From elephant-talk at arastar dot comSat Oct 29 15:35:28 1994 Date: Fri, 28 Oct 1994 23:57:56 +0800 From: elephant-talk at arastar dot com Reply to: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: elephant-talk at anthor dot arastar dot com Subject: Elephant-talk digest v94 #154 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 154, Friday, 28 October 1994 Today's Topics: Transcriptions ... transcriptions ... Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 Re: Old concert footage King Crimson/Fairport Convention connection Discipline LCG The Sheltering Sky Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 S. King and The Crimson King Danielle Dax Re: Tablature Re: Elephant Talk #153 Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 NPR; The Sheltering Sky damage and ffwd A guitar sounds familiar Remasters Available in the UK? VROOOM review Re: Sylvian/Fripp: Damage vroom review Re: A bit of info (Danielle Dax) Thrak / Muppets connection! Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 King Crimson: Indiscipline Re: Fripp and Tamm Re: Elephant Talk #153 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 12:06:20 -0600 (CST) From: MTKEEN at STTHOMAS dot EDU Subject: Transcriptions With all the talk about transcriptions, I thought I would bring this up again. A couple of years ago I did a complete transcription of Discipline (the song, not the album), I imagine many of you have it. If Toby wants to put a transcriptions issue sometime, or has a place to store it, I would gladly contribute. It has been revised slightly since I last put it out. I am considering doing Fracture, and if I decide to take that beast on I should have it out by New Years-ish. Work to do..... Matt mtkeen at stthomas dot edu [ I think transcriptions are best kept at the ftp sites, rather than posted to the digest, where they take up a lot of space. So, after this issue, if people wish to send transcriptions (and please do), I'll archive and announce them. Matt's transcription appears in this issue, below. -- Toby. ] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 94 12:29:52 CDT From: polaris at stat dot tamu dot edu (Bubonic Mango Shelton) Subject: ... transcriptions ... I may be able to speak for myself as well as others: I am quite interested in seeing transcriptions, but I do not know how much I could actually contribute to making them, if anything at all. I am a big fan and a mediocre guitarist, but have little or no hope of figuring any Crimso song out by ear. My point... I would like to have copies of transcriptions, therefore I rank as one of those interested. -polaris [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 Date: Fri, 21 Oct 94 13:58:33 -0400 From: "Lee S. Kilpatrick" (Mr. Breeze) > Bruford had more eyes on him than any other member. Fripp banned smoking > during the set (announced as the band walked out) and the Argentines were Was it specifically Fripp who did this? Belew also banned smoking during his tour earlier this year. > If you're ever luck enough to track down the 2LP set "The yopung person's > guide to King Crimson" it contains a booklet with the band's history from > Giles Giles and Fripp > and the early Fairport Convention connection (a great > band!) right through to the end of the first chain of Crimsons in the What's the Fairport connection? > Discipline Frequently Asked Questions > 1. Chapman Stick mailing list > Administrivia: dns at cs dot nott dot ac dot uk > There is a set of Stick WWW pages at http://web.cs.nott.ac.uk/~dns/stick/ This has changed; it currently gives you the new address when you try it. Lee [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 94 14:08:55 EDT From: Ron Peterson Subject: Re: Old concert footage >As for KC on video, I for one would love to see a video companion to "The >Great Deceiver" box set. In the Yes video history "Yesyears" there's a >short snippet of this incarnation of KC in action, whereabouts unknown. >What chance, I wonder, of someone releasing the whole of this concert on >video? I've often wondered what happened to all the concert film that's been shot over the years for a variety of bands. You occasionally see excerpts from it (the television commercials for Creedance Clearwater Revival for example) but little or none of it is available on video tape. I've been to many concerts where there were one or more cameras filming or video taping the show and have never seen a public release of any of those shows (Peter Gabriel, Yes, Laurie Anderson). I'm sure some of the old film has been destroyed due to lack of money for storage costs or improper care, but I get the feeling that there is still a lot out there somewhere (perhaps in some record executives private home theater?) Some of it may reside with the artists and just hasn't been released because they aren't satisfied with the quality (or in Fripp's case his desire to have live performance remain an intimate unique experience) as the following message seems to indicate: >With the release of Damage, RSFQ, L of CG, and along with some concert >videos from the mid 80's, RF seems to have moved away from his past >disdain of releasing concert material. Does anyone know if the crude copy >of a Japanese-produce video of a live Sylvian/Fripp concert will be >released stateside? Perhaps its an artists equivalent of a pension plan; hang on to some tapes and release them when you need some income. Does anyone have any idea what has happened to any concert films or tapes that have never been released? I know of one case myself. The Next Wave Festival at the Brooklyn Academy of Music (BAM) video taped a variety of performances by Laurie Anderson, The President, John Cage, and others. Those tapes are stored at the New York Public Library and can be viewed only with permission of BAM. I found this out from a fellow writing a thesis on Laurie Anderson which gained him access to the tapes. You can log into their online card catalog via the net and see the listing for the tapes also. And on another note, did R. Fripp ever publish that music industry expose he mentioned a year or so ago? Ron ron at vicorp dot com [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 21 Oct 94 14:15:00 EST From: "Jordan Smith" Subject: King Crimson/Fairport Convention connection I'd like to learn more about the connection mentioned by James Digan between the early editions of King Crimson and Fairport Convention. Thanks. Jordan Smith [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 13:31:19 -0600 (CST) From: MTKEEN at STTHOMAS dot EDU Subject: Discipline It will be a while before Fracture is finished, but I should have it done hopefully by New Years. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Discipline by King Crimson Transcribed by Matt Keen The easiest way to understand what is happenning in the peice is to either listen to it in headphones, or disconnect one of your speakers. Adrian Belew's part I beleive is hard left and Robert Fripp's is hard right. If you listen to each line seperately, you will get a better idea of what is going on. The opening section is in 5/8 with Adrian playing Part A and Robert playing Part B. Part A ------------------------| ------------------------| -5---2-----5---2------*-| ----------------------*-| ---3---3-0---3---3-0----| ------------------------| Part B ------------------------| ------------------------| -2-----5---2-----5----*-| ----------------------*-| ---3-0---3---3-0---3----| ------------------------| After many measures of that, Adrian drops down a half step and plays this: Part C ------------------------| ------------------------| -4---1-----4---1------*-| ----------------------*-| ---2---2-----2---2------| ---------4---------4----| On top of that, Robert starts a new theme in 4/4 played on top of Adrain's 5/8. (These are pretty much straight 16th notes) Part D --------------------------------------------------------------------| --------------------------------------------------------------------| -8-----6-----4----8---6---4-------8-----6-----4---8---6---4---4---*-| ---6-----6-6---6----6---6---6-6-6---6-----6-6---6---6---6---6-----*-| --------------------------------------------------------------------| --------------------------------------------------------------------| After all that they both return to playing Part A and B again, but after several bars, Robert drops 1 note and plays in 9/8 against Adrian's 5/8. ----------------------| ----------------------| -2-----5---2-----5--*-| --------------------*-| ---3-0---3---3-0------| ----------------------| Once the 9 against 5 cycles through, they go back to Part A and B for a brief while followed by a repetition of Part C and D. Now a completely new theme emerges. Initially Adrian and Robert are playing the same thing (Part E), but after a few measures once again Robert drops a note, Part F, and plays 14/16 against Adrian's 15/16. Part E --------------------5------------| -5---7----5---7---------7--------| ---4---6----4---6-----4---6----*-| ---------4--------4---------4--*-| ---------------------------------| ---------------------------------| Part F ---------------------5----------| -5---7-----5---7-------7--------| ---4---6-----4---6-------6----*-| ---------4---------4-------4--*-| --------------------------------| --------------------------------| Adrian begins a 10/8 phrase to which Robert plays 16th notes against. Part G (Adrain's eigth notes) -5-----3---------------| ---5-----3-5-----3-----| -----2-------5-----2-*-| ---------------2-----*-| -----------------------| -----------------------| Part H (Robert's 16ths) -5-----3------------------------------------| ---5-----3-5-----3--------------------------| -----2-------5-----2-2--------------------*-| ---------------2-------2---5---2---2------*-| -------------------------0---5---3---5-0----| --------------------------------------------| The modulate up a minor 3rd and continue in a very similar pattern. Part I (8ths) -8-----6---------------| ---8-----6-8----6------| -----5-------8----5--*-| ---------------5-----*-| -----------------------| -----------------------| Part J (16ths) -8-----6-----------------------------------| ---8-----6-8-----6-------------------------| -----5-------8-----5-5----3--------------*-| ---------------5-------5----3-5---5-3----*-| -------------------------3------5-----3----| -------------------------------------------| Adrian and Robert play Part K in unison, until once again Robert drops a note and plays 14/16 against 15/16 (Part L). Part K -------------------------------11----------------| -11----13-------11----13-------------13----------| ----10----12-------10----12-------10----12-----*-| -------------10-------------10-------------10--*-| -------------------------------------------------| -------------------------------------------------| Part L -------------------------------11-------------| -11----13-------11----13----------13----------| ----10----12-------10----12----------12-----*-| -------------10-------------10----------10--*-| ----------------------------------------------| ----------------------------------------------| The final theme comes out in Part N. Adrian plays this against Roberts completely new variation on it, Part N2.:) Eventually they again modulate up another minor 3rd, and begin Part P. Robert is playing Part P2 (11/16) against Part P (12/16). Part N -------------------------14----11------| -14-------12----14---------------------| ----13-------11----13-------13----13-*-| -------11-------------11-------------*-| ---------------------------------------| ---------------------------------------| Part N2 ----------------------14----11------| -14-------12----14------------------| ----13-------11----13----13----13-*-| -------11-------------------------*-| ------------------------------------| ------------------------------------| Part P -------------------------17----15-------| -17-------15----17----------------------| ----16-------14----16-------16-----16-*-| -------14-------------14--------------*-| ----------------------------------------| ----------------------------------------| Part P2 -----------------------17----15-------| -17-------15----17--------------------| ----16-------14----16-----16-----16-*-| -------14---------------------------*-| --------------------------------------| --------------------------------------| Once the 11 and 12 get back into sync, Robert resumes playing Part P until the final phrase. This is the recapitulation of the main theme of Discipline, it is an octave higher than part E or F and is unaccompanied by drums or Stick. Adrian and Robert play Part Q until Robert decides to drop a note for the last time (Part R). Part Q ------------------------------17----------------| -17----19------17----19-------------19----------| ----16----18------16----18-------16----18-----*-| -------------16------------16-------------16--*-| ------------------------------------------------| ------------------------------------------------| Part R ------------------------------17-------------| -17----19------17----19----------19----------| ----16----18------16----18----------18-----*-| -------------16------------16----------16--*-| ---------------------------------------------| ---------------------------------------------| Eventually the 14 against 15 cycles and they are once again in unison playing Part Q until the end of the piece. Footnotes: ---------- Keep in mind this is only ONE way of hearing the phrases. I think they actually begin with a pickup note or two, but the phrasing for all other repetitions sound this way. At least to me. :) During Part L, I believe Robert screws up. Yeah, I know it is hard to beleive, but he misses the high D and it only happens once. Conisdering the style of the peice it is very unlikely that this is SUPPOSED to be that way because it would be the ONLY thing that never repeats. Who knows? The chords that enter at Part N and P are actually the right hand part of Levin's Stick part. The notes are just movements of parallel fourths, g#&c#, f#&b, c#&f#, b&e. Then for Part P, up a minor third. As far as I can tell, that is the only section that has a predominant Right Hand Stick Part. Any questions, comments, or correction please e-mail me at : mtkeen at stthomas dot edu Enjoy! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 19:23:30 -0300 From: oso Subject: LCG Hi, I used to be the biggest KC fan when as a boy but failed to stay tuned to Fripp's efforts for quite a long while, so I am a little bit puzzled at his work with the League of Crafty Guitarist (dated '87 and called 'Live' here at Argentina) which I came across few days ago. I'd like to listen to Fripp's own perspective about this piece. If anybody has recorded any public opinions he may have uttered and is willing to quote him for me, I'd be enormously grateful. Personal comments appreciated, too. TYIA. Eduardo Grosclaude - Neuquen, Argentina [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 16:57:13 -0500 (CDT) From: watcher of the skies (John P Mohan) Subject: The Sheltering Sky Larry Roger Nittler writes: >Yesterday I was listening to National Public Radio's new program All Things >Considered, and noticed something interesting. They play little snippets >of music between news stories, of all different kinds. Yesterday, they >played a short bit of the song "Islands" and a little while later, a little >bit of "Sheltering Sky". I heard "Sheltering Sky" too on Morning Edition last spring. I never cease to be amazed by the stuff they play between stories-- I've also heard Peter Gabriel and Bela Fleck, among other things. Also, regarding "The Sheltering Sky": I know that this is a novel by Paul Bowles, but I don't know much about the book itself (I'm gonna try and read it next time I get a chance, which might not be until winter break). What is it about this book that musicians are attracted to? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 19:53:30 -0400 From: MrWarwick at aol dot com Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 RE: NPR's All things considered, with KCv2's Islands between articles. >>>Yesterday I was listening to National Public Radio's new program All Things Considered, and noticed something interesting. They play little snippets of music between news stories, of all different kinds. Yesterday, they played a short bit of the song "Islands" and a little while later, a little bit of "Sheltering Sky". <<< You can tip your hat to the person who was directing that day. I know Bob Boilen, an excellent composer in his own right, has done a great deal of directing ATC, and if he directed that day, I wouldn't be surprised if he used Islands. I knew him when I lived in DC, and he told me he liked to put interesting music as segues. At the end of the broadcast, they say who directed that day, so you know who to praise or blame.... HW [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: dan dot comfort at genie dot geis dot com Date: Sat, 22 Oct 94 00:31:00 UTC Subject: S. King and The Crimson King Stephen King's new horror novel INSOMNIA contains several references to an evil entity known as the Crimson King; at one point the hero realizes he is "in The Court of the Crimson King". King is, of course, a famous rock fan and amateur musician. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 22 Oct 94 14:50:41 PDT From: "Ken Stuart" Subject: Danielle Dax For Elephant Talk: >Date: 20 Oct 1994 17:48:29 U >From: "Shearston Simon" >Subject: A bit of info. > ><< acting in a personal capacity >> > >Gossip - Fripp also went out with the ex-girlfriend of our lead singer >(Karl Blake). Her name was Danielle Dax; another artist in her own right. Gosh, Danielle Dax and then Toyah Wilcox! One might deduce from this Grace Jones? Joan Jett? :-) :-) Once again it is shown, opposites attract! ObMusical_Content: neo-psychedelic/gothic music fans will enjoy Danielle Dax's "Inky Bloaters"... -- respect to all, Ken ken at snowcrest dot net (primary address) (if no answer, try ken dot stuart at tigerteam dot org ) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 14:24:47 +1300 From: james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz (James Dignan) Subject: Re: Tablature Thank you Peter Evans ! More tablature please!!! (The only Crimson I've played up till now has been "Peace" and "I talk to the Wind"... this'll keep me busy for a while). Anyone got music for "Book of Saturday" to share? Fallen Angel? Wake of Poseidon? James Dignan, Department of Psychology, University of Otago. Ya jivu v' 50 Norfolk St., St. Clair, Dunedin, New Zealand pixelphone james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz steam megaphone NZ 03-455-7807 * You talk to me as if from a distance * and I reply with impressions chosen from another time, time, time, * from another time (Brian Eno) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: ottari at ismennt dot is (Ottar Isberg) Subject: Re: Elephant Talk #153 Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:14:53 +0000 (GMT) Cadence & Cascade Dear team has anybody there found the chords to "Cadance and Cascade". It starts with alternating E & E 7/9 chords but than I am lost. Help ! regards Orn Orrason MDS ltd Iceland [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:22:05 -0500 (CDT) From: watcher of the skies (John P Mohan) Subject: NPR; The Sheltering Sky Larry Nittler writes: >...I was listening to National Public Radio's new program All Things >Considered, and noticed something interesting. They play little snippets >of music between news stories, of all different kinds. Yesterday, they >played a short bit of the song "Islands" and a little while later, a >little bit of "Sheltering Sky". It was pretty cool. (I assume Larry meant to say "news program" instead of "new program", since ATC has been around longer than I have.) Last spring I heard "Sheltering Sky" during Morning Edition (the morning equivalent of ATC). They've also been known to play some Peter Gabriel and Bela Fleck, among other impressive entries. Sometimes the music is loosely related to the news story that has just concluded. Interesting stuff... Also, about "Sheltering Sky"... what is it with this book? Both KC and the Police have made obvious references to it in their music... I am very curious about this novel and hope to read it as soon as I get the chance (which probably won't be until winter break!). Until then, would anyone be interested in perhaps discussing the relevance of the book's theme to the song, if their is any? Just adding some of my own inconsequential chatter... JP Mohan Grinnell College Grinnell, Iowa [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:15:36 +1000 From: keens at pitvax dot xx dot rmit dot edu dot au (Jeremy Keens) Subject: damage and ffwd i had the good fortune to receive ffwd and damage from some friends who had just been to the uk, so will add my comments to those circulating, though more general. brian ritchie's review (et153) fairly covers the damage music. tasty packaging and tasty music. it emphasises to me the larkstongue sound of the music fripp is making - underlined somewhat by the review of vrooom. we seem to be back to the heavy fripp, the dull monotonous chord-sequences (was that eno in the league of gentlemen sound grabs) we all seem to love (and some love more than the other two crimsons). the album also made me wish sylvian was in the new crimson - but again the vrooom comments suggest belew may be up to par (he was the weak link in the third crimson, my HO, shared by some others here, but refured by others, so no comments please!). a side note. the first day was produced by sylvian and bottril, damage by fripp and b. any significance? i am not sure how much ffwd has had on the list as i am still tryning to access four issues in the 140s which may have covered it. in brief it is an excellent ambient album. the fripp guitar is obvious in most tracks, in various degrees in the mix. a few tracks (particularly 10 and 12) could be from a fripp/eno collaboration. the music is better than pomme fritz, but less beaty than earlier orb. in short a good ambient and fripp album, but don't go in expecting a FRIPP album - the orb are very there. on the basis of the cover, i dont expect anyone will buy it though. it is a boring crappy dead-hippy sort of doodle i remember the artable students used to do at school. when compared to damage (or any other recent fripp related product) it sucks heaps. jeremy [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:41:25 -1100 From: james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz (James Dignan) Subject: A guitar sounds familiar G'day all... I've just been listening to some stuff by David Baerwald and the band he was once in, David and David. Somehow, his guitar sound is very reminiscent of the long sustained "buzzing" notes so beloved by our own Mr Fripp, especially on tracks like "Welcome to the Boomtown". Just thought I'd share that with you. Sorry. James Dignan, Department of Psychology, University of Otago. Ya jivu v' 50 Norfolk St., St. Clair, Dunedin, New Zealand pixelphone james dot dignan at stonebow dot otago dot ac dot nz steam megaphone NZ 03-455-7807 * You talk to me as if from a distance * and I reply with impressions chosen from another time, time, time, * from another time (Brian Eno) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Iain dot Robertson at tiuk dot ti dot com Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 09:12:20 GMT Subject: Remasters Available in the UK? ET'ers, I know that the subject of the remastered CDs has been getting a lot of coverage recently, but on Friday I discovered something suprising which has prompted me to post this. I discovered in Andy's Records a copy of Starless and Bible Black which didn't have the "Definitive Edition, Remastered by Robert Fripp and Tony Arnold 1989" legend on the back. This surprised me, as I thought all the KC CDs had been remastered. When I got home, I discovered that whilst my LTIA is remastered, my Red isn't, despite the fact that both of these were purchased within the last 18 months. All this begs the following question: Are all the KC CDs available as remasters in the UK, or did Andy's just have old stock? As all the remastering was done in '89, the latter seems unlikely, so what's the score? +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Iain Robertson _ Email: iain at tiuk dot ti dot com | | MOS Design _| '-. IMS: IAIN | | Texas Instruments Ltd \, _} Phone: (0234) 22 3109 | | Bedford, England \( TI Ph.: 474-3109 | +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 13:16:39 GMT From: Toby Howard Subject: VROOOM review From: Mike Taylor (piscine at mailhost dot tcs dot tulane dot edu) Subject: King Crimson - VROOOM Date: 23 October 1994 This review first appeared in the 'Gibralter' Progressive Music newsletter. King Crimson: VROOOM (1994; Discipline Records DR 9401 2) ========================================================= Though Gibraltar usually eschews the "big name" prog bands, leaving their discussion to their respective electronic digests, I've made an exception here. The reformation of Crimso is always eagerly, nay, zealously anticipated. The new "double trio," in particular, has met with a massive amounts of rousing speculation. Before I begin, I feel I have to register this caveat: I have a great deal of admiration for King Crimson but there are countless fans who would (and will) do more justice to this release than I am capable of. These fans are intimately more familiar with KC's ever-changing styles across their many albums. I haven't even HEARD all of Crimson's albums, though that is slowly being remedied. (Quit gaping, it's unsightly!) Still, I'll do my best to help whet your appetite as the approaching release date nears. As most of you probably know by now, the new Crimson formation consists of the _Discipline_ band (Fripp, Belew, Bruford and Levin) plus Trey Gunn on Stick (Levin is credited with Stick and basses) and Pat Mastelotto on acoustic & electronic percussion. _VROOOM_ was recorded in early May during the first rehearsals of this new formation. This six song "EP" is presented "as a calling card, rather than a love letter, to those generous enough to give it ears." This calling card heralds Crimso's return in one aggressive, triumphant and, as you would expect from King Crimson, progressive blast. A glance at my jotted notes reveals such comments as Intense...Strident... This is like having TWO _Red_ trios => double the intensity, double the pleasure...GEEZ, is this intense...Pure Assault...SHRED!! The disc opens with a 17 second unlisted track of subterannean emanations to introduce the assertive groove of the title track. "VROOOM" (7:16) is divided into two sections. The first is again divided into two alternating themes. The first theme is a blues boogie rhythm, as played by the _Discipline_ group using the heavy sonic assault of the _Red_ group. The second theme is a spacier section, with phased guitar playing picked chords, over which the bass plays a gentle but stately line. About half way through "VROOOM," the band changes direction completely, playing a very Beatlesque passage oddly like the intense ending of the Beatles' "I Am the Walrus." Crimso creates a dense wall of sound, pulsating between the speakers, making it difficult to discern all six musicians. In particular, it is very difficult to discern between Bruford and Mastelotto, if indeed both are playing. The next two tracks featuring the writings of Belew. "Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream" (4:42) uses another groove (suprisingly, many of these songs are based on familiar and fun grooves), this time featuring Belew's inimitable vocals. Belew brings his strong Beatles' influence into play, particularly in the verse. His voice has been processed to sound amazingly like John Lennon, singing in his "intense and angry" voice, ala _The White Album_, giving this tune a strident edge. This song also again highlights the strong role played byt the percussion throughout this album. With two percussionists, both playing electronic drum kits, a lot can happen between them, and does. It takes several listens to appreciate the full extent of percussive rhthyms on this disc. Next is the incredibly quick-paced "Cage," (1:35), a song about locking ourselves in our homes to protect ourselves from the crime that rules the streets. Belew delivers 45 lines of text in the brief time of this song, but leaves room for a quick "intensity break" from the band. The most difficult instrumental listen is "Thrak" (7:18). The band plays two, maybe three different rhythms simultaneously. Each rhythm ebbs and tides independent of the others, each slowing and speeding the pace at it's leisure. Electronic percussion hones the ragged edge of the out-of-synch polyrhthyms, creating a GREAT deal of tension. "Thrak" is seven minutes of pure, teeth-grinding assault, relentless until the very end. At this point, the band continues with "When I Stop, Continue" (5:18), a studio improvisation that runs on a little longer than Belew intended, hence the title. This improv is probably one of many sessions the guys used to feel out the new material and each other. The mind can only boggle at the possibilities that occured in those six days of May...and the impending full-length release. An excellent improv, "When I Say Stop, Continue" is the best song to separate and highlight Mastelotto's and Bruford's intertwined percussive rhythms. After the climatic build and imperfect ending, King Crimson close on a gentle note. "One Time" (4:28) is a beautiful latin shuffle in 6/8, and is the type of song I feel features Belew's voice at his best. In a wistful voice recalling "Matte Kudasi," Belew sings: One eye goes laughing one eye goes crying through the trials and trying of one life one hand is tied one step gets behind in one breath we're dying. In the space of exactly 31 minutes, King Crimson have left their calling card. I now wait patiently for their love letter. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 00:22 GMT From: ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk (Ron Chrisley) Subject: Re: Sylvian/Fripp: Damage Path: susx.ac.uk!doc.ic.ac.uk!qmw!demon!news.sprintlink.net!nwnexus!news.halcyon.com!usenet From: tntmusic at halcyon dot com (Kevin J. O'Conner) Newsgroups: alt.music.progressive Date: 22 Oct 1994 03:44:10 GMT Organization: Tinty Music Lines: 26 References: <380s9p$eus at amhux3 dot amherst dot edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blv-pm0-ip28.halcyon.com X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.1 In article , malcolm at wrs dot com (Malcolm Humes) says: > >jdliss at unix dot amherst dot edu (Jeff Liss) writes: > >>1. Damage (Sylvian/Fripp/Gunn) 4.31 (unreleased S/F) >>2. God's Monkey (S/F/G/Botrill) 6.42 (First Day) >>3. Brightness Falls (S/F/G) 6.29 (FD) >>4. Every Colour You Are(S/Karn/Jansen/Bariberi) 5.40 (Sylvian solo) >>5. Firepower (S/F/G) 7.02 (FD) >>6. Gone to Earth (S/F) 2.28 (Sylvian solo) >>7. 20th Century Dreaming (S/F/G) 8.03 (FD) >>8. Wave (Sylvian) 6.11 (Sylvian solo) >>9. Riverman (Sylvian) 5.01 (" " ) >>10. Darshan (S/F/G/B) 10.47 (FD) >>11. Blinding Light of Heaven (S/F/G) 4.15 (unrel. S/f) >>12. The First Day (S/F/G) 4.44 (" " ) > >>Doesn't specify which show, just says 12/93. > >I thought this was supposed to be from the same Japanese concert that >was sattelite broadcast and bootlegged on a double CD. Can anyone compare >the two and confrim if they are from the same show? > They are different shows. I A-B'd Damage with my tape of the Royal Albert Hall show of December 5th (i think that's the date), and at least the first half of Damage is from that show. Somebody please put this in a FAQ. -- Ron Chrisley (ronc at cogs dot susx dot ac dot uk) Web users, try: http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/ronc/index.html [Includes pages on my research, & music: my collection, wants & for sale] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 23 Oct 94 11:04:08 GMT From: Toby Howard Subject: vroom review (Forwarded from alt.music.progressive) ///////////// I GOT THE VROOM ///////////////... A friend of mine just got his hands on the new KC EP - VROOM... Fortunately I had a cassette handy and made a quick tape--all I can say is--brace yourselves!!! -- and as I've said several times before after first listens to KC albums... my ears will never be quite the same! Prog's original pioneering ensemble is offering a preview of their 4th incarnation -- their "double trio" in the six track CD... There's about 31 minutes of music. Talk about short tracks that reem new sphinctres--"Cage" wins the A.M.P. lottery, IMO. The tracks are 1. VROOM 2. Sex Sleep Eat Drink Dream 3. Cage 4. Thrak 5. When I Say Stop, Continue 6. One Time Tracks 2 3 and 6 include vocals featuring Adrian Belew--much like his latest solo effort--there's a heavy John Lennon influence at work here. Most exciting to my ears however, was the degree to which this work recalls The Great Deceiver era and in particular back to the beginning -- In The Court... All I can say is this is the most stunning 1/2 hour of progressive rock music I've heard since... "Discipline" was released in 1981. For the equivalent of a studio "boot" of the new six member version--the recording quality is phenomenal, and for me, at least immediately justifies the price. What I find most intriguing about these tracks is KC seemingly moving in a more experimental and pop direction simultaneously--much like the Lark's Tongue/Starless period. Make no mistake, this is the BIGGEST sound around! And yet it's only a warm-up to their work on a full-length studio LP at P. Gabriel's Real World studios. The title track, "VROOM" is a grandiose instrumental rocker in the tradition of "Lark's Tongue Pt. II" and "Red." The driving groove has lots of percussive charges spewing shrapnel over the top--it eventually resolves in a contrapuntal riff reminiscent of Gentle Giant and early KC, then shifts into a closing section--almost a different track--which sounds vaguely Beatle-esque over a Godzilla stomping groove. The harmonic interplay with Gunn's ethereal stick--Belew's guitar groans and effects-- and Fripp's ambience leads to pure aural hypnosis. Needless to say I loved it--for an instrumental, it seemed to encompass all the power and experience of the previous Crimsonic incarnations... "VROOM" with Pat Mastellato and BB on drums happily reminds me of that wall-of-sound percussion backdrop with the inventive madness of Jamie Muir! It's hard to tell what's going on with the rich ambience--much of it must vary between Gunn's upper register stick and Frippertronics. On "Sex/Sleep..." and "Cage" Belew opts for the rich vocal distortion treatment reminiscent of Lake on "20th Century Schizoid" -- yet the songs and grooves are clever, up to date -- and as convincingly original as anything in KC's past catalog--given the times. "Cage" is a 1.5 minute ode--with plenty of bridges and choruses (!!!)--to the compartamentalized insantity of modern life in the USA... The new KC, like the 80s KC is half American--and this cross-cultural aspect has brought a lot of humour and soul into KC's music. "Thrak" is pure, blissful ear abuse--and runs on a bit long. This is the downfall of a powerful galactic empire's primary industrial planet--it's pure thrashing scourge--something akin to what GWAR might sound like if they had Royal Academy of Music training... The polyrhythms here between BB and Mastelato are unbelievable--along with Levin's menacing bass orchestrations--definitely not Sunday morning listening. Another apparent improv--"When I Say Stop, Continue" is an intoxicating ambient venture--which eventually evolves into a turbo-groove, and really grows on you after a few listens. The short set is closed by "One Time" -- another of Belew's finest vocal efforts ever--how his talent has grown since the 80s in that regard! This has almost a reggae/calypso feel--and leaves a very sweet taste in the ears. I won't get into the detail of the lyrics--it's best left to your personal discovery. Recently there have been few musical events I've been excited about. As for the global community of progressos--KC will be the tour not to miss in '95. I was pleasantly surprised by MTV's "Un-Ledded" -- a shining example of great musicianship in a veritable creative desert--not that I was ever the world's biggest Zep fan. But as for KC--I'll gladly pay my $15 for VROOM; I figure 31 minutes of KC is worth about double of 60 minutes of REM or Smashing Pumpkins... Fripp's liner notes state this was recorded during a week of full rehearsals in May... and is intended as "a calling card rather than a love letter..." I understand the CD will be available through a West Coast distribution outfit, Possible Productions (they're taking orders via dinokiller at aol dot com -- as indicated in the Elephant Talk KC digest). I was told the release date is set for the first week in November -- and they'll be charging a full CD price ($14.99 USA). Enjoy... --Imam Freon [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 10:57:12 PDT From: charly at hal dot com (Charly Rhoades) Subject: Re: A bit of info (Danielle Dax) > From: "Shearston Simon" > Subject: A bit of info. > > << acting in a personal capacity >> > > You might be interested to know that in a previous life I was in a British > band called "Shock Headed Peters" from 1984-87(?). During that time we > recorded several times. [...] > Gossip - Fripp also went out with the ex-girlfriend of our lead singer > (Karl Blake). Here name was Danielle Dax; another artist in her own right. Trivia Addendum: Dax provided the drawings for the covers of both "Let the Power Fall" and "The League of Gentlemen" (which was, in turn, used for the cover of the CD combining portions of LoG and "Under Heavy Manners"). In LtPF one can see a portion of a letter that seems addressed to Danielle in the hand of one of the rendered figures. I agree that Dax is a superb artist, not just with her visual work. She made two *excellent* albums in the early/mid 1980s that are worth hearing: "Jesus Egg That Wept" and "Inky Bloaters." A CD exists containing most of these two releases called "Dark Adapted Eye." I also enjoy (though to a lesser extent) her musical work with Mr. Blake in the band Lemon Kittens. A bit more sparse than her own work. I have recently seen early Lemon Kittens albums released on CD now. One of these, "We Buy a Hammer for Daddy" (ca. 1980), also has what seems likely to be simple line drawing produced by Dax (or at least very much in her style). I don't particularly care for the more empty and electro-dance-oriented style of her more recent music. . . Charly Rhoades . . . . HaL Computer Systems . . * . . . . . . . charly at hal dot com :. . . . * http://www.hal.com/~charly/ . . : * . .. . [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 23:15:30 -0400 (EDT) From: CHOSSMAN at DAVIDSON dot EDU Subject: Thrak / Muppets connection! Two quick things: Isn't "Thrak," reportedly on the VROOM (how many o's? r's?) a song from the leage of Crafty Guitarists? I'm pretty sure there's a song on the washington video and on an appearence Fripp and the League played on VH-1 called Thrak. It's a very confusing mess of harsh discordant chords... If it's the same song, who authored it? Is Fripp tryingto somehow tie his work with the League into the new Crimson, for some fort of continuity? Also, please listen again to "Brightness Falls" on Sylvian & Fripp's the first day. Somewhere around 3'40 - 3'46 I swear Mr Fripp's guitar speaks the voice of Beaker! (that *really* wierd, incoherent assistant to the mad scientist on the muppet show) Is this not strange or what? C h a d O s s m a n Chad Ossman CHOSSMAN at davidson dot edu [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: pvallado at sdcc5 dot UCSD dot EDU (Paolo Valladolid) Subject: Re: Elephant-talk digest v94 #153 Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 22:38:53 -0700 (PDT) > From: "Kurt F. Colville" > Subject: Sustained Crimson > > This may have been covered in previous issues of ET, but I am interested in > finding out how Robert achieved his "infinitely sustained" guitar tone. > That is, technically, how was Robert's gear rigged so that he could play > indefinately sustained notes and chords and still play rapid (!) passages > without any change in equipment? I use an Ebow, but even that lacks in > many ways (i.e., no possibility of playing chords or fast passages). How > in the world does Robert do this, and is it practical to duplicate on an > amateur level? Any information would be much appreciated. I discovered just this afternoon how he does it. He sits next to a guitar amp with the gained turned up. Really, that's all. I was playing my newly acquired Gibson ES335STDW guitar through a Peavey Classic 50 amp (2x12 speakers). The amp volume was at a comfortable level (well below the pain threshold level) but the gain (distortion amount was turned up. I happened to be sitting about two feet away from the amp. I found that I was able to get notes to sustain as long as I wished by continuing to apply vibrato to a fretted note. Controlled feedback made this possible. Perhaps it may have been slightly easier for me to achieve controlled feedback with my brand of guitar due to it being a semihollowbody. Perhaps using a solidbody guitar will require more volume to achieve the same effect. Your ability to achieve feedback on certain notes on your guitar depends on the guitar itself as well; the materials used in its construction (type of wood(s), age of wood(s), etc.) and the manner of construction. In short, turn up the gain of your amp, sit/stand near it (being careful with regards to protecting your hearing) while applying vibrato to a held note and let the feedback sustain the note. A variation on this is to touch the headstock of your guitar to the speaker cone of your amp. One more thing: Your guitar and your strings must be ready. Just kidding, Mr. Fripp! -- Paolo Valladolid ----------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | | ----------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado at sdcc5 dot ucsd dot edu for more info \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 23:17:59 PDT From: John Relph Subject: King Crimson: Indiscipline I was listening to _Discipline_ today, and when I heard the first part of "Indiscipline" I was strongly reminded of the song "American Woman" (by the Guess Who if I remember correctly, and that's a big `if'). Does this association occur to any other E.T. readers? (That's Elephant Talk, not Entertainment Tonite, not Extra Terrestrial.) -- John [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 14:26:29 -0400 (EDT) From: terry kroetsch f Subject: Re: Fripp and Tamm I just finished Eric Tamm's Fripp tome - a fascinating read, indeed. My favourite part was the Guitar Craft diary - wow. Does anyone know if Fripp ever read this book or if Tamm got any response after the book was published. Certainly, Fripp did not approve while it was being written. Also, is there a way to contact Mr Tamm in this regards. Perhaps Faber and Faber could help? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: ottari at ismennt dot is (Ottar Isberg) Subject: Re: Elephant Talk #153 Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 15:18:21 +0000 (GMT) Even more KC on Icelandic televison: There was this uninteresting program on TV yesterday. The only thing that was interesting there was the fact that In the court of the crimson king was used a lot as a background music. Not excatly the usual type of background music. greetings from the North Orn Orrason [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] ----- ADMINISTRIVIA ----- ** POSTINGS Please send all postings to Toby Howard, at toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk. ** SUBSCRIPTIONS/ADDRESS CHANGES USA subscribers: please contact Ken Bibb at elephant-talk-request at arastar dot com. Non-USA subscribers: please contact Toby Howard, at elephant-talk-request at cs dot man dot ac dot uk. ** ARCHIVES FTP: The Elephant Talk archives are available on ftp.uwp.edu, in /pub/music/lists/elephant-talk, and recent issues on ftp.cs.man.ac.uk in /pub/toby/elephant-talk. EMAIL: The Elephant Talk archives are also available via email. To get an index send: "index discipline" "index elephant-talk" to listserv at arastar dot com and to retrieve files (in this example, the discography, discipline #63 and elephant-talk #148) send: "get discipline discog" "get discipline discipline.63" "get elephant-talk et.148" to listserv at arastar dot com (send email to kbibb at arastar dot com if you encounter problems with the email archives). ** WWW http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/toby/elephant-talk.html ** LEGALESE The views expressed in Elephant Talk are those of the individual authors only. Elephant Talk is released for the personal use of readers. No commercial use may be made of the material unless permission is granted by the author. Toby Howard http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/staff-db/toby-howard.html [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]