Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #1248 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 1248 Saturday, 23 December 2006 Today's Topics: "Indiscipline" lyrics Re: Discipline symbol Larks' tongues in Autumn Grass? Re: Discipline symbol Re: Origin of the name King Crimson Indiscipline lyrics Fripp photos and ProjeKct 2 TCOL/TPTB Gatefolds ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send *all posts* to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com ** Posts intended for the newsletter should have a subject prefix of ETPOST ** Posts intended for an individual newsletter contributor should have a subject prefix of their ET 'Ticket Number', shown at ETxxxxx in their 'From:' line in the newsletter. 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If you'd like to donate to the upkeep of ET, please press the "Donate" button at ETWeb. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:30:52 -0500 From: Don Cooper Subject: "Indiscipline" lyrics Glenn, and fellow ET'ers, I read years ago that Adrian's lyrics to "Indiscipline" are about a letter he received from his wife. Don ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 18:04:19 +0000 From: Sam Scali Subject: Re: Discipline symbol I don't know if this has been discussed before, but I have another interesting question regarding the "Discipline" symbol. The original LP and CD editions featured a noticeably different design (the looping is more dense and symmetrical) from what is used on subsequent reissues. Does anybody know why this change was made? Was the original icon no longer legally unavailable? I much prefer the initial configuration to its replacement. Thanks, Sam Scali >I see that the "mark" on the cover of Discipline is copywrighted by the >artist (and untitled?), maybe this had something to do with the difiuclty >in finding the album on CD, I don't know. Get free, personalized commercial-free online radio with MSN Radio powered by Pandora http://radio.msn.com/?icid=T002MSN03A07001 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 13:28:13 -0000 From: Gareth.Page Subject: Larks' tongues in Autumn Grass? After a period of more than 30 years I rediscovered Autumn Grass by Continuum, an anglo-hungarian effort released in 1971 The line-up consisted of Yoel Schwarcz-classical guitar, flute, harmonica, recorder, sax; Tim Rice-organ, piano; Peter Billam-bass guitar, electric guitar; Harvey Troupe-drums. And no, not the Tim Rice who wrote lyrics for some awful musicals The liner notes suggest that the album combines Elizabethan music and rock, a fair comment when you see the track listing includes Vivaldi's concerto in D major (also played by Steve Hackett with his acoustic trio). The title track takes up the entire second side. This was written by Patric Standford, the Yorkshire-born composer, and is quite avant garde for an early 70s (ostensibly) rock album, and includes a short violin section that is very reminiscent of sections of Larks' Tongues part 1 and Providence. The two vinyl copies I've bought both have a fair amount of surface noise, which does interfere with your listening pleasure on some of the quiet sections, but I strongly recommend this to any LTIA-era crimhead. Baz Page ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 11:01:14 -0600 From: Scott Ranalli Subject: Re: Discipline symbol This post is regarding Glenn A's message in the latest Elephant Talk newsletter about the meaning of the lyrics of Indiscipline. FYI, the lyrics for Indiscipline came from a telephone conversation Adrian had with his wife while he was on the road. She was referring to a painting or sculpture (I can't remember which) she had recently completed. My source for this information was a magazine interview Adrian did at the time of the album. Adrain looking at his guitar is just some showmanship on his part. Regards, Scott Scott Ranalli Project Engineer DELTA CONSULTANTS 10255 Richmond Ave, Suite 200 Houston, TX 77042 832.200.1426 (direct) 800.477.7411 (toll free) 713.376.5477 (cell) 713.981.8821 (fax) www.deltaenv.com Member of Inogen www.inogenet.com Confidentiality Notice: If you are not the intended recipient of this email, please delete it. Thank you. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 18:34:29 +0000 From: Mr Tea Subject: Re: Origin of the name King Crimson This from jdanna03 at comcast dot net in ET #1247... > Specifically, does the name refer to the psychotropic mushroom > Amanita muscaria, the fly agaric, which has long been associated with > Beelzebub? The name King Crimson was actually derived from a particularly potent 'brand' of LSD tab that was doing the rounds in the mid-to-late sixties. It was coloured with cochineal food colouring to distinguish it from 'ordinary' tabs, and was referred to as 'King Crimson' because of its effectiveness and vivid hue. Pete Sinfield was a heavy user when he first joined forces with McDonald, Lake, Giles and Fripp, and already had a bulging portfolio of far-out lyrics and poems based on the visions and hallucinations he had experienced while under the influence of the drug. One of these was, of course, 'In the Court of the Crimson King', and while the eponymous king referred to in the song may well be a reference to Beelzebub, it was the candy-coloured source of Pete's inspiration (rather than the result) that provided the newly-formed band with its name. As any Crimson historian will know, Pete was a fearlessly adventurous drug enthusiast during the years that he was involved with the band, and he also indulged in regular cocktails of heroin and cocaine. The lyrics for '21st Century Schizoid Man' were written under the influence of this brain-frying combo, and there is an obvious contrast with the luminous, fantastical imagery of his LSD-inspired lyrics for 'Epitaph', 'Moonchild' and 'Court'. It's probably fortunate that the band didn't know in advance that 'Schizoid Man' would become their signature song for all eternity, otherwise they might have called themselves 'Speedball'. Nick pp Mr Tea -- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 09:21:08 +0000 From: Tarquin Folgate-Norton Subject: Indiscipline lyrics Regarding the lyrics to Indiscipline.. they are about a letter Ade received from his wife (and this was told by Mr Belew himself). I can't remember where I read this but it all fell into place when I found this out. The knotwork on the cover was initially thought to be a traditional symbol but later found to be a specific work by Steve Ball www.steveball.com/knotwork/index.htm and therefore all the usual copywrite issues came into play. TTFN ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 21:50:08 -0600 (CST) From: ktulu19 Subject: Fripp photos and ProjeKct 2 The ProjeKct 2 CD "Live Groove" has a CD case plastered with photos of Robert playing guitar on stage. I find it somewhat amusing that they must have been taken by a flash-photographer while the CD contains a looong sound-clip at the end of '21st Century Schizoid Man' during which Robert has walked off the stage in the middle of an improvisation because an audience member took his picture. Is the audience member snapping a pic more disturbing than a professional with a powerful flash that is in closer proximity? I assume he must have had some forewarning that the band was to be photographed by someone paid to take his picture. I'm just surprised that he even agreed to that instead of opting for a CD package without band photos when he is so vehement against the interruption of the creative act. Praying for Crim Mk. IX (?) to be unveiled someday, Rick Deresz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:41:56 -0500 (EST) From: ebh4 Subject: TCOL/TPTB Gatefolds Am I the only one chomping at the bit for these to get released? I think it would add a nice touch to my current collection of KC merch and I think we should fill out a petition for interested parties in completing the gatefold editions of the KC catalog? Would anyone else be interested? Eli ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #1248 *********************************