Reply-To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Discipline #105 D I S C I P L I N E The INTERNET newsletter for Robert Fripp enthusiasts Number 105, Friday, 3 September 1993 Today's Topics: More videos Re: Crimsom videos Sylvian/Fripp promo CD... More on drumming Shifting Rhythm Bases King Crimson and Fripp videos Update: Musician's 100 Greatist Guitarists Fripp & Bruford Brief Mention - Fripp/Sylvian promo compilation Thela Hun Ginjeet and Matte Kudasai Frippertronics Chapman Stick brochure Fripp in a Box The First Day (times) query for eno-philes Recorders or mello? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1993 10:00:31 -0500 (CDT) From: Larry Roger Nittler Subject: More videos I just wanted to add two more videos to the list. I was introduced to KC several years ago through the promotional video for Elephant Talk (just a live performance) that was used as the opening for a late night rock video show on Denver's PBS channel 12, about the time MTV was starting. It's really cool that this nightly show started with a close up of Tony Levin's fingers on the Stick. They also showed a video ( obviously from the same concert) for Matte Kudasai. > play 3ofaPP any more, because it seems as though Bruford "gave up" or > something for the majority of the album. The drumming on "Sleepless" for > example makes me want to cringe, despite the contributions of the other ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I seem to remember an interview with KC ~1984 in which Bruford says that the drumming on Sleepless was not what he recorded but what Fripp added with a drum machine or something. Anyone else remember this? Larry R. Nittler [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: iddkjj at iddis dot com (Kevin J. Jarnot) Subject: Re: Crimsom videos Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 11:47:03 EDT > As far as Crimson videowise... > > Bremen Beat Club 1970 - 10 mins Lark's Tongue Part II (with Jamie Muir) > Black Oak Arkansas - Easy Money (Live) - 1973 Atlantic promo film 10 min > Live on "Fridays" 1981, do Thela Hun and Elephant Talk 20 min > Heartbeat promo video 5 min > New Music Interview 1981, w/live bits 10 min > New Music Interview 1982, w/live bits 8 min > IRS Cutting Edge show 15 min > Live at the Rockpalast 1982 Germany 55 min (supposed to be excellent) > Sleepless (Extended Dance Mix version) promo vid - 8 min > The Noise, Live in Frejus France 1981 60 min > Three Of A Perfect Pair Live in Japan 1984 90 min In addition to these, I have KC playing live at Montreux (I think). The show featured several bands/performers. I believe I taped it of off "Night Flight" back in 84-85. It features them playing "Elephant Talk", "Heartbeat", and "Sleepless". Kevin --- Kevin J. Jarnot - Senior Programmer/Analyst - IDD Information Services 100 Fifth Ave, Waltham, MA 02154 (617)890-7227 / (617)890-7449 Fax GCS/MU d? -p+ c+ l m++(*)@ s !g w+ t+ r- y+ u++(-) e++(*) n-@ h(*) f? "The monkey boys are evil - Lord Whorfin is SUPREME!" [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 26 Aug 1993 11:27:28 -0500 (EST) From: "Joshua Vaughn, DePauw University" Subject: Sylvian/Fripp promo CD... I thought some of you fans out there might be interested in knowing about the promo CD for the Sylvian/Fripp album that our radio station received this summer. It's called "David Sylvian/Robert Fripp God's Monkey - Retrospective", and has three tracks from the new album and a collection of other David Sylvian stuff. Here's a track listing for thos interested: God's Monkey (edit) Jean the Birdman Brightness Falls Heartbeat (Tainai Kaiki II) - Returning to the Womb (Sylvian and Sakamoto - this a worse title than anything off of Tales from Topographic Oceans :-) Blackwater (Rain Tree Crow) Every Colour You Are (Rain Tree Crow) Orpheus Let the Happiness In Silver Moon Taking the Veil Words With the Shamen The Ink in the Well Weathered Wall Forbidden Colours (Acoustic Version) Ghosts (Japan) This was a good introduction for me, having never heard of David Sylvian until this whole Sylvian/Fripp thing. Have fun, Josh [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 11:10:08 CDT From: Joe Zitt Subject: More on drumming dalton at isidis dot colorado dot edu (lizard man) said: > I grew tired of SAOTW quickly because of the boring drumwork. And I never > play 3ofaPP any more, because it seems as though Bruford "gave up" or > something for the majority of the album. The drumming on "Sleepless" for > example makes me want to cringe, despite the contributions of the other > players. Don't get me wrong, Paul and Jerry are good drummers, but they > cannot match the sheer creativity Bill contributed to two different > incarnations of KC. If memory serves, Bruford originally played a floating, less metric part in "Sleepless", but Fripp insisted on the steady backbeat. This was one of the last straws for Bruford, and led to the breakup. On another note: what does all this Sylvian/Fripp activity mean for the new King Crimson project that was supposed to happen? In listening to the S/F album, it struck me that it sounded closer to the classic hard-edged classic Crimso (like "Easy Money" or "One More Red Nightmare") than the '80s band ever did. It seems obvious to me that Sylvian should be the voice of the new Crimson, letting Belew concentrate on guitar. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 13:23:46 MDT From: pmartz at dsd dot es dot com (Paul Martz) Subject: Shifting Rhythm Bases In Discipline #104, dalton at isidis dot colorado dot edu (lizard man) writes: > I fail to see why Robert would set his sights on anything but the loftiest > of goals. And to pick a drummer who will not challenge his rhythm in ways > he has more than ably coped with in the past looks to me like a lowering of > goals. I can't help but think we've all gotten the wrong impression here. I've never heard Fripp having any trouble playing over Bruford's rhythms, nor have I ever heard anything really "rhythmically distracting" from Bruford, at least nothing that an accomplished drummer couldn't duplicate given a few minutes' warm-up and practice. I'd be more inclined to believe Fripp's adversity to Bruford is the result of Bruford's all-to-frequent use of cymbals. -paul pmartz at dsd dot es dot com Evans & Sutherland [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 13:30:43 MDT From: pmartz at dsd dot es dot com (Paul Martz) Subject: King Crimson and Fripp videos In Discipline #104, Malcolm Humes listed several King Crimson / Fripp viseos, but failed to mention the Bill Bruford instructional video "Bruford & the Beat" which features King Crimson (Fripp, Belew, Levin, Bruford) performing "Discipline". Also segments of an interview with Fripp (and, of course, lots of dialog and drumming from Bruford). -paul pmartz at dsd dot es dot com Evans & Sutherland [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: phv at equalizer dot cray dot com (Paolo Valladolid) Subject: Update: Musician's 100 Greatist Guitarists Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 15:29:55 PDT _Musician_ magazine took an informal reader's poll on what guitarist was left off their list of the 100 Most Influential Guitarists of All Time. Guess who won...our man Robert Fripp! Steve Howe and Adrian Belew finished not too far behind Mr.Fripp in the Reader's Top Ten Greatests Guitarist Who Were Left Out of the Musician Poll. I think Derek Bailey was mentioned as well. Still no mention of the great German guitarist Hans Reichel, but the man gets so little media attention (at least in the US) that I'm not surprised (but sad nonetheless) that he (and many other wonderful musicians) continue to languish in relative obscurity. There was a short article which surmised that perhaps the Musician editorial staff was overcompensating in their attempt to not give Mr.Fripp special treatment in the Guitarists List since he had worked for them for some time. Perhaps he will find this amusing when he reads this. I address the following to Mr.Fripp, now that the realization that you will be reading _Discipline_ has begun to hit me: Thank you for deciding to bring your String Quintet Tour to San Diego. Despite the impression my comments about your show may have given, I really did enjoy your show. I was sitting at the table directly in front of you, flanked by two Fripp worshippers/lookalikes from Argentina. When planning future tours with the Fripp/Sylvian tour, King Crimson, and other touring projects which may involve yourself, please continue considering San Diego. From what you saw at the Belly Up Tavern in San Diego, you should be aware that you have many fans here. Yours truly, Paolo Valladolid [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 27 Aug 93 07:53:07 MET From: Jan Subject: Fripp & Bruford I've just received my first issue of Discipline .It is great, thanks. I have a reaction to the Bruford / Fripp controverse (sp?). First there might be another reason Bruford doesn't join a new KC. Rumour has it that Bill is to form a band with Allan Holdworth, so maybe Bill just doesn't have the time to play with KC. Apart from that, I believe Bill admitted in an interview that, as far as he was concerned, the reason to join the new YES were mainly finacial. He knew earning money with YES would allow him to continue Earthworks. And his heart was with Earthworks , not YES. Another issue mentioned was Live recordings. This reminds me of the only time I saw Fripp live. It was with KC on the Beat-tour, here in Nijmegen (Netherlands). What was so special about it was : it has been the only time I've been at a concert and the band did a real encore. After the first encore (leave stage for five minutes, do one more so song and into the dressing room) the audience kept shouting for over 15 minutes, the lights were already on. Then KC returned, they'd already changed clothes !!. Fripp who'd been wearing a costume and tie during the concert was know wearing a t-shirt and jeans. They really looked surpised with such a crowd. Adrain Belew said "We're out of tunes , so we'll play the first song again". Then they did a version of "Thela Hun Gingeet" but without the voice (on tape ??). It was really something special. Regards, Jan [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: gtaylor%vme dot heurikon dot com%heurikon dot UUCP at cs dot wisc dot edu (Gregory Taylor) Subject: Brief Mention - Fripp/Sylvian promo compilation Date: Thu, 26 Aug 93 14:53:20 CDT Just a note to those of you who are particularly idiotic collectors of Sylvian material. Virgin has released a promo-only compilation in rather sparing numbers stateside [we only got 2 at the station]. There is not any new material here, save for an "edit" of God's Monkey [no doubt the same one that'll be on the promo single as a "radio edit"]. David Sylvian/Robert Fripp: "God's Monkey - retrospective" DPRO-12805 God's Monkey/Jean the Birdman/Brightness Falls/Heartbeat (Tainai Kaiki II)/Blackwater/Every Colour You Are/Orpheus/Let the Happiness In/Silver Moon/Taking the Veil/Words With the Shaman/The Ink in the Well/Weather- ed Wall/Forbidden Colours [the orchestral version from the 1983 12"]/ Ghosts You might want to keep an eye out for it. I think your money might be better spent for the "Jean the Birdman" non-LP b-sides, but hey. Gregory [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1993 00:09:41 -0400 (EDT) From: MCGLINCJ at bcvms dot bc dot edu Subject: Thela Hun Ginjeet and Matte Kudasai Gees! I feel really stupid for asking this, but does anyone know what the chorus to Thela Hun Ginjeet is and what it means (ditto Matte Kudasai)? Would appreciate it if you did, because I've had Discipline for about 6 years now and I still haven't seen any trace of these phrases anywhere- although I think Matte Kudasai is Japanese. Anybody? Buehler? Thanks!!! :):):) "It's a dangerous place..." Joe [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 31 Aug 93 04:16:54 edt From: Sheeran_F at ODG dot ceo dot dg dot com Subject: Frippertronics 1) The best Frippertronics I have heard was I recall, in Guitar Player magazine in 1985, 86, probably not as late as 87, though. It was a piece called I recall "Easter Sunday" and recorded live, I recall, for a BBC special. Up till this second I have always thought this was TV but now I am not quite sure - I may have automatically assumed BBC was TV, but they do radio too, don't they. The loops were not very washy - had lots of short individual notes; the soloing was kind of Larks III -like, a big fat raw sound doing a pretty stranded, lonely rant. Tsumetakute, sabishii are alot more accurate if you speak Japanese. 2) I've got it into my head to see if I can introview the big guy when S/F has its two-week tour of Tokyo. Anybody have a clue as to how to set this up? Do I just hit the first show and try to get backstage? Maybe contact the venues and ask for his local management? Etc? Kind of a different subject, but has anyone considered having Discipline interview Fripp? I'm sure we are tired of seing the same 10 questions that are in all the other interviews... Maybe submit questions and have someone winnow out duplicates, give them some structure, etc.? FS [[ I suggest you contact the management office if you want to try and arrange an interview. Please mention Discipline if you do contact them. The address is: Opium Arts Ltd 17 Gosfield Street London W1P 7HE Tel: 071-631-5221 Fax: 071-255-1559 -- Toby ]] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Sun, 15 Aug 93 19:09:10 -0400 From: Walter K. Daniel Subject: Chapman Stick brochure There was a small item about the Chapman Stick in the June 1993 issue of Electronic Musician magazine. I mailed a card with a request for information and received a brochure in the mail. This brochure describes the Stick in great detail and discusses some recommended Stick tunings. Emmett Chapman even provides a few paragraphs of history about the instrument. Contact info: Stick Enterprises, Inc. 6011 Woodlake Ave Woodland Hills, CA 91367 USA 818/884-2001 818/883-0668 fax I suspect that a self-addressed stamped envelope would be greatly appreciated. [[ The Stick mailing list is at Stick-request%moliere at uunet dot uu dot net -- Toby ]] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Tue, 31 Aug 93 13:52:56 EDT From: 1LT Robert Friedman 5-3502 Subject: Fripp in a Box Good day, eh? Well, I'm getting ready to buy more effects for my guitar rack, and I was wondering if anyone out there is aware of the status of this alleged *new* "Fripp in a Box." I'd really like to see what this device does/will include before I go spending a lot of money on things that can only approximate what I'm trying to do (frippertronics and long sustained single notes). I want this new device, but if it does not exist I'll be forced to purchase the old version of the "Fripp in a Box" (the ElectroHarmonix 16 sec delay), but the sound quality is not optimal by today's standard. So, if you've knowledge of this product (who's supposedly selling it anyway?), let me know. Thanks. -Bob Friedman -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "Why do we kill people who kill people : "Mr. Neutron--easily the most to show people that killing people is : dangerous man in the world!" wrong" -Anon. : -M. Python Bob Friedman is Mr. Neutron at rfriedma at aeha1 dot apgea dot army dot mil -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 1 Sep 93 16:52:40 PDT From: "John M. Relph" Subject: The First Day (times) I finally found a used (promo) copy of _The First Day_, and I noticed something odd. The track times listed on the US CD differ from those reported by Gregory Taylor (from Virgin UK CDVX 2712). I have not yet sat down with my player to verify these times, but the question remains: Are the tracks actually different lengths between the US and UK CDs? Here are the different track timings: UK US God's Monkey 5'01 4'58 Jean The Birdman 4'10 4'09 Firepower 10'28 10'25 Brightness Falls 5'07 6'05 20th Century Dreaming 11'53 11'50 Darshan 17'19 17'17 Bringing Down The Light 8'31 8'31 Here's another question. Do track timings differ between UK cassette, LP, and CD formats? Is "Brightness Falls" really a minute longer on the US CD? I'll be verifying the track times when I get home tonight. Oh, and has anybody yet seen the second _Jean the Birdman_ single? I need discographical information (catalog, times, etc.). If you would like a copy of the latest Fripp/Crimson/etc. discography, please send e-mail. Ciao, [[ It's also in the Discipline archives, at ftp.uwp.edu -- Toby ]] -- John [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Thu, 2 Sep 93 00:19:26 -0700 From: David A. Craig Subject: query for eno-philes i have heard tell of an opal artists compilation that appeared a few years back. is the eno on it otherwise unavailable? what is it called? is it still available? was it available ioon the us only as an import? if it is now unavailbvale, would anyone like to trade for a tape of it? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: ophir at math dot tau dot ac dot il Subject: Recorders or mello? Date: Thu, 2 Sep 93 13:23:12 GMT+3:00 Me & my friend had an argument: What's playing on 'The dance of the puppets' (from In The Court... for those ignorant guys who don't know) a mellotron or real recorders? Figure that out (or ask Boby. BTW he ain't got a link to DIS eh?) Ophir "As the puppets dance , ITCOTCK" (In The Court) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] To join this mailing list or have your thoughts in the next issue, please send electronic mail to Toby Howard at the following address: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The Discipline archives are available on ftp.uwp.edu, in /pub/music/lists/discipline. The views expressed in Discipline are those of the individual authors only.