phrases are played by Bert or me.

(to be continued)

Bye, Tom

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 10:41:20 +0100 (MEZ)
From: Johannes Korn <jokorn at mibm dot ruf dot uni-freiburg dot de>
Subject: Re: Gordon Haskell
snip
> keeping Gordon off the release?  It strikes me odd that the two studio
> pieces from his era were re-worked.  Cadance and Cascade has his vocals
> replaced by Adrian and Bolero is billed as a re-mix (to remove his
> contributions?).  The lack of Lizard material strikes me as odd givin that
snip

I think the main (and only?) change in 'Bolero' is the bass part that
has been renewed by Tony Levin for whatever reason (maybe Mr. Fripp
didn't like the old one or the sound quality was too bad?). If
you listen to it, you can hear Tony's characteristic style quite well.

Cheers,
Johannes

jokorn at mibm dot ruf dot uni-freiburg dot de

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 03:01:51 -0700
From: bfcain at ix dot netcom dot com (Bradley F. Cain )
Subject: KC in Mix Magazine
    Check out Crimson's live sound setup review in Mix magazine
(October, 1995 - Vol. 19, No. 10).
    The article describes how the sophisticated (stereo!) stage
monitoring helps all the band members keep track of and feed of each
other and details what equipment is used for us gearheads...

Don't say I didn't warn you,
Bradley F. Cain
bfcain at ix dot netcom dot com

Date:         Tue, 24 Oct 95 06:38:22 EDT
From: michael jeter <MDJKB at CUNYVM dot CUNY dot EDU>
Subject:      Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #231
RE:  LongAcre NYC Shows
I can understand the ticket prices, or, I should probably justified the prices
in my mind in the following manner:  KC are a fair.ly large band in the
rock idiom(6 members) with a relatively small following, compared to people
like Clapton, for instance.  Combine this with the fact that the show is taking
place on Broadway, and the price is comprehensible.

However, I am not all "hugs and kisses" toward this outcome of events.
First of all, we were told that KC would play M, T, W, F,&S.  I call up
Telecharge, and they tell me its only M, T, & W.  Further, they would not or
could not tell me the prices of the tix until the day they went on sale(I had c
alled days before, trying to plan my budget)  It makes no sense that we don't
know the price until the tix go on sale.  And it makes even less sens that we
only get three shows when for at least a month, we were told we would get 5.
C'mon, DGM.  What gives?  this was exceedingly sloppy

However, for those who would like to get together, I am attending the
Wednesday night show, 6th row, orchestra , centersage:-)

Michael Jeter  718-372-8556
Stop Before You Start, Be Still My Beating Heart:-)

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 07:24:14 -0400
From: gleaso74 at potsdam dot edu (Scott  M. Gleason)
Subject: RE: ONWARD magazine
Hello everyone,
     ONWARD is magazine dedicated to covering "progressive" music.  Issue
number one will be out in December and will contain interviews with
echolyn, PENDRAGON, SADUS, SPOCK'S BEARD, ARS NOVA, OBLIVEON, CAIRO, TEN
TON TIDE, DARK HALL, WHITE WILLOW, and possibly EVERON, STRANGERS ON A
TRAIN, SHADOW GALLERY, and ARAGON.  If anyone would like any information at
all, simply write to one of the following addresses:  gleaso74 at potsdam dot edu
                 or:  brizzb at sage dot edu

"We receive all we venture to give..."

                          -YES

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 09:06:33 -0400
From: Jose dot Douglas at turner dot com
Subject: KC/CAMEL
     The only connection (slight) that I can think of is that Brian Eno
     played (can't remember if he produced, but can check it out) on
     Camel's RAIN DANCES album back in 1977.

     Phil Collins played percussion on I CAN SEE YOUR HOUSE FROM HERE, but
     that's neither her nor there.

     Speaking of Camel, they have a new CD coming out on 6 November called
     Harbour of Tears. Their previous, DUST & DREAMS was pretty good.

     Bye for now.

     JD

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 09:55:31 -0400
From: "Gordon Emory Anderson" <ganderso at notes dot cc dot bellcore dot com>
Subject: Fripp on Eno's "I Fall Up"
Although I don't believe he's credited, that has to be Fripp on "I Fall Up"
>from Eno's boxed set. The liner notes credit the song to an unreleased album
entitled "My Squelchy Life". Does anyone know for sure? (Or read the credits
more carefully?) The song is good, and Fripp's playing is good, but somehow I
feel the two do not synergize like the collaborations of ole.

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 15:33:26 GMT
From: Jason Thornton <jthornton at ucsd dot edu>
Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #231
Subject: 'Thrak' on vinyl?

>kohern at direct dot ca (kevin patrick o'hern) wrote...

>> Hi, does anyone know if 'Thrak', 'Vroom', or 'B'Boom' were released on
>> vinyl (most likely in Europe I suspect), if so who do I talk to?

>I don't * know * absolutely for certain that they weren't on vinyl, but I
>would rather doubt it. Judging by the length of the albums they would have
>to cram about an hour's worth of music onto one LP and that is invariably a
>recipe for repellant sound quality. Since quality of that nature appears
>important to Fripp I would hardly imagine he'd permit a vinyl release.

Sorry, but vinyl is NOT "invariably a recipe for repellant sound quality."
In fact, a lot of audiophiles tend to prefer vinyl, because unlike
current CD digital technology, vinyl captures the entire sound wave -
not just little segments of it.  Through the right equipment (ie, expensive),
a record might very well sound better than a CD to some people's ears.
I prefer CD's myself - for numerous reasons including price of equipment, size,
easy switching from track to track, and, of course, shuffling and programming
modes).

Many long CD's, such as Sylvian/Fripp's "The First Day" are released, in
limited form, as double LP sets.  (I remember seeing this in a store here
in San Diego).
___________________________________________________________________________

Jason Thornton                             "He who does not assert himself
jthornton at ucsd dot edu                          thereby remains free of blame."
San Diego, CA                                     --Lao Tzu
                      "Organic Machinery"

Chapman Stick, Silver Polycarbonate, #2125

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 08:40:12 -0700
From: "William M. Heinrichs" <billh at olympic dot JPL dot NASA dot GOV>
Subject: RE: Thrak: The Motion Picture
>
>Does anyone know if Bob The Fripper is planning to film any of the Thrak
>shows for commercial release?
>
>~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~
>        Anil Prasad                         aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca
>

Hello,

	I can tell you that the House of Blues concert was
displayed on a tv monitor giving a continuous full stage
view. I do not see why it wouldn't have been taped. BTW:
This concert was absolutely, posatively, one of the BEST that
I have ever attended! Maybe, if we all say please ...  =)

later,

	-Bill

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 10:01:50 +0800
From: John dot Lukes at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (John Lukes)
Subject: Thrak liner notes
I gave a copy of Thrak to a good friend for his birthday last week,
right after several of us saw the show in Berkeley.  He phoned last
night (I could hear Thrak playing in the background) and thanked me
again for the gift.  He asked me if I had noticed the backwards words
that are on each page, and challenged me to seek them out and decipher
them.  He says it's pretty humorous -- and very Crimsonian.

I haven't checked it out yet, but plan to.  (Is this OLD NEWS to this
group? -- if so, my apologies)

-JOHN

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 13:05:23 -0400
From: "Gordon Emory Anderson" <ganderso at notes dot cc dot bellcore dot com>
Subject: Radio Play?
Another thing (this being my 2nd Email posting), can anyone tell me why KC
seems largely ignored by commercial radio these days? "Dinosaur", amongst other
tunes, is certainly radio-friendly (unlike "Vroom", because it has committed
the cardinal sin of not having vocals). On my way to work I regularly flip
between stations to check traffic and, perhaps, hear something that isn't crap,
but never a mention of KC (in NYC, no less!). Some might say that commercial
radio doesn't believe the public will like KC, but I don't buy that (the public
would like KC, or at least some of it, and radio stations know it). Can someone
explain this? Is the payola system selecting quality here, or what? This may be
why Jazz died in the 70s, because true creativity can't be controlled and
programmed for success, so mass media has herded the American public into
safer, more predictable pastures. Internet may be an end run around this.......
Emory.

From: Terrance L Kalka II <tlkalka at mailbox dot syr dot edu>
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 13:28:19 EDT
Subject: KC live/studio
This is in response to the ET'er who felt that after listening to B'Boom,
KC weren't worth seeing, since "They can reproduce their studio sound
onstage...there is little difference between THRAK and B'boom."(paraphrase)

WHAT????
Sorry for the breach of nettiquette, but WHAT???  One of King Crimson's
selling points has always been the fact that the live experience is
radically different from the studio experience.  The concert I saw in
Buffalo, NY proved that many times over.  B'boom should prove it as well,
and  I would like to point out some of the cases where this is so:
1. Frame by Frame - many of Fripp's cirular runs are completely different
>from any 80's version.  The division of percussion duties augments this
track as well.
2. Red - C'mon, this sounds nothing like the original track, and not
a whole lot like the live 80's version.
3. B'Boom/THRAK - Both are much longer, more wild and far less polished
than the studio versions.  There are several gestures in B'boom which
have been changed or replaced.
4. Talking Drum/Larks' II - The new instrumentation demands that this
is different from previous versions.  It gets better as the years go on.
5. Heartbeat - Trey Gunn really helps flesh this one out.
6. Sleepless - just listen to the percussion.

I suppose this isn't the most pedantic argument, but I think if one
really listens to all that's going on in a 90's KC recording, one will
find some astonishing differences between different versions of the same
song.  I guaruntee that any KC concert will be different from any other

peace
Terry

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 95 16:22:46 JST
From: ohsawa at csg dot sony dot co dot jp (T. Ohsawa)
Subject: KC Interview   A. Belew
This is a continuation of the translation of an interview conducted by the
magazine Marquee.
AB represents A. Belew. M represents Marquee interviewer. Please refer to
my earlier translation if you want to capture the whole atmosphere. I can't
translate everything at once due to time constraints.

M. Is that where King Crimson as a band differs from other bands?

AB. It's hard to find out which part of King Crimson is different from the
other's. But the general characteristic of King Crimson is like that. Of
course, it is no doubt that Robert is responsible for the majority of it.
He leads the band and if there is certain sound that he likes then it's
probably the sound we are creating. He is supporting everything in the
back. I, Tony and Bill who have been working with Robert take in the
concept and make it into a material we could play. Each person with strong
characters and their music identity crash each other and form one material.
Though we discuss much about it before we play it, the music itself has its
own life in the end and it will move on.

M. I have an impression that Robert is not only an instrument player but
also his certain policies
of music frame the activities of King Crimson. Which part of Robert do you
sympathize with and therefore continue to be a Crimson member?

AB. He is my favorite player but at the same time he is a conceptual
musician. He has a very strong ideas and insists on fulfilling those ideas.
He will concentrate on those ideas. That's why there is a strong character
in his music. The reason why I like to play with Robert is that two of us
together can do something others can't do. He always supports my ideas and
I feel that we have a very good partnership. He is also a good friend of
mine. He is a complicated person so it takes time to understand him. I have
spent a lot of time on it and he became a good friend. Even if we didn't
play together, I would have been a fan of his activities.

M. Wasn't your visit to Robert's house and your discussion with him in 1991
one of the major triggers for starting King Crimson this time? Did you
propose anthing to him at that time?

AB. I proposed to him in the beginning that we should bring in the right
players and make it a band or Robert and I only would play together and
invite different players per album. You know that in early King Crimson
days they had different players per album. So I thought it would be easier
for Robert to do like that. He and I would form a core and then invite
players who would fit for each song. This song should be played by Bill
Bruford, but the next one should be played by Pat Mastelotto. That was my
original proposal. If you don't want to do a full band King Crimson with
former members, then it could be done in the way I just said.  But few
years after that Robert thought that he wanted to do everything including
that (Laughs). I think that's why he wanted to have both Pat Mastelotto and
Bill Bruford in the band. I was pleased that he arrived at such a
conclusion. There's nothing we cannot do now. It's wonderful for me that I
can play with them.

M. But why did you at that time proposed the rebirth of King Crimson?

AB. Here in the States, since the atart of the '90's there were rumours
here and there that the new King Crimson would be born. I was always asked
by everyone if there will be a birth of new King Crimson. So I thought I
should meet Robert when I went to England for some other occasion. I met
him and asked if there would be a new King Crimson. If there would be one,
I said I want to definitely join it. Interesting thing was that Robert was
already thinking the same thing.

M. Was that a simple coincidence? Or ---

AB. There was something I think. We realized vaguely that the time has come
again for King Crimson to do something. I didn't want to be out of it. Not
just watching it from a distance but I wanted to actually take part in it.

(to be continued)

Bye, Tom

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 23:58:13 EDT
From: whatthat at nando dot net
Subject: ET:  Re:  Daryl Hall solo album
The Daryl Hall album eventually did come out in 1980.  It was called "Sacred
Songs" and as I remember it, it seemed to have been one of those albums that
came out around the time with the cover art slightly changed every few
hundred copies, like Hall & Oates own "Voices" album.  I have a copy of
Sacred Songs -- the only common track with Exposure is the sequence
beginning "Urban Landscape" into "I May Not Have Had Enough Of Me But I've
Had Enough Of You", but the last number has been retitled "NYCNY" and given
new lyrics, and a proper ending (even though it's a fade) instead of the
little radio static track on Exposure.  I thought it was very interesting
that the vocal part was completely different (words, tune, and subject
matter) and to me, it opened my ears for later alleged travesties such as
the erasing of Gordon Haskell, the snipping of "Starless", etc.  It's ironic
to hear Frippertronics in a pop setting, as in the song "Something In 4/4
Time" (how's that for a title for Fripp to play on?) and I'm not sure it
comes off, but I like it anyway.  The album is well worth picking up if you
can find it.

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 23:52:14 -0400
From: OlafurT at aol dot com
Subject: ABBA ?
Fripp or ABBA. Boy, tough choices nowadays . . .

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 20:40:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Damon D. Jackson" <PICL137 at FSPHY1 dot HEP dot FSU dot EDU>
Subject: anyone in Orlando?
I am getting ready to travel from Tallahassee down to
Orlando to see King Crimson, and was wondering if anyone
would like to get together before the show?  Just send
me some email, and we will see if we can work it out!

Damon Jackson
picl137 at fsphy1 dot hep dot fsu dot edu

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 17:32:40 -0700
From: Ubiquitous at eworld dot com
Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #231
     Just saw the Crimson show in Phoenix last night. Sitting in the front
row I couldn't help but notice that Tony Levin and Adrian Belew truly stole
the show. I have never seen a bass ( and stick) player have so much charisma
on stage ! It was absolutly mesmerising. Belew is definatly one of the best
and underated guitar players I have ever seen. Fripp was, in my opinion, was
too stoic. It was hard to even really realize his presence. As for the show
it was abosolutely phenomenal!

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 17:08:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: THRAK <joe at speakeasy dot org>
Subject: Giles, Giles and Amnesia ???
Greetings once again to the League of Crimheads!

	A few issues back, a post briefly mentioned the forgotten
pre-Crimso album, "The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles & Fripp."  Was
it Fripp who recited the Rodney Toadey skits?  I think they are very
funny and play them for my non-Crimhead friends (all of them) all the
time.

	There is a part between songs on The Great Deceiver boxed set
when Fripp is talking with the audience before introducing a song.  One
of the crowd members is being especially raucous and Fripp quips:
	"Your enthusiam is appreciated, however, control is needed."
To which the crowd gets a good chuckle.  But it's right before this part,
when he begins speaking, he says at one point: "No, not Rodney."

[ I remember going to various UK concerts in the 70s and it was common
  practice for the crowd to shout out "Rodney", regardless of which band
  was playing. There was another name often called out too,
  which I've forgotten -- Toby ]

	Can anyone decipher what the audience member is saying that
prompts Fripp to say this?  I'm assuming he is referring to Rodney Toadey
>from the Cheerful Insanity album, but the way Fripp shrugged it off (if
one can imagine it verbally) made it sound like a piece of his past that
he would rather forget.

	Does Fripp ever talk about the significance of Giles, Giles &
Fripp, other than how it evolved into King Crimson?  Is it something he
is somewhat ashamed of?  I'm assuming so, because it is never mentioned
other than as a point of trivia.

	If anyone is capable of reading Mr. Fripp's mind or if you, Mr.
Fripp, would be humble enough to share your thoughts and opinions on this
album, please don't refrain.  Any thoughts or information is appreciated.

Thraks in advance.

-Joe

From: David Maclennan <davidm at cs dot moc dot govt dot nz>
Subject: "Stillusion" extra tracks
Date: 25 Oct 1995 09:31:28 +1300
To put T. Ohsawa's mind at rest, I can hereby report that the extra
tracks on the Voiceprint CD of Pete Sinfield's "Stillusion" are
DREADFUL!!

One other point: the tracks are in a different order than on the
original vinyl version, so you'll need to program your CD player
accordingly (leaving out the extra tracks of course!).  The sound
quality is lovely, I might add.

-- David Maclennan

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 16:08:22 -0400
From: jdmassey at mindspring dot com (Jack Massey)
Subject: Re: B'Bummer
Mike wrote:

>Sorry if this flies in the face of the popular opinion I read in 'Elephant
>Talk', but having bought both 'Thrak' and 'B'Boom' I can't help having the
>distinct impression that I've bought the same thing twice. I don't think
>I'm going to make this mistake again.

Shit, Mike, the live version of "Red" on B'Boom is worth the price of
admission alone (that's the price of the CD)! The remainder of B'Boom is a
case for musical subtlety. Therein lies the beauty. Obviously, you're not
"listening".

Jack

jdmassey at mindspring dot com

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 13:10:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: The Man Himself <altruist at shoko dot calarts dot edu>
Subject: Originality Rant (Or: Why Steve Goodman doesn't owe Fripp an explanation)
Steve Goodman wrote:

> Thus my question, given the above.  I'd like to perform this material,
> which, one might easily admit is similar in a lot of respects to either
> Frippertronics, Enossification, or Soundscapes (though on a much lower-
> budget level), and mainly put it through PA systems live at places like,
> say, Ice Cream Parlours.

> What would Mr. Fripp's idea be about this?

> I tend to think along the lines that even slight imitation is in my case
> profoundly complimentary, and while I have a drive to perform the work and
> bring it to people who might otherwise not hear it, I still have the utmost
> respect for people who have been recording this type of music for over 20
> years.  Yes, I've debated the enrollment in the GC courses, but lacking the
> money and time, I've had to rely on my own resources to achieve what's been
> done so far.

You should feel *absolutely* no problem with playing this music.  And
without wanting to be offensive, the notion that you might need to go
through a Guitar Craft course in order to justify playing E-bow loops in
ice cream parlors is profoundly ridiculous.

Look at it this way: From a certain point of view, Fripp has been doing
an imitation of Bartok, Hendrix, and Schoenberg for the last thirty
years.  (He even ripped off "The Planets" by Holszt (sp?) and billed it
as his own composition under the title "The Devil's Triangle.")  Do you
think he asked any of these influences for their permission?

Just about anybody who makes music is following somebody else's lead.
The thing that makes it unique and distinctive has to do with how much of
themselves a person puts into the process, and whether or not their
musical sources of inspiration serve as a point of arrival or a point of
departure.

Fripp and Eno don't hold the patent on looping any more than Hendrix holds
the patent on an electric guitar, even though in each case, these people
more or less defined the realm min which these instruments are used.  Look
at guys like David Torn or Michael Brook.  These are two players for whom
looping is an instrinsic aspect of their musical approach.  As a matter of
fact, I also do work with loops, and yes, I even use an E-bow, and the
stuff I do doesn't sound like Frippertronics or Soundscaping.

Personally, I have a feeling Fripp would be pleased to know that somebody
else is carrying on his tradition -- the ice cream parlour as a choice of
performance site is very much in line with Fripp's penchant for atypical
performance venues, such as barber shops and pizza joints.

You're right in saying that a slight imitation might be profoundly
complimentary.  But what would be even more complimentary would be using
these tools and finding your own approach to it, in the same manner than
Fripp used his influences as a starting point towards his own development.

So ask yourself this question (and I'm speaking metaphorically here, too):

If you record a tape loop of your own speaking voice, is it going to sound
like a tape loop of Fripp's speaking voice?

The answer depends upon how closely you attempt to copy his accent.

--TMH

From: Paolo Valladolid <pvallado at waynesworld dot ucsd dot edu>
Subject: Rock And Jazz
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 12:46:47 -0700 (PDT)
Someone brought up the question: Why does not Fripp play jazz?
While I do not presume to speak for Mr. Fripp, consider the
following:

- Many of Crimson's improvised moments come very close to jazz
in spirit if not in form. "Thrak" and "Requiem" are the closest
I've ever heard Crimson venture towards free jazz territory.

- To most people, the word "jazz" connotates a way of playing
music within a specific rhythmic and harmonic tradition; namely
"swing feel" and certain types of chord progressions. There are
a number of creative musicians (such as Fripp, Fred Frith, David
Torn, Anthony Braxton, etc.) who avoid classifying themselves as
jazz musicians in order to avoid being pigeon-holed in this manner.

- You are more likely to reach a wider audience as a "rock" artist
than as a "jazz" artist. A lot of people want to hear words along
with the music and grow impatient or even angry if exposed to
instrumental music with no words at all.

-
Paolo Valladolid
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 20:48:47 +0300
From: j at vrooom dot pp dot fi (Jukka Kukkonen)
Subject: Fripp's guitar solos (re: ET 230)
Peter asked in ET230:
>>I've been trying to figure out some of Fripp's solos on "The
>>Bridge Between" with no luck.  Does anyone know what modes or scales he
>>generally uses?
Hmm...How many guitar solos by Fripp have you found on the Bridge Between then?

I found only the obvious one on "Blue" (recorded in Rosario, Argentina on
May 10, 1993) which is a Starless-like melody (in G minor). That solo is a
typical example of Fripp's eclectic selection exotic scales.

BTW, also the title track from "Red" was never played live until in
Argentina in 1994 (released on B'Boom). It has some dark Eastern European
Bartok-like modes, just like VROOOM and especially VROOOM VROOOM.

In the 80's the "Classic Crimson" became "Crafty Crimson" and Bartok was
replaced by Beatles, Bach and something like the Indonesian Gamelan music.

Nowadays Fripp's playing is mostly Soundscapes, which starts with a block of
guitar noise that is then intensively sculpted with various special effect
devices into a piece of music. "Threnody for Souls in Torment" is a fine
piece of soundscapes, although it's hard to say how much of it is actually
played by Trey Gunn, whose Stick is more dominant on tBB than Fripp's Tokai.
-Jukka <j at vrooom dot pp dot fi> http://personal.eunet.fi/pp/vrooom/

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 20:49:50 +0300
From: j at vrooom dot pp dot fi (Jukka Kukkonen)
Subject: Camel connections (re: ET-231)
Phil asked in ET-231:
>Mel Collins plays on early KC and some Camel albums. are there other
>connections between the two bands?
Not many direct connections (KC's an animal of a different nature), but
speaking of 'Collinsions': Phil Collins has played with both Camel (on "I
Can See Your House From Here") and Fripp (on "Exposure"). Also Fripp's long
time collaborator Brian Eno, who appears on Camel's song "Elke" on Rain
Dances, has used Phil as a session drummer. And Mel plays well on No-Man's
"Flowermouth", also featuring our Master Fripp on guitar.
-Jukka <j at vrooom dot pp dot fi> http://personal.eunet.fi/pp/vrooom/

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 20:49:09 +0300
From: j at vrooom dot pp dot fi (Jukka Kukkonen)
Subject: I.B.E. (re: ET-231)
Niko asked:
>I just happen to take notice of the release of a Fripp CD called
>INTERGALACTIC BOOGIE EXPESS - LIVE (DGM 1991). Does anybody know this one???

I suspect Fripp does not play on all of the tracks, although he has
personally signed my CD. There are 9 other crafty guitarists listed (incl.
California Guitar Trio). Fripp was the force that got the tour moving in
the first place - he even had to sell one of the most valuable instruments
>from his personal guitar collection to make money after being ripped off by
EG management. Fripp reveals the whole truth in the excellent and
interesting liner notes.

The CD is actually recorded live only in Germany, as they were not as well
received in other countries. Fripp tells in the CD booklet how the mayor of
a Spanish town had walked out laughing out loud after hearing the first
chords. "Larks' Thrak" is a composition by Fripp and it might be one of his
earlier attempts to build the bridge between the 70's & 90's King
Crimsons. The other tracks are typical crafty stuff. Also the obligatory
Bach arrangements are there.

After the 20th track "Wabash Cannonball", which is the last one listed,
there are 2 more hidden extra tracks with minutes of silence before them: a
"non-performance for photographers" (not for bootleggers though :-)
introduced by Master Robert himself and a surprise encore, probably played
when the unsuspecting crowds are leaving the hall.  Are there E-Talkers who
attended the League's Dusseldorf, Bonn or Hannover gigs in 1991? Please
tell us more.  -Jukka <j at vrooom dot pp dot fi> http://personal.eunet.fi/pp/vrooom/

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 14:13:26 -0400
From: "Weissenburger - Jeremy S." <jeremysw at umd5 dot umd dot edu>
Subject: Re: Earthbound
>Date: Fri, 20 Oct 95 10:33:42 JST
>From: ohsawa at csg dot sony dot co dot jp (T. Ohsawa)
>Subject: Earthbound in CD
>
>Fellows, there is already CD'd Earthbound available in Tokyo. I think I've
>seen it even last year or before that. If you desperately want it, you
>should contact "DiskUnion" CD shop, "Shinjuku Record" , "Warehouse" or
>"Wave". I saw one at DiskUnion last week, next to "USA".
>
>Bye, Tom

This is an illegally bootlegged copy.  If any of you see Earthbound on
CD, this is not a legitimate release!

--Jeremy

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 10:39:57 -0600
From: vanvalnc at is2 dot nyu dot edu (Chris Van Valen)
Subject: Yet another Elephant Talk/Chalkhills tie-in
Hi all

An excellent recent release "Testimonial Dinner"-a compilation of artists
covering the songs of XTC. On the Rembrandts version of "Making Plans For
Nigel" Pat Mastellotto excells.

Cheers,
CV

Other people can go home
Other people can split
I am here all the time
I can never quit
                        --David Byrne, 1979

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 10:58:40 -0400
From: kenth at magicnet dot net (Kent Huffnagle)
Subject: King Crimson newsletter
Thank you for the latest edition of Elephant Talk.
King Crimson is one of my favorite bands. I can't wait until
November when they play the Tupperware Aud., I will be sitting 3rd row.

I noticed that noone mentioned there apperarence that will be on the Conan
O'Brien show, I think its on Nov. 14th.
Is this true or did it fall through?

Thanks again, and I will be looking forward to the next edition.

Kent Huffnagle

Orlando, FL

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 11:31:42 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Larry R. Nittler" <lrn at howdy dot wustl dot edu>
Subject: Camel /KC
Phil wrote:

-Mel Collins plays on early KC and some Camel albums. are there other
-connections between the two bands?
-
-Thanks in advance,

-Phil.

Brian Eno played with both Camel (on the Rain Dances album) and Fripp.

Larry

___________________________________________________________________________
|      Larry R. Nittler		   Human beings were invented by water as |
|      lrn at howdy dot wustl dot edu	     a means of transporting itself from  |
|   Interstellar Dust Buster         one place to another. -- Tom Robbins |

From: dave at verdant dot demon dot co dot uk (Dave Bevan)
Organization:  My Organisation
Date:          Wed, 25 Oct 1995 17:30:16 GMT0BST1,M3.4.0/02:00,M10.4.0/02:00
Subject:       Earthbound Again
I think I may have said this about 6 months ago, but I'll say it
again seeing as there's been some recent discussion on Earthbound.

If (when?) it comes out on CD, then I will certainly get it, despite
the music quality - which I dont think is so bad - this album is
worth it for the version of Schizoid Man.

Mel Collins on Sax makes it a truly unique offering.
--
Dave Bevan          |
Leamington Spa      | dave at verdant dot demon dot co dot uk
England             |

From: "ToddM"  <ToddM at laserm dot lmt dot com>
Organization: LaserMaster Corporation
Date:     25 Oct 1995 13:36:19CST6CDT
Subject:  I had the strangest Crimson Dream last night
I had a very odd dream that King Crimson was playing at a local elementary
school last night.  Although, the school looked completely different than I
remember it looking in reality.

When I got there, the band had set-up lots of older musical equipment on-stage.
In other words, circa 1974 or thereabouts, but not like what you would have
seen the Lark's Tongues band playing, but lots of latin percussion and extra
drumming.

EVERYBODY in the band had huge yellow afros, especially Bill Bruford.  I don't
know why but it didn't strike me as being funny in the dream.  The music I can
remember experiencing in the dream had a heavy latin percussion vibe.  In
fact, I seem to remember it being Bill on drums, Adrian on congas and timbales,
Tony on bass, Pat on percussion and berimbau, trey on bongos and congas, robert
on a Les Paul, and a bunch of african individuals in native dress all playing various
odd percussion instruments (kalimbas, timbales, rainstick, boo bams, you name it)..

The music was extremely rhythmic, but the concert got cut short due to two
reasons.  Either (a) the audience didn't expect King Crimson to take the 1980s
percussive/gamelan thing to the next level or (b) robert was playing too loud
and Bill couldn't hear enough percussion so he walked off.

I got the impression that it was happening in 1995, not 20 years ago since the
dress styles were all modern, but the big yellow afros made me wonder.

I seem to remember that, after the musicians wandered away there were TONS of
roadies packing everything up and the school turned into a shopping mall and all
dispersed in different directions and when I left I was in a completely different
city.

I don't often have such vivid dreams, especially dreams of bands I enjoy so I
thought I'd write!

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 15:15:51 -0600 (CST)
From: Z4K42 at ttacs dot ttu dot edu
Subject: FT.WORTH SHow
A friend and I are driving down from Lubbock to see the show and I was
wondering if anyone knew of interesting things happening after the show. I will
be able to check my mail on the day of the show, so if this gets posted by
then, then email me direct.
Scott

Date: 25 Oct 1995 15:50:07 -0600
From: "John Ott" <John_Ott at ATK dot COM>
Subject: Re:  Mel Collins trivia
                   RE> Mel Collins trivia
>Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 11:10:29 -0500 (CDT)
>From: Philip A Patston <patston at uic dot edu>
>Subject: KC and Camel

> Dear Trivia Fans,

>Mel Collins plays on early KC and some Camel albums. are there other
>connections between the two bands?

>Thanks in advance,

>Phil.

Both Robert Fripp and Mel Collins play on David Sylvians 1986 release "Gone
to Earth" ,
as does one of my other favorite guitarists: Bill Nelson (former frontman of
Be-Bop Deluxe).

From: weldwd at www dot dgi dot net
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 16:17:22 -0600
Subject: et reply to #231
In regards to "lizard":
>     -  a narrow dynamic range with both high and low frequencies severely
>compressed,
>     -  vocals that sound like they were recorded in a tin can,
>     -  levels of tape hiss and "crackling" on several tracks, particularly
>"Indoor Games"

This is typical of the vinyl output from U.S. Atlantic Records in the
Seventies: uniformly appalling. There was, after all, a REASON (besides the
prog fan's normal snobbery and one-upmanship*) we all rushed to the import
racks for new releases back then. KC, early Genesis, you name it..if it was
on
Atlantic or Atco, it stunk. Pity we never pressed a class-action suit.
* I was guilty as charged, BTW.   :)
Given all that, Lizard AND Islands were still,  I think, basically subpar
technically.
While on the topic: Earthbound. SAVE YOUR MONEY unless you are a TOTALLY
anal collector.
As we say at the office, "It's all junk, Earl". Maybe someone will upload a
sample of "Peoria"...aaargh.
When Fripp allowed this to be released as a contractual fulfillment, he did
his fans no favor.
(This may be apochryphal, but I've heard that RF actually APOLOGIZED for
that record at one point
during the '79 solo tour- but not at any show I saw.)

Lastly, I'd agree with the comments that the live arrangements this time
out are cut too much of the same cloth as the recordings, with little room
for risk, disaster or triumph. I really enjoyed the
Minneapolis show, but in terms of adventure...just not there. Maybe a band
CAN be too damned
talented for its own good.
I suppose I'm asking for a flaming. Hope not.
Love to all.

Peace, love and loud music will save your life.

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 14:20:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sasha Alain Wolf <fripp at uclink3 dot berkeley dot edu>
Subject: In The Court . . .
Maybe someone out there has the asnwers to these questions

1) Has anyone else noticed that on the definitive edition for "In The
Court of The Crimson King" the song "moonchild" actually begins at the
end of "Epitath". Let me explain. On the CD, "epitath" is listed as track
3 and "moonchild" as track 4. The music for "moonchild" begins at the end
of track 3 continuing into track 4. In fact, the first 20 or 30 seconds
of "moonchild" are on track 3. Why is this this way? I never seen any
other album by any group with this kind of thing. Does this occur on the
original record? If this wasn't accident (which I doubt it was), does
anyone know why Fripp & Co chose to do this?

2) I've asked about KC and New Jersey jokes before and no one seemed to
have asn answer. I'm stil curious. In "The Abbreviated King Crimson", New
Jersey is mentioned in the linear notes (which I think were written by
Fripp):

	 "Generally, the group's [King Crimson] was worthy of respect,
prasie, and avoidance at various and same times. Hordes of earnest young
men from New Jersey would probably agree."

This only confused me further still. With this quote in mind, can anyone
enlighten me on the relationship between King Crimson and New Jersey.

	- Sasha

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 18:06:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: gwn3 at mail dot albany dot net (Bill Nagel)
Subject: KC/Hawkwind connection?
Here's an *extremely* random question, which may or may not have been asked
previously--i've only been getting ET for ~2 months. To answer it, it
probably helps if you're British and over 40.

I just noticed (finally--HELLO? HELLO?), in the liner notes to ITCOTCK, the
credit for "Equipment by Vick and Dik". Is "Dik" the very same DikMik of
Hawkwind fame????? You know, the one credited with "electronics" & "audio
generator" & the like for Hawkwind between 1969 and 1973. Somehow it seems
to me that the chances of there being two men named "Dik" in London in the
late '60s specializing in weird (for the time) electronic equipment for the
"space rock" scene are mighty slim, but i'd love to hear from anyone who
knows anything concrete about this (private email please), or has any
firsthand memories of HW shows of the '69-'73 period.

I must admit that the thought of Dave Brock and Robert Fripp in the same
room is *quite* amusing. Anyone who has read the utterly hilarious
inserts/booklets/notes from "In Search Of Space" and "Space Ritual" will
understand what i'm talking about. Sorry for the lack of "hard Crimso"
content (but i'm also flaming mad about the tix price for Longacre in NYC.
Phuck that--i'll see 3 Phish shows for the same money--and judging from
VROOOM, THRAK, B'Boom, & the 6/2 show in Boston, i can only hope to hear the
exact same versions of everything for the FIFTH time ;-) Maybe i'm just
jealous i won't get to hear the improvs. Anyway--

bill

From: Phillips Bob <Bobp at dfi dot com>
Subject: Mingus/Monk/KC
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 95 15:07:00 PDT
In the previous ET, I refered to an unfavorable Rolling Stone review that
accused King Crimson of being a second-rate imitation of Charlie Mingus.
As my mental fog has cleared a little, I realized that the reviewer had
actually accused KC of being a second rate imitation (or something similar)
of Thelonius Monk.

Senility is a horrible thing.

Anyway, the question remains:  does anybody know any specific influences by
Monk on KC or any KC "borrowings" from individual Monk compositions?  While
I think the reviewer was probably off the wall, it's not impossible given
that LTIA 2 quotes liberally from Stravinsky's Rite of Spring.

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 17:44:15 -0400
From: sclarson at uceng dot uc dot edu (Stephen J. Clarson)
Subject: Echoes Feature Cassettes
Toby:

This information should be of interest to the 'League of E-Talk Subscribers':

Pip. Pip.

Steve Clarson

>Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 21:23:49 -0700
>From: "John K. Diliberto" <echoes at well dot com>
>To: sclarson at uceng dot uc dot edu
>Subject: Echoes Feature Cassettes
>
>                     Echoes Feature Cassettes
>
>The following are collections of Echoes Feature cassettes, the seven
>minute artist profiles you hear on Echoes.  We've put several of our
>favorites together on cassette.
>
>1) JAPANESE SOUNDSCAPES
>2 cassettes $20.00
>A collection of 14 Echoes feature interviews with leading contemporary
>musicians from Japan.
>Tape One
>Toru Takemitsu-Zen Classics
>Hiroki Okano/Kosei Yamamoto & the Wind Travelin' Band: Synthesized Zen
>John Kaizen Neptune: Shakuhachi Surf Music
>Stomu Yamash'ta: Temple Music in Space
>Shakuhachi Summit (w/Katsuya Yokoyama, John Kaizen Neptune, and Kazu
>Matsui)
>Ryuichi Sakamoto: Japanese Blender
>Azuma: Synthesizer Tone Poems of Home
>
>Tape Two
>Tomita: Synthesized Classics
>Katsuya Yokoyama: Shakuhachi Master
>St. Giga: Radio from the Stars
>Yas-Kaz: Percussion of the World from Japan
>Yoko Ono: Primal Screams and Dada Dreams
>Ancient Culture, Modern Music (w/Sakamoto, Takemitsu, Kitaro, Osamu
>Kitajima)
>Osamu Kitajima: East-West
>
>ECHOES: VOICES OF THE SOUL
>single cassette: $9.98
>This cassette includes feature interviews with the following artists:
>Peter Gabriel: Inner Moods, Outer Worlds
>Philip Glasses Low Symphony
>Kate Bush: Siren of the Soul
>David Sylvian: Music for the Interior Life
>Robert Fripp & the League of Crafty Guitarists
>Brian Eno: Enosense
>Enya: Celtic Choirs
>Mike Oldfield: Tubular Bells Returns
>

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 23:36:00 -0500
From: penseur at intellex dot com (Ed Poe)
Subject: Egghead technical music thingies in ET 231
(apologies for the length of this post...)

mopix at sirius dot com (michael harrison) writes:

>This makes me think
>that it is really hard to mix this band night after night with the same
>excellent results. Is there a technical reason why touring bands can't
>place speakers in more spots in bad venues to improve overall audio spread?

Yes.  It's a huge pain in the butt.  If the time were available to do that
much of a sound check (and it isn't), the conditions might improve (but I
don't know how much).  The problem is more bad mixing than bad
amplification, but the placement does affect the sound.  Mostly, it's just
people running a mixing board who can't hear what it sounds like where
_you're_ standing.  Now, if it sounds terrible where _they're_ standing,
then someone else should be running the board.

Here's hoping they do a good job in Austin (a terrible hall)...

                and...

Gideon B Banner <ggggbbbb at minerva dot cis dot yale dot edu> writes:

>Is this what Tony Levin plays in concert?  I always thought he had some sort
>of electric upright.

Levin and Gunn play Chapman Stick - ten (or twelve) strings, tuned in
Guitar and Bass parts (point your browser to Toby's FAQ for more info, and
to the web page for a link to the Stick page)

>And I had always assumed JM's solo at the beginning of "Talking Drum" was
>on >congas or something similar, until I saw an actual "talking drum"
>advertised
>in a music catalogue.  Is this an actual instrument?

Yes.  I'm not even going to try to guess its origin other than a vague
"somewhere in Africa", but it's basically hourglass-shaped, and has strings
that stretch from the head and tie at the base.  You hold it under one arm,
and make it "talk" by increasing or decreasing the pressure with which you
squeeze it - loosening or tightening the head and varying the pitch.  Very
hard to play well.

>And what precisely is a mellotron?

An electronic keyboard (organ) dating from the sixties, it reproduces
sounds stored on tapes.  Lots of new faux-hippy bands are using them again.

                and...

John Saylor <jsaylor at MIT dot EDU> writes:

>I am no expert, preferring to listen rather than dissect, but I have a
>feeling that the pitch collections he uses are often symmetric.  In other
>words, you take the twelve steps of the octave and group them into smaller
>repeating units that form regular patters in the context of the twelve step
>[chromatic] scale.  The fully diminished chord [b d f a-] is one example, as
>is the tritone [c f+].

Note that the fully diminished chord is built on stacked minor third
intervals; the tritone is two stacked minor thirds without the intermediate
note (in other words, the B and F in that [b d f a-] form a tritone, as do
the D and A-flat).

>For instance, most musicians think of a scale as something that covers an
>>octave and repeats the same pitch collection in each octave.  This is not
>>necessarily so.

Depends on if you believe in equal temperament tuning.  ;-)  This is
important because:
        1.  If you don't, then scales don't repeat themselves at all (due
to the nature of perfect and imperfect intervals)...
        2.  If you do, try tuning your guitar to Fripp's new standard (from
the lowest string, start on C, go up in fifths to the E on the fifth
string, and put the nominal 'E' string on the G a third above its usual
pitch) and play around on the bottom (pitch, that is) two strings.  If you
put your finger on the seventh fret of that C string, you should have a
unison between that note and the open G string.  Unless your guitar is
fretted for that tuning, you won't be able to have that unison in tune and
have the proper fifth between the open strings.  (Am I going on too long
here? :-)  Discuss...
        3.  All microtonal discrepancies aside, the "new standard tuning"
allows you to play any major scale on just two strings, with the same
tetrachord (and fingering) on both (which is symmetrical, and I'm agreeing
with your symmetry hypothesis here - it just took me a while to get to it).

The way Fripp tunes leads itself to symmetrical playing (in scales, and in
the ability of chords to plane _across_ the neck as well as up and down
it).  The Stick is tuned similarly, with like results.  Egghead theoretical
stuff, but it produces interesting results in playing.

If you own a guitar, and have yet to try the New Standard, play with it a
while - I can barely play guitar in the first place, but I like the way the
tuning pushes my improvisation.  Ohh, and tune the C and G for the proper
(tempered) fifth, not the unison.  :-)

Waaaaayyyyyy too much time on my hands....

                             - e

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 02:17:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: Santiago Andres Patino Gomez <s-patino at uniandes dot edu dot co>
Subject: Colombia ? Eh? - Greetings from the worlds basement
I want to know the reasons that KC, or EG music or whatever had to make=20
the USA album disappear from the galaxy.=20
I wanna know if any of the KC members has heard about a cuntry called=20
Colombia. ( yes, the narco-democracy, the terrorism Eden, the only=20
country with more violence than Bosnia + Vietnam + El Salvador + Rwanda +=
=20
.., the schizoidest nation in this planet, guinness record : 30000=20
murders/year ( but that was in 1994, we hope this year this score will be=
=20
ridiculous, since we are sure we can attain 40000 very easily)) and I=20
wonder if they have the courage to visit us. In 1974 Rush made their=20
first stop in Bogota, checked the Colombian fields, saw the natives=20
smile and pass along and then smoked in Lebanon.

Mr Blackcat : I personally love your opinion about B-boom and Thrak : I=20
won=B4t waste my money anymore buying those boring live CDs !! So I will=20
buy a more improvisational live cd. I dont know, it could be Nirvana,=20
Milli Vanilli - the real, of course- Megadeth, Guns n=B4Roses ... well,=20
something that does not involve=20
 technique, or sound or those kind of useless things, well something a=20
little more "unpredictable" than King Crimson. Thank you, I love you!=20
 =20
If anybody shares my interest in Yes, Rush, The Police, Pink Floyd, Led=20
Zeppelin, Soda Stereo, Charly Garcia, Seru Giran, Sui Generis, La Maquina=
=20
de Hacer Pajaros, Marillion, UK, Genesis ... I will appreciate if they=20
e-mail me and tell me about where to find information in CYBERSPACE and=20
specially about where to find g & b tablatures, or just writing it in=20
Elephant Talk.

Bye, read you in a few more turns of this strange globe !=20

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 11:06:53 -0400
From: michael dot radzick at peri dot com (Michael Radzick)
Subject: Sunday all over the world...
  Hello fellow KC fans. I have a question, although I am fairly new to
Elephant Talk and this is my first posting (forgive me if I do anything
that is against the rules), I have yet to see any comment on the "Sunday
All Over the World Project" that Mr. Fripp and Mr. Gunn were involved in
about two years ago. It seems that everyone compares Mr. Fripps recent
music to certain periods (i.e. the "Red" period or the "LTiA" period) and
comparisons are even made to certain songs from periods and albums that
Mr. Fripp has played on.  However, I did notice that no comparisons are
made to or from the selections from the "Sunday All Over the World"
disc. Is it the general consensus among readers of "Elephant Talk" that
this collection of songs is that far below the standard that the readers
expect it is not worth a mention? For the record, I found this disc to be
quite enjoyable to listen to. Anyone else agree or disagree? Please let me
know.
  Also, I read a few issues back and someone posted a letter on the
difficulty they were having in finding a vinyl copy of "The Young Persons
Guide to King Crimson." If they are interested, I have a spare copy I would
be willing to part with. They can e-mail me at miker at peri dot com.
   Keep up the good work, all who are involved. The only thing I would
change about this newsletter is the publishing of lenghty concert
reviews. They are a little much sometimes. Oh, and for what it's worth, the
column that Mr. Fripp wrote for "Guitar Player" magazine a few years ago
was one of the best columns that magazine ever presented for their readers
to enjoy. It's a shame that most of the people who wrote in to the magazine
didn't appreciate Mr. Fripp's personal insight on the appraoch he takes to
playing the guitar.  Something I feel is as equally important as actually
playing the guitar. His column is sorely missed.

Sincerely
Yours,
Mike Radzicki

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 12:08:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Beury <beurych at grove dot ufl dot EDU>
Subject: MR. Bungle...Disco Violante
Hello all.
	I have just finished listening to the NEW Mr. Bungle album and
upon discussion of the album's new sounds and influences came a discussion
of the players on this album. Until just recently I was not aware that
Trevor Dunn is really in fact the one and only Trey Gunn in disguise.
This seemed to keep me craving for more information on the players of
this band. I was hoping that someone may in fact have the inside scoop on
this madness. I have been a fan of Crimson since my early days of college
and since my music appreciation has increased drastically. Some of my
influences have been known for appearing on various albums of other
artist and in this case a band of unknown artists( kind of like the
Residents). I have my theories as to who some of the players are but the
rest escape me. The influences of John Zorn can be heard throughout and I
know he does appear on the album. I also have a theory that possibly the
drummer and keyboardist from Medeski, Martin and Wood may appear on the
album from the sounds of it. And these guys are tied to the NY scene with
Zorn.( BY the way if you are up there in time check out MMW and John Zorn
at CBGB's around Thanksgiving-They will finish blowing your mind after
the first leg of KC is over and the second is in full speed.) So again
feel free to send me your ideas or FACTS on the real players of Mr.
Bungle or if you think the rest of us could us an inside scoop send it
along to Elephant-talk. Well I have been counting the days until my first
exposure to the Crimson King. And hope to be worthy of the King's Court of
followers. So keep your eyes peeled and your ears open. Because the King
has returned to take his place upon the thrown again. Long Live the
Crimson King. All hail the Double Trio!

-Chaos

		'I repeat myself when I am distressed
			I repeat myself when I am distressed
				I repeat...
					I LIKE IT!'- Adrian Belew

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 19:13:10 +1030
From: tsymeo at zenon dot logos dot hol dot gr (Tefkros Symeonides)
Subject: Doctor Diamond
"Groon" was included in  both "Young Person's" and "Frame by Frame" but
"Doctor Diamond" was only included (live) on "The Great Deceiver". Does
anybody know why, and if it was ever released as single or something?
Tefkros Symeonides.

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 14:16:37 -0500
From: jdehm at gold dot interlog dot com (JD Murray)
Subject: Essential
In ET #230, Mark Mushet wrote:

>Now, on topic, I think that "Healthy Colours 1 to 4" are an utter waste of
>time. Were these tapes sitting around waiting for an excuse to be released
>or was it created anew for filler? I'd rather the "Essential Fripp and Eno"
>be a COMPLETE package incorporating the entirety of "Pussyfooting and
>Evening Song".

I care to disagree. Fripp was obviously around when Eno and Byrne were
making My Life In The Bush Of Ghosts since Fripp is given an arranging
credit on Regiment.  It would be interesting to know why Fripp didn't play
for the album as Fripp and Eno were dabbling in the same style, hence
Healthy Colours. Maybe Byrne and Fripp had a falling out or three was a
crowd.

Anyways, I like Healthy Colours and am quite glad it was released instead
of just repackaging No Pussyfooting and Evening Star together. It reflects
what Fripp and Eno were interested in at the time and Fripp's guitar
playing reaches quite a climax of sorts by the time it gets to part IV. We
probably would have been scooping the album with Healthy Colours on it in
droves if it was originally released in 1980 when it was recorded.  Fifteen
years is quite a period for hindsight.

Regards,
JD

--
>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>>
All that we see or seem is but a dream within a dream.            -Poe
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
http://www.interlog.com/~jdehm/home_page.html

Date: Thu, 26 Oct 1995 14:16:58 -0500
From: jdehm at gold dot interlog dot com (JD Murray)
Subject: Ian MacDonald, author
In ET #230, Russell Whitworth wrote:

>Incidentally, I'm still convinced (until someone comes up with
>evidence to the contrary) that the author Ian MacDonald is not
>the King Crimson member Ian McDonald - mainly on the grounds of
>spelling!  And yet... my copies of Exposure (vinyl and CD)
>include thanks to "Ian MacDonald" as one of the artists involved
>but not appearing.

I agree. If you read the jacket notes about the author it does mention that
he is in the music business but doesn't really give much detail. Perhaps
the author Ian MacDonald some how met Fripp and gave some kind of advice,
hence the thanks in Exposure.

Regards,
JD

--
>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>><<>>
All that we see or seem is but a dream within a dream.            -Poe
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
http://www.interlog.com/~jdehm/home_page.html

From: weldwd at www dot dgi dot net
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 16:17:22 -0600
Subject: et reply to #231
In regards to "lizard":
>     -  a narrow dynamic range with both high and low frequencies severely
>compressed,
>     -  vocals that sound like they were recorded in a tin can,
>     -  levels of tape hiss and "crackling" on several tracks, particularly
>"Indoor Games"

This is typical of the vinyl output from U.S. Atlantic Records in the
Seventies: uniformly appalling. There was, after all, a REASON (besides the
prog fan's normal snobbery and one-upmanship*) we all rushed to the import
racks for new releases back then. KC, early Genesis, you name it..if it was
on Atlantic or Atco, it stunk. Pity we never pressed a class-action suit.
* I was guilty as charged, BTW.  :) Given all that, Lizard AND Islands were
still, I think, basically subpar technically.  While on the topic:
Earthbound. SAVE YOUR MONEY unless you are a TOTALLY anal collector.  As we
say at the office, "It's all junk, Earl". Maybe someone will upload a
sample of "Peoria"...aaargh.  When Fripp allowed this to be released as a
contractual fulfillment, he did his fans no favor.  (This may be
apochryphal, but I've heard that RF actually APOLOGIZED for that record at
one point during the '79 solo tour- but not at any show I saw.)

Lastly, I'd agree with the comments that the live arrangements this time
out are cut too much of the same cloth as the recordings, with little room
for risk, disaster or triumph. I really enjoyed the Minneapolis show, but
in terms of adventure...just not there. Maybe a band CAN be too damned
talented for its own good.  I suppose I'm asking for a flaming. Hope not.
Love to all.

Peace, love and loud music will save your life.

From: Terrance L Kalka II <tlkalka at mailbox dot syr dot edu>
Date: Thu, 26 Oct 95 20:01:36 EDT
Subject: In the grand tradition...
In the grand tradition of newspaper goof-ups regarding King Crimson, this
was pulled out of a Rochester, NY newspaper:

November 16th:
King Crimson and California Guitar Trio: Eight-piece percussion band.

Date: Fri, 27 Oct 95 02:38:04 GMT
From: eylerw at coral dot indstate dot edu (David Shoemaker/Wendy Eyler)
Subject: Music for Non-Musicians, Claymont, 1985
 Hello everyone,

I'm trying to get in touch with anyone who attended the first Music for
Non-Musicians Seminar that Fripp hosted at Claymont Court in West Virginia
in 1985.  I was there, in all my 16 year-old, Crimso-maniacal glory, and
besides wanting to reminisce about it, I'd really  love to catch up with
the special folks I met that weekend.  High points as I remember them:

       -- Several great conversations with Fripp
       -- Playing guitar along with Fripp and 3 others, in my first public
guitar performance!
       -- Going with everyone to the local restaurant, Chianti's, on its
last day of business, for a public concert

If anyone reading this was there that weekend, please get in touch with me.
If it was half as special for you as it was for me, we owe it to ourselves
to discuss it a bit!

Thanks,
David Shoemaker

Date: Fri, 27 Oct 95 18:45:25 JST
From: ohsawa at csg dot sony dot co dot jp (T. Ohsawa)
Subject: Interview  A.Belew
This is a continuation of the translation:

M. I think it is quite difficult for bands and musicians with long careers
to be engaged in a new activity without losing freshness. From your
experience, could you tell us what is the key to keeping the freshness?

AB. First, you have to put yourself under different circumstances. That's
the same with a new band.  We all have fresh attitude. We have new faces
like Trey Gunn and Pat Mastelotto. I myself am always thinking about music
to keep the freshness and always seeking new possibilities. And I try not
to repeat myself. As a musician, there are a number of new technologies I
should learn and tools I can use . There's a lot I should learn each
time. A small thing becomes the bridge to the next inspiration. As long as
you move forward, you will always hit both similar ideas and totally
different ideas.

M. You said previously that the time has come for King Crimson to do
something. I feel that Crimson appears again at the time when the trend of
popular music changes. Do you think that Robert has any intention about it?

AB. From what I felt through discussion with Robert, I think that he had
much intention. There is no doubt that he was aware of something rising
within him. Robert seems to periodically feel the desire to do something
that cannot be done within a normal world of rock. Then he starts doing
Guitar Craft or something that is more abstract. But like now, he also
wants to do a wonderful music in a band with other members. So, it is
himself, his mind that made him ready to start King Crimson again. And it's
similar with me. There aren't so many people that I want to play
with. There aren't many situations, either, in which I sacrifice something
for. But this is one of them. It must be something exceptional that makes
me get out of my house because usually it is most enjoyable to make records
in my own recording studio (laughs). That's why King Crimson is a very
special thing for me.

(to be continued)

Bye, Tom

Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 12:26:03 -0400
From: MarkDAshby at aol dot com
Subject: Italian pressing of Earthbound
I just thought I'd throw in my first contribution to this brouhaha,
balderdash, ballyhoo...

I recently got my hands on an Italian pressing of Earthbound and was
wondering if any KC collector out there would be interested in it.  E-mail
me, if so.  It's in excellent condition.

I've been reading about some people's problems with ticket prices here on the
US tour.  I suppose then I should consider myself fortunate that main floor
seats at the Wilkes-Barre, PA show are only $32.50.  I'm in row O, so that's
not too bad.  I wish they'd played Washington or Baltimore, though.  Shorter
drive for me.  Oh, well.

THRAKs a lot,

Mark

MarkDAshby at aol dot com or mdashby at wam dot umd dot edu

Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 19:07:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Adam Levin <alevin at ari dot net>
Subject: Sylvian in DC.
David Sylvian will be performing solo at the Lincoln Theatre in
Washington, DC on November 8th. Tickets are available through Ticketmaster.

-Adam

Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 13:51:29 -0400
From: ARCHITO at aol dot com
Subject: KC in Denver
My 25 years of waiting!

KC came to Denver last night (Fri 10/27) at the 100 year old Paramount
Theatre. After having been a crimsoid for 25 yrs, it was special to finally
see them live! The CGT started things off and KC took the stage after about 1
hr. Song play was similar to other reports posted in ET. An outstanding
concert! I had a 10th row seat and was able to get within 3 ft of the stage
during the encores. I'll be in the 4th row for KC in Colorado Springs (Sun
10/29). See you there . Life doesn't get much better than this! Thanks to
Toby for communications.
Doug Abshire  ARCHITO at AOL dot com

Date: Sun, 29 Oct 1995 13:45:10 -0500
From: 76641 dot 673 at compuserve dot com
Subject: ET Post - re: Issue Number 231
Bob Phillips in issue number 231 makes some interesting points about the
LIZARD recording from the early 1970's.  IMHO, LIZARD was/is one of my
favorite KC's recording from that time mainly due to the sound production
qualities that according to Bob's comments, "... a narrow dynamic range
..", "... vocals that sound like they were recorded in a tin can ..." and
"... levels of tape hiss and "cracking" on serveral tracks ...." make this
KC outing a "major disappointment" for Bob.

After reading his comments, I first played my less than pristine LP of
LIZARD ... wow! not bad! Next, on to my CD (DE version) and low and behold
- the (playing/listening to DE version of CD of LIZARD) ..... I think I
like the older LP better!!!  I've never really done a side-by-side "taste"
test before! Hey, maybe the defective copy of bob's was used to make my
copy of the CD ?

Anyway, from a pure musical stand, LIZARD is most interesting due to the
way it's constructed "in the studio".  RF once said only a handful of
recordings were able to convey a performance in that the recording itself
becomes the event, hence his favor of live performance over studio works.
LIZARD (imho) is an event for the listener via records --- In a similar
fashion to RF's EXPOSURE, a master-work!

Also, having seen the "Islands" band live in 1971 performing "Cirkus", I'll
take the LP anyday and just try and hold that memory to myself.

Regards,

Richard Mascarini - Saratoga NY

From: "tim siefkes" <timsks at visi dot com>
Date:          Mon, 30 Oct 1995 05:58:31 +0000
Subject:       Talking Drums and Mellotrons
>thought he had some sort of electric upright.  And I had always assumed
>JM's solo at the beginning of "Talking Drum" was on congas or something
>similar, until I saw an actual "talking drum" advertised in a music
>catalogue.  Is this an actual instrument?  And what precisely is a mellotron?

A "talking drum" is an actual instrument, orignating in Africa.  The
drum is held under one arm and played with a curved beater stick.
There are leather strips around the body attatched to the heads.  By
squeezing the body of the drum under the arm, it tightens the
head(s) and therfore alters the pitch as you play it.  I understand
that skilled players in Africa use it to mimic their speech patterns
to such a high degree that it is actually used to communicate over
distances, hence the name "talking" drum.  I've seen King Sunny Ade's
band (from Nigeria) several times here, and he always has at least
three talking drum players on stage with him.   A very powerful
sound!

As for the mellotron, it can be considered the earliest analog
"sampler".   By pressing keys on a small keyboard (limited to about
three octaves range) you trigger the movement of a length of magnetic
audio tape over a playback head.  So when you select "strings" or
"flute" or whatever, you are actually playing a recording of that
instrument.  You could have your choice of three different tracks on
one bank of pre-recorded tapes.  You selected your sound by turning a
dial that moves the position of the heads relative to the tape.  36
lengths of tape, 36 playback heads. The tapes were limited to eight
seconds in length, which surprisingly proved to be not so much a
limitation as one might expect.  The biggest problem was that this
tape/head mechanism was somewhat fragile and didn't always withstand
the rigors of rock bands' schedules from night to night.  (As Fripp
wrote in liner notes, "Tuning two mellotrons, doesn't".)

It was featured prominently by bands such as KC (those ethereal
sustained chords on "In The Court..."), Genesis ("Watcher Of The
Skies"), Moody Blues ("Knights In White Satin") and Yes (the
transition from Stravinsky's Firebird into "Siberian Khatru" comes to
mind) and many others.  They are still available, but digital
samplers have of course taken over where many mellotrons have left
off.  Still, there's something about THAT SOUND....
Tim Siefkes
timsks at visi dot com
http://www.visi.com/~timsks

Minneapolis, MN

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:22:55 -0700
From: Paul Martz <martz at shaft dot fc dot hp dot com>
Subject: another literary reference?
After reading all about Stephen King's reference to the "Crimson
King", I thought I would post the following, from American author Kurt
Vonnegut's book, _Deadeye Dick_:

    I tinkered, too, with the idea of having the voice of God coming
    from the back of the theater. [...]

    The actress playing Celia would ask why God ever put her on Earth.

    And then the voice from the back of the theater could rumble, "To
    reproduce. Nothing else really interests Me. All the rest is
    frippery."

   -paul		martz at shaft dot fc dot hp dot com

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 13:02:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: brat prince <reive at phantom dot com>
Subject: TIX: New York Crimson Dates-- I'm confused!
Ok... I get up at 9am on a Sunday morning (this is dedication) to get
Crimson tickets for me and three friends for the show that we've all
heard is happening on the 25th.  But yet there only seem to be three
shows, for the 20, 21, 22.  Anyone know the story?  I wound up getting 1
ticket for myself, not knowing who was going to be available during the
week.  I probably got a better seat that way anyway.

Oh, and although I think $50 bucks is worth it for these guys.... ouch!

--
Racheline Maltese		    |    "My neighbor with no arms wanted
reive at phantom dot com		    |	  to know how it feels to let
http://www.phantom.com/~reive	    |	  something go." -Jeffery McDaniel

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 01:04:46 -0600 (MDT)
From: ecerb at indra dot com (Elaine C. Erb)
Subject: Tix---Agony
        You mean I'm not the only one that Ticketbaster tortured in trying
to get tickets??  If it wasn't bad enough that tickets went on sale the one
weekend I was out of town, I had some novice (or is that how they train
their staff?) when I called on the following Monday morning to get tickets.
We got the Denver tickets okay, in not great seats, but I thoroughly
confused the woman when I asked for Colorado Springs tickets.  Yes ma'am, I
want to go again when they are playing in the state on my birthday!
        Well we talked about these tickets long enough before she let me go
as she was obviously more concerned about the calls she was about to get
for Bowie tickets.  I didn't realize until the Denver tickets got here
(improperly addressed the first time they mailed them I might add) that she
hadn't gotten the Colorado Springs tickets included.  So I called to
reorder and they would not take any note of my complaint against the
original ticketer whom I asked three times for tickets to the Springs!!  So
I now have mediocre seats to two shows and an ever increasing distaste for
Ticketmusser.  Why use them when there are alternatives?? Last time through
I went in to the grocery store and could pay by check.  All for a quarter
of the service fee charged by Ticketbluster.

                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Human speech is like a cracked kettle on which we tap crude rhythms for
bears to dance to, while we long to make music that will melt the stars.
-Flaubert

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 15:36:02 -0500
From: kikor at interaccess dot com (kikor)
Subject: Detroit Tickets
 Hi there. I succeeded in getting tix for KC's Chicago performance (the
main floor sold out in @ 12 minutes...we scored 3rd row balcony). I am now
in search of 2 for the Detroit show on 11/28, obviously the closer the
better, but hey - beggars can't be choosers. I'm more than willing to pay a
bit over face value if I must. Please respond to my eMail address
<kikor at interaccess dot com>.

 Thanks.

-frank

Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:09:08 -0500
From: bpp105 at psu dot edu (Benjamin Perry)
Subject: Ticket needed!
Hey E-T ers!

I just found out that tickets for the Crimson show in Wilkes-Barre, PA have
been on sale for some time, even though the fools at TicketMasturbater swore
that they knew nothing of the show.  Oh well!  If anyone has an extra seat
for the show, I would be more than willing to take it off your hands.  Reply
by personal email to

bpp105 at psu dot edu

It would be great to see Bob and the boys once again!

Bennie

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Benjamin Perry                                                   bpp105 at psu dot edu

  "And what if all of animated nature
Be but organic Harps diversely framed,
That tremble into thought, as o'er them sweeps
Plastic and vast, one intellectual breeze,
At once the Soul of each, and God of all?"
             Samuel Taylor Coleridge, "The Eolian Harp"    (1795)

From: "Fred Raimondi" <fred at d2 dot com>
Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 10:34:13 -0700
Subject: Gig review: The Hollywood House of Blues KC Show
Did you ever go to a show that was fantastic, but the venue was absolutely
terrible? Well, that was the case at the October 22nd KC show at the House of
Blues in Los Angeles. It was a stellar show by KC, very loose, lots of goofing
around, good freeform playing, and it looked like they were genuinely having
fun.

Not the case for those of us in the audience.

It was very hard to see for the people standing in front of us, the chatter of
people around us made it really hard to focus on what was going on, the
security people were VERY rude, and standing up for a two and a half hour show
in a crowded smokey room with loud obnoxious people at every turn was a joy I
just can't describe.

I did find it curious that for our $42.50 per ticket (yes! $42.50) those of us
that arrived early enough to get seats, were notified that all the really cool
seats (which were empty until the show started) were reserved for Virgin
Publicity, various management companies, and other luminaries that probably
didn't pay for their tickets anyway. I know that most of these problems are
beyond the control of the band, so I don't blame them.

Other than those few things, the show was fantastic. KC outdid themselves.

For me, that venue was truely a House of Blues.

--
#############################################################################
#  Fred Raimondi         310 314 2809 Office    "It is impossible           #
#  Digital Domain        213 917 5193 Pager        to achieve the aim       #
#  300 Rose Ave          fred at d2 dot com                   without suffering"   #
#  Venice, CA 90291      ####################################################
#############################################################################

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 95 18:55:19 UT
From: "Jim Sciarra" <Jim_Sciarra at msn dot com>
Subject: Gig review: Wow!
I am still in a daze from the seeing King Crimson at the Marin Veterans Hall
last Saturday night.  It was one of the most intense concert experiences of
my life.

I was already elated by the good fortune of being able to walk to
a Crimson show only two blocks from my house, so I was probably more
receptive to the opening act than I otherwise might have been.

The
California Guitar Trio was good.  Just good.  They are certainly competent
players, and have learned their technique well, but (IMHO) lacked a certain
passion.  (Also they were much too loud.)  They did a little piece of
"Schizoid Man" that was amusing.  They also played the entire first movement
of Beethoven's Symphony No. 5, which was for me their most impressive piece.
One of the trio was dressed entirely in black, with his face obscured by a
large hat.  This led some people in the audience to speculate that it was
Robert Fripp.  I don't think it was him, though.  His playing was great, but
just a bit shy of the perfection that characterizes the Man himself.

>From
the moment Crimson came on stage to the end of the show, they were positively
riveting.  They opened with "Thela Hun Ginjeet", and from there went
immediately into "Red".  The band was playing with a ferocious zeal, but the
sound was rather muddy.

By the end of "Red", the soundman had things
straightened out, and everything was crystal-clear from that point on.

The
third song was "Dinosaur," and it sounded so much like the studio recording,
we could have been listening to the album!  It is amazing that this band can
produce that kind of sound live.

Memory gets fuzzy here on the exact order
of songs, but I know they did "One Time", "Three of a Perfect Pair", "VROOM
VROOM", "Matte Kudesai," "B'Boom", "THRAK", "Neurotica", and others,
finishing up with "Elephant Talk" and "Indiscipline".  Throughout, Belew's
voice was in top form, and they all seemed to be having a great time.  The
playing was much tighter, more focused, more intense, than on the B'BOOM
album.

After the show they performed three encores of two songs each (A
triple duo?  Three perfect pairs?).  I'm kicking myself for being unable to
remember some things -- I'm getting senile.  The first encore was "VROOM" and
"Walking on Air", I think.  The second encore is lost in the bowels of my
mind, because it was the third encore that blew me away -- "The Talking Drum"
and "Larks Toungues in Aspic".  "Larks Tongues" was the only point in the
show where Fripp was visible in the lighting.

Apart from a "Good evening"
and a "Thank you" from Belew, there was no talking and no contact with the
audience.  They were just up there playing, so into the music.  It was great.

I wanted to be able to write a coherent review of the concert, but it has
just left me stupid and speechless.  Sorry.

			Jim

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 15:26:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: The Man Himself <altruist at shoko dot calarts dot edu>
Subject: GIG REVIEW: King Crimson at House of Blues, October 22, 1995
This was no ordinary King Crimson gig (if there is indeed such a thing).
Shows on the first leg of the American tour (and, as I understand, most of
this second leg) have been arranged mostly in 3,000 - 5,000 - seat
theatres, with ultra-orderly Orchestra seating; audience members were only
allowed back into their seats inbetween songs, and dancing in the isles
was frowned upon.

In contrast, the House of Blues gig was staged in a rather small club,
with a mass of standing fans packing the floor space.  To say that the
audience was enthusiastic is an understatement, as demonstrated by the
people who headbanged to "VROOM" or the gentleman in front of me who
pounded the air Metallica-style throughout the concert and pogo-jumped to
"Indiscipline," fist upraised.  I half expected a mosh pit to form during
the middle of "Lark's Tounges."

Standing no more than fifteen feet in front of the stage, hearing drum
sounds coming from the kits themselves rather than from P.A. speakers, and
being able to glance down from *behind* the stage from the stairs on
either side [Tech geek alert: Fripp is using a Roland VG-8], it was
sometimes hard for me to fathom that this was indeed KC.  The band seemed
to be having a blast ("I miss this!" were the first words uttered by
Adrian), although there were a few moments when the group seemed a bit
stunned at the sheer intimacy of the whole event.  (There were several
moments when Trey Gunn scanned the audience with a wide-eyed look).

Needless to say, the band was in close quarters.  Although there was no
direct lighting on Fripp, the stage circumstances were such that he was
very clearly visible throughout the concert.  This made Bruford's
oft-quoted remarks about Adrian as the happy schoolboy and Fripp as the
stern headmaster come very much to the fore, as Belew cavorted about the
stage gleefully while Fripp held a look on his face suggesting an internal
physiology capable of turning coal to diamonds in a matter of minutes.

Some highlights:

-- Adrian and Tony doing a speedy, choreographed unison neck bend on a
tune (I can't recall which) that sent the crowd roaring with approval.

-- Tony improvising Entwistle-approved walking lines on "Red" and
upper-register slap-bass fills on the breakdown of "People".

-- Adrian slipping a silly blues lick into "Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream"
which cracked up both the band and the audience.

-- A stray bit of reverbed noise that crept into one of the silent breaks
in "Sex," causing the musicians to look at each other with looks of "Where
the hell did *that* come from?!" confusion (and a particularly priceless
raised-eyebrow reaction from Fripp).

-- "Elephant Talk," which came to a precision climax.  The crowd roars --
and then a backbeat comes crashing back in, as a spotlight slowly fades
in on Bruford, with a smug grin on his face.  The band tries in vain to
come back in, before Bruf stops the beat with an "Oh well" look.  Belew:
"He always warned us he was going to do that one of these days...!"

-- Belew's opening rap on "Indiscipline," which was shot forth at a
blistering speed.  Adrian then looked at his watch and remarked, "Yep,
that's the fastest I've said it yet -- eight seconds."

-- A percussion piece as the first encore, featuring Bruford, Mast*****o and
Belew banging away on small instruments.

-- Belew and Mast******o tossing picks and drumsticks (respectively) into
the audience.

Other bits of oddness:

-- "THRAK" was played without re-stating the main theme -- it ended after
the free-improv section wound down.

-- As with the show I saw in June, Trey Gunn was almost completely
inaudible throughout most of the show, although the Stick duet leading
into "ET" was somewhat longer than usual.

-- Valet parking at House of Blues cost $8.00 and the miscreants almost
lost my car.

-- There was no rendition of "The Talking Drum."

-- Tony and Trey took turns playing the stick line on "ET."

All in all quite a show, and one that both the audience and the band
members will likely remember for a long time to come.

Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 17:05:57 +0800
From: John dot Lukes at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (John Lukes)
Subject: Gig review: Berkeley show!
Wow!  Jumping gee-haw-sa-fats!  What a show!  Seeing the Double Trio for
the second time this year (Warfield, SF a few months back), enabled me
to pay attention to details that escaped my discernment the first time
through.  I have to agree with all the posters who jumped to Trey Gunn's
defense when some early tour reviewers tried to argue that he wasn't
doing too much.  And the lighting specifically will call your attention
to the fact that Trey is tapping and fretting mega-amounts of the sound
that the band is creating.  The man is all over that Warr Guitar, and
obviously having a great time doing it.

I also enjoyed the extended encore set, which features a fabulous
percussive trio piece featuring Bruford, Mastelleto, and Belew.

The California Guitar Trio keeps on getting better and better...
obviously more comfortable with the audience and even more in tune with
each other.  Picked up their first CD and like it very much.

Great stuff.  Go see them!

-JOHN

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 00:29:40 -0400
From: FISH246 at aol dot com
Subject: gig review: crimson show ---10-22-95
Hi toby--just thought i would let you know i saw king crimson at the house
of blues sunday night! great great show---2 hours!!!!!!!!  show! crowd was
really into it---they played red,three of a perfect pair,larks tongues part
2, talking drum, among others.

I talked with Adrian Belew before show ---real nice guy ---told me how
great it was in japan where they are so popular! I still cannot get over
how great bill bruford is after all these years! i have seen him with yes,
uk,crimson,solo,etc.

Most amazing part of night was meeting keith emerson after show! To my
surprise he did not like show. wasn't musical enough for him. he thought
they were all such great players but did not like what they were doing! he
told me about how he met greg lake----it was at a show at the fillmore
west---the nice were the headline act and king crimson were the opening
act!!!!!!! can you believe this!  he was a super nice guy---thoght this
might interest you.  love your page on king crimson----keep up the good
work.

                                   take care -----------STEVE FISHER

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 02:57:56 -0700
From: bfcain at ix dot netcom dot com (Bradley F. Cain )
Subject: Gig Review: Los Angeles (House of Blues)
    SYNOPSIS: KC at the House of Blues was the best concert I have ever
seen by a wide margin easily surpassing the June show I saw in San Diego
June or any recorded performance I've heard.

    My words will doubtless fail to express the level of energy I
witnessed at the House of Blues last night (but that won't stop me from
trying!)  I really can't imagine any substantive criticism of this
show, so my unabashed praise isn't just glowing, it's a reflection of
how impressive KC was at HoB.

    MY POSITION:  General admission afforded me the opportunity to
stand about 10 "rows" (people) back from the stage to the right so I
had a very good view of Levin and Belew, a fair view of Gunn and Fripp
and obscured views of Mastelotto and Bruford (the stage at HoB is
rather high off the floor and the drum risers accentuate the effect).
By chance, one of the plexiglass acoustic separators reflected a
perfect view of Bruford's hands for much of the show (and everyone
knows 90% of his drumming is from the wrist down).

    SOUND:  Because I was very close to the right side speakers and
subwoofers, I didn't hear much of the left channel, but it really
didn't matter -- whatever I missed in imaging I reaped in mix quality.
The overall sound was very well balanced, much better than on B'Boom or
Thrak and much better than what I experienced in San Diego where my
balcony position yeilded a great view, but the distance added some
lengthy reverb times (blame Copley Symphony Hall; although a beautiful
venue, it wasn't designed for this kind of music).
    The only mixing error I picked up was the very low volume of the
bass drums which was remedied about a third of the way into the show
when People began.  The sound was punchy and vibrant, far from the
heavily compressed nature of B'Boom and much brighter than Thrak.
Equalization was well balanced across the spectrum.
    W a r n i n g :  It has been 24 hours since the show and my ears
are still ringing, albeit to a lesser degree, as are those of the
friend I attended with.  As much as I loved the sound and appreciated
the clarity and power, I really wish I'd worn earplugs.  Consider them
seriously...

    BAND:  Other HoB attendees, back me up on this one...  KC really
appeared to enjoy themselves at this show.  Adrian was constantly
smiling and pushing the limits in response to the crowd.  At one point
he said something to the effect of, "This is the most fun I've/we've
had in a long time."  Adrian's solos were confident: much more outside
and daring than those at the San Diego show or on B'Boom.  I thought he
was going to break the guitar neck with his bends.
    Similarly, Tony was full of facial expressions.  He was so in the
pocket I worry he may never find his way out.  Seriously, Levin was on
fuego -- like Adrian, Tony was constantly improvising.  He played a
sort of "reckless precision" pulling oscene mini-solos from thin air.
Tony also used the bow more percussively on his electric/upright bass,
beating the strings at times, hand plucking them at others.  Needless
to say, his stick playing was furious.  Tony's body language was as
responsible for his deep pocket groove as his hands.
    Tony and Adrian shared a great deal of interplay -- they smiled
almost every time they made eye contact.  When Adrian would change a
vocal phrasing or style, he would look back to Fripp or over to Tony
with a "how's that" look and they would respond in kind with the
appropriate approving expression.  I swear I saw Robert Fripp smile...
    In San Diego, I couldn't tell what Gunn was doing mostly due to the
mix.  That has been remedied.  Gunn's bass contributions were quite
distinct from Tony's and their respective styles mesh well.  Tony and
Trey fed off each other well constantly shifting registers whenever
necessary to avoid stepping on each other or simply doubling notes as
lesser bands might.
    Unfortunately, I couldn't hear as much of Mastelotto's work as I
could in San Diego (more of it may be panned to the left); there I was
impressed at how much he delivered; at HoB I couldn't hear much more
than his cymbal work and some deep resonant toms in most songs although
B'Boom (which continues to get more deeply polyrhythmic every time I
hear it) provided a good balance sonic balance of both drummers.
    Fripp's sounds were not as distant at this show (excepting B'Boom /
Thrak).  His notes were distinct, and his sound was more
straightforward.  Less decay and faster attacks on many sounds.  His
lead tone in LTiA2 (the last song of the show) was overbearing and
disgusting (that's good).  The notes carried a lot of intentional
overhang, less flange than on B'Boom and more distortion / overdrive.
Thrak was the one song were Fripp, as expected, went off the deep end.
Much more improvisational and much longer (as previous reviews noted)
than before.  The longer it went, the less relation it retained with
the album version.  Overall the most creative part of the show if for
no other reason than it represents a good chunk of new material.

    SONG HIGHLIGHTS: Red, the 2nd tune, spewed fire!  The biggest
surprise was not how good Red was, but how good all the other songs
were.  Whereas in San Diego Red and a few other songs were the clear
highlights, it is hard to pick a best performance from HoB.
    The additions of Thela Hun Ginjeet, 3ofaPP (flawless Levin
harmonies) and Neurotica (powerful) far outweigh the loss of Heartbeat
(not missed at all) and Matte Kudasai (seagulls missed).  Most missed
was Talking Drum, but the 3-man percussion solo described in the
thorough Japan review was well-received.
    Perhaps the most fun was had with Indiscipline.  Adrian rattled off
the first verse like an auctioneer, let his guitar hang loose, rolled
up his sleeve, looked at his watch and said "Eight seconds...fastest
yet."  He then slowly and purposefully adjusted his whammy bar, took
control of his pleasantly hideous neon orange guitar, set forward and
thrust the band and crowd into the infamous frenzy of "I did!"
    People was downright funky.  The best version I have heard yet, a
strong contender for the best song of the show and one I hadn't liked
nearly as well until Sunday.  The groove was harsh and percussive.
Blame Bill and Tony.
    Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream represented pure rage.  When that song
breaks down, there is little else to do but stare in awe and listen as
the parts stray and converge to synchronicity.  Much more independence
of the individual parts than on either album (i.e. less of the "wall of
sound" syndrome).
    Elephant talk, the song I anticipated most, did not disappoint.
After ending it, the band broke into a reprise to my delight.  Then,
when the rest of the band simultaneously ended the song abruptly, Bill
was apparently bamboozled: he kept going for a note or two so the song
ended on an anti-climactic medium snare hit.  Very funny.  Adrian, of
course, points this out to the crowd saying that "Bill always wanted to
be fooled and now it has happened."  Bill gets applauded for a mistake.

    DOWNFALLS:  The band did make a few serious errors, but nothing
tragic.  Adrian missed a pedal or two and lost a couple of notes; the
opening notes of a few songs were sonically muffed (maybe they were
initally undermixed then quickly raised or the compressor gates weren't
properly adjusted between tunes); the band screwed the pooch once badly
in Frame by Frame misplacing the beginning of a verse after coming out
of the "chasing eighth notes" lead that preceeds.
    Unrelated to the band -- I have to vent about the complete assholes
I got stuck next to.  These amusing slobs had at least four large beers
each before the band came on, about four more during the show, then
they broke out joints in the middle (at a no smoking show no less).
When all the dope and booze kicked in, these guys were worthless.  They
kept coming and going to the bathroom and bumping into everybody
completely oblivious.  They tried dancing and headbanging like a bunch
of Poison fans and they constantly screamed things during the soft /
silent portions of the show.  I was embarrassed FOR them.  I'm not for
telling people what they should and shouldn't do, but if your thinking
about getting really loaded at a show, keep it to yourself -- these
guys were total dickheads.  I sincerely hope their ilk doesn't surface
at any other show.  I wonder if they knew everyone around them was
seriously laughing at them...

    LASTING IMPRESSIONS:  The crowd (sans dickheads) was very
responsive to the band's experimentation and energy (a couple people's
dates, who appeared not to be familiar with the music, looked honestly
frightened at some parts).  The band obviously appreciated the crowd
and Adrian made comments to that end.
    KC summed up the character of the show in the order of their second
and last encore.  They played Walking on Air THEN LTiA2.  Although the
HoB show was lush and beautiful in parts, the true character of this
how was raw power -- much more so then I saw only a few months ago.
    KC has clearly gotten more comfortable with all the material for
this leg of the tour.  Each song is more prescise and at the same time
more diverse.  The dynamics are wider and the improvisation more
challenging.  How can six excellent musicians stick with a band with
such tightly structured material?  In each song there is so much room
to experiment that each player really is conducting their own
controlled solos.  That's what much of the show felt like.  While Bill
rolls, Belew screeches, Fripp mutates, Pat splashes, Trey strikes and
Tony warbles.
    Epic form, endless creativity and an improved songlist made this
the most satisfying display of performance artistry I have ever seen.
How can I (sigh) go on with normal life?

Enjoy,
Bradley F. Cain
bfcain at ix dot netcom dot com

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 07:39:49 -0700 (MST)
From: Bill Lantz <lantz at primenet dot com>
Subject: GIG REVIEW : October 23 Phoenix
October 23, 1995

Phoenix Symphony Hall, Phoenix, AZ

This was a day held in high anticipation. The June gig in Tempe was
cancelled in favor of an extra day in LA so us Crimson fans in AZ have been
waiting for this one since May's announcement that KC was coming (actually
since May 84).

I was 5th in line the day tix went on sale and I went to the Symphony Hall
Box Office thinking that would help my location at the venue. I was happy to
walk away with row J (10th row) center). Get there early when tickets go on
sale in your area. There seems to be a high number of comp seats being set
aside. This could be just a function of our local promoter though.

The California Guitar Trio truly impressed us and revealed what kind of
sound we were in store for. The medley they perform that contains Schizoid
Man is fantastic. Lots of time changes and mood swings. And the 1st movement
of Beethovens Fifth was amazing to watch. Bravo. Lots of eyebrowze.

Fripp was onstage for 3-4 minutes before most people noticed him. The
soundscapes after the CGT continued for about 10 minutes and then he snuck
in. The area he was in was very dark. He began to add to the layers. Then
Tony came on and added a bit, Bruford followed, then Trey and Pat and
finally Adrian. The sound swelled and we were all transfixed. Adrian turned
around, raised his arms ala Zappa and issued a stop command. This time they
did not continue ;).

Thela Hun Ginjeet roared in next. It was nice to hear the tape effects
again. After my internal wallpaper was shredded by Red, Adrian asked "Is
everyone warmed up?"

Well we were. And we were treated to and excellent evening of music. The set
was similar to the Japan gigs with the exception that they did not perform
Matte Kudasai or Walking on Air. I was hoping that Adrian would break out
the drill but it didn't happen. But the improvs we were given were
delightful. The intro to Neurotica seems to be an area that is becoming sort
of the 90's version of Voyage to the Center of the Cosmos. I'll be
interested to hear if they continue to develop this.

The second encore brought out the triple drum/metal block set up. Lots of
smiles from Adrian, Bill and Pat. Noteworthy in LTiA pt 2 was Tony's bass
lines, especially toward the very end. He found a different groove and
caught everyones attention on stage. Listen for it.

The light show was very good. Robert was visible for the entire show - even
spotlighted. They used a sort of vari-light and the usage of these during
One Time (the only "slow" song of the night ie. no Heartbeat, Matte, WoA
etc.) was very appropriate. The sound in Symphony Hall was perfect. And the
db range was off the rictor scale. That place will never be the same for me.

I didn't stick around after the show, but a friend did. The guys popped out
after about 90 minutes (outside) and signed stuff and talked. Robert breezed
by everyone (no sigs) and boarded the bus. Pat was the first one out (being
the only smoker in the band) and seemed to know several people.

A great night. Adrian said they'd be back - sooner this time. Anybody that
was at this show - PLEASE contact me.

Thanks for the forum Toby,

Bill Lantz
Tempe, AZ

Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 16:39:46 -0600
From: pw at accugraph dot com (   Phil Webster   )
Subject: KC gig review El Paso October 25th
Gig Review:

King Crimson
8:00 p.m. MDT
October 25, 1995
Abraham Chavez Theater
El Paso, Texas

Reviewers:

    Phil Webster <pw at accugraph dot com>
    with input and performance review from Rick du Bois <rick at accugraph dot com>

Brief KC autobio:

    PW: 31, first KC album YPGtKC purchased in '77 or '78; subsequently
    all other KC LPs (no bootlegs, but including French import of
    "Earthbound"); much of RF & BB solo/other work on LP & CD; concerts
    (in Toronto): BB at El Mocombo twice, RF "One small mobile
    intelligent unit" Frippertronics tour at U of T (both shows); KC:
    Discipline tour at the Masonic Temple (first show), ToaPP tour at
    CNE bandshell.

Tickets:

    Price was $35 + $2.50 convenience fee,  Row H seats 28, 29, no
    problem getting good seats, no Ticketmaster horror stories, an
    advantage to living in a small city in the Southwest.
    Disadvantage: hardly anyone we want to see comes.

Stage:

	PM		RF		BB

	TG		AB		TL

    --------------------------------------------

Row H                 PW RdB

    Great seats!  Centered, high enough (i.e. not in the orchestra pit)
    and far enough back to get the stereo effect without being too far
    to see the musicians expressions.

Crowd:

    Diverse, spanning teens to fifties.  The venue was about 1/4 full,
    if that--surely disappointing for the band, but there were many
    dedicated new and inveterate fans.  This was evidenced by the calls
    and appreciation shown for old and new songs.  Two rows behind us,
    some rowdy Spanish speakers:  "!Viva Kin Creemson!", "!Claro que
    si!", "Maestros", etc.  Behind and to my left, a couple intent more
    on their conversation than the performance.  As politely as I
    could, I asked them to keep it to themselves; they were offended by
    this and claimed it was the rowdy hispanics, but their (audible)
    conversation went away and so did they at some point . . . "`Oh,
    frabjous day, Calloo, Callay,' he chortled in his joy! . . . Twas
    brillig and the slithy toves . . ."  WHY CAN'T SOME PEOPLE
    UNDERSTAND THAT THEY ARE NOT IN THEIR F**KING LIVING ROOMS WHEN AT
    A PUBLIC PERFORMANCE.  Some rowdiness and howling is normal at a
    rock concert, but who wants to hear someone's vacuous natterings
    during a sublime quiet moment in a KC song?  I'm getting off my
    horse now . . .

RF anecdote:

    This brings to mind the Discipline tour at the Masonic Temple when
    RF walked up to center stage and attempted to speak to the
    audience.  Some inebriated fool in the balcony kept yelling at RF.
    Finally, RF, frustrated, said to the idiot: "You're a rude f**king
    twerp," and went back to his guitar.  One person ruined what many of
    us looked forward to.

Concert:

7:45 p.m. PW & RdB arrive to little or no fanfare ;-), brief look at
    wares for sale, take seats, interesting pre-show taped music
    playing in hall;  worth getting there early if you like ambient
    music

8:05 p.m.  Opening act: California Guitar Trio (three amplified Ovation
    guitars, three guys, one in a suit & hat, one with jeans & long
    hair, one in garb I can't remember

    Series of excerpts from songs including from itCotCK

    Arrangement for three guitars of a mini-Beethoven Symphony #5

    Two(?) songs in the LoCG genre, one featuring Soundscapes played on
    an Ovation

    The famous "To Cats in a Fug" in D Minor by Bach arranged for
    guitar trio (perfect setup for "Cat Food"--maybe next time)

    Two more songs in the LoCG vein

8:35 p.m. exeunt CGT (no encores), roadies set up for KC, recorded
    Soundscape music

8:50 p.m. Enter RF, starts live Soundscape performance, followed and
    joined by BB, then TL, AB, TG and PM, each member greeted by warm
    applause (the titles and order of songs are as best as we can
    remember)

    transition to Thela Hun Ginjeet

    Red

    AB: "Hola, hello . . ." introduction: (i) light remarks about
    sparse crowd (ii) request that pot-heads not smoke near stage as he
    has to complete rest of tour and needs his voice (he said this more
    obliquely)

    Frame by Frame

    Dinosaur

    Neurotica

    Vroom

    One Time

    Three of a Perfect Pair

    Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream

    two Sticks transition to Elephant Talk

    exeunt KC; thunderous applause & stomping & whistling

    (Encore set 1)

    AB: "What you lack in size, you make up for in volume."

    VroomVroom

    Walking on Air

    Indiscipline

    exeunt KC; more thunderous applause & stomping & whistling

    (Encore set 2)

    BB/PM/AB drum trio at front of stage ("Prism"?)

    LTiA(ii)

10:40 p.m. exeunt KC

Performers:

RF: Dressed in black vest with untucked white dress shirt.  What can I
    say?  Some of RF's words: "Music is a very considerable friend to
    us at awkward moments."  In his self-effacing way, he was reigning
    over the current court from his central/obscured position on
    stage,  his unique battery of sounds and rhythms balancing dark and
    light.

BB: Good old BB.  Wearing a egg-yolk yellow jacket to match his kit.
    One of my favorite artists to watch.  Have seen him more into the
    music before, but overall an excellent performance.  He augmented a
    couple of songs with tuned percussion.  Nobody drums quite like
    BB.  Horsing around during the trio with AB & PM, saw BB mess up
    and lose a stick.  He displayed his incredible dexterity during the
    trio while the other two and the crowd looked on in amazement.  For
    me though, it's his subtle mastery, his precision and his ability
    to elicit wonder through his music.  Gracias a Dios por BB.

TL: Dapper, clean shaven on top, in a white shirt and black pants.
    Observed TL using the extended fingernails (don't know the
    technical name) during one song . . .  I forget which one.  Fun to
    watch, as always, enjoys performing and is a flawless musician.  In
    "Walking on Air" TL played the electric double bass (not sure of
    the proper name) which surprised me because I thought it was
    played on the Stick.

AB: Adrian, longish hair, flamboyant guitars (bright orange Strat,
    cherry red Les Paul) a looseness in playing and bearing that seems
    alien to RF.  Reminds me somewhat of Kim Mitchell of Max Webster.
    Wearing a double breasted suit, if I recall correctly.  I agree
    with a previous review that his voice has improved since the 80's
    incarnation of KC.  Still, the spoken pieces in THGJ and
    Indiscipline and the instrumentals are more to my taste.

PM: Interesting complement to BB.  Sketchy impression: more of a "play
    it loud" rock drummer.  Because I'm such a BB fan, was watching BB
    a lot more than PM.  Enjoyed him in the drum trio with AB & BB.

TG: Played Stick throughout the performance.  As noted in previous ETs
    more of a guitarist's approach to the instrument.  Especially
    apparent during the two Sticks piece.  Lost in the mix a lot of the
    time, but was apparent and appreciated in songs like LTiA(ii).

Sound:

    The sound system was good, not great.  The volume was just about
    right.  I think part of the problem must be mixing all six
    musicians well.  As noted above, what TG was doing was lost on me a
    lot of the time.  I would watch him intently playing his Stick, but
    couldn't pick out what he was playing.  Drums were clear.  RF
    wasn't loud enough in some sections to penetrate my addled
    consciousness to full effect.

Performance:

Rick's review:

    CGT - I thought they were unique. A well balanced performance
    for opening KC. The best opening act since Steve Morse opened
    for Al Di Meola, John McLaughlin and Paco De Lucia.

    KC - A tight performance, as expected. I thought they had a
    good mix of new, middle (Discipline, Three of a Perfect Pair)
    and old King Crimson. It was nice to see Robert Fripp, as
    opposed to hiding behind Bill Bruford. Although the audience
    was small in numbers, they seemed to be very receptive to
    the show. I hope KC will not consider the poor ticket sales on
    their next tour and return to El Paso, maybe a smaller, more
    intimate venue would be appropriate.

PW's review:

    CGT:  A good act to start the concert.  An appropriate pairing,
    like the Max Webster/Rush New Year's Eve concerts at Maple Leaf
    Gardens.  The arrangements of the classical works were intricate
    and performed well.  I liked the Soundscape effect from the
    Ovation.

    KC:  A strong and spirited performance by KC (not a swift thrak in
    the a--- as put forward by another, visit
    http://euphony.com/euphony/articles/36/Crimson/KingCrimson-TC.html
    if you want to pursue this viewpoint).  The ability of the entire
    band to make the intricate pieces sound effortless is amazing.
    Great opening with RF's intro joined by BB and TL then transition
    to THGJ.  Excellent choice to follow up with "Red" to get the crowd
    into it.  Of the slow songs, liked "One Time" a lot, but felt
    "Walking on Air" was better on the CD.  As noted by Rick above, a
    good mix of songs, though nothing from pre-BB KC.  The LTiA(ii) was
    incredible.  The best version I have heard through three tours and
    the recorded versions.  Lots of interwoven textural additions which
    raised this old standard to a new level.  Especially liked the
    changes in the ending which I previously found to be a let down for
    such a great piece.

Conclusion:

    "I like it!"

Date: Sat, 28 Oct 95 17:05 EST
From: "James B. Erickson" <JBE%A1%Health_Net at mcimail dot com>
Subject: House Of Blues Review 10/22/95
Hello All,

	Well,  it has been one week since being attacked by KC on their current
rounds.  I'm still a little weak-kneed from the "EVENT" at the House Of Blues
gig on the one and only Sunset Strip in Hollyweird, CA.  It all started Sunday
night Oct 22 at approx 6:30p.m. which is when my girlfriend and I arrived to be
sure and get a good spot in line so a good seat/space could be had since this
was a G.A. show that started at 9:00p.m..  It turned out that this still put us
approx 30 people back in line.  But this wait was well worth it.  It was still
pretty fun to hang and check things out and watch the line grow.  It also
allowed for time to get mentally prepared, if you know what I mean, for the
show.

	While we were waiting and watching and preparing we were able to catch
little snippets of the sound check.  Of coarse this only fueled restlessness of
wanting to get inside.  Once the sound check was copleted who should come
strolling out but Tony Levin.  He just strode across the street to their Hotel.
I'm not sure many people recognized Tony,  how could you not,  because he made
it without being approached by any of us waiting in line.  Finally 8:00p.m.
arrived which is when they opened the doors.  Being 30 deep in line I figured
we would surely secure a good position once inside.  Well it turned out to
fornt row stage left.  I couldn't believe we were actually going to be elbows
on the stage for the night.  This is the closest I have ever been for any
event.  We also were sheilded from being crowded by a speaker to our left. This
meant we had something to lean against and a place to set beers.  Once everyone
was inside the place was packed.  So feeling we were locked into out spots I
ventured off for some brew before showtime.  While waiting for two cold ones
who should come down the bar but Mr. Fripp himself.  I really wanted to say
something but was unable to do so without it sounding like total blathering.
So I left it at a head nod and got back to stage left.

	We are all pretty familiar with the paticulars at this point.  RF comes
up on stage and starts the soundscapes.  Then CGT takes the stage and let loose
with their set.  Awesome as usual and much more intense when your close enough
to see their every move.  Why can't all shows be this way?   Then KC takes
stage and the assault on the senses begins.  Man,  I was really dumbfounded
that I was standing right up front.  I was also amazed that all of their
equipment was on this small stage.  We had perfect sightlines to all members of
the band with Mr. Gunn standing directly aboves us.  Of coarse the familiar
scent filled the air and Adrian and Trey looked at each other and smiled
acknowleging waft that floated about.  So for the next two plus hours they
blasted us and seemed to be enjoying themselves.  I wont go into a set list
here until the end of my post.  Everybody seemed to be in sync except for a few
instances when you would see the contorted faces and chuckles.  To me they
played a flawlees set with the exception of not playing LTiA.  After there
first of two encores Pat tossed a couple of drum sticks to the crowd of which I
almost nabbed.  But I just wasnt quick enough.  There was a consolation prize
though because after the final encore  my girlfriend asked for the set list
that was at Trey's feet from one of the roadies.  She got it and got a big
sloppy kiss from myself.  People saw what she had gotten and immediately we
were swarmed by a few people who wanted to take a peek and jot down the info
for their own.  This was by far a much better show than when we saw them at the
Wiltern Theater in June.  I'm sure being right up front had alot to do with
this sentiment.  My only request to RF is please release an "Official Boot II"
for this leg of the tour.  And most selfishly for myself please relaese the
House Of Blues entire show.  It was truly a memorable occasion.

	On a lighter note once people started clearing out the floor area was
soaked in beer and other assorted toddies.  Evidence  that there had in fact
been an assault.  But the topper was going outside and right there on Sunset
Blvd.  a fellow concert goer was tossing his cookies all over the sidewalk.
Nice dump buddy I only hope you remember the show.  Below is the list of songs
taken directly from the playlist:

Circular Improv
Thela Hun Gin Jeet
Frame By Frame
Dinosaur
One Time
Paople
Vroom, Vroom
B'Boom
Thrak (No Out Head)
Neurotica
Three Of A Perfect Pair
Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream
Stix
Elephant Talk
Indiscipline

1st Encore
----------
B'Bish
Vroom
Walking On Air

2nd Encore
----------
Red

Listed on set list but not played
---------------------------------
Talking Drum
Larks Tongue In Aspic

I'm intrested to hear anyone elses opinion of that show also.

"Is It Safe?"

JBE

Date: Sun, 29 Oct 1995 09:24:25 -0700
From: mopix at sirius dot com (michael harrison)
Subject: Denver 10/27/95 (Paramount Theater)
Hello out there,

Highlights from last night's time wounding at the old Paramount:

Great sound, (narrow venue, good seats for my ears, improved mix?).

Very strong duo improv. sequence for Tony Levin and Trey Gunn. Of the five
different versions of this stick question and answer duet that I've heard,
friday night's creation was perhaps the finest. The stick piece captured on
"B'Boom" is short in duration and not nearly as complex or satisfying as
the advanced layers of tones they're progressing into now. The music is
growing.

Live Thrak (especially recent versions) is truly beyond compare in the
world of music. No power chord band ever jumped into fantastic noise
improv. creations in
the way Crimson does these days. No jazz group ever went so far out with
such intellegence and passion for the sounds. All six cylinders fire with
perfection.

Appreciative as always, the Colorado audience gave a standing ovation for
the first encore return, and then remained standing and dancing for the
rest of the show. I don't know how the band perceived this, but it seemed
to add energy to the proceedings.

The special encore drums emerged again Friday night. Bill Bruford seemed to
be having good fun after dropping a stick, quickly grabbing the fallen
tool, and recovering in time to get his lick in. Its nice to see that big
smile.

Robert Fripp was sharp, exacting, and raging in his solos. The Fripp
explosion during Dinosaur, after A.B.'s quiet section, is classic Crimson.
R.F. is the
true show man, all substance no empty acting.

Other notes:

Maybe I'm projecting again, but it seemed that right after Adrian Belew
requested smokers to remove themselves to the back of the house, someone
lit up in the third row. It appeared that Adrian was angered by this
defiant attack on his throat and lungs, and he seemed to stare at the
offenders with a really dark look for the first third of "Red". Even though
an angry Adrian really fits this piece of music, it was not a good scene.
The moral is: Respect the wishes of A.B. and the band, and take yer smoke
to the back of the house! Jeez.

I do hope the Colorado Springs show is well attended. Coupons were handed
out to people exiting the Paramount on friday, offering ten dollars off on
Springs Crimson tickets for sunday...

Never since Weather Report have I enjoyed a live band so much. I wish my
little tour could continue, but its back to CA for me. I'll be reading the
gig reviews
and wishing to be there,(where ever there happens to be).

See this tour if you can, upgrade your tickets if possible, enjoy.

Later,

Michael


Mike Stok