Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #1210 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 1210 Tuesday, 7 June 2005 Today's Topics: NEWS: Adrian Belew Announces Tour 2005 NEWS: Adrian Updates his Corner Fripp on eastern Long Island , question on Robert Fripps soundscape music Emotional content? CunninLynguists King Crimson Influences Heroes Review- Live in Philadelphia, 1982 La 1919 eBay auction of possible interest to ETers ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send *all posts* to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com ** Posts intended for the newsletter should have a subject prefix of ETPOST ** Posts intended for an individual newsletter contributor should have a subject prefix of their ET 'Ticket Number', shown at ETxxxxx in their 'From:' line in the newsletter. 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The ET TEAM accepts no responsibility for the views of authors of posts. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b. If you'd like to donate to the upkeep of ET, please press the "Donate" button at ETWeb. ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 21:06:29 -0500 From: Rob Murphree Subject: NEWS: Adrian Belew Announces Tour 2005 2 0 0 5 A D R I A N B E L E W T O U R U P D A T E : M a y 3 1 , 2 0 0 5 June 16 - Columbus, OH @ Promo West June 17 - Buffalo, NY @ The Tralf June 18 - Pittsburgh, PA @ The Rex Theatre *July 1 - Naperville, IL @ Rib Fest *July 15 - Cincinnati, OH @ Bogarts July 16 - Chicago, IL @ Park West *July 17 - Cleveland, OH @ The House of Blues July 19 - Farmingdale, NY @ Downtown July 20 - New York City @ BB King's July 21 - Annapolis, MD @ Rams Head July 23 - Philadelphia, PA @ Penn's Landing Festival July 30 - Nigata Japan @ Fuji Rocks Festival September 23 - Chattanooga, TN @ Nightfall Concert Series - MORE DATES TO FOLLOW - No recording devices, please. * Date has changed since tour was first announced. For venue web links and the latest news please visit the Official Adrian Belew Web Site @ www.adrianbelew.net . To SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE from the BIG ELECTRIC ChAT/Tour Notification List, please visit http://www.adrianbelew.net/bec.html. On behalf of Adrian, thank you for your ongoing support and please travel safely! Rob Murphree Adrian Belew Webmaster www.adrianbelew.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 21:06:29 -0500 From: Rob Murphree Subject: NEWS: Adrian Updates his Corner Greetings, Adrian has posted an update to "Adrian's Corner" over at his web site. www.adrianbelew.net Topics covered: SIDE TWO release, Tour and band information, Krimson, The Bears, etc. Check it! Rob Murphree Adrian Belew Webmaster www.adrianbelew.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 12:33:07 -0700 From: Larry Rader Subject: Fripp on eastern Long Island Greetings from Amagansett, NY. Amagansett is a tiny village just east of the Hamptons and just west of Montauk. It's not known for much besides one of the most beautiful stretches of beach in North America, overpriced but delicious local fresh fish and vegetables, and an itsy bitsy nightclub called Stephen Talkhouse. Fripp's tour comes through 'the talkhouse' on Sunday, June 19. Amagansett is about 2.5 hours east of NYC. I've been to the talkhouse many times. It's a favorite spot for big stars to play, early in the evening, and then it's got local bar bands from 11 til 4 AM everynight. It holds maybe 100 people for concerts with artists who ordinarily play halls that are dozens of times bigger, or even more. They book great artists who love the intimacy of the room (and the relaxing nature of spending a day or two out here in paradise). They charge a lot to get in but it's the smallest place you'll see these types of acts play in. I'm particularly curious how the Fripp show will be. Fripp's a control freak and this place is sort of a casual honky tonk. It may be a bit lighter in intensity than usual; Fripp does speak lovingly about the calm of his walks around his home village; he may do the same here. More likely, Fripp will be Fripp, and the place will be silent and super cool. I saw John Cale there some years back and the 40 or so people who showed up got a night of high art and reverence. I imagine that tickets sell out to the big name acts pretty fast so you should book in advance. Here's their website. www.stephentalkhouse.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 15:22:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Weston Minissali Subject: Question on Robert Fripps soundscape music Dear Robert Fripp enthusiasts, I consider myself a major King Crimson fan, and I am a fan of Robert Fripp's work on Exposure and the League of Crafty Guitarists. I am going to see Fripp in New Your City and I have not listened to much of his ambient and soundscapes work. If anyone has any suggestions as to what I should pay attention to in this type of music or recommend a CD to help me appreciate it more. e-mail me at ziggyzep at yahoo dot com Thank You Weston ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 16:33:15 -0500 From: Brunkhorst Subject: Emotional content? In 1986, when I was an undergradute in college, I heard a performance of Carl Stone's electronic piece 'Shing Kee', which contains a digital sampling and manipulation of Akiko Yano's performance of Schubert's 'der Lindenbaum'. The next day, composer Larry Austin, a professor at this school (the University of North Texas), met me on the sidewalk, and asked me for my thoughts about the performance. I responded that I was glad to hear electronic music with real emotional content. He said nothing and continued on his way. It took me years to understand his non-answer. The signifier is arbitrary. Whatever meaning we assign to the word 'tree' is something agreed upon by those of us who speak English. Even then, the word 'tree', whether audible or visible, points to the idea of a tree, not necessarily to an actual tree. (For example: Shoe trees, decision trees, and family trees all use the idea of a tree, but not an actual tree. Yet we all agree on what those mean.) This idea is more slippery in music. For a note or group of notes, or rhythm, or system of harmony to point toward a specific idea requires agreement on what that idea is, and that doesn't always work in Western music. Musical 'meaning' is always subjective. It is always about the listener. (This is the explanation, by the way, of the joke in 'This is Spinal Tap' about D minor being the saddest of all keys - because a key by itself contains nothing but an agreed-upon group of notes.) There are cultural agreements. For example, when you sing 'Danny Boy' near anyone Irish or Scottish (as I often hear in Nova Scotia, for example), the response and emotion generated is predictable. But African listeners may not have the same response. When the creator/performer of the music shares enough cultural agreement with his/her audience, then the creator's sense of intended meaning might match the listener's interpretation of it. Cultural agreement could include shared items of geography, language, time, lifestyle, common knowledge or experienced events, or a great number of other things. Sometimes, particular sounds and patterns form regular 'blocks' of agreed-upon meaning, called tropes. At this point in popular music culture, guitar tones, drum sounds, and chord sequences have become tropes. When layers of signifiers stack up and point in many different directions, a richly layered texture may result. If you hear the theme from the American TV quiz show 'Jeopardy', you know that this is a device used to measure time (while the contestants are thinking of and writing their final answers - it has become a statement about the passage of time, to be used with whatever sense of sarcasm or joy the user intends. But it is still on the surface level just a particular group of notes in a particular order. (The late Frank Zappa was very skilled at the use of tropes.) When something does not adhere to cultural agreements, or use familiar patterns, it may be more difficult for listeners to connect to it quickly and simply. (This is a fancy way of saying that 'simple' people may not like 'difficult' music, but those terms are open to interpretation.) We could look at it Jungian terms, and see simple heart-beat derived rhythm as an archetype, and see the lowest degrees of Pythagorean harmony (as found in the natural overtone series) as fundamentally simple as well - and use those as yardsticks of the concept of simplicity, by which we could judge emotional impact. But that dodges the question: What is within the listener that causes certain responses to certain sounds? This question lies at the heart of music criticism, and to a degree, music theory. But the idea that 'simpler' music appeals to more people seems to have validity - the evidence around us seems to point to that idea, at least in North America. To judge KC as 'emotionally cold' or distant or anything will always be a statement about the listener. It's easier to say 'I like it' (or dislike it), and say why. The learning of one's 'why' is of value. All of the above is subjective as well. I have found it to be true for me. It may not simplify things, but I find things to be rich. Kevin Brunkhorst ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 May 2005 10:14:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Weston Minissali Subject: CunninLynguists I resently heard a song by the rap group CunninLynguists named Doin Alright. In this song they sample Book of Saturday from King Crimson's album Larks' Tongues In Apic. I thought this was very intiresting. What happens is the song starts off with the normal Book Of Saturday riff, then they fade it away and come up with a varified version of it, so it is in simple 4/4 time. The name of the group is CunninLynguists the song name is Doin Alright and the album name is Southernunderground. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 15:31:40 +0200 From: Matthias Maier Subject: King Crimson Influences Andrew Fox wrote: > Also, have Radiohead ever admitted that King Crimson or Robert Fripp are > an influence on their recorded work. Just listen to the tracks... Hi, if you listen to radiohead's live album "I might be wrong", I think you can hear Thom York singing "Here comes the flood" between the tracks "idioteque" (the song with the lyrics "ice age coming...", maybe influenced by some "Exposure" tracks...) and "Everything in its right place". Matthias Munich/Bavaria ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 May 2005 21:27:21 +0000 From: Mark Atkinson Subject: Heroes Hi I'm sure I read recently that Robert Fripp and/or Adrian Belew and/or as King Crimson, had recenty released a version of Bowie's "Heroes". I'd love an MP3 of this and to know where I might purchase an original copy from. Best wishes, etc Mark A ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 01:24:54 -0700 From: John L Adams Subject: Review- Live in Philadelphia, 1982 This is quickly becoming my favorite Crim live recording. Sid Smith seems to think that Adrian is the MVP on this one, but I'd have to give that particular honor to Fripp. That's not to say that Adrian isn't on fire here; nothing could be further from the truth. The whole band is seriously cooking. I'm really moved by the live version of The Howler. This performance of the Sheltering Sky is my favorite of the ones I've heard. This is my favorite Thela, an Elephant Talk that seems to go beyond the song, and a glorious FxF and Sartori. While I'm partial to the Mexico City '96 Neurotica, this performance is moving and cooking! Fripp really seemed to be feeling it this night. If you saw this available as a Club pick and thought you had a sufficient collection of '80s Crim, think again!! This is a must have, and is a perfect companion piece to Club 4. I can't get enough of this one! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Jun 2005 05:51:01 +0100 From: "Harvey, Mark \London Examiners\" Subject: La 1919 Thanks for the replies to my query about La 1919. The album pales quite a bit the more you listen to it, to be honest (it was good weed...). But a worthy buy for four quid (and not 34 quid, as appeared, thanks to a mysterious ly transubstantiating pound sign). Nice to here some prog from Italy, thoug h. Perhaps this is a new thread. Why is it only some countries that seem to "get" prog? And why on earth, apart from Britain, are the frontrunners (IMHO) Belgium and Japan? (I'm thinking particularly of Present, Ruins and any of the bands with Dave Kerman in them.) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2005 21:46:15 +0100 From: gakochan Subject: eBay auction of possible interest to ETers Hi, ETers might be interested in a few items on my eBay auction: * HELLO Magazine featuring Robert and Toyah at home (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6963846961) * Book Of Saturday, 90's King Crimson Fanzine #11 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6963846960) * Guitarist Magazine with Tony Levin interview: (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6963978029) * Guitar Player magazine with Adrian Belew interview: (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6963978020) Best wishes gakochan ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #1210 *********************************