Errors-To: admin at elephant-talk dot com Reply-To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Sender: moderator at elephant-talk dot com Precedence: bulk From: moderator at elephant-talk dot com To: newsletter at elephant-talk dot com Subject: Elephant Talk #1082 E L E P H A N T T A L K The Internet newsletter for Robert Fripp and King Crimson enthusiasts Number 1082 Tuesday, 21 January 2003 Today's Topics: NEWS: CGT Announcement, Grammy, MP3 Full Album Downloads RF in a trio free as a bird free as a bird 2 Re: KC lyrics Re: KC lyrics pt 2 Re: that Toyah article Re: Old school vs new school Flaming Lips Re: Sylvian/Fripp-not a trio Recommendations for Live365 radio stations for sale/trade How should the "Industry" distribute music Re: Moan about Moaning Bruford and Time Re: Kazaa/Brains Get Kazaa without the spyware! Battery Farmers additions to posting about KC-relatives League of Gentlemen ------------------ A D M I N I S T R I V I A --------------------- POSTS: Please send all posts to newsletter at elephant-talk dot com To UNSUBSCRIBE, or to CHANGE ADDRESS: Send a message with a body of HELP to admin at elephant-talk dot com or use the DIY list machine at http://www.elephant-talk.com/list/ To ASK FOR HELP about your ET subscription: Send a message to: help at elephant-talk dot com ET Web: http://www.elephant-talk.com/ Read the ET FAQ before you post a question at http://www.elephant-talk.com/faq.htm Current TOUR DATES info can always be found at http://www.elephant-talk.com/gigs/tourdates.shtml You can read the most recent ten editions of ET at http://www.elephant-talk.com/newsletter.htm THE ET TEAM: Toby Howard (Moderator), Dan Kirkdorffer (Webmaster) Mike Dickson (List Admin), and a cast of thousands. The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. ET is produced using John Relph's Digest system v3.7b (relph at sgi dot com). ------------------ A I V I R T S I N I M D A --------------------- Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 22:43:33 -0700 From: Jon Lybrook Subject: NEWS: CGT Announcement, Grammy, MP3 Full Album Downloads Forwarding a recent announcement from Bert Lams of the California Guitar Trio. The CGT's new tour starts this week. Be sure to visit the CGT Website for the latest tour info at http://cgtrio.com/yamanews.htm#tour While you're there, be sure to visit *CGT Direct*, the CGT's own on-line store featuring special live Collector releases not available elsewhere, tour apparel, as well as new Downloadable CGT Albums in high-quality, variable bitrate, MP3 format, in their entirety. Another thing that sets the CGT apart: Complete music from the CDs with album artwork, all downloadable from CGT Direct at http://cgtrio.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv. Hope to see lots of ET Fans on tour and thanks for supporting the CGT. ~^*~^*~^*^~*^~*^*~^*^*^*^*~^*^*^*^~*^~*^*^*^*^~*~^*~^*~^*^*^ Dear All, Happy New Year from California Guitar Trio! After a holiday break we are looking forward to going on tour again, and are starting to work toward new music. We'll be in the Northeast in January, the West coast in March and possibly Europe in the late spring. In the fall we will tour in Texas and the Southern states. Please check out our website at http://cgtrio.com for details, as they become available. Enclosed is our tour schedule for January. Last week we heard good news from Tony Levin: the piece "Apollo" from his CD "Pieces of the Sun" has been nominated for a Grammy (best instrumental rock). This piece features the CGT! Thank you all for your support, and we hope to see you at one of our shows this coming year! Best wishes, bert ~^*~^*~^*^~*^~*^*~^*^*^*^*~^*^*^*^~*^~*^*^*^*^~*~^*~^*~^*^*^ California Guitar Trio Winter Tour Schedule as of 1/19/03 Please see the Yamanashi News page on the CGT Official Website at http://cgtrio.com/yamanews.htm#tour for the latest info. All times and dates subject to change. January 2003 Tue 21 St. Louis, MO Generations 10709 Watson Road TIX: (636) 256-8322 Showtime: 8pm Wed 22 Des Moines, IA Hoyt-Sherman Theatre 1501 Woodland TIX: 515-243-2903 Showtime: 7pm Thur 23 Chicago, IL Schuba's 3159 North Southport TIX: (773) 525-2508 Showtime: 8pm Fri 24 Grand Rapids, MI The Wealthy Theater 1130 Wealthy NE TIX: (616) 459-4788 x110 Showtime: 8pm Sat 25 Ann Arbor, MI Ann Arbor Folk Festival Michigan Theater 603 East Liberty TIX: (734) 763-8587 Showtime TBA (After 6pm) Sun 26 Drive Day Mon 27 Albany, NY Borders Books and Music 59 Wolf Road 518-482-5800 Showtime: 7pm Tue 28 Schenectady, NY Van Dyck 237 Union Street TIX: 518-381-1111 2 Shows! 7pm and 9:30pm Wed 29 Philadelphia, PA Tin Angel 20 S. Second Street TIX: (215) 928-0978 Showtime: 8pm Thur 30 Anapolis, MD Borders Books and Music 1115 Anapolis Mall 410-571-0923 Showtime: 7pm Fri 31 Manhattan, NY Borders Books and Music 550 Second Ave 212-685-3938 Showtime: 6pm February Sat 1 Bridgeport, CT Acoustic Cafe 2926 Fairfield Ave. TIX: 203-335-3655 Showtime: 9pm Sun 2 Boston, MA Middle East (upstairs) Opening: The Sweepers 472 Massachusetts Ave TIX: 617-354-8238 x223 or Ticketmaster Showtime: 8pm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:38:17 +0000 From: "dileep bagnall" Subject: RF in a trio Robert Rucker, of Course! How could I forget Red. One of the albums of the 70's. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 05:00:58 -0800 (PST) From: Hywel Davies Subject: free as a bird does Adrian play a piano on this tune (Belew prints/Broadway), or is it a sampler triggered from the guitar? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 05:02:50 -0800 (PST) From: Hywel Davies Subject: free as a bird 2 sorry, it isn't on Broadway, i meant the Broadway disc of "Vrooom Vrooom"... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 08:28:16 -0600 From: CRAIG Subject: Re: KC lyrics >interesting how much of KC lyrics in the past are so >English; and how you don't get questions from the UK about cultural >references in the more recent KC lyrics. "We" don`t? ...Perhaps because Ade`s lyrics are less obtuse? >Are we in the UK more assimilated >to USA culture, Possibly. >or do those of you in the US not come across UK stuff that >often, so it is harder to get to grips with? No, it`s because now Krimson is a 75% American band, & then it was 101% BRITISH! Cheerio! ~C NP: FFWD .....(Fripp w/ The Orb) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 08:52:53 -0600 From: CRAIG Subject: Re: KC lyrics pt 2 >Let's clarify all this. Faggots was not written by Pete Sinfield I know. I never indicated that, in fact, it was my understanding that Fripp, not Palmer-James, wrote the lyrics to "Great Deceiver"..... (I can`t recall where I had heard this...) ............... Anyone? >(it's Palmer-James' fault, er, composition...). ;) I`ve always preferred Peter Sinfield`s way w/ words, but both are/were great. ~C PS: Anyone wish to comment on that lyric to "Easy Money" (live version only)........ Something about going before the judge, "...`cause they caught me licking fudge, and they never told me once, You were a minor"? !!!!! 8^O ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:21:57 -0600 From: CRAIG Subject: Re: that Toyah article http://www.femail.co.uk/pages/standard/article.html?in_article_id=112396&in_page_id=112 >Q: >Highs and lows? >Toyah: The level of success I enjoyed in the Eighties was staggering for >me. One minute people laughed at my pink hair, the next they were all >copying me. Having recently watched "Urgh: A Music War" for the umpteenth time, I can never get over how hysterical Toyah`s stage presence was back then......... Kinda Cyndi Lauper meets Bowie (they weren`t copying you, Toyah), doing a Richard Simmons aerobic workout! What a hoot!!! ....She sure can sing, though. Wish she & hubby would reform Sunday All Over the World! ~C ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:47:25 -0600 From: "Jonathon Smith" Subject: Re: Old school vs new school Flaming Lips >Inevitably,the Flaming Lips sold out,watered down their sound >significantly,eventually completely getting rid of all the electric >>guitars and FX. Sure they sold out. I forgot that there were so many bands making The Soft Bulletin back in the mid 90s. And that's probably why so many indie bands want to make The Soft Bulletin now. I like their old stuff, but there's no way in hell you can insinuate that they sold out. I mean, who else was doing that stuff? Jonathon "God works in a mysterious way-- The Church can sleep and feed at once." --T.S. Eliot ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 11:18:01 -0500 From: Josh Emery Subject: Re: Sylvian/Fripp-not a trio Sylvian/Fripp made two tours. One in 1992 of Italy and Japan as a trio - Sylvian/Fripp/Gunn. A second tour in 1993 including the US was made with the addition of Brook on guitar and Pat on drums. Josh Emery ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 10:48:25 -0600 From: "Rex Fermier" Subject: Recommendations for Live365 radio stations Hopefully by now most of you have taken the time to listen to Krimson news radio broadcast over the internet at WWW.live365.com. This is a GREAT web based radio station that plays the music of King Crimson and its current & former members and others associated with KC. I was wondering what other stations at Live365 might be recommended by the readers of this fine newsletter? Anybody? What are you listening to right now! Rex ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:08:44 +0000 From: "Matt D" Subject: for sale/trade For sale or will trade for something i need (like Live at Berkeley) Club 8- The Vroom Sessions Club 13- Nashville Rehearsals Sylvian/Fripp- Damage David Sylvian- Gone to Earth King Crimson- Level 5 (#3644) Bill Bruford's Earthworks-Footloose in NYC DVD Let me know. Matt D www.spacestationintegration.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 11:33:06 -0600 From: "Rex Fermier" Subject: How should the "Industry" distribute music From all reports, the sales of CDs is down again. The way of doing business in the music industry has changed from the last century. It seems that people prefer to download their music off of the web for free, rather than pay $15, or so, for a CD in a store. Unfortunately, there is no such thing as a free lunch. Downloading music from file sharing web sites doesn't compensate the musicians for all their work. And, if they aren't being paid, why should they bother creating and performing the music we all love to listen to? So here's my challenge to the readers of ET and the fans of King Crimson: "How would YOU run the music industry in the 21st century?" Remember, you can't just "give it away." There are people that help that need to be paid. For example; The artists who write the music. The musicians who perform the music. The studio people who record, mix and polish the recordings. The artists who create the nice packaging with their artwork. The marketing/sales people who let you know the music is out there. The distribution people who make the recordings available to you. The accountants who keep track of the expenses. The business managers who keep everything running smoothly. So what are you going to do to get the music out? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:20:04 -0500 From: "Ryan Tassone" Subject: Re: Moan about Moaning In ET#1080, David Crossen said: "I believe that one of the great aspects of King Crimson in recent years has been the way in which the creative process of the band has been opened up to us. We had the VROOOM EP before THRAK, the ProjeKcts before TCOL and now Level 5 and the Happy EP before The Power To Believe. This is a process that many bands would be reluctant to display to the public, that is, if they have any process to speak of. Does this make us happy? Are we grateful for such insight? No instead we get a steady stream of posts complaining that the forthcoming release contains nothing new." I agree! Especially in light of things Crimson has done in the past. Several entire riffs from Exposure made their way onto KC albums released almost a decade later! The entire interlocking arpeggio vocabulary was developed in The League of Gentleman and prior. And think of THIS... The Power to Believe v. In The Wake of Poseidon -They both have several versions of a recurring theme; an a capella opening, an instrumental version near the middle, and an ending with voice and instrument together ("Peace" and "The Power to Believe"). -After the a capella opening, there's a loud tune for contrast ("Level Five" and "Pictures of a City"). -Both albums have one semi-comical tune near the middle that parodies certain rock elements ("Happy" and "Cat Food"). -They both have near the end a long instrumental based around a Bolero-like rhythm on the bass and drums, starting quietly and building in intensity ("Dangerous Curves" and "The Devil's Triangle"). Interesting parallels, no? Discuss. Ryan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 10:13:43 -0500 From: "Mike Frazer" Subject: Bruford and Time I love that Bill is not necessarily the time keeper of the group. The melodic focus of bands like KC, Yes and Frank Zappa let all the instruments be melodic parts, even the traditional rhythm instruments. Listen to the drumming of Vinnie Coliuta (sic?) on "Tinseltown Rebellion" by Zappa. Vinnie is in a complimentary time that only coincides with the rest of the band every 4, 6 or 8 bars. Bill is a fantastic proponent of this type of drumming. Rock on Bill! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:16:44 -0500 From: "brad cook" Subject: Re: Kazaa/Brains Get Kazaa without the spyware! -- >Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 17:13:38 -0600 >From: "John Spannaus" >Subject: Kazaa / Brains > >>If you dont have it, go to kazaa.com to >>download it. Its a relatively small program.I am currently downloading a >>juicy 90 meg 1974 video clip of Larks Tongue in Aspic part 1 and i must say >>the quality is superb > >Use caution when downloading this type of program.. It is filled with >Spyware and other junk that can slow down your computer and eventually >cause a lot of problems for yourself.. Actually there is a way to get Kazaa minus all the bundled crud and spyware. I DL'ed 'Kazaa Lite' from www.kazaalite.com. If you're going to get Kazaa then get this one. The original version jacked my laptop up but this one has been running just fine due to some kind citizen stripping out all the snooper programs and offering it up to you and I for free. You can also get ad-aware at that site for free. Good program to search your computer and get rid of spyware. As always, scan all dl'ed files for viruses before using. brad cook ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 22:27:33 +0000 From: "Michel Champagne" Subject: Battery Farmers Notwithstanding the accepted meaning of the term 'battery farmer' that has been presented on this list, the term also struck me as a valid pun for one engaged in the 'Vampiric' behaviour that Robert characterised some audience members of the late '73 - early '74 Crim shows, just prior to the first time KC 'ceased to exist'. Or in other words, someone who 'cultivates' something/person (in this case a musician) so that they can 'feed' on it (in this case, its 'energy.') Additionally, I believe Peter Hammill composed a song around this period called 'Energy Vampires' as well, or perhaps I'm imagining that . . . ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 12:07:01 +0100 From: "lichtafee" Subject: additions to posting about KC-relatives As I used some german and french letters in my last posting that are not used in english, some of the mentioned names had been changed (including something like "=F8") by the e-mail programme (?). For anyone interested: the complete names are Peter Broetzmann, Edgar Varese, Gyoergy Ligeti and the mentioned piece is called "Ameriques". Joerg Fischer ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:24:43 -0600 From: Albert Oller Subject: League of Gentlemen Hi all, two posts in one ET about one of my favorite periods of Fripp's music! I find both 'God Save the King' and 'Thrang Thrang Gozinbulx' to be essential. 'God Save the King' (lp) has some great funny moments with people making silly statements and noises. These are missing from the cd version. The studio versions are very precise, and I've always likened them to some of J.S. Bach's lessons. The cd version is very different from the lp version, but I don't know about the cassette. I prefer the lp version over the cd, but that may be just because I heard it first and internalized it after so many listens. 'Thrang Thrang Gozinbulx' is great. It's more swinging and ecstatic than the studio versions. There are a few really beautiful songs that aren't on the studio album; beautiful to the point of bringing tears to my eyes. My lp version of 'God Save the King' has some scratches, so it isn't a good candidate for making a copy. I would like a clean copy if anybody has that available. Also, does anybody have a clean copy of the 'Under Heavy Manners' lp? Mine suffered from too many plays before I owned a tape player-recorder. I'd be happy to work out a trade or some other compensation. One question I have about a song on TTG: Who was Johnny Brill? Regards, ago ------------------------------ End of Elephant Talk Digest #1082 *********************************