Reply-To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Sender: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Precedence: bulk From: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk To: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk Subject: Discipline #101 Discipline, Number 101 The INTERNET newsletter for Robert Fripp enthusiasts Tuesday, 20 July 1993 Today's Topics: ** From the editor ** Tony Levin in concert REVIEW:Pointer to Array of Noises: Sylvian/Fripp "The First Day" Angels in the Architecture Thoughts on #100 Stick Virtuoso Jim King Crimson Bruford/Hard Luck FAQ? Robert Fripp reading Discipline? Fripp and the Damned REVIEW: Fripp guitar workshop/concert Stick List? [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] ** From the editor ** Thanks to all of you for your kind comments about Discipline, after #100 went out last week. I'm touched. Here's to another 100 issues, at least. -- Toby [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Wed, 14 Jul 93 17:41:01 CDT From: Diane Westerfield Subject: Tony Levin in concert I saw the Peter Gabriel concert in Chicago this past weekend. I went to the show because I received a ticket as a gift, and now I'm glad I went -- Levin knocked me off my feet. I lost my mind when he started doing windmills on the Stick during "Shock the Monkey." If you have some extra cash to spare and think Peter Gabriel's OK, go see the concert. It's a great show all around, and Levin is fantastic. --Diane Westerfield [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: gtaylor at fullfeed dot fullfeed dot com (Gregory Taylor) Subject: REVIEW: Pointer to Array of Noises: Sylvian/Fripp "The First Day" Date: 13 Jul 93 15:08:36 GMT Organization: FullFeed - Usenet, E-mail, UUCP feeds (+1 608 246 2701 guest) David Sylvian and Robert Fripp "The First Day" Virgin UK CDVX 2712 God's Monkey 5:01 Jean the Birdman 4:10 Firepower 10:28 Brightness Falls 5:07 20th Century Dreaming 11:53 Darshan 17:19 Bringing Down the Light 8:31 The early spring of 1992 saw David Sylvian and Robert Fripp playing a limited number of engagements in Tokyo, accompanied only by one of Fripp's Stick playing Crafty stalwarts Trey Gunn. As the non-presence of a percussionist might suggest for these dates, the recordings from the minitour suggested a somewhat predictable batch of instrumentals anchored by Fripp's looped guitars, Sylvian's washes of keyboard, and the occasional bit of wistful vocals. What *was* a bit of a surprise was the extent to which Sylvian used the presence of Fripp/Gunn's noisier instincts to get a bit grimy now and then, opting for forms which came across almost as conversational and bluesy. The softer instrumental material was very much as you'd expect from the "Steel Cathedrals" - era F/S collaborations. While that material seemed to dominate the recordings I heard, the "Grunge Dave" stuff was unexpected and interesting to me, in part because one never associates that sort of work with Sylvian's sensibilities as a more mature artist [one can, of course, burrow back into the old Japan catalog for ample evidence of that during the days when Japan was [opine here] a second-bench bunch of roxybowy clones]. One edges around it in "Pulling Punches", flirts with it in the title track from "Gone to Earth", and so forth. But on balance, I found myself thinking that perhaps it was just as well that Fripp hadn't called upon the steady but unimaginatively unswinging stuff on the drums that he had come up with for "Sunday All Over the World." Then the rumours started up about Sylvian singing with a reformed King Crimson, Sylvian working in Minneapolis with Steve Tibbets, and so forth. "The First Day" is the result of what the buzzes were all about, and I'm absolutely delighted at the extent to which both my expectations were fulfilled and the extent to which they were modified. The occasional moment of real fun (such as opening the jewel box and deciding that the glowering Sylvian inside looked like no-one else so much as Gregg Allman with the goatee shaved off and a dye job). Augmented with Steve Tibbett's pal Marc Anderson [at least I think this is the guy from MacAlister that I knew, right?] and sometime Gabriel sideman/producer David Bottril, this disc includes some of the most serious "get down" action from either Mr. Sylvian and Mr. Fripp in some time. Jerry Marotta swings furiously all the way through, whether handling the house/funk grooves that anchor "Brightness Falls" or "Darshan" (we hear some commendable Ingrid Chavez dancefloor influence here, I think) or playing the somewhat more predictable Crimhead "meters with numerators over 8" rhythms of "Firepower" or "20th Century Dreaming". Mr. Fripp cranks up and provides us with some of the strangliest raging beast with a wahwah stuck in its throat since Heaven only knows when ("Red" perhaps?), and the Frippertronics (perhaps under the engineer's hand) are ah, tastefully applied - along with Mr. Sylvian's usual bed of atmosphere and loops that have been all over his more ambient outings of late. In this case, they function more as the noisy crosstalk of the modern world than the drenched landscapes of the lake country so favored by the poets. Sylvian, in obvious deference to the temperature of the proceedings and with a possible eye toward suggesting a break with some of his previous recent outings [indeed, one can hear some similarities in the lyrical metre and delivery with the more engaged performances on "Rain Tree Crow"], digs out the bullhorn or at least a vocal mike which will distort warmly for almost all of his performances, as well as really giving way in a much more explicit way to the music this time out (the vocals on the extended "20th Century Dreaming" really seem more like "lead breaks" than the sort of focus of our attention that one expects vocals to provide). And there's only one explicitly instrumental piece on the disc - the dense Frippertronic/keyboard takes on "Bringing Down the Light" (a sort of "Evening Star" meets "Plight and Premonition"). Gunn isn't invisible at all (indeed, his Stick work is all over the place) - but, rather, it's like the work of a world-class waiter: the food appears on your plate out of nowhere, prepared and presented nicely (the Stick playing on "God's Monkey" is *right* in the pocket, and I doubt that the slow and subtle rhythmic transitions from Crimsonoid crunching to the loping end rhythms of "20th Century Dreaming" would have worked without him. Lord, I'll bet Bruford would have loved to take a crack at *that*....). Only two of these pieces really show up in their present form at all from the earlier Tokyo tapes, so you'll have to trust me - there's some more great material floating around out there (something called "The Blinding Light of Heaven", for starters). Maybe we'll get some non-LP B-sides! I hate ratings, but recognize their use: 9.2 Hematite/Whippet-Doberman mix/dark indigo. A worthwhile and satisfying addition to the catalog of both men, I think. Considering that either one of them has an ego larger than many develop- ing nations, it'll be interesting to see how long they can work together. I hope it lasts. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: "Ferdinand Pienaar" Date: 15 Jul 93 11:52:12 GMT+200 Subject: Angels in the Architecture A couple of years ago I bought (for almost nothing) an Editions E.G. compilation tape called _Angels in the Architecture_. On it are two pieces by Fripp. The longer one is "1988". It sounds like a "frippertronics" piece, by which I mean that it sounds like it was created by repeated additions to a signal loop with a delay of a few seconds. The signal source does not sound like a guitar (which doesn't mean that it couldn't be one, of course). It is a beautiful piece of music, reminiscent of side 1 of _Evening Star_ (? the 2nd Fripp/Eno collaboration), but more unadorned. The other Fripp piece on the tape is "The Chords That Bind". This is shorter and less interesting than "1988", and certainly played on guitar. Does anyone know anything further about "1988"? Is Fripp playing guitar on this piece, or some other instrument (a synthesizer, possibly)? [[ It's Frippertronics, which is tape looping using two revoxes. -- Toby ]] Ferdinand +---------------------------------------------------------+ | Ferdinand Pienaar | | Dept. of Electrical & Electronic Engineering, | | University of Stellenbosch | | FPIENAAR at firga dot sun dot ac dot za | +---------------------------------------------------------+ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: 15 Jul 1993 13:29:58 -0500 From: MOONLIT KNIGHT Subject: Thoughts on #100 A hearty thanks to Toby Howard for everything. Somehow or another this list is always the most active and interesting, partly because it's a great time to be a Fripp/KC fan. And, Gawsh, all my little thoughts sent to the list are in Fripp's files somewhere... Here are some more: on the live recording issue. Fripp is big into editing at times in both studio and live recording (I still haven't figured out why Larks III on the box set is cut) but if you look at the Great Deceiver all that is notably absent. Bob is downright repetitious on that set, including announcements and cheering etc. Trey Gunn: Dealing with Stick players is a strange thing, because we always tend to think of Tony Levin as our Stick champion, but Gunn's greater committment to the instrument makes Tony almost seem like a hack! I mean, if you want to talk about posture, Tony is known to crouch over the thing (I'm thinking of "indisicipline" at Frejus 1982) -- but maybe the idea is to make the audience breathe in a constricted manner during an oppressive song. Still, I like this guy. I know this is my private little obsession that I bring up once in a while, but if Trey is from Texas that makes Bob our Lone Englishman in this band. Fripp/Slyvian: very encouraging, can't wait. Jeff [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: phv at equalizer dot cray dot com (Paolo Valladolid) Subject: Stick Virtuoso Jim Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 11:43:11 PDT Thanks to Mark for the Trey Gunn interview. I've been fascinated with the Stick for a while now and Trey's interview help shed a little bit more light for me. I wonder if I've already met the Jim Lampi referred to in the interview. A year and a half ago, I had the pleasure of meeting a Stick player named "Jim". My guitar instructor at the time felt the jazz bug coming on and wanted to play traditional jazz instead of the pop/fusion stuff he normally plays at gigs so he assembled a quartet with sax and drums. Completing the quartet would be his friend Jim from Los Angeles. Jim turned out to be incredible. He basically played the role of bass/second guitar, simultaneously comping with his right hand and playing swinging bass lines with his left; occasionally using his right hand to play challenging unison lines with the sax. Most impressive was his ability to play great solos with his right hand while his left hand continued to play bass without skipping a beat. Regarding Trey's comments about the tone of the Stick, Jim had a great sound, considering he was playing through borrowed amplifiers; very crisp, sort of like Stanley Jordan. When I chatted with him he said his first instrument was guitar. Being a Stick player made it very easy for him to meet his favorite acoustic guitarist. I forgot this guitarist's name, but from Jim's description it could have been Leo Kottke or Phil Keaggy; someone who excelled at the art of finger-style solo guitar. Anyway, when Jim attended this guitarist's concert, the guitarist found out about the presence of a Stick player in the audience and so arranged for Jim to meet him afterwards (the guitarist had started playing in a duo with another Stick player). I asked Jim how long had he been playing to develop the independence of the hands and he replied that he had been playing for fifteen years. I mistakenly assumed that accomplished Stick players like Jim were in demand since there were so few of them but Jim told me it was not so since most people would rather work with more "normal" instrumentalists like bass guitarsts and guitarists. My guitar teacher thought highly enough of Jim to let him perform solo during the gig. He performed (perhaps to poke a little fun at Stanley Jordan) a rendition of Monk's "Round Midnight" which blew away Jordan's recorded version in terms of feel and imagination (not to mention the wider range of the Stick's ten strings as opposed to the six strings of the guitar); and Chick Corea's "Crystal Silence", highlighted by a stirring distorted Stick improvisation. So I wonder if this was the person referred to by Trey and Mark as "the great Jim Lampi". He had brown hair and tended to play his black Stick sitting down. Paolo [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: David Bayer Subject: King Cimson Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 13:51:35 -0700 Hi, I've been enjoying Discipline. I was wondering what official and unofficial videos exist of King Crimson. I've got a japanese laserdisc of the Three of a Perfect Pair Tour. I heard there was also a video of the beat tour? Do you know much about this? Also, do you know of any good sources for tapes of the complete Amsterdam show? Some of it became Larks Tongue, I believe, and some was on the live disc from Frame by Frame. Thanks, Dave Bayer [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 00:01:48 EDT From: Greg dot Andrade at um dot cc dot umich dot edu Subject: Bruford/Hard Luck I find it very disturbing to hear about Bill Bruford and Earthworks' struggles with the music business. Bruford has always been cynical in regards to the business, but has never given up. I would think that Bruford earned a fair sum of money on the Union tour with Yes, but that probably made up for lost ground with other projects. It's a shame that artists like Bruford cannot make a decent living, when they have the true talent. That's why I do my best to educate my friends and associates about music. With a better knowledge of music fundamentals, people can develop a discerning ear and begin to appreciate the true greats. I never try to "convert" people or preach my view of music, but I have certainly succeeded in increasing the number of progressive and jazz fans, though by only a minimal amount. I would urge everyone to get the word out and make a worthy contribution toward the careers of musicians like Bruford. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 11:35:24 BST From: Toby Howard Subject: FAQ? I'd like us to have a FAQ. Would people care to send me suggestions for its contents? As a start I'll include - address for the Sylvian mailing list - address for the Stick list - RF's management address - pointer to Discipline archives - pointer to the discography Toby [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 18:56:25 -0700 From: David A. Craig Subject: Robert Fripp reading Discipline? egad! do we really want to expose ourselves like this? I suppose any offers of music trading could now end you up with a bomb in your letter-box? then again, engaging the man in dialogue could be fun. maybe we could get him to understand that *recordings* of live music also have their own profound value of experience. different from a concert, to be sure (i agree wholeheartedly with him about the relationship between music, musician, and audience), but a value that is think it is safe to say has deeply affected the lives of many people. i would be interested to hear discussion of the point raised by lizard-man, that fripp seemed unwilling to take the challenge of a shifting rhythm base. always seemed kinda wimpy, to me. (separate from the obvious personality problems between bfuford and fripp ...) [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] Subject: Fripp and the Damned Organisation: IRISA / INRIA Date: Tue, 20 Jul 93 11:45:03 +0200 From: Eric Rutten I have long wondered in how far Fripp had been involved with the Damned, and recently mailed somebody who knew about the Damend. Here is his answer. The "Fun Factory" single actually exists: it must have come out eventually, as I have it. Eric Er> On a bit unrelated note, I am interested in appearances of Robert Er> Fripp on guitar on the Damned records. I know his photograph is Er> featured on the sampler with the grey cover (double album, can't Er> remember its title) along with pictures of Lol Coxhill (who plays on Er> their 2nd LP) and others. But I never could figure out on which album Er> Fripp plays: would you know that? The double album you're thinking about is a compilation released on MCA records called "the light at the end of the tunnel". According to the official Damned bibliography, "Just after the `strawberries` summer sessions came another peculiar collaboration, this one between The Damned and King Crimson guitarist Robert Fripp who was `part of the Lol Coxhill gang` and had met the band at a TV show. He traded licks with Captain on a song called `Fun Factory` and co-produced it with the group as a potential single for Bronze which, sadly, was never released. He also joined The Damned onstage at the Hammersmith Odeon." As you can see, his involvement with The Damned was quite limited... hope that helps! ttyl stephane dot gelinas at synapse dot org ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Eric Rutten | room: 221 (Green 338) IRISA / INRIA | phone: +33 99 84 72 33 Campus de Beaulieu | fax: +33 99 38 38 32 F-35042 RENNES CEDEX - FRANCE | e-mail: rutten at irisa dot fr ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: Toby Howard Date: Tue, 20 Jul 15:56:21 1993 Subject: REVIEW: Fripp guitar workshop/concert "Does anyone have any conceptual difficulty counting up to five?" ----------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Fripp's Guitar Workshop, Saturday 19 June, 1993, College Street Centre for the Performing Arts, Nottingham, U.K. A review by Toby Howard and Ian Piumarta One of the day's first pleasures, apart from the drive from Manchester to Nottingham through the wonderful Derbyshire scenery, to the accompaniment of obscure Frank Zappa songs with Ian's spoken annotations, and driving round the same roundabout seventeen times before we found the right turnoff, was to meet a stick player who turned out to be Discipline reader Mark Butler. Mark was a little worried that he'd brought his stick to a guitar workshop, and feared some awful withering comment from Fripp. In the event, he had nothing to worry about. The workshop began at 2.30, when about 40 people clumped into a large rehearsal space, where we found chairs arranged in two rough concentric circles. And we _mean_ clumped. No-one new what to do, where to sit, whether to get their guitars out, to tune, to dweedle [this is Ian's term for what is perhaps best euphemistically described as guitar-based self-abuse], to sit quietly -- or what. Fripp was the perfect host, inviting people to seat themselves intelligently. He beckoned Mark to an empty chair. The adjacent chair was shortly taken by Trey Gunn, and Fripp commented to Mark "You are fortunate to have one of the greatest stick-players in the United States sitting next to you". Toby looked at Mark with a "er, like SCARY, man" expression on his face. Gradually, people got settled and sat, quietly waiting. Fripp sat, perched on his chair in what appeared to be an hideously uncomfortable posture but which was, no doubt, a masterpiece of achievement with the Alexander Technique. We sat, and waited, and waited, and... after a few minutes there was a total silence in the room punctuated with only the occasional cough or embarrassed giggle. It was extraordinary. Eventually, when some sort of silent calm seemed to have descended upon the congregation, Fripp pulled out a watch and said "And so, at 2.47 p.m. on Saturday 19th June, 1993, I declare this workshop in session". Sitting next to Fripp were Hideyo Moriya, Paul Richards, and Bert Lams -- the California Guitar Trio -- and Trey Gunn. After some chat about it being his first ever workshop, Fripp asked everyone in turn to identify themselves and say why they were at the workshop. There was an extraordinary mixture of people, from perhaps the age of 12 and up. Folksy types, metal men, jazzers, people without guitars, -- B.J. Cole, the UK's number one pedal steel guitarist -- and a family of 4 there "for a day out". It was an almost exclusively male audience. Working as "the inner circle" and "the outer circle", the first exercise was called "Circulation", and the object here was to practice the art of "listening". The idea was to pass a note onto your right-hand neighbour, who would respond to the note and pass another note onto his neighbour, and so on. We tried it. A more horrible noise you would be hard-pressed to imagine. This was about 40 guitars: nylon stung, steel strung acoustics and electrics, some plugged in, some not, and non tuned uniformly. Then Fripp had the outer circle comment on what they had just heard. The inner circle tried again. It was better. We repeated this a few times and then again with the roles of the inner and outer circles reversed. It was fascinating to see the improvement. The California Guitar Trio demonstrated circulation between the three of them, and it was _seamless_. Fripp launched into what was the to be the first of two monologues to occur during the afternoon, describing what the circulation was all about. Fripp explained that the note which was passed around the room wasn't merely a frequency, but something much more recondite: each note that was played took with it something of personality of the player, and was imbued with a quality all of its own that could be passed on to, and reinforced by, the next person in the circle. The next exercise was to do with polyrhythms. It was at this point that Fripp asked whether everyone could count to five. Establishing that we could, he set half the inner circle counting 5's, clapping on 1 and 4. The other half were to count in 7's, clapping on 1 4 and 6. We did this together and, again, it was a mess. We practised a bit, and it sounded better. Then one group had to count 14 bars of 5's, the others counting 10 bars of 7, so that the pattern cycled every 70 bars. We tried it, and then discussed it. How do we keep track of the beats, was what the exercise seemed to be about. Instead of counting explicitly 1-2-3-4-5, 2-2-3-4-5, 3-2-3-4-5, and so on, Fripp proposed an alternative scheme where we _saw_ the notes in front of our eyes. This was the material for his second mystical monologue of the day. "Hmm," thought Toby, "This is a lot for a 2-hour workshop." And it was. It had become clear that Fripp hadn't structured the workshop well. At no time we were asked to tune up; there were too many ideas thrown out and not followed up; then, towards the end of the workship Fripp asked: "would anyone care to play anything?" The atmosphere in the room instantly changed. There was silence, again. People either looked at the floor, or at the ceiling. Eventually someone plucked up the courage, or whatever it was that they needed. More followed. People strummed chord changes; played short compositions; little tunes; a kid of about 13 sludged out tortured Nirvana licks on his overdistorted electric guitar; Mark played a stick tune (and when he played a particular high melody riff Toby spotted Trey Gunn's expression say "hey, that's an interesting riff"); a kid of about 16 played a piece on a nylon-string. "Very good", said Fripp -- his only comment on anyone's playing. "How far would you like to take your music?" Fripp asked. The young man answered "as far as I could allow myself" and when asked to elaborate, he made the comment that many of the metal musicians, whose music he respects, seem to be not-very-nice-people, and he didn't want to be like that. Fripp commented on the dangers of the social power that comes with success. We then had a short open question session, in which Fripp explained that there was to be a radio interview before which we might like to ask questions that would not be typical of such a radio interview. I think both of us were slightly annoyed when most of the questions were of the typical radio interview persuasion. One of the better questions was about the New Standard Tuning, which Fripp explained as having come to him while he was enjoying a sauna in New York. He said "it was very hot, when suddenly this tuning floated past me." The audience were, understandably, a little dissatisfied with this response. Fripp didn't seem able to comprehend the difficulty we had in understanding the concept of a tuning "floating past your head". Fripp made some more comments concerning how "wretched" the music business is, before winding up the workshop when a reporter from BBC Radio Nottingham came to do the live radio interview. We were invited to stay if we wished, and about a dozen did. Afterwards, people chatted with Fripp and the California Guitar Trio. Ian, ever eager for stimulating musical experiences, quizzed Fripp about Guitar Craft. The only permanent base for this seems to be in Germany now, but there are plans afoot to start up a GC series in (of all places) Argentina. Maybe Argentinian guitars are "ready to accept" New Standard Tuning now? Anyone who has read Eric Tamm's book on Fripp will have been concerned at the accusations leveled against the GC teachers concerning their attitudes to GC students now that Fripp is no longer involved full time with the courses. When asked if the teachers really had taken on a condescending "airs and graces" attitude with the students, Fripp made some obscure deflectionary comment about "never trusting people who want to teach you something". He seemed either unwilling to furnish a clear answer to the question of their attitude, or unable to understand the question. Ian was left rather baffled, and in no way reassured that GC still has the friendly unassuming atmosphere that Tamm's book describes. It was an odd event, to say the least. Sunday ------ The next day Toby returned to Nottingham (without, alas, Ian, but with, happy to say, his partner Jane. Er... Toby's partner, that is, not Ian's). Toby and Jane met with Mark again, and some itinerant stick players, and had a few beers before the evening's gig. The gig, going from the reviews we've seen in Discipline, was very similar to the Californian shows in style and content. RF, Trey Gunn and the trio entered through the audience, and the music was a mixture of Fripp/Gunn frippertronics, trio pieces, and the five working together. There was no spoken communication with the audience. About 1/2 way through the gig Fripp and Gunn set up a very jarring discordant frippertronics loop, that was very loud, and -- to my ears -- not very musical. Jane was angry as it made her existing headache worse! Then, they all left the stage, with the loop in progress. The house lights stayed down, and noone knew whether it was an interval or not. Some people, us included, guessed it was, and I suspect some wanted to get away from what was, frankly, a bloody awful racket. We had interval drinks waiting at the bar too! But none of the staff knew what was happening either, saying that if we left the house, we couldn't get back in. So we went back to our seats, and after a few minutes Fripp et al reappeared, and thankfully switched off the loop. They played some more, and came back for an encore. For a final encore, they reappeared from the back of the hall, each wearing the regulation black ovation. At the front of the hall they played a Guitar Craft-type piece (I think I recognised it from Show of Hands) and Fripp dedicated it to the itinerant stick players who were in the 2nd row. That was beautiful playing. Incredibly, some asshole took a flash picture from about 2 feet away from them. Fripp turned and looked at the person, and shook his head slowly, while not missing a beat playing his part of the piece. It was a great gig, and our gin and tonics are still, presumably, waiting for us at the bar. [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] From: patrick5 at aol dot com Date: Tue, 20 Jul 93 11:15:19 EDT Subject: Stick List? I have heard several mentions of an Internet discussion area for the Chapman stick from the Discipline list, and was wondering if anyone had information about this list and how I could join it? I hope to buy a stick soon and would like to get more information about one. Patrick [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] To join this mailing list or have your thoughts in the next issue, please send electronic mail to Toby Howard at the following address: toby at cs dot man dot ac dot uk The Discipline archives are available on ftp.uwp.edu, in /pub/music/lists/discipline. The views expressed in Discipline are those of the individual authors only.