From elephant-talk at arastar dot comThu Jul 27 07:02:18 1995 Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 22:06:32 +0800 From: elephant-talk at arastar dot com Reply to: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: elephant-talk at anthor dot arastar dot com Subject: Elephant-talk digest v95 #210 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 210, Wednesday, 26 July 1995 Today's Topics: WWW: Elephant Talk Indexes Sacred Songs Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Re: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) Thrak review??? Soundscapes Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Fidelity on CD's of Discipline, Beat, Three Import Acoustic Adrian Oh God no Re:Robert Fripp/Daryl Hall Re: Michael Moorcock USA on CD: Yes, but not officially Re: early vinyl pressings FAQ: David Cross Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) crimso covers exist?!? New Percussion G.O.A. & Covers backwards frippertronics Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 We grouchy Yes fans (ET #209) "Frame by Frame" and "Great Deciever" no longer available? Sacred Songs Sacred Songs Correction Erm... reviews anyone? About men and mice! Fripp & Fripperies Belew and Fripp on Terry Fresh's Gross Air Crimso covers Sacred Songs Rembrandts Hi all&Re:Fracture tab RE: Fripp and Daryll Hall Re: More on Bruford... Re: "Go Between" KC/Bruford stuff FW: first-run is important! Re: #4(4) Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Searching for a King Crimson transcription Peter Hammill shows Camilla's Little Secret Best Fripp solo REVIEW: Thrak in "San Ramon Valley Times" Soundscapes/CGT/LGA tour update JSYK (just so you know) Re: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] POSTS: Please send all posts to toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk ARCHIVES: The ET archives are: WWW: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/elephant-talk.html FTP: The Americas: ftp.qualcomm.com, in /pub/et FTP: Rest of world: ftp.cs.man.ac.uk, in /pub/toby/elephant-talk EMAIL: Send "index elephant-talk" to listserv at arastar dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: E#KIRKD at ccmail dot ceco dot com Date: Tue, 25 Jul 95 13:44:59 CST Subject: WWW: Elephant Talk Indexes Fellow ET readers, A while back Toby put out a request for someone to create a master index for Elephant Talk. I crazily enough accepted the challenge as I was reading through all the past digest at that time anyway. For those of you who haven't yet discovered them, both an index of past ET topics, and an index of ET "talkers", now can be accessed from Toby's WWW ET pages. Both indexes also have *direct links* to the past digests at Mike Stok's full text archives. You may be wondering how these can be of use to you? (Or you may not!) Well think of all those times you've asked a question not knowing if it had been previously asked and answered. Well now you can look it up before asking what "Thela Hun Ginjeet" means for the umpteenth time. Or you can find past postings of transcriptions and lyrics. Or you can search for past threads on bootlegging, or the Eric Tamm book. And so on and so on... The "talkers" index is an easy way to find postings by particular people, including Fripp, Levin and Gunn. An ascii version of the topics index can be easily printed for later reference. I will not say that either index is devoid of errors, or in any other way perfect, but they ain't half bad, and I encourage you to check them out. The topic index, far and away the more difficult one to put together, is still only complete through ET 161 (as of this writing), but I hope to catch up to current digest in due time. I will be updating each on a weekly basis. This is my way of saying thanks to Toby and all ET readers for the Web pages and digests. Enjoy! Daniel Kirkdorffer e#kirkd at ccmail dot ceco dot com -- "It is impossible to achieve the aim without suffering..." (So true!) -- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 09:50:43 -0700 From: maccoun at violet dot berkeley dot edu (Rob MacCoun) Subject: Sacred Songs Yes, this was a GREAT record. I found it hard to believe the Hall of Hall and Oates could create something I could like so much. The problem is that Hall, his label, or both tried to shelve it originally. I heard that it only came out after a letter-writing campaign by interested fans, which explains the inner sleeve photo of Hall walking out of a company vault carrying a stack of tapes. My guess is that Hall and/or his label still doesn't like it. I don't recall any Gabriel songs (you may be thinking of "Here Comes the Flood" on Exposure, or "Exposure" on PG2 -- RF calls these three a trilogy), but there are some good Frippertronic moments -- a lot of overlap with "Exposure" and some excellent DH ballads. (DH also sings on some "Exposure" tracks.) I've been searching for a CD version ever since. I welcome anyone's suggestions about where to find it. Rob MacCoun Graduate School of Public Policy Univ. of California at Berkeley 2607 Hearst Ave., Berkeley CA 94720-7320 tel 510-642-7518, fax 510-643-9657 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 09:56:31 -0700 From: maccoun at violet dot berkeley dot edu (Rob MacCoun) Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 >Another item: On the original vinyl inside sleeve to Peter Gabriel II there >is a great foreshadowing (pun intended.) Arranged throughout the lyric >sheet are small square photos of the musicians' faces, followed by an >assortment of square icons that represent the instruments they played. For >example Tony Levin's photo (with hair and full beard!) is followed by >simple renderings of an acoustic bass, an electric bass headstock and two >open mouths indicating backing vocals. Well by a process of elimination >and examination of the instruments that follow you can find where the Fripp >photo should be. But there is only a black square... I hate to keep adding all these circa-1980 reminiscences, but hey, I'm an old fart (started listening to Fripp and Gabriel in the early 70s). A friend saw PG during the PGII tour, and said that the guitarist played sitting down, shrouded in darkness, and was only introduced as "Mr. Dusty Roads." Rob MacCoun Graduate School of Public Policy Univ. of California at Berkeley 2607 Hearst Ave., Berkeley CA 94720-7320 tel 510-642-7518, fax 510-643-9657 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 13:04:35 -0400 From: mchugh at telco dot com (Mike McHugh) Subject: Re: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) > From: "Michael Dixon (COAS)" > > I read this list fairly regularly and subscribe to the Digest version. > Anyway, my query concerns a release in the early eighties of Daryl Hall > (yes, he of Hall and Oates fame). Fripp played on it, and possibly > produced. Anyone else heard this? Forgive me if this has been discussed I don't know about that, but quite a few years ago Daryl Hall was the guest VJ on VH-1 (I think?). One of "his favorite" videos that he played was LTIA I. Flipped me right out. Mike [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Neal Bauer Subject: Thrak review??? Date: Fri, 21 Jul 95 11:27:44 MDT Bryan was kind enough to post a review of Thrak from the Kansas City New Times. I just had to comment. > King Crimson (Thrak). Twenty six years ago, K.C. first unleashed on the > world its arty, sensitive and ultra-violent take on the pop music with In "Ultra-violent"? Guess the reviewer recently read Anthony Burgess. What the hell is ultra-violent music and how in the world does it apply to some of the most relaxing music created in the past three decades? (I find most of KC quite peaceful and introspective.) > Eleven years ago, they constructed a > masterpiece of industrial free-form chaos on side two of ToaPP, the band's "Industrial"? Just because there is a cut called "Industry" doesn't make it industrial. "Chaos"? The reviewer sure likes to throw out adjectives that, to me at least, have little to do with the music. > As a record,though, Thrak honestly > surveys the terrain of a kingdom forever destroyed by violence and > longing. Does anyone besides the reviewer get this feeling from Thrak? If I believed in a Christian heaven (and I thought I'd be going there) I'd definitely hope that the house band was KC. I find the music full of complex patterns built up as the music progresses rather than anything destroyed. Neal [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 13:08:16 -0500 (EST) From: STEPHEN LAUB Subject: Soundscapes RE:Soundscapes & Thrak...live Have found some close-shot video and (dat) audio of BOTH. Looking for same in trade (only)...Frippertronics too! Have much other audio/video as well. Please inquire... SFL at lilly dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 95 14:19:13 EDT From: "michael D. Jeter" Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 the writer of "time of The Hawklords" was Brian Butterworth, under the influenc e of Michael Moorcock, or something to that effect.. Obviously, Brian Butterwor th could be a pseudonym for Moorcock, but the book is not listed as having been written by moorcock; I know, b/c the search for this boook has been a minor obs ession of mine for almost six years...do any of you know where I can get a copy , or do any of you have a copy you would be willing to part with for some ammou nt? Also, Is "Book of Saturday" anothe newsletter for KC? If so, how do I get it? [ -- Toby ] Thanks, Michael:-) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Nadav Noah Caine Subject: Fidelity on CD's of Discipline, Beat, Three Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 11:33:53 -0700 (PDT) I bought my copies of Discipline, Beat, and Three of a PP the days they came out (way back when there was only one CD player on the market, the Sony D5 I believe) --y'know, they have paper stickers/song lists pasted directly onthe CD's. Well, I thought the fidelity was the cat's pajamas at the time, but now the tremendous hiss etc. on them is getting intolerable. How is the fidelity on YOUR Crimson CD's of this period? Would buying new copies help at all? Are later copies of the CD's different? Thanks in advance, Nadav Caine (nadav at leland dot stanford dot edu) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: d dot zemel at genie dot geis dot com Date: Fri, 21 Jul 95 12:40:00 UTC Subject: Import Acoustic Adrian I just bought the Japanese import Acoustic Adrian Belew which has two songs not on the domestic version available for purchase at Adrian's last two tours. On the Japanese version, "Young Lions" and "Men In Helicopters" are inserted between "Crying" and "Martha Adored". It's a bit pricey for just two extra songs, but if you gotta have EVERYTHING...! By the way, I got mine as a special order from the cool Sacramento store, Obsessed With Music. You can reach the owner at S dot REULE at GENIE dot GEIS dot COM which is how I order from him. Still tingling from the fabulous Milwaukee show, Dean [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 17:19:04 -0400 From: KB305 at aol dot com Subject: Oh God no In a message dated 95-07-21 12:57:05 EDT, somebody wrote: > "to >their knowledge Fripp had never strayed more than a few inches from his >stool". No. I can't bear the thought. No. That's too weird. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 18:47:41 -0400 From: Otherroad at aol dot com Subject: Re:Robert Fripp/Daryl Hall Regarding Mike Dixon's inquiry of SACRED SONGS, I have the LP you're discussing. Regrettably it was never released on CD. This was not a mere case of Robert Fripp showing up on a couple tracks of someone's album. He is on the entire album. He produced it. And he even wrote or co-wrote a couple of the tracks. This is very much a collaborative effort from these two as much as were Bowie's Eno produced albums. This is a great album (it's been a while since I heard it, but now I'm dying to put it on again), but, as you can imagine, it is quite far removed from the Hall and Oates "sound." If you recall "North Star" from Fripp's EXPOSURE, that'll give you a clue as to what you might find on SACRED SONGS. As such, RCA absolutely shit their pants when they heard it and refused to release it. Finally, about three years after it was produced, it saw the light of day (1980). In a gleeful and satiric stab at RCA, the inside sleeve photo shows Hall impishly rescuing his tapes from the vaults. It was Fripp's original intention that this album, EXPOSURE, and Peter Gabriel's second album (which he also produced) should form an MOR trilogy. However that got screwed up because of delays in his own album (released in 1978) and what seemed at the time the demise of SACRED SONGS. Now Robert Fripp also made a guest appearance (just one track, I think) on one of Hall and Oates' albums, although I can't recall which one. If you can find it somewhere, grab it. Perhaps someone on the net might have a copy to sell (although I sure wouldn't let mine go). I wonder if there's any way Fripp could rescue this gem and release it on Discipline. Hey, Dinokiller, what about it? Gary Davis [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 16:14:24 +0800 From: John dot Lukes at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (John Lukes) Subject: Re: Michael Moorcock The "Dancers At The End Of Time" sci-fantasy trilogy, starting with "An Alien Heat," introduced me to the very fun and inventive genius of Michael Moorcock. I ended up reading a couple dozen of his books and soon discovered Philip K. Dick. Some folks I mention this to tease me by saying that I went from Moorcock to Dick, and laugh, but I just don't get the joke. (dah) By the way, what, if anything, does this have to do with KC? -JOHN [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 16:28:01 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself Subject: USA on CD: Yes, but not officially There's been inquiries into the availability of _USA_ on CD lately... I have seen this release; there's a copy of it in a store here in town. It's clearly not an EG release. Obviously, somebody got a copy of either a vinyl or cassette version of the original album and bootlegged it onto CD. There are also an additional four songs featured, which could be from anywhere. So you're dealing with a bootleg edition of _USA_. If you're thinking of buying it, then you should hear the disc before you put money down. It's not at all uncommon for extremely shoddy-sounding master tapes to be used as source material for bootlegs of rare or out-of-print albums. Then again, Fripp has said he's "under pressure" to re-release the album, so you might want to wait instead. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 16:51:08 +0800 From: John dot Lukes at Ebay dot Sun dot COM (John Lukes) Subject: Re: early vinyl pressings Having worked for a man who used to work in a Warner Brothers record pressing plant in Southern California somewhere, he explained to me that as the vinyl-plastic liquid is injected into the mold, it tends to heat up the mold (which is some kind of metal), and soon the mold itself gets hot. When the mold gets hot, he said as the vinyl-plastic was being injected, you could actually hear it sizzling (like eggs). All those sizzles caused surface irregularities And then as they separate the mold, particularly if there's been "sizzling" (he didn't call it that), little bits of the fried vinyl-plastic stay behind in the mold. He said when management wanted to maximize volume, and didn't care about quality, they'd keep the production folks pumping the lp's out, so the molds didn't have time to cool, and the production workers didn't have time to clean the molds, which apparently wear out through use anyway. So, more quality-conscious manufacturers take care to keep the production rate lower and don't use the molds as long -- and use better quality vinyl (some even use pure vinyl), whereas most commercial releases are some kind of mix of vinyl and plastics, as well as additives to help get the disc out of the mold in one piece. This is one reason why "audiophile" vinyl always cost more...and why European and Japanese vinyl used to always sound better, because their quality standards usually dictated that they do smaller lots and a slower rate, and maximize the sound quality of the album. A stab from my memory banks........ -JOHN [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 95 15:59 BST From: ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk (Ron Chrisley) Subject: FAQ: David Cross Date: Wed, 19 Jul 1995 21:48:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Hank w. Wright" Subject: Crossing the Big Picture... The album I am listening to as I type this is "The Big Picture" by David Cross! Up until last week I never even knew that he recorded solo. This album apparantly came out in 1992, and I have another album coming... something about a "Testing Ground." Testing to Destruction, their latest CD (released last October or so). Does anyone know ANYTHING about the David Cross albums? Are there more than two? Yes, there is also Memos From Purgatory, his first. David can be found of lots of other recent releases too, like the 4 Radius CDs (Arc Measuring, Sightseeing, another one and a compilation, all available form Ear-Rational, I think), The Low Flying Aircraft CD (which also features Keith Tippett and the drummer from the Cross band, and is available from Red Hot Records, like the Cross albums are), and Jade Warrior's Distant Echoes. This one I am listening to is very good..are they all like this? I think you have the best one, although TTD excells at times. I would really LOVE to hear from anyone with info. Done. I will say what I always say when I post this info: I do not understand the apathy towards David's work on the part of Crimso fans. -- Ron Chrisley (ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk) http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/ronc/index.html Chill. Enjoy. Repeat. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 95 10:11:11 CDT From: sauer_fd at brutus dot vought dot com Hello, With respect to the band Hawkwind and fiction - Michael Moorcock has been associated with the band, and has written a great deal of science fiction and fantasy; however, he is not the author of the book in question. It was titled "The Time of the Hawklords" and was by Michael Butterworth. As I recall, it was published in the late 70's and was a lousy read. For anyone interested in Hawkwind, there are a few WWW pages - for a start, try http://www.computel.com/~whatsup/hawkwind/ Back to the subject at hand. There is an interview with Robert Fripp, and a description of his Soundscapes equipment setup, at http://www.futurenet.co.uk/music/futuremusic/January95/Fripp.html http://www.futurenet.co.uk/music/futuremusic/January95/Soundscapes.html I didn't upload the files due to copyright questions, so go take a look for yourselves. Hoping KC comes to dallas-fort worth in the fall. Thanks for the newsletter. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Subject: crimso covers exist?!? Date: Sat, 22 Jul 1995 11:59:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Albin Michael Rose" Crimso covers exist?!? Great scott, I've yet to hear of a band attempting anything like this. Aside of course from the list I just read in #209. I can think of some cool selections, though--imagine Tom Waits doing "Cat Food," John Zorn calming down long enough to cover "Indiscipline," or--/here's/ one that ought to scare you all--imagine Soundgarden, freakin' SOUNDGARDEN, doing "Ladies of the Road." The song itself by KC always verges too close to the real (i.e. real sexist) thing, only Fripp's utterly un-raunchy distorto breaks and that fantastically filthy sax solo save it for me. (I always crack up during the sax solo. It's like a libidinous six-foot cottonmouth tongue, I don't know how else to describe it.) Imagine a band like Soundgarden covering it--would it be an homage to what was actually a parody, an homage to the real thing, a parody or what was actually a parody, or what? I'd love to hear a saxophone quartet or a string quartet doing a very straight cover of "Discipline." Imagine Kronos Quartet doing ToaPP. Ultimately, any band covering Crimso would have to fight reeeealy hard to not sound like a lame Crimso cover band. Imagine anyone performing something from the album Starless and Bible Black, and having it /not/ sound like Crimso. Oh--and the closest Primus ever got to covering Crimso is Claypool noodling around with "Sartori in Tangier" backstage, which appears on their Cheesy Home Video (which is itself quite fun). That and the general influence heard elsewhere, i.e. the bass of "Jerry Was A Race Car Driver"/ "Elephant Talk", or the crimsoid licks on the Punchbowl album. We can't hold that against them, though--other people need to work this vein. It's too cool a set of ideas to let be monopolized by one band, and so few others do it differently enough. One last PS--who'd ever thought that a band begun in '69 would have audience members who might yell "Mr. Bruford is IN THE HOUSE!"? Cheers, Albin [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: r dot derousse2 at genie dot geis dot com Date: Sat, 22 Jul 95 07:30:00 UTC Subject: New Percussion G.O.A. & Covers In ET #209, Craig Branham wrote: >Speaking of Bill Bruford albums, Bruford cut an album with a classical >percussion ensemble (from Amsterdam) called, I think, "Go Between," which I Yes. Great album! The band's name is The New Percussion Group of Amsterdam, and Bruford plays on one track. Here are his comments about it, taken from his book, "When In Doubt, Roll!": "Fracture actually is a live recording. The group was always short of studio material, and partly to fulfill recording commitments, we became adept at hiring mobile trucks and recording live, omitting the applause, and passing these tracks off as studio work. This particular track was recorded at the famous Concertgebouw in Amsterdam, home of the Amsterdam Symphony Orchestra. We all know the Dutch to be liberal in their attitude to the arts, and there was therefore nothing incongruous about two percussionists from the orchestra, unbeknown to me, attending our midnight concert. Neils LeLarge and Jan Pustjens, observing the young wild man on stage brutally punishing a large rectangular playing area of thundersheets, gons, Roto- Toms, ratchets, woodblocks, etc., detected a distinct affinity with the twentieth-century percussions music their classical percussions group was beginning to tackle, and made a mental note that, should they ever need a tour of life on the rock side of the fence, here was the ideal guide. Twelve years were to pass before they contacted me to work with their New Percussion Group of Amsterdam playing original works. The concert was held at the same concert hall on February 25, 1985." >Does anyone know what happened to this recording and/or if there is even a >remote chance of acquiring it? I don't know if it's still in print or not, but I got a CD copy of it from Wayside Music last December for about $8.50! Here is their address: Wayside Music P.O. Box 8427 Silver Spring, MD 20907 Good luck! Terry Kroetsch wrote: >Another thread to follow - ,I am making the ultimate KC cover tape. Can >anyone help? I have the obvious ones...I would be willing to copy this for >interested parties if I can get a full tape. >So far: April Wine - 21st C First of all, which April Wine recording has 21rst Century Schizoid Man on it? Secondly, here are some other covers that I'm aware of: BOOK OF SATURDAY Asia Live Mockba: 09-X1-90 Bi Kyo Ran Live Vol. 4 EPITAPH Hector Liisa Pien GREAT DECEIVER, THE Bi Kyo Ran Live Vol. 4 HEARTBEAT Belew, Adrian Young Lions I TALK TO THE WIND Camper Van Chadborne Camper Van Chadborne Opus III Mind Fruit IN THE COURT OF THE CRIMSON KING M. Walking On The Water Pictures of an Exhibitionist Mike Quatro Jam Band Paintings IN THE WAKE OF KING FRIPP Heldon II: Allez-Teia [OK, this really doesn't count, but I think that many Crimso fans would be interested in Heldon and Richard Pinhas] RED Wood Against the Grain STARLESS Asia Live Mockba: 09-X1-90 Bi Kyo Ran Live Vol. 4 --Roy [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: john dot brown at cyberlnk dot com Organization: CyberLink Date: Sat, 22 Jul 95 02:14:43 -0400 Subject: backwards frippertronics Has anyone ever listened to Frippertronics played backwards? It is easy to rig a cassette tape to play backwards and some of the LET THE POWER FALL tracks have a wonderfully orchestral quality when played in reverse reply to JOHN>BROWN at CYBERLNK dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 95 01:28:55 EDT From: "michael D. Jeter" Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Hello, everyone....as soon as I posted, I realized how contradictory my stateme nts were...to whit: I am glad we don't flame, and then I go and flame Wakeman and Howe,...I am sorry if I have offended anyone, and I am most sorry, if in so me way, I have brought down the level of discourse...I would like to thank Kris tiP for her wonderful story of her grand mother and rural Georgia: Thank you v ery much:-) btw, we have a mutual friend in Kath:-)...also, to the person who posted the journey, rest travel analysis, while I don't claim to understand it all, I enjoyed. Again, Thank you all, and If I have in anyway brought down the level of ET...I am sorry. Thank You, Michael:-) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 22:23:10 -0400 (EDT) From: CRIMSO Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 Well...due to the incredible response of the posting that I had about the early video stuff I had I decided to take a lookat the video and see what was on it...I came up with a list...and I apologise for some errors...I was trying to remember what I havent seen in two years!! The early show was Black Oak Arkansas...Larks Tongue II excerpts into Easy Money and then some Improv The Video is indeed Larks tongue I...I apologise for the error I also have an interview of Fripp around the time of 3oaPP after that I have this Rock Alabama German concert which appears to be a "Beat" tour Video I also have both the MTV Sleepless and Heartbeat videos...along with I advanced mask with Andy Summers and then some video footage that appeared to be live and by a camcorder...then when you have a closer look its actually them playing about 30 minutes of a soundcheck during 3oaPP tour....This was all jumbled on one 2 and a half hour VHS tape which I purchased some years ago. Some of the stuff is good quality and some of it leaves a bit to be desired. I am sorry if I excited many of you...I was just going on recollection...I will give out copies eventually when I have a chance but right now I have not access to quality VCR's...so I will post agian when I have a new stereo one and borrow another. Again I apologise. The Engineer formerly known as Tim Ritter [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 1995 16:14:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven Sullivan Subject: We grouchy Yes fans (ET #209) in ET 209 Michael Jeter bitched about how bitchy Yes fans are on the a.m.y. Usenet group, contrasting them to the courtly habituees of ET. I'd like to point out two things to Michael: 1) KC has always delivered the goods, Yes most emphatically has not. 2) The dynamics of a newsletter are quite different from those of a newsgroup. The Yes newsletter (NFTE), for example, is far more vanilla than the Usenet group. It's rather less satisfying getting into an argument via newsletters that appear once every week or two, than via a newsgroup with virtually 'instant' feedback. I posit that if there were a KC *newsgroup*, you'd see more KC-related bitching than can be found on ET. peace&luv&hellokitty- S. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 1995 21:33:05 -0400 (EDT) From: JPRICE at TrentU dot ca Subject: "Frame by Frame" and "Great Deciever" no longer available? Salutations Crimheads, I work at a CD store in Ontario, Canada. Yesterday the owner mentioned that "Frame by Frame" and "The Great Deciever" were no longer available and that the one copy of each that we have in the store would be the last ones we would be seeing. Does anyone know if these have been discontinued, perhaps only in Canada or North America? It strikes me as unlikely that the DGM box (TGD) would be deleted as a label that size may have nothing to lose by maintaining it's catalog. For a large label it often does make sense (at least to them) to discontinue "product" that does not meet certain sales levels. I can certainly see that FbF could meet this criteria. In addition, we all know that KC material DOES disappear from the market. Can anyone authoritatively confirm or deny this news? I'd like to know, if only to help me decide whether I should buy them or not as "collector's items".(I probably can't afford them right now anyway. And then how do I justify such a purchase to my SO when I already have both. It was just my first thought when the owner said this.) Anyway, I'd love to know. Thanks to all responding and esp. to Toby. My life would be less fun without this list. J. P. Hovercraft aka jprice at trentu dot ca "Also THRACK Zarathustra" [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 1995 22:17:45 -0400 From: LarksTngue at aol dot com Subject: Sacred Songs >Anyway, my query concerns a release in the early eighties of >Daryl Hall >(yes, he of Hall and Oates fame). Fripp played on it, and >possibly >produced. Anyone else heard this? Heard of it? I own it. It's actually a pretty good album. If I remember correctly (My short term memory is shot to shit, but my long term seems to be working) the most outstanding aspect of it was Daryl's vocals. RF shines at times, but he is definately a hired hand. It's been a while since I listened to it, so I could be wrong. I truly grew to respect Daryl Hall after I heard this release, though I'm not much of a fan of his other stuff. The Gabriel cover on it is NY3 (NYCNY on Daryl's LP), and it's actually a Fripp song from Exposure. If I remember correctly (again) this LP was released as part of a Trilogy that Fripp was putting out that consisted of Exposure, Sacred Songs and.........I can't remember what the other one was. It might have been PG's first solo release. Also, Daryl Hall sung on more than a couple of songs on Exposure, ie. You burn me up I'm a cigarette, North Star, I may not have had enough of me, etc.. It's an LP worth picking up if you can find it, but Exposure is actually much better, If you're looking for a combo of Fripp and Hall. -Lewis [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Jul 1995 22:55:48 -0400 From: LarksTngue at aol dot com Subject: Sacred Songs Correction After I made my last post, I put on Exposure. It was quite excellent, as I hadn't listened to it in years. When the song "I may not have had enough of me, but I've had enough of you" came on I realised that I inadvertently attributed the vocals to Daryl Hall, but it's actually Peter Hammill. So sorry -Lewis [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca (Anil Prasad) Subject: Erm... reviews anyone? Date: Sun, 23 Jul 95 3:49:11 EDT Okay, There's three new Fripp-related releases out there... new soundscapes, new crafties and the official Thrak bootleg. There's also been a deafening silence in terms of the amount of discussion these releases have generated. Howzabout some reviews folks? Or is this list primarily made up of North Americans who have yet to gain access to these releases? :-) ~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~ Anil Prasad aprasad at ccs dot carleton dot ca ~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~'`^`'~*-,._.,-*~ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Subject: About men and mice! From: rune dot johnsrud at infolink dot no (Rune Johnsrud) Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 17:11:38 +0100 Organization: InfoLink Datatjenester AS About men and mice... (or something ;-) Two things... Has anyone here heard the resemblance in the audio-soundscaping- guitarplaying realm, between our beloved guitar-God R. Fripp, and the humble (but oh-so God-like) guitar player David Torn. Personally I consider him to be "the jazz" version of Robert Fripp. This impression just got stronger when I bought David Torn's latest album; "Tripping Over God". If that's not enough, I have reason to believe that the two gentlemen have been THIS close to meeting (if they have not already). You see, David Torn is a frequent visitor in the realm of Mick Karn, Steve Jansen & Richard Barbieri, and these stellar musicians have been known to play as the backing-band (when not doing they're own thang) for a previously ET mentioned band named No-Man, with which Robert Fripp has delivered lots'n'lots of solid guitar playing. And again, if that's not enough, the "Tripping Over God" album is a totally guitar-created thing (except for some perc. & bass noises), and there are LOT's of soundscaping going on here you see. (And it's one FU..... neat album, tough, but extremely neat!) The second item on the agenda: Why does King Crimson consider Scandinavia (esp. Norway) to be made of nothing but AIR! I only begged for ONE concert within the Scandinavian borders, but the God(s) have not listened to me in any way.... Why does it have to be this way... Being a frequent ET reader, I'm almost rendered incapable of speech and movement for several days after reading all the SUPERB gig reviews posted here. It's not fair, it's not fair I tell's ya! KC might not have sold 10 million albums over here, but I KNOW for a fact that they have sold enough to hold at least ONE concert. (I'm begging here! ;) Oh... This is the LAST item (I promise!!!!): For those of you out there who understand the Norwegian language, I just have to mention a "little" project I'm partaking in on my spare time. It's called "ProgNetik", and it's the only (bi-monthly) magazine in Norway (and possibly Scandinavia) that covers progressive -and symphonic music in depth. And in our newest Issue (NR. 6), thanks to one of our readers, we have been able to get a gig-review >from the KC show at "The Royal Albert Hall" in London. For a free sample, write to my eMail address, or use the following snail-mail address (doesn't matter where you live in the whole wide world!!): ProgNetik Stalsberggata 20 N-2010 STR0MMEN NORWAY Ah... One more thing... This is my first posting to ET, and all typos are mine, Mine, MINE!!!!! Rune Johnsrud ProgNetik - "Editorial staff" | Rune A. Johnsrud | ProgNetik (editor) | | rune dot johnsrud at infolink dot no | "Home of Progressive Music" | -> ProgNetik "On The Air", 106.8, 22.30 - 24.00 TIRSDAGER! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 16:06:53 -0400 From: ritch at mail dot htp dot com (Ritch Calvin) Subject: Fripp & Fripperies Hi all: I know this thread is a bit old, but I still see it kicking around (I can't even recall who originated it!). Anyway, I 'm surprised that no one has noticed that the original poster would have Robert Fripp, the founder and fire of KC, reduced to a mere frippery! Well, it amused me, anyway. Ritch Calvin [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 19:30:02 -0400 From: LarksTngue at aol dot com Subject: Belew and Fripp on Terry Fresh's Gross Air /Oh--and a p.s. to whomever first titillated us with the "Fripp /and Belew on /Fresh Air" tidbit--was that just to generate demand? Or did /you hear a /different interview somewhere? YES!! I heard some interview with RF on NPR and an interview with AB some month's later on the same station. This was in the late 80's or early 90's and I had forgotten about it until I joined ET. I thought they were interviewed by a woman, but I might be mistaken. That's all I can remember. I know it was on NPR and I know it happened!!! I did not imagine it (at least that's what I keep telling myself). Robert Fripp Mainly talked about his philosophy, and how he taught his guitar school students how to properly lift their fingers off of the gtr strings upon the resolution of a note. That's all I remember. I hope someone out there can find these, 'cos I want a copy just to prove my sanity (ok, to prove that I'm not totally insane). -Lewis [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 16:00:20 +1300 From: james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz (James) Subject: Crimso covers Terry, Don't forget Opus III's techno cover of "I Talk to the Wind" (on their "Mind Fruit" album) James James Dignan, Department of Psychology, University of Otago. Ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk St., St. Clair, Dunedin, New Zealand pixelphone james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz / steam megaphone NZ 03-455-7807 * You talk to me as if from a distance * and I reply with impressions chosen from another time, time, time, * from another time (Brian Eno) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 08:46:05 -0500 (EST) From: "M. S. AtKisson" Subject: Sacred Songs Michael Dixon is wondering about Sacred Songs... To my scant memory, it seems that this Fripp-produced Daryl Hall album was supposed to be part of a triology that included Exposure, and the Peter Gabriel album that includes "Here Comes the Flood". For whatever coporate reasons,they were released way out of synch. I think that all the songs on Sacred Songs are Daryl Hall (and sometimes Fripp) compositions. A version of "Here Comes the Flood" is on Exposure, as well. My review? This is an interesting album. The title song is an answer to a girlfriend who wants to be immortalized in one of his songs. His answer is no--"They're all sacred songs/they're not easily won," and "I'd have to face you again and again." There are also lots of references to Hall's interest in Aleister Crowley and many other things magickal. My favorite tune, though is "Babs and Babs", which not only has an interesting Fripp break in the middle, but also holds some interesting comments on relationships. How does Sacred Songs relate to Exposure? In some ways they are both comments on Life and Work. Who knows what the artists were intending. Currently trying to convince my band to cover "Mary"... * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * M. S. (Peg) AtKisson * (matkisso at opal dot tufts dot edu) * "That is the way that it is Department of Neuroscience * because it is that way." Tufts University School of Medicine * Boston, Massachusetts * Robert Fripp [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 06:23:45 -0700 From: Michael Tanigawa Subject: Rembrandts Another KC cover: The chorus to "Epitaph" appears on ELP's "Welcome Back My Friends ...". I think this is right after "Battlefield". Mike Tanigawa Sr. Customer Support Engineer Alta Group of Cadence Design Systems [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 95 16:35:14 BST From: totos at dds dot nl (Pierre) Subject: Hi all&Re:Fracture tab Hi, everybody! This is my first ET letter, so wow! Being a 2 1/2 years old Crimhead I read ET constantly , though I'm not a wizz-kid. I get ET through my friend who's subscribed to it. We both visited The Hague show, and sure enough, for us both it was simply stunning. But we won't write anything about that, well it was a date anyway... In some issue (#206, i believe)of ET somebody asked for a tab of "fracture". One can find it at http:\\huizen.dds.nl\~piero\fracture.tab. I'm not quite sure about some pieces, so if somebody's interested and can contribute some more ideas about that, mail my fellow schizoid Kirik (totos at dds dot nl) and we'll work it out. Pierre Kourzanoff, the Netherlands, Leiden. piero at dds dot nl [But please don't think I'm a Dutchman or have something to do with France :) ] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "People are people, and they are basically bad" Zappa. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 12:20:58 -0400 From: george_wiles at emh3 dot arl dot mil (George C. IV Wiles) Subject: RE: Fripp and Daryll Hall >Date: Tue, 18 Jul 1995 14:05:30 -0400 (EDT) >From: "Michael Dixon (COAS)" >Subject: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) >Anyway, my query concerns a release in the early eighties of Daryl Hall >(yes, he of Hall and Oates fame). Fripp played on it, and possibly >produced. Anyone else heard this? If I remember correctly, this wasn't >a bad piece of work- done at around the same time that Fripp and Peter >Gabriel worked on PG's second one. There may have even been a Gabriel song >on it- I used to have the vinyl but it has been gone for years. The album is Sacred Songs, and was indicated as part of a trilogy consisting of it, Gabriel II and Exposure, back when Mr. Fripp was more generous with the liner notes. I enjoy it alot, but I was a fringe Hall & Oates fan before discovering Fripp, Eno & Gabriel in college. One standout tune is NYC, which is the same music as "...Had Enough of You" ( the Fripp/Peter Hammill song on Exposure that goes..."that is the way it is, because it is that way" etc) but with different lyrics. The song ends in a tape loop of frenzied Frippness, which on the vinyl goes all the way into the last groove, so that on a manual turntable it never ends! The same technique is used on White Shadow on Gabriel II. On my Sacred Songs, Exposure and other '79 - '80 Fripp albums there are messages scratched into the vinyl between the last groove and the label, but I can't recall them without doing research into my vinyl archive (the basement). Does anyone have a complete list? And yes, I know there is only one groove (per side) on an LP, but you know what I mean. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 10:03:51 -0800 From: delgadil at cisco dot com (Kevin Delgadillo) Subject: Re: More on Bruford... >Hello, > Firstly, I would like to thank everyone for their mails and posts >answering my question on Bruford's solo works. Yes, I also enjoyed those posts. Interesting to read different opinions of these performances. > Now for another: What is the status on the book mentioned in that >on-line chat _When In Doubt, Roll!_ ? Is this a, (auto)biography or a how >to play like me book ? Is it out of print ? Could anyone send me the >publisher and ISBN ? This book is published by Modern Drummer Publications and is a combination of drum transcriptions and Bill's personal commentary and insight on each piece, and his philosophy on musical performance/training. It's really meant for drummers since the bulk of the book consists of drum transcriptions for many of his better recorded efforts:(from memory) Heart of the Sunrise Fracture Beelzebub Fainting in Coils Flags Infradig The Drum Also Waltzes Hells Bells One of a Kind, Part II Impromptu, Too! Alaska In the Dead of Night Time to Kill Industry Frame by Frame Discipline Matte Kudasai The Sliding Floor I might have missed some... Anyway, the trancriptions are very accurate (I've found only two or three mistakes) and look pretty difficult only because every little Bruford nuance is notated (and he typically doesn't play the same measure exactly the same...) The "philosophy" sectiosn are very interesting and are worth the price of the book. There's some interesting history on the UK years as well as he describes its formation and breakup. Pretty interesting stuff. Also discusses his transition from Yes to KC. The drum transcriptions are really great for "getting into Bill's head" and really show his genius. He doesn't claim it be a "play like Bill Bruford" book; instead it's positioned more as a "this has how my playing has evolved" kind of book, and approaches it with a historical perspective. It also contains some suggested drumming exercises related to each song (most of which are extremely difficult, but great for independence). The transcriptions are fun to play along with, and are within the grasp of most intermediate drummers. Really interesting to follow the transcriptions while listening to the music. I don't have the ISBN # but it's available at most music stores in the drum section. It retails for $12.95 and is worth every penny. > Also, a few of you mentioned the Bruford/Moraz albums, are these still >around ? Out on CD ? The two recordings in question, _Music for Piano and Drums_ and _Flags_, are supposedly out of print. I got mine on CD several years ago as a special order and received them on the Caroline label, not EG. These are both good although not among my faves. I haven't seen these around recently and doubt they are still available. Kevin [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 10:29:02 -0700 From: JIMBINO/Apple at eworld dot com Subject: Re: "Go Between" I have this on casette: NEW PERCUSSION GROUP OF AMSTERDAM is the official artist of the work, with Keiko Abe and Bill Bruford as guests. Bill is on track one, foutreen minutes or so long, and he's playing acoustic traps. Unique and fun stuff, although I have no idea where to get it today. Perhaps one of the on-line music ordering houses...? BTW - regarding all the Bruford recommendations flying about recently, I HIGHLY suggest Stamping Ground-Live from BB's Earthworks band. Done live in the U.S. - it's a killer! - - JB [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 11:46:27 -0600 From: tedward at geographix dot com (geographix) Subject: KC/Bruford stuff Hey, I am not at home,and don't have all the info I need, but I will try to present my questions. On the Bruford album, "One of a kind" I think it is, there is a female singer with the oddest, off tone sort of voice on the second song. I love this, does anyone know if she (I don't know her name since, like I said, I don't have the album handy) sings anywhere else? Also, there have been a few postings about video's and When in doubt Roll (brufords book) I have When in doub Roll, it is very interesting, it is mostly sheet music for drummers, but with each song is a page or so of bruford's comments which are enlightening. I also have a bruford video, which is a drummers instructional video, but it also includes some footage from live performances by Yes, and Discipline by King Crimson, and I don't really remember what else. Someone also asked about Moraz/Bruford albums. They are (at least the one I have) published by, Surprise, e.g. The one I have, "music for piano and drums" is very intersting. Piano and drums only. Bruford says it is the closest he will probably ever come to playing jazz (I suppose he means in the classical sense). Ted Ward. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Smith, Thomas E." Subject: FW: first-run is important! Date: Mon, 24 Jul 95 15:53:00 PDT Hello fellow crimsters, To the post in #208 regarding the musical value of first-run imprints, yes, there is a difference. An article I read by an engineer/producer, it might have been someone who worked with the Allman Bros., was discussing the mastering process. That's where they take the studio master and put it onto the CDs, cassettes, etc. The interviewee remarked how much control the master maker has over the material: EQ, mix, etc. and that the artist only really follows the "studio to CD" process the first time around. Then as the catalog is sold, borrowed, stolen, etc. and reprinted, the results can be vastly different. I remember!!!!!!! Interview with Don Was in Bass Player (forget the issue, will check, and it was the Stones he worked with most recently). His upshot was to buy the album as shortly after it was released as possible, to get what the artist intended. Note the pains that Fripp himself went through with EG to come out with the "Definitive Editions" of KC catalog. Or Jimmy Page, for that matter. Mastering is a tricky, important process, and what the artist wants is not always what the public gets. Valete, Thom [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 16:39:12 -0400 From: JMYandel at aol dot com Subject: Re: #4(4) Elephant-talk digest v95 #209 I just picked up Robert Fripp : 1999 and am highly impressed. I wasn't sure at first what to expect, but I listened to it with an open mind (the kind of mindset needed to truly experience KC) and it is now one of my favorite discs. I highly recommend it! Now, for my question, which is addressed to fellow musicians. Does anyone know the exact process that Fripp uses to create Soundscapes? I know this has been discussed recently, but I would like any detailed information that anyone would have. I assume that a large portion is attributed to MIDI, which is no problem for me, since I'm a keyboardist--but I've heard he also uses some kind of tape-looping procedure. Could anyone provide me with some information on how I could do this myself? Many thanks in advance! Here's hopin' that the Crimson King returns to Chicago in the fall! 8^) --jonathan "Music is the cup that holds the wine of silence. Sound is that cup, but empty. Noise is that cup, broken." --Robert Fripp [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 24 Jul 1995 16:44:45 -0600 From: "John Ott" Subject: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) >Hello all- >I read this list fairly regularly and subscribe to the Digest version. >Anyway, my query concerns a release in the early eighties of Daryl Hall. >(yes, he of Hall and Oates fame). Fripp played on it, and possibly >produced. Anyone else heard this? Forgive me if this has been discussed >recently- I have enough trouble keeping up with the Elvis C mailing list >and can't read every post on this one. If I remember correctly, this wasn't >a bad piece of work- done at around the same time that Fripp and Peter >Gabriel worked on PG's second one. There may have even been a Gabriel song >on it- I used to have the vinyl but it has been gone for years. > Regards- > Mike I still have my copy on vinyl. It was part of what Mr. Fripp had planned as a trilogy. (Peter Gabriel II, Daryl Hall's "Sacred Songs", and His "Exposure") On the liner notes of "Exposure" he explains why the plan did not execute. Mr. Fripp produced and provided guitar and frippertronics. Mr. Hall had done a lot of the singing on "Exposure" which was mostly replaced with P. Hamill (insisted upon by Mr. Hall's record company at the time). "Sacred Songs" is not at all like the Philly soul of Hall and Oates. My copy is not for sale as I am very fond of it. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 23:32:49 -0400 From: TSSand at aol dot com Subject: Searching for a King Crimson transcription You would be the people to know, I am in search of a transcription to 21st Century Schizoid Man but the harder part to find is the saxophone. Do you know where it is possible to find a transcription including the saxophone part? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 01:19:56 EDT From: RLHM63A at prodigy dot com (MR BRIAN W SULLIVAN) Subject: Peter Hammill shows I would like to know if you or anybody know of any type of Peter Hammill happenings? I've been a long time fan of Hammill ever since my earliest King crimson albums. I consider Peter Hammill the same caliber as Gabriel and Fripp but he keeps an obvious low profile. If you have any info please reply. Thank you. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Jul 95 14:59:45 BST From: justin at VNET dot IBM dot COM Subject: Camilla's Little Secret Let me reply to Claas's review, 14-7-Elephant talk. Claas mentioned Tantalizing Eyes , which was indeed released as a single. I think it was only put out on vinyl and is definately a must for several different solos. It caught my eye (and ears) because it was plugged as "The record that can change every time you play it" and even though you are playing the same bit of the record you do not always hear the same solo. Something to do with the grooves. Including the versions on the CD (the Steps) I have counted six different ones. Has anybody else found any more? The vinyl is now really hard to get hold of, but if anyone's interested I got mine mail order from S & R Cressidia (the record label I presume) 865 Ringwood Rd, Bournemouth, Dorset, BH11 8LL, UK. Well worth a listen (IMO). Cheers Justin [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Jul 95 09:35 CDT From: trex at skypoint dot com (Ryan Sutter) Subject: Best Fripp solo In ET #209 Albin Micheal Rose wrote: "...on the topic of great RF solos (or "the best RF solo IMHO,", etc), those of you who haven't already checked out his contribution to "Baby's On Fire" off of Eno's Here Come the Warm Jets should do so sometime in the future..." All I can say is, Go! Right now! Get it! It is one of those moments that always brings a smile to my face. I second the vote for best Fripp solo and highly recommend this album to any and all. You're missing out if you're missing this. Ryan Sutter trex at skypoint dot com Nuclear Gopher Cheese Factory - http://www.skypoint.com/members/trex/ng1.html " " - John Cage [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 20:20:30 GMT From: russell Subject: REVIEW: Thrak in "San Ramon Valley Times" Hi ETers, Although I normally live in Scotland, I'm currently living in San Ramon, California for a few months. (Incidentally, I wasn't able to get tickets to the San Francisco KC concerts, and I'm now insanely jealous of the reviewers posting here who seem to have attended more than one show. Not fair!) Anyway, I found the following review in the San Ramon Valley Times, Sunday July 16 1995. I'm reproducing it verbatim, including the hilarious errors of fact and spelling. ===================================================================== Guitar fans should bow before King Crimson "Thrak" King Crimson Virgin, rock ** out of **** Maybe there was a guitar geek in your neighborhood. The kid who spent hours in his room noodling around on his ax, mendering in and out of actual songs, occasionally crossing the line into ear-bloodying white noise. King Crimson is a band a guitar geek could love. On "Thrak," the band's fifth release and first since 1987, there are even a few accessible radio-ready songs for the non-guitar geeks among us. This lineup includes founder Robert Fripp and longtime members Adrian Belew, Tony Levin and drummer Bill Buford along with newcomers Trey Gunn and Pat Mastelotto. The band's sound revolves around the dueling, noodling guitars of two masters - Fripp and Belew - over Buford and Mastelotto's hyper-propulsive rhythms. Primus fans may find a spritual ancestor in King Crimson, if Primus were more guitar- and less bass-centered. Beware: This is not an album of top-40 singles. It's full of dozens of tiny audio soundscapes (Fripp is credited on the liner notes for "guitar, soundscapes and mellotron") that either meld or bump up against each other. The band is best when it is revving together on all four cylinders on instrumentals like "VROOOM." But given the lineup, there are a surprising number of accessible songs. "Dinosaur" and "People" are catchy, the former highlighting the playfulness of Belew's voice. On other tunes, he sounds like a dreamier, less ironic David Byrne. If Byrne were a guitar geek, of course. - Joe Garofoli, staff writer ===================================================================== P.S. Here's another "is it the same Ian MacDonald?" question. Not Foreigner this time, but is he also the author of "Revolution in the Head - The Beatles' Records and the Sixties"? The sleeve-notes describe Ian MacDonald as former deputy editor of New Musical Express, and "an accomplished musician and composer." I suspect it is not the same person, but can anyone confirm? Regards, Russell Whitworth [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 20:40:44 -0400 From: TRAPDOOR1 at aol dot com Subject: Soundscapes/CGT/LGA tour update Interstellar Discs 9034 Haaf Road Fogelsville, PA USA 18051-1717 Office: (610) 285-2843 Fax: (610) 821-3539 E-Mail: Trapdoor1 at aol dot com ROBERT FRIPP: SOLO SOUNDSCAPES w/ THE CALIFORNIA GUITAR TRIO & LOS GAUCHOS ALEMANES TOUR UPDATE: Sept. 1st & 2nd: Muhlenberg College, Allentown, PA USA -CONFIRMED Ticket info: Tickets go on sale August 1st. Available thru the Muhlenberg College Center for the Arts box office. Call (610) 821-3333. Box office hours are daily 10AM thru 6PM EDT Sept. 3rd: The California Guitar Trio (only) will be performing at an outdoor festival in Rockford, Illinois, approx. 9:45PM More details as they become available. Sept. 5th: Club Bene in Morgan, New Jersey. -CONFIRMED Ticket info & sale date pending. Sept. 6th: Gaston Hall at Georgetown University 37th & O Sts. NW Washington, DC -CONFIRMED Ticket info: Available thru Ticketmaster. Watch this board for sale date. Sept. 7th: In-store performance in Manhattan, possibly J&R Musicworld. This is unconfirmed but likely. Sept. 8th & 9th: Washington Square Church, NYC, NY USA -CONFIRMED. Ticket info: Tickets go on sale August 12, 1995 at: Downtown Music Gallery 211 E. 5th Street New York, NY (212)-473-0043 e-mail - dmg at panix dot com Downtown's hours are: m-th 12pm - 10pm. sat-sun 12pm-12am Tickets may NOT be ordered over the internet. At this time tickets are not available by phone. This may change. Tickets are $22.00 each and there is a 4 ticket limit per person. Terms of sale are CASH ONLY. No checks, No credit cards. Show times are 7:00 and 9:30 with doors opening 1/2 hour before. The University of Delaware in Newark DE is on tap for Sept. 4th. This is unconfirmed. This schedule will be updated in Elephant Talk weekly, or as confirmations come in. Best, -MT [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: E#KIRKD at ccmail dot ceco dot com Date: Tue, 25 Jul 95 14:02:58 CST Subject: JSYK (just so you know) JSYK, While I was driving from Belmont station to Woodridge, south of 75th street on Monday evening July 24th 1995, just after 6pm Central Standard Time, in my 1988 Ford Escort EXP, it hit me as I passed the First Congregational Church at Maple Avenue heading south southeast, while dark storm clouds menaced overhead, that the double trio is simply the medium necessary for King Crimson to produce today's more complex music live on stage. One can only ask, "How could we not have known?" Peace, Daniel Kirkdorffer e#kirkd at ccmail dot ceco dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 26 Jul 1995 17:55:10 +0200 From: lhs at cs dot man dot ac dot uk (Lhorens Marie) Subject: Re: Fripp and Daryl Hall (Sacred Songs?) Hello everyone, ============== >I read this list fairly regularly and subscribe to the Digest version. >Anyway, my query concerns a release in the early eighties of Daryl Hall >(yes, he of Hall and Oates fame). Fripp played on it, and possibly >produced. Anyone else heard this? ... =============== That's right Fripp played on it and produced it. The title is SACRED SONGS (ref : PL 13574 on RCA catalogue - 1977). But it was more than that, in his note on Exposure, Robert Fripp wrote : "This album [Exposure] was originally conceived as the third part of an MOR trilogy with Daryl Hall's solo album "Sacred Songs" and Peter gabriel II both of which I produced and to which I contributed. With the non-release of "Sacred Songs" and the delay by dinosaurs of this album it is impossible to convey the sense which I had intended..." A bientot. Lhs [lhs at tidc dot estec dot esa dot nl] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] The views expressed in Elephant Talk are those of the individual authors only. Elephant Talk is released for the personal use of readers. No commercial use may be made of the material unless permission is granted by the author. Toby Howard, Elephant Talk editor. http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/staff-db/toby-howard.html toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]