Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 18:07:19 +0000 From: "Michel Champagne" <micheljch at hotmail dot com> Subject: Re: 41 pictures of a man in the city on TV
"prof. Dawid" <prof dot davy at usa dot com> writes:
>1. What the hell is the difference between "Pictures of a City" and "A Man, >A City"? Does anyone know?
The biggest differences to me are the chords that open up both tunes. It's been too long since I knew how to tell notes apart but they're certainly different; the opening of "A Man, A City" sounds more dissonant to me, although those apparently settled on by the time it became the studio recording "Pictures of a City" on ItWoP are actually better choices, to my plebian ears at least. Not having any CDs to reference at the moment at work, I must say that I seem to recall that the rather subdued and jazzy midsection in PoaC is somewhat different in the original tune as well. And this is maintained throughout the subsequent live recordings of PoaC made by the 'Islands' band as well.
The bottom line is of course that they are variations of the same tune at different times in its compositional history. At the time of the 1969 performances by the original Crimso, the tune was called "A Man, A City" and the title settled on when it was formally committed in the studio turned out to be different. Big whoop. Robert being the 9apparent) stickler he is for details (and that is not a bad thing in my mind), he chose to make the distinction now that his is in a position to do so.
Of course, there are a few different versions of LTiA part 1 (e.g. Zoom Club, Beat Club, Studio) that exhibit similar differences; my assumption here is that the piece already had a name from the get-go and so it's always listed by that one name.
This does raise another issue for me, however. Growing up in the mid-late 1970's listening to KC (really discovered them in '76), I was never aware that the band had performed 'Mars' live, and was dismayed that 'The Devil's Triangle' did not credit Holst at all. Of course, I seem to recall Holst's estate being rather anal in that they sued Isao Tomita over his electronic rendition of the entire "Planets" suite, claiming that he had changed the music around so much that he shouldn't have used Gustav Holst's name at all, so I figured that perhaps Fripp had approached the estate and was told to do his own thing and take credit as well. It always bugged me though, seeing how Yes had ripped off Holst (part of 'Jupiter' I think) on their second LP, (I think the tune is 'The Prophet'), ELP ripped of Bela Bartok and Leos Janacek BIG TIME on their first LP (The Barbarian is an admittedly excellent arrangement of Bartok's 'Allegro Barbaro' and Knife Edge is from a Janacek Sinfonetta I think) . . . and I wanted to believe that Robert was above all of that. But that was thirty years ago, and we all do things that, in retrospect, we cringe at the thought of, and I'm certainly not immune myself, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. He is, after all, only human.
Notwithstanding a reviewer quoted in 'The Young Person's Guide to KC' praising KC's performance of 'Mars,' it was truly not until I heard the live performances on 'Epitaph' that I realized that they actually played it straight BEFORE 'The Devil's Triangle' appeared.
So what's my beef? Simply put, 'Mars' by KC and 'The Devil's Triangle' by KC *are* two different pieces of music. The latter borrows a great deal from the former, to be sure, specifically rhythm and the main chord progression. But it also goes places vastly diffferent than the original composition, and it's easy to tell a performance of 'Mars' (e.g. from 'Epitaph') from a performance of 'The Devil's Triangle' (e.g on the 'Live in Detroit' club cd, I *think*). So why is the latter listed on the CD as 'Mars'? It's clearly TDT.
Admittedly, this is a minor bee in my proverbial bonnet, but it's buzzing around in there nonetheless. Perhaps Robert's attempting to make reparations for appropriating Holst's handiwork in 1970 without giving him credit. I don't know. And I'm certainly not qualified to make any pronouncements on the subject, but it's interesting to think about it just the same.
OK, I am done with my logorrhea for the day!
Happy Holidays to all.
Mike