Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #1089 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 1089 Tuesday, 4 February 2003 Today's Topics: GIG BIZ: Tour dates... GIG BIZ: March 8th Boston tix on sale Re : Club 21 Private lives of KC members Re: Downloading, etc. Thunderbird Suite King Crimson Chicago Of bum cds, satire,and turntables club 21etc obtuse trivia question Private Lives communism Re: CD's, Private Lives And Club 21 Re: the facts on Danielle Dax Re: BRAINTICKET LARKS' TONGUES IN ASPIC Parts I - V Hackett/Bruford Re: CD's, Private Lives And Club 21 Re: CD Durability ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent ten editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:07:16 -0500 From: "Jim Baxter" Subject: GIG BIZ: Tour dates... but this is tomorrow (to quote John Paul Jones) Just saw the link on Krimson News about some US dates for the Crimson tour. Atlanta went on sale yesterday. http://www.ticketmaster.com/artist/735446 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 11:39:31 -0500 From: "David Chabon" Subject: GIG BIZ: March 8th Boston tix on sale Haven't seen any notice of this in ET, but tix for the March 8th KC show at the Orpheum in Boston went on sale yesterday (Feb. 1st) via Ticketmaster. I copped a single ticket in the front of the orchestra (row HH)...looking forward to a great show. See you there!!! Dave Chabon dsc22 at cornell dot edu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 12:00:26 EST From: DrBaht at aol dot com Subject: Re : Club 21 >If anybody has suggestions about what Club 21 tracks might best mate with >which album tracks, I'm all ears...or eyes... "Robert's Ballad" was later developed by Adrian into Model Man. "Robert and Bill" became the intro to an early version of Larks' Tongues in Aspic III, that was jettisoned for the finished product. Parts of "San Francisco" were later used by Adrian for his track I Wonder, though I think it may have also developed into a bit of Dig Me. And obviously, "Fragmented" became Industry. There are some great organized versions of a few of these ideas on the cd Studio Rehearsals from the late fall sessions of 1983. The biggest plus is that Bruford's parts were much more appropriate for the music that was being conceived for TOAPP. The idea "San Francisco" sounds especially killer and has some extended soloing by Belew. By then, Bruford had let go of those hiccuppy kicks that went out of style with the seventies, playing it straight ahead and attempting to lay down a groove. Whenever I listen to this track, I wonder why this idea was not taking further for TOAPP. It would have fit in well on the accessible side. >the tracks are just jams, really, the disc has a fragementary, incomplete >feel to it. I agree. I was hoping for more structured sessions in the vein of the Studio Rehearsals bootleg. Though it is interesting to hear these early jams, the band seems to be in the mood to noodle...and that mood doesn't always make itself available to enjoyment and in-depth listening. -bahtology ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 17:05:44 +0000 From: "Anna Rose" Subject: Private lives of KC members Call me weird, but when I get obsessed with a band/singer I like to know all the details possible. I liked knowing all the birthdays of members of The Who, I liked being able to rattle off a complete Pink Floyd discography, I liked being able to name all the members in all Crimso's various incarnations, I liked knowing the names of all Peter Gabriel's wives/children/backing band... etc. I enjoyed having hundreds of random anecdotes on the tip of my tongue, to bring up whenever someone mentioned a related topic. It makes the musicians more real, somehow, less distant and inaccessible, as does finding newspaper/ magazine articles and websites about them. None of my contemporaries had ever heard of amy of my favuorite bands before meeting me, and so I can't really talk about them to them, so I have to know as much as possible to satisfy the obsession. Or something like that. Go ask a psychologist. The point is, it's nice to know I'm not the only one. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 12:21:14 -0500 From: "Darin Lemieux" Subject: Re: Downloading, etc. >I would disagree here. If you make a copy for your own use after purchasing >the cd is much different than downloading a cd. In the former you have paid >for the product.In the later you have not paid for the product. Jim, I think what Steve was trying to say was if you download a copy of a CD you own in order to have a backup, it's cool. As an example, I have a CD that got destroyed when someone tried to break into my car - I've downloaded and burned a copy of that one because the original is unplayable. Others I've lost - and downloaded and burned. In that case, it's no big deal, because I shelled out the cash once, and to me, that should be enough. While we're on the subject of CD's and who is buying what, are there any US university students that get visited by a company known as Campus Discs? They come to a bunch of Universities in Canada - basically, they buy used CDs from students, and sell those CDs back at $10 a shot. $20 for a double, $30 for a triple. They end up with some ineresting selections at points - I scored B'BOOM off of them - I was quite pleased with that one. Anyway, just curious. Later all, Darin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 18:17:15 +0000 From: "Marie Anderson" Subject: Thunderbird Suite Howdy, I didn't order a copy of T-bird suite from DGM and now it's sold out. Is there another source I can get it from or is there somebody willing to either sell or trade for theirs. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 14:34:52 -0600 From: "D Jacobson" Subject: King Crimson Chicago I expected advance warning. No info at king-crimson.com Tickets went on sale today for KC at Park West March 14 and 15. Any info on other dates? Please respond to ET, not directly to me. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 17:17:49 -0500 From: "philip m. quirk" Subject: Of bum cds, satire,and turntables Hello all from beautiful Brooklyn, I've been reading the two posts about the damaged CDs, and I have a suggestion if your discs skip frequently- perhaps the lens on your CD player need cleaning. A dirty lens may cause skips. I have CDs from the mid-80s that still play beautifully, and I own about 400 CDs, with maybe one or two defects in the whole collection. Sometimes the player needs a tweak(Take that either way.) David Vella's satire was a great laugh, especially considering the many nit-picking humorless types that post here. Cheers, David! I don't mean to resurrect an old thread, but I picked up the live album by a group called Tabla Beat Science that features a turntable/scratching solo on one cut and scratching rhythm on many others. The album(two discs) is excellent, featuring Bill Laswell on bass, with a drummer, tabla player,DJ/turntablist, sarangi, vocals in English & (Hindi?). Thunderbird Suite just landed in my mailbox recently and I highly recommend it to anyone who enjoyed the ProjecKts. Trey Gunn and Pat Mastelloto rock the house on this one, and anyone who may have doubted PM's drumming ability should just go silent after hearing this disc! "Nobody goes there anymore- it's too crowded" Yogi Berra ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 22:43:38 -0000 From: "robert.golland" Subject: club 21etc I too have read little about this release. I was hoping to read some perceptive and erudite comments on the subject. I m impressed. It seems to be something "new" from the 81-84 band. Maybe more jamming and playing around with ideas than improvisation but certainly worth buying. Tony's bass has never been more upfront, no vocals either. Secondly British music sure is in a bad way. Obviously too much commercially driven music through tv's Popstars etc. But even bands like Travis, Stereophonics, Coldplay etc seem a little uninspired, pretty but not challenging. Thirdly new stuff. Mats and Morgan from Sweden are worth a listen. Cheers, Robert. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 19:28:41 -0500 From: Dan Buxbaum Subject: obtuse trivia question Don't know if this is related to that trivia question being mentioned, but "Empty Frame" is also the name of a track on the Eno/Cale album 'Wrong Way Up'. Robert Fripp does not appear on this recording. -- "I want to hear the frighteningly original all the time." -- Frank Zappa ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 17:27:36 -0800 (PST) From: Wasser Dan Subject: Private Lives Sorry, folks. I have to side with Profdave. It's not like he was hounding the boys, knocking on their door, ringing them up, sending letters. All he did was ask a question for gawd's sakes. I also enjoy knowing about rock stars' private lives, home life, whatever. There have numerous books on The Beatles and plenty of other rock stars because IT'S INTERESTING. If you're not interested, fine. But don't disparage others for wanting to know. I don't understand why YOU get so offended by other people's wanting to know. A couple of years ago, when Adrian played The Birchmere in Virginia (USA), he invited questions. As a result, I had the fortunate opportunity to ask several questions of him. Dan: What did you have for breakfast today? Adrian: (paraphrasing) Dunkin' Donuts. Many more years ago, when Adrian did his "totally unplugged" tour .. he played The Barns At Wolf Trap (again, in Virginia) and, again, invited questions. Among other questions (one about RF which he gladly answered), I asked what it felt like being on stage, by himself (versus being with a band). He answered: totally naked. I find it quite refreshing when "rock stars" act like regular people. And I appreciate having the opportunity to find that out. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:28:55 EST From: GORTAY at aol dot com Subject: communism Further to previous comments on the "this is America and we ain't communists" topic:- if you're not a communist why do you keep your copy of "Red" under your bed? Rosa Luxemburg. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:46:10 EST From: Biffyshrew at aol dot com Subject: Re: CD's, Private Lives And Club 21 Mike Dickson wrote: >DGM have been kind enough to offer me a replacement so I'll get it from >them directly, but of all the bazillion CD I have bought in the last decade >or so, the only ones with pressing defects have been those from DGM. Does >anyone else share this experience? I also have a very large CD collection, and nearly all of them have been trouble-free. Yet I've experienced player compatibility problems with the first disc of _Epitaph_, disc one of _The Night Watch_, and, funnily enough, _The ConstruKction Of Light_ (which was not a DGM product). Your pal, Biffy the Elephant Shrew ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 20:47:03 -0600 From: Craig Subject: Re: the facts on Danielle Dax >the sleeve was designed by Danielle Dax who >also did the sleeve for 'Let the Power Fall'. She also created the covers for the Lemon Kittens stuff. Nice!!! > Danielle provides vocals on >the track 'Minor Man'. In addition to her musical career she appeared in a >number of films Which others???? >...including Neil Jordan's excellent 'Company of Wolves' in >which she takes her clothes off ... Will locate ASAP, ..thanks! 8^D ~C NP: Lemon Kittens-"The Big Dentist" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 21:13:40 -0600 From: Craig Subject: Re: BRAINTICKET Anna wrote: >For several months now I have been searching in vain for the music of the >band Brainticket (attracted I think by the statement in a rock >encyclopedia that said, 'Is this the obscurest band ever?'). Hardly. >However the encyclopedia >proved correct, in that no matter where I looked, I found absolutely nothing. You must have been looking in all the wrong places. >Then I went onto Kazaa and was able to download the whole of their album, >'Cottonwoodhill'. (This is an absolutely devastating album, it's great, >get your hands on it if you possibly can. You`re preaching to the choir... (There are no doubt many on ET who know it as well...) I have the LP AND CD,... (I may put the CD on eBay soon, as I no longer need it now that I have the vinyl). BTW: The cover is one of the most amazing you`ll ever see, so just having a miserable CDR burn is sad. >It should carry a Government Health >warning.) Hee hee. Well, it does have the following warning on it.......... "Only listen once a day to this record. Your brain might be destroyed." ..............and... "After listening to this record, your friends won`t know you anymore". >If I had ordered it from HMV or wherever, it would have cost probably >between #30-40 and taken 4 or 5 weeks to arrive. But from Kazaa it only >took a few hours, and cost nothing apart from your basic Internet cost. No, it`s not that rare,expensive, *or* obscure. >I can't deny that I felt a bit guilty - I mean, has anyone EVER bought a >Brainticket album in the history of the world? I strongly suggest you try their "Celestial Oceans" album. It`s even better!!! (I`m not big on "Psychonaut", but some really enjoy it). >Probably not (apart, of course, from the guy on Kazaa) - but downloading >is really great to get hold of obscure stuff, rare material, single >B-sides that didn't get onto albums, etc. If Brainticket had been >available, I would have bought it, but since it wasn't... You can contact me (off list) if you need URLs for this sorta stuff... Brainticket (mostly a Swiss band, but they had German members too) was the brainchild of Joel Vandroogenbroeck. He also did a soundtrack for an amazing documentary that the famous surrealist artist H.R. Giger did about his own work, called "Necronomicon". There are many other Brainticket albums too, ("Voyage", "Adventure").... They are fairly easy to find,.... unless you need the originals on vinyl. Happy listening, ~C ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 22:57:39 -0500 From: "MALCOLM XERXES" Subject: LARKS' TONGUES IN ASPIC Parts I - V BRYCE, I commend you on your willingness to tackle that magnum opus! Might I recommend that you make a recording of LARKS' TONGUES IN ASPIC, Pt. I - V, including both versions of Pt. IV? I have found such endeavours to be tremendously helpful, in the past. I also recommend that you visit a site dedicated to FRACTURE/FRAkCTURED, but I do not know its URL, offhand. Perhaps a GOOGLE SEARCH might help you. http://www.MALCOLMXERXES.com Batterie/Percussives/Vox >Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 15:08:46 +0000 (GMT) >From: Bryce Sutherland >Subject: Larks Tongues In Aspic (Part IV) > >Hello there, > >I'm a 16-yr-old music fan from Scotland, and have recently bought the EP >"Happy With What You Have To Be Happy With". On "happy...", as I'm sure >you're aware, there is a track called "Larks' Tongues In Aspic (Part >IV)". To me, so far, this is the ultimate progressive rock track of all >time... I just love it. Now to my question: do you know of anywhere I can >get guitar tabs for this song? I've searched everywhere, and I just can't >seem to find it. I'd appreciate any help you can. > >Regards, >Bryce Sutherland > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 02:34:44 -0600 (CST) From: Ethan Taylor Sellers Subject: Hackett/Bruford Russ Bellinger wrote: "[...] this is the first time since then [1976] that Steve [Hackett] and Bill [Bruford] have worked on a project." Not sure about the exact chronology, but Bruford played on 2 songs on Hackett's Genesis Revisited project, which may predate the Gordian Knot project (and also features Levin, Wetton, and a host of other notables). It could just be that I heard about the Genesis Revisited disc before I heard about the Gordian Knot disc... -Ethan * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Ethan Taylor Sellers etseller at midway dot uchicago dot edu - http://home.uchicago.edu/~etseller esellers at tautologic dot com - http://www.tautologic.com sellers at turtledown dot com - http://www.turtledown.com www.mp3.com/tautologic/ * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 11:03:04 +0100 From: izyrp at odn dot de Subject: Re: CD's, Private Lives And Club 21 hi this is exactly what is happening with my recent received disc 1 of "Ladies of the road"! Amazon.co.uk kindly promised to send me another copy but after your message it seems that I may get another flawed one. Or some misprinted copies seem to have found their way to United Kingdom... siggy > Talking of print flaws, does anyone else have problems with their copy of > 'Ladies Of The Road'? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 11:30:44 +0300 From: "WWN" Subject: Re: CD Durability Let's stop this discussion - there's a lot of places in WWW to learn about CDs durability! Start from: http://www.fadden.com/cdrfaq/ & http://www.cdrfaq.org/txtdiffs.zip - there's more than enough information on this subject. I think the only aspect to discuss is CDs' SOFTWARE bugs - like those in HC2, Deja VROOOM etc. Otherwise we'll soon be talking about The Red Book instead of Red ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #1089 *********************************